Multi-Jurisdictional Grand Jury in Bedford County, Virginia

[steveP120]

New to this platform, longtime reader, though. I spied that Stacey Welch FB post, too; I took a screenshot of it right away (images at the end of this post-- if you can't see them for some reason, let me know.) The post is real and legit, not a troll. View attachment 79304View attachment 79305

There are two people named "Stacy Heller-Welch" on Facebook. The second one looks like a troll to me and likely posted the comment.



Is the post still up? If it was taken down, it was likely taken down because it was posted by a troll, or if posted by the real Stacy Heller-Welch, she had second thoughts about her post. I did not see the post still up but I am not an expert on Facebook and a clever Troll will post outrageous things in dark corners to avoid detection.

 

[beachlvr0810]

There are two people named "Stacy Heller-Welch" on Facebook. The second one looks like a troll to me and likely posted the comment.

View attachment 79340

Is the post still up? If it was taken down, it was likely taken down because it was posted by a troll, or if posted by the real Stacy Heller-Welch, she had second thoughts about her post. I did not see the post still up but I am not an expert on Facebook and a clever Troll will post outrageous things in dark corners to avoid detection.

I do not and have never deleted anyone's comments on my TMD page...freedom of speech. And the entire conversation is still there. You just have to take the time to look for it. And the comments were not posted by a "troll", I have had quite a few private conversations with the person who posted it.

 

[steveP120]

I do not and have never deleted anyone's comments on my TMD page...freedom of speech. And the entire conversation is still there. .

The statement that you have never deleted anyone's comment does not mean that the comment is still there.
People can remove their own comments if they have second thoughts about what they posted and Facebook can remove comments when flagged by other users.

Have you seen the conversation lately? (of course a troll with sock puppets will post and re-post deleted comments endlessly) The "comment" is no longer indexed by Google. Previously it was indexed by Google but pointed to an empty (deleted?) page.

Please post a link to the conversation on Facebook IF it's still there.

Sorry, but I think you and I have been wasting time with trolls and sock puppets; a fact of life online. If the real person wrote it, she may have had second thoughts, perhaps after feedback, about overstating her case, presenting opinions of others' guilt as facts, and deleted the post herself.

 

[steveP120]

Please post a link to the conversation on Facebook IF it's still there.

If the post still exists, this is how you find the permalink on Facebook if you don't already know how to:


Locate the ‘timestamp’ for the post. This will either be an amount of time e.g. 30 minutes ago (for recent posts), or it will be a date e.g. 30th April (for older posts).
Right click on the timestamp and copy the url. Alternatively, you can click the timestamp with left mouse button and it will open up the post into a page where you can copy the permalink from your address (URL) bar at the top.
Now you can copy and paste the permalink as you please!

from: http://dannyasling.com/2014/04/28/how-to-get-the-permalink-for-a-facebook-post/

 

[steveP120]

If one does a google search on the date and time of that ALLEGED/DELETED Facebook post and alleged poster

"July 13 at 10:47pm" Stacy Heller-Welch
https://www.google.com/webhp?source...-8#q="July+13+at+10:47pm"++Stacy+Heller-Welch

NO FACEBOOK PAGES SHOW UP IN RESULTS.
Other similar search terms turned up no Facebook pages containing the alleged post.

If one does a search on the time, date, and user name of a post that actually exists on Facebook such as one of her other posts.

"July 17 at 10:33pm" Stacy Heller-Welch
https://www.google.com/webhp?source...-8#q="July+17+at+10:33pm"+Stacy+Heller-Welch+

GOGGLE RETURNS A FACEBOOK POST.

Of course I can't prove unicorns don't exist just because Google can't find a live unicorn. One can't prove a negative. But if you want to argue that unicorns or a web post exist, you should come up with a live unicorn or permalink.

Even it was not posted by a troll and she posted it herself, and later deleted it herself, one might want to consider that she retracted her statement.

 

[beachlvr0810]

The statement that you have never deleted anyone's comment does not mean that the comment is still there.
People can remove their own comments if they have second thoughts about what they posted and Facebook can remove comments when flagged by other users.

