MI - 4 students killed, 6 injured, shooting at Oxford High School, 30 Nov 2021 *Arrest incl parents*

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I know that some schools have metal detectors- was this school not a school that up until now people thought there was much risk? (I have to say that back in the dark ages when I went to school, this kind of thing was unthinkable and I cannot imagine students having to worry about being shot.)
I agree. I can remember a few times that some male students would plan a fight after school. I guess those were the days.........
I can't wrap my head around the things currently happening in our nation & world.
 
I just don’t understand why LE would hold the press conference before the parents were in custody!

I think the charges are warranted given the evidence reported - IMO these parents were highly negligent at best, and near-conspirators at worst.

If the Prosecutor wants to make an example of holding them accountable, how are they allowed to take $4k and make a run for it?

BBM and that's just what's been released. I imagine they have more than what we've heard.
 
Cell phones shut off. That's new to me.

CNN Breaking News
@cnnbrk

1h

The Michigan school shooting suspect's parents withdrew $4,000 from an ATM today, an official says, and their cell phones are turned off
"CNN reports that investigators had been keeping track of school shooter's parents via cell phone pings but "at some point the cell phones were turned off and it seems that the trail went cold."
https://mobile.twitter.com/lookner

That was posted upthread; so interesting that they were actively tracking them. Then lost them! Moo.
 
BBM. This year has been especially tough on school staff. My principal still receives threats on a regular basis from parents angry over mask mandates, etc. Our board meetings are filled with ranting parents upset about masks, curriculum, etc. The last 2 years have been tough on staff and students. Our administration is constantly feminine us about giving grace and understanding to the students who are almost having to relearn how to be in school. There is no winning. I'm sure the administration will regret their decision forever. There were supposedly no prior discipline reports for EC. The district may not have known he had access to a gun. I'm sure they did not realize/think he posed an immediate threat or they would have handled things differently. They may have thought they were supporting him in encouraging parents to seek help while not "punishing" him by kicking him out. In hindsight it's easy to see/say what should have been done.

My questions are when you are presented with this:

On Nov. 30, 2021, the morning of the shooting the next day, Ethan Crumbley’s teacher came upon a note on Ethan’s desk which alarmed her to the point that she took a picture of it on her cellphone. The note contained the following: a drawing of a semiautomatic handgun, pointing at the words: “The thoughts won’t stop. Help me.” In another section of the note was a drawing of a bullet, with the following words above that bullet: “Blood everywhere.” Between the drawing of the gun and the bullet is a drawing of a person who appears to have been shot twice and bleeding. Below that figure is a drawing of a laughing emoji. Further down the drawing are the words, “My life is useless.” And to the right of that are the words, “The world is dead.”

why aren’t you asking the parents the hard questions, are there guns in the home, does he have access to the gun is there a possibility he has one at school, do a search. I hope they did ask these questions of the parents, if the parents lied, there should be more charges. If they did not ask the parents these questions I consider that a failure under the circumstances of having this disturbing drawing. Whether they viewed the drawing as possibly referring to suicide or a threat to others I don’t understand sending him back to the classroom because the parents failed to take him home. I understand it is a very difficult atmosphere these past 2 years but this drawing goes beyond routine discipline situations. MOO
 
You are certainly entitled to your opinion.

However, let’s say the parents did not flee. Let’s say they did just disappear for their own safety.

What is your opinion then about the crimes they have committed as of now? If they haven’t “fled,” they have still missed a mandatory court appearance. This court appearance was not voluntary, so by missing it they become fugitives from the law.

Secondly, they purchased a gun expressly with the intent of giving it as a gift to someone below the age of legal gun ownership. That, too, is a crime.

We can infer that they knew there was at least the possibility that Ethan took the gun to school, or else his so-called mother would not have texted him, “Ethan, don’t do it.”

I’m not arguing with you, but truly want to know your opinion about these events.

And this is not even to include that the father didn’t pay child support for his older children, which I didn’t know about until it was posted here. That’s a crime as well, although not directly related to Ethan’s crime.

I truly am curious as to your opinion, since you feel they shouldn’t be blamed for Ethan in any way.
I'm not sure what crimes you are talking about? I don't know about the terms of the court appearance, so are they fugitives, has there been a warrant for their arrest?

Do we have proof, or only gossip, (social media) if this was a gift to their son. I had originally heard it was the father's gun, and the son only said again on social media that it was a gift to him. And if so, in my rural area, young people do receive guns as gifts, it doesn't mean that they are immediately responsible, but the parents in my area take their children hunting or gun practice. It's not an immediate inheritant skill the children have but is learned. Since the gun was only bought recently, maybe dad was going to teach skills of how to handle the gun to his son?

As far as mom's text, don't do it, I truly feel that was a gut reaction after the school meeting that morning, possibly she saw something in his attitude that seemed defeated. Don't do it could have meant, don't hurt yourself?

