NC - 12-year-old dies at Trails Carolina wilderness therapy camp, Lake Toxaway, February 2024

So this bivy was altered, due to broken internal mesh, with an opaque outer layer. Does that mean they didn't have another one that wasn't broken to use instead? That's all they had left for this kid on his first night there? No extras, despite all the money these parents pay? How many of these did they have, and how many kids were in them that night? How many that were altered in this way; was it only his?

What were the parents told about sleeping arrangements? Are these bivys common in these types of camps? Or what safe alternatives do other camps use?

It seems like a catastrophic management failure, IMO.

Also it sounds like anytime one of the kids panics in the bivy, the other kids have to just lie there nearby and hear it?
Horrible.
Wasn't altered. Bivy's have layers. This poor child ripped a layer trying to find oxygen.

I posted in this thread long ago that it became murder the minute they locked that zipper with the alarm as the child wouldn't have been able to escape a fire etc.

Just like locking the doors to a theatre with people inside and then a fire breaks out, I hope to H-E-Double-Toothpicks that someone is charged and held accountable for this child's horrifying, uncalled for end.
 
What bothers me is not only that they covered the only air intake - the mesh section, but he was in the bivy with his head down the small, FEET end. Opposite end from where the air came in. Was this protocol? Other survivors are describing the claustrophobic, suffocating experience of being put in this thing and then wrapped and pinned down with a tarp. It was inevitable someone was going to die. No air, wrong way in, and pinned to the floor. I bet some of the survivors got brain damage from the anoxia.

MOO

IMO one possibility is that he wasn't made to go in head-down but ended up trapped that way when moving around trying to find a way to get more air.

It bothers me that they described him as mumbling in his sleep. It could be that he talked in his sleep; I have heard kids do that. But it could also be he was making sounds of panic or difficulty breathing and wasn't asleep, IMO/JMO.
ETA: Adding link
 
IMO one possibility is that he wasn't made to go in head-down but ended up trapped that way when moving around trying to find a way to get more air.

It bothers me that they described him as mumbling in his sleep. It could be that he talked in his sleep; I have heard kids do that. But it could also be he was making sounds of panic or difficulty breathing and wasn't asleep, IMO/JMO.
ETA: Adding link
I just don't see how a twelve year old would have the room to turn a complete 180 degrees in that confined a space. A six year old? Sure. But the average twelve year