Have you seen the conversation lately? (of course a troll with sock puppets will post and re-post deleted comments endlessly) The "comment" is no longer indexed by Google. Previously it was indexed by Google but pointed to an empty (deleted?) page.

Please post a link to the conversation on Facebook IF it's still there.

Sorry, but I think you and I have been wasting time with trolls and sock puppets; a fact of life online. If the real person wrote it, she may have had second thoughts, perhaps after feedback, about overstating her case, presenting opinions of others' guilt as facts, and deleted the post herself.

Like I said...the post is still there. It has not been deleted and she is not a troll. A troll would not have known the things we discussed.

 

[steveP120]

Like I said...the post is still there. It has not been deleted and she is not a troll. A troll would not have known the things we discussed.

IF the post is still there, please post a link to it as politely previously requested.
I would hope that anyone would check that the post was still there before making such a claim that the post was there. Go back in your browsers history and post the link you looked at if you looked at such a post before claiming it was still there.

Otherwise, I will assume that you are posting your opinions, "I THINK the post is still there" as fact.

Even if you talked to the real person online, it does not mean that someone else can't post false comments online under her name.

Just post the link to the Facebook post if it exists. There is a good chance you are being fooled into vouching for a Troll or vouching for a retracted statement. If you have any minimal online relationship with her, out of respect for her (not to mention accused), you should check that she made the statement and check to see that it's still online before letting a troll impersonate her.

 

[RichardLewis]

Looks like Amy Welch will be in Bedford, VA this Friday August 7, in front of the grand jury. If she is not careful, she could end up in the same situation as her grandmother.

http://www.wset.com/story/29715814/welch-granddaughter-called-before-grand-jury

Anne Arundel Co., MD - The granddaughter of a person of interest in the Lyon sisters case is ordered to appear before a grand jury.

Amy Welch was served with a subpoena on July 17, according to law enforcement sources. Welch’s grandfather is Richard “Dick” Welch.

The grand jury investigating the 1975 murders of Katherine and Sheila Lyon meets Friday in Bedford.

Richard Welch's local attorney, Carter Garrett, declined our interview request Wednesday. Garrett wants to wait until after the grand jury meets to comment.

 

[WaynezWorld]

Looks like Amy Welch will be in Bedford, VA this Friday August 7, in front of the grand jury. If she is not careful, she could end up in the same situation as her grandmother.
[/I]

Good development. Hopefully this Amy woman will testify truthfully and honesty. It has been implied by the media that like her grandmother she has been running interference for Richard Allen Welch.

This is a woman who was not even alive in 1975. While her grandfather Richard may seem a pleasant man to her, it is very possible that she has no idea what really went on but has protected him based on his version.

She needs only to tell the truth.

 

[steveP120]

Good development. Hopefully this Amy woman will testify truthfully and honesty. It has been implied by the media that like her grandmother she has been running interference for Richard Allen Welch.

This is a woman who was not even alive in 1975. While her grandfather Richard may seem a pleasant man to her, it is very possible that she has no idea what really went on but has protected him based on his version.

She needs only to tell the truth.

I believe the media, based on unnamed statements, claimed that Amy, the granddaughter, has been in frequent communication with the possible participants, specifically her grandparents (Richard) and even Lloyd in prison.

It's common for people to keep in touch with relatives. One can speculate if it was just normal family communication, an unhealthy interest in the case (which many of us have), or if she really knows anything or is trying to interfere, but it's just speculation.

I really wish the police had better evidence than 40-year-old stories/rumors, conveyed by a granddaughter who was not alive at the time. Her mother was eight at the time, and clearly states she would have known if two other girls were in the house for days and no locked basement room existed.

In addition to being forty-years old, most of these stories contradict each other in major details. A person can't be murdered in state A by guy A, and be seen alive later in state B with guy B. Not that one of the stories might be true.

 

[WaynezWorld]

I believe the media, based on unnamed statements, claimed that Amy, the granddaughter, has been in frequent communication with the possible participants, specifically her grandparents (Richard) and even Lloyd in prison.