I am truly at a lost why you would bring into the conversation about the fathers child support for his older children? If you follow any kind of law, or in the court, that is inadmissible because it isn't even relevant to the case. This is why, if I ever did anything wrong to be tried in court, I would only choose to be judged by a judge, not a jury. I am honestly astounded by the response tonight. I pray our justice system prevails and crimes will be tried, if guilty, punished, but no one will be swept into incarceration by public opinion alone. Let the facts decide. MOO
 
If we are going down the rabbit hole for wanting to assign levels of guilt to the parents, what guilt do we assign to the school for knowing what they knew, yet allowed him to remain in school instead of escorting him out the door? They also could have/should have searched his backpack & locker. Do we assign guilt to the students and their parents who said after the fact that they didn't go to school because they knew something was up? Slippery slope to only blame his parents, when there were so many other clues. My simple feelings are for the innocent school mates and parents who have lost so much. I haven't any other thoughts for revenge against family, school and others. MOO
The parents apparently knew their son was capable of such a horrific act. Knowing that, they bought him a gun anyway. They taught him to use it. They urged him to not get caught looking up ammo on his phone. They didn't lock up the gun. They didn't warn the school. They didn't search his backpack. They refused to take him home.

The students who stayed home should not be blamed. The school was aware of the rumors and had assured everyone that it was safe. They posted a letter:

"We are aware of the numerous rumors that have been circulating throughout our building this week. Student interpretations of social media posts and false information have exacerbated the overall concern. We want our parents and students to know there has been no threat to our building nor our students."

Some Students Stayed Home Ahead of Oxford School Shooting Due to Online Threats (newsweek.com)

Those that chose to stay home out of fear and lack of trust in the school should not be blamed in any way.

Is the school liable? They obviously knew there was a problem. I'm not sure if they knew EC was the source of the rumors. But they certainly should have suspected when they found his disturbing drawing.

MOO
 
Mom had a gut feeling? Or knew EC was dangerous? She text before dad found gun missing?

sorry but these parents are idiots, IMO- the shooter in CT killed his mother (Sandy Hook, Adam Lanza) - why did they feel safe? And who tells your child "I'm not mad at you; you need to learn not to get caught." That is the icing on the cake for me, IMO.
 
Sheriff on CNN Don Lemon show saying that this is the first time in 21 yrs that charges were announced at a press conference without notifying his office beforehand so they could pick up the accused and get them in custody. His office learned of the charges from the media
 
Sheriff on CNN Don Lemon show saying that this is the first time in 21 yrs that charges were announced at a press conference without notifying his office so they could pick up the accused. His office learned of the charges from the media

That's what I saw on the video posted above. What's going on with that? Of course it's about the parents and not the young killer of 4. Need to read up why the Sheriff's department was excluded. <modsnip>
 
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I'm not sure what crimes you are talking about? I don't know about the terms of the court appearance, so are they fugitives, has there been a warrant for their arrest?

Do we have proof, or only gossip, (social media) if this was a gift to their son. I had originally heard it was the father's gun, and the son only said again on social media that it was a gift to him. And if so, in my rural area, young people do receive guns as gifts, it doesn't mean that they are immediately responsible, but the parents in my area take their children hunting or gun practice. It's not an immediate inheritant skill the children have but is learned. Since the gun was only bought recently, maybe dad was going to teach skills of how to handle the gun to his son?

As far as mom's text, don't do it, I truly feel that was a gut reaction after the school meeting that morning, possibly she saw something in his attitude that seemed defeated. Don't do it could have meant, don't hurt yourself?

I am truly at a lost why you would bring into the conversation about the fathers child support for his older children? If you follow any kind of law, or in the court, that is inadmissible because it isn't even relevant to the case. This is why, if I ever did anything wrong to be tried in court, I would only choose to be judged by a judge, not a jury. I am honestly astounded by the response tonight. I pray our justice system prevails and crimes will be tried, if guilty, punished, but no one will be swept into incarceration by public opinion alone. Let the facts decide. MOO
Regarding if the gun was a gift:

James Crumbley purchased the gun, a 9 mm Sig Sauer SP2022 semi-automatic pistol, on Black Friday, November 26, at a shooting goods store in Oxford. A store employee confirmed that Crumbley's son, Ethan, was with him.

On or around the same day, Ethan Crumbley posted a photo on social media with the caption: "Just got my new beauty today. SIG SAUER 9mm." The post included heart emoji

On or around November 27, Jennifer Crumbley posted on social media: "mom and son day testing out his new Christmas present."

So according to both EC and his mom, it was EC's gun.

Prosecutor lays out disturbing timeline in explaining why school shooting suspect's parents were charged - CNN
 
Sheriff on CNN Don Lemon show saying that this is the first time in 21 yrs that charges were announced at a press conference without notifying his office beforehand so they could pick up the accused and get them in custody. His office learned of the charges from the media

What a screw-up. SMH
 
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