Identified! MN - Lilydale, Miss River, UncFem 25-30, 805UFMN, blue shorts, Jun'76 - Roberta Seyfert

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Absolutely tragic. An apparently severely mentally ill father with some kind of religious syndrome that led to him and 2 sons being killed. Immigration issues were not the cause but triggered. Terrible fate. I wonder what happened to Roberta and her mom after that incident? Die the mom remarry? Was Roberta with her mom or put in foster care or with a relative (not unusual in the 50s for children of single parents). I wish we could learn more about her life.

Precious soul, rest in peace
you are loved and reunited with your family.

inmyhumbleopinion said:
Poor Roberta and her poor mother :(
Madera Tribune 24 April 1958 — California Digital Newspaper Collection

Clipping from Independent - Newspapers.com

1958 Press Photo Arlene Seyfert Cries After Husband, Sons Killed in Shootout
Click to expand...
 
Susikatze said:
Absolutely tragic. An apparently severely mentally ill father with some kind of religious syndrome that led to him and 2 sons being killed. Immigration issues were not the cause but triggered. Terrible fate. I wonder what happened to Roberta and her mom after that incident? Die the mom remarry? Was Roberta with her mom or put in foster care or with a relative (not unusual in the 50s for children of single parents). I wish we could learn more about her life.

Precious soul, rest in peace
you are loved and reunited with your family.
Click to expand...
I could not find anything about Roberta or her mother, but in one of the articles the grandparents who lived in California were mentioned (probably Roberta’s mothers parents), nobody from Minnesota.
 
Surprised there aren't any new articles on her identification. Did a google search of her name and usually when there's a new id I can find local news reporting. But so far nothing. Maybe I'm wrong.

I looked up her father's name and found this.
Charles A Seyfert (1920-1958) - Find a Grave...

States that he was born in North Dakota in 1920. Shows he was enlisted "Sept. 1942 to July 1943, Pvt-lcl U.S. Army."

Looks like there's another spelling of his wife's name from the articles cited by @inmyhumbleopinion above.

"Applicant's name for his headstone is, Arline M. Seyfert who resided in Tucson, Arizona."
 
DSCrime said:
Surprised there aren't any new articles on her identification. Did a google search of her name and usually when there's a new id I can find local news reporting. But so far nothing. Maybe I'm wrong.

I looked up her father's name and found this.
Charles A Seyfert (1920-1958) - Find a Grave...

States that he was born in North Dakota in 1920. Shows he was enlisted "Sept. 1942 to July 1943, Pvt-lcl U.S. Army."

Looks like there's another spelling of his wife's name from the articles cited by @inmyhumbleopinion above.

"Applicant's name for his headstone is, Arline M. Seyfert who resided in Tucson, Arizona."
Click to expand...
This helps. I had found an obituary of an “Arline Seyfert” or “Arline Mary Seyfert” of Monticello, MN (she lived in a nursing home), which is only 51 miles away from Lilydale, where our Doe was found. Her burial site, St. Michael, is closer, though not by much, at about 45 minutes:
Google Maps

The Madera Tribune article gives Mrs. Seyfert’s age at the time of the incident as 34 (in April of 1958), and the obituary I found says, “She was born in Minneapolis Aug. 8, 1924 …,” so it matches there (you have to scroll way down):
Miscellaneous Hennepin County, MN Obituaries
 
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inmyhumbleopinion said:
This helps. I had found an obituary of an “Arline Seyfert” or “Arline Mary Seyfert” of Monticello, MN (she lived in a nursing home), which is only 51 miles away from Lilydale, where our Doe was found. Her burial site, St. Michael, is closer, though not by much, at about 45 minutes:
Google Maps

The Madera Tribune article gives Mrs. Seyfert’s age at the time of the incident as 34 (in April of 1958), and the obituary I found says, “She was born in Minneapolis Aug. 8, 1924 …,” so it matches there (you have to scroll way down):
Miscellaneous Hennepin County, MN Obituaries
Click to expand...

Great job @inmyhumbleopinion!
 
victoriarobinson642 said:
RobertaSeyfert-232x300.jpg

Rest in peace, Roberta.
Click to expand...
I wonder when her mother or others noticed she was missing?
 
That's definitely her mother. She obviously came back to Minnesota at some point when Roberta was young. She and Roberta may have ended up estranged, or the obit didn't mention Roberta simply because the family didn't know what happened to her. I wonder if she was ever reported missing, and if so, why the dots weren't connected when her body was found, as Roberta had obviously been living in Minnesota and at least partly had grown up there, and had family nearby besides her mother, her mother's obit lists aunts and cousins, etc. Maybe her family thought she had left the state, if she was the type to travel and hitchhike, or maybe she visited relatives out of state at times. Or perhaps simply, it was a case of the dots not being connected in a different time, whereas today they would have been. I do wonder if she and the other so far unidentified Jane Doe were killed by the same person, if Roberta was murdered. She obviously had a sad life in some ways. Hopefully, she had some happiness and stability in between her tragic death, and the tragic events of her early childhood.
 
30Anne said:
I wonder when her mother or others noticed she was missing?
Click to expand...

Maybe she didnt grow up with her mother? In the 50s, children of "criminals" were often removed from their mothers care, even if the mothers were innocent and placed in foster families or homes. I wonder whether that was the case and that is why nobody missed her. Also, after that massive of a trauma, i wonder if the mother was mentally stable enough to raise a (traumatized) child. There was no real access to therapy back then.