"Detectives provided the details to get the warrant to search the Anne Arundel County home of Richard Welch's granddaughter Amy. The warrant says Amy has been privately messaging and using Facebook to communicate with family members about the case. Sources tell WUSA9 that police seized a computer and phone after searching her home last week." from http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/201...chard-welch-to-lyons-sisters-murder/31059729/

It's common for people to keep in touch with relatives. One can speculate if it was just normal family communication, an unhealthy interest in the case (which many of us have), or if she really knows anything or is trying to interfere, but it's just speculation.

I agree but I think the inference by LE is that there is unusual communication between Amy and Richard Welch. They have alleged that after having little contact or years, Thomas Welch and Richard Welch begin to communicate frequently after the initial press conference naming LLW but not RAW or TTW as suspects. LE said these communications were unusual and that RAW and PJW made trips to Bedford unannounced.

TTW now claims to remember the Lyon sisters being at RAW's house, which is a change in tune from his first statements.

I really wish the police had better evidence than 40-year-old stories/rumors, conveyed by a granddaughter who was not alive at the time. Her mother was eight at the time, and clearly states she would have known if two other girls were in the house for days and no locked basement room existed.

I do not believe the granddaughter will be a big key to this case unless it is some accessory (long) after the fact or if maybe she has inadvertently helped RAW to communicate or dispose of evidence.

In addition to being forty-years old, most of these stories contradict each other in major details. A person can't be murdered in state A by guy A, and be seen alive later in state B with guy B. Not that one of the stories might be true.

LLW Jr has been interviewed at least 3 times according to law enforcement and his statements have been all over the place. I take it as a given that someone facing a charge like this would minimize their role in such a crime ("Uncle Richard and I just wanted to pick them up and it got out of hand") and tell half and partial truths or the truth clouded by several lies.

Since Welch as indicted, it has been revealed there are several witnesses with interesting information-

CONNIE AKERS- LLW JR brought bloody clothing to Taylors Mountain.

HENRY PARKER- Helped burn weighted bloody duffle bags with LLW JR

THOMAS WELCH- Saw girls at RAW home that he believes were the Lyon sisters.

WES JUSTICE- RAW allegedly confided in him about the abduction/rape/murder of the girls.

I wish that police had followed up better in '75 but they did not.

We will never get all the pieces of this puzzle, but we may get enough to tell what definitively happened.

Just my instinct, I think RAW will be indicted before the end of this month.

 

[steveP120]

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/loc...and-jury-resumes--lyon-sisters-case/31280681/

Obviously no info on private grand jury.

Someone needs to tell them, even if you are guilty, you don't look guilty by hiding under a jacket or behind a sheet of paper.

 

[rosie_lee]

Bruce Leshan (@BruceLeshan): https://twitter.com/BruceLeshan?s=09

Bedford deputies just arrested Leslie Engleking on charges of lying to #LyonSisters grand jury. @wusa9 http://t.co/mGLwutfKd4

2 of 2 Engleking is brother in law of Richard Welch, person of interest in disappearance of #LyonSisters @wusa9

BREAKING: Deputies arrest witness on perjury charges in #LyonSisters murders. @wusa9 http://t.co/ReQl5OeGus

Engleking joins sister Patricia facing perjury charges. Police allege ongoing coverup in the 40 yr old murder of two little girls. @wusa9

 

[Historydetective63]

Bruce Leshan (@BruceLeshan): https://twitter.com/BruceLeshan?s=09

Bedford deputies just arrested Leslie Engleking on charges of lying to #LyonSisters grand jury. @wusa9 http://t.co/mGLwutfKd4

2 of 2 Engleking is brother in law of Richard Welch, person of interest in disappearance of #LyonSisters @wusa9

BREAKING: Deputies arrest witness on perjury charges in #LyonSisters murders. @wusa9 http://t.co/ReQl5OeGus

Engleking joins sister Patricia facing perjury charges. Police allege ongoing coverup in the 40 yr old murder of two little girls. @wusa9

Isn't it great to see justice being served?!!!

 

[rosie_lee]

Isn't it great to see justice being served?!!!

It absolutely is! Systematically they are getting them, one by one.

 

[Historydetective63]

it absolutely is! Systematically they are getting them, one by one.

yeah!!!

 

[RichardLewis]

Bruce Leshan (@BruceLeshan): https://twitter.com/BruceLeshan?s=09

Bedford deputies just arrested Leslie Engleking on charges of lying to #LyonSisters grand jury. @wusa9 http://t.co/mGLwutfKd4

2 of 2 Engleking is brother in law of Richard Welch, person of interest in disappearance of #LyonSisters @wusa9

BREAKING: Deputies arrest witness on perjury charges in #LyonSisters murders. @wusa9 http://t.co/ReQl5OeGus

Engleking joins sister Patricia facing perjury charges. Police allege ongoing coverup in the 40 yr old murder of two little girls. @wusa9

OK, Engleking... that rings a bell. Here is a post from Four Eyes and my response below. I will look deeper into this connection.

The authorities have received this image for their consideration last month. Can anyone comment on
LLW's biological mother as to her name, or date of death.

Thomas Welch Sr,- Thomas Welch Jr,- <modsnip> A tragedy and travesty of
three generations. Pawns on LWK's chessboard.
Do research on deceased Engelking(s) previously living in RAW duplex on 41st Pl , compare to the relationship to Engelking convicted of FB child *advertiser censored* ring, may give you a page or two of discussion. A person posting online is public for anyone and everyone to read. All speculation, probably unwise, as John Q. Public is on a low tier
security level for data base research. Thank you for the opportunity to post this time.

Hmmm... ok, sort of cryptic. Well, here goes...
October 3, 2012
"Michael Engelking, 37, of Alexandria, Va., was sentenced today by U.S. District Judge Richard L. Voorhees in the Western District of North Carolina to serve 210 months in prison and lifetime supervised release."

http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/two-m...-conspiracy-trade-child-*advertiser censored*

Mugshot: http://www.north-carolina-public-re...enburg-County/Michael-Engelking.22890610.html

Websleuths link "little girls love to play" http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...e-Girls-Love-to-Play-Club-quot-6-men-indicted

Interesting, Patricia Welch is the registered agent for this corporation L. Engelking, Inc. (Leslie Joseph Engelking)
http://www.marylandcorporates.com/corp/791530.html

It appears that Michael A. Engelking (dob 5-8-75) is a son of Leslie J. Engelking, dob Jan.1947
So, it seems the Kraisel to Welch / Engelking analogy is some sort of "sins of the father" and "birds of a feather" thing...

What a really weird world that Patricia Welch lives in where her husband Richard and nephew Lloyd are POI's in the Lyon sisters abduction, she's arrested for perjury, her brother in-law Lloyd killed his wife in a drunken auto accident, her nephew Thomas let child sex offender Lenny Kraisel live in his home, she has numerous jail bird relatives, and she just coincidently happens to have worked with / for a guy whose son becomes nationally infamous when he is arrested by the FBI for using Facebook to share child *advertiser censored*.
Seriously, you just cannot make this dysfunctional s#!t up.... I can't wait for the book to come out.

 

[steveP120]

It absolutely is! Systematically they are getting them, one by one.

I hate to burst your bubble, and wish they were getting the major players, but the people "got" by perjured grand-jury testimony are usually reluctant witnesses.

For example if a son murders someone, runs home and into his mother, the mother may be reluctant to testify. The son, anyone, does not have to testify against himself, but the mother does. Likewise if the son asked his brother to give him a false alibi, the brother even if he did not provide a false alibi may be reluctant to testify. It's the secondary witnesses that are likely being arrested now.

But it must be something really bad to commit perjury over. I think Richard Lewis might be pushing the guilt by association a bit far, but if some of the people were engaged in child sex, I can see that being something they might not want to admit to even if they could no longer prosecuted for child-sex crimes so old.

Crimes so old might establish a pattern of behavior with young girls, where something could go wrong and end in murder even if that was not the original plan.

 

[Tulessa]

ABC13News &#8207;@ABC13News 6m6 minutes ago
UPDATE: Granddaughter of Person of Interest in Lyon Sisters Case Arrested

 

[gregjrichards]

ABC13News &#8207;@ABC13News 6m6 minutes ago
UPDATE: Granddaughter of Person of Interest in Lyon Sisters Case Arrested

Wow thanks Tulessa.