Or maybe, Roberta was reported missing but since she was an adult, nothing became of it.
Really i wish we knew more about Roberta and her mom after the headlines.
 
Susikatze said:
Maybe she didnt grow up with her mother? In the 50s, children of "criminals" were often removed from their mothers care, even if the mothers were innocent and placed in foster families or homes. I wonder whether that was the case and that is why nobody missed her. Also, after that massive of a trauma, i wonder if the mother was mentally stable enough to raise a (traumatized) child. There was no real access to therapy back then.

Or maybe, Roberta was reported missing but since she was an adult, nothing became of it.
Really i wish we knew more about Roberta and her mom after the headlines.
Click to expand...
We can learn something about Roberta’s mother from the obituary. She never married again and had no other kids, she was loved by her family, she had two sisters and nephews and nieces, one niece was probably specifically close to her. Also she “liked music, always had a bright outlook and was an inspiration to all who knew her”.
 
Roberta's older brothers are also buried in the same cemetery as her father. While it may have been a standard tombstone at one time for this memorial park in California, I found the design on the tombstones of her father and brothers (as well as on a tombstone of a paternal uncle who died much later) of a boat sailing for heaven interesting, given how they died. Her brothers' tombstone (and the uncle's) also include one line of the British poet Tennyson's poem ''Crossing the Bar'' which continues the same theme. It was popular in Victorian times- her mother, although born in 1924, seems to have been familiar with it and presumably liked it since it is on the tombstone of both of her sons. Just some thoughts that came to mind when I saw the tombstones of Roberta's brothers- Thomas G W Seyfert (1948-1958) - Find a Grave.... I find poetry and cemeteries interesting as well as true crime cases. Roberta's mother seems to have recovered well from the tragedies that happened to her and been a resilient person, judging from her obit. It not only doesn't mention Roberta ( for whatever reason), but neither does it mention her sons. Whether what happened to Roberta was another great tragedy for her( Roberta disappearing suddenly), or if her mother didn't have a great relationship with her and she just assumed Roberta was out there living her life or hoped that, would be interesting to know.
 
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summergirl1 said:
Roberta's older brothers are also buried in the same cemetery as her father. While it may have been a standard tombstone at one time for this memorial park in California, I found the design on the tombstones of her father and brothers (as well as on a tombstone of a paternal uncle who died much later) of a boat sailing for heaven interesting, given how they died. Her brother's tombstone (and the uncle's) also include one line of the British poet Tennyson's poem ''Crossing the Bar'' which continues the same theme. It was popular in Victorian times- her mother, although born in 1924, seems to have been familiar with it and presumably liked it since it is on the tombstone of both of her sons. Just some thoughts that came to mind when I saw the tombstones of Roberta's brothers Thomas G W Seyfert (1948-1958) - Find a Grave.... I find poetry and cemeteries interesting as well as true crime cases. Roberta's mother seems to have recovered well from the tragedies that happened to her and been a resilient person, judging from her obit. It not only doesn't mention Roberta (for whatever reason), but neither does it mention her sons. Whether what happened to Roberta was another great tragedy for her(Roberta disappearing suddenly), or if her mother didn't have a great relationship with her and she just assumed Roberta was out there living her life or hoped that, would be interesting to know.
Click to expand...
 
summergirl1 said:
Roberta's older brothers are also buried in the same cemetery as her father. While it may have been a standard tombstone at one time for this memorial park in California, I found the design on the tombstones of her father and brothers (as well as on a tombstone of a paternal uncle who died much later) of a boat sailing for heaven interesting, given how they died. Her brothers' tombstone (and the uncle's) also include one line of the British poet Tennyson's poem ''Crossing the Bar'' which continues the same theme. It was popular in Victorian times- her mother, although born in 1924, seems to have been familiar with it and presumably liked it since it is on the tombstone of both of her sons. Just some thoughts that came to mind when I saw the tombstones of Roberta's brothers- Thomas G W Seyfert (1948-1958) - Find a Grave.... I find poetry and cemeteries interesting as well as true crime cases. Roberta's mother seems to have recovered well from the tragedies that happened to her and been a resilient person, judging from her obit. It not only doesn't mention Roberta ( for whatever reason), but neither does it mention her sons. Whether what happened to Roberta was another great tragedy for her( Roberta disappearing suddenly), or if her mother didn't have a great relationship with her and she just assumed Roberta was out there living her life or hoped that, would be interesting to know.
Click to expand...
There is no preceded in death section in Arlene’s obituary, so it looks like it was a decision not to mention anyone, but as we can see from the obituary she was a devoted christian and she never married, I would think she suffered deeply inside all her loses and probably moarned her family for all her life.
 
summergirl1 said:
Very true. It should be interesting reading more about Roberta and her case. It's too bad everything did not get connected much sooner, as she lived nearby, and wasn't from out of state.
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Yes and it is also bothers me that there was a second girl, Ramsey County Jane Doe 1977, who was also not identified at that time! They were the same age and we found in just a year apart
MN - MN - St Paul, Childs & Warner Rd, WhtFem 16-30, UP4804, in Miss River, chipped teeth, clothes Jul'77
 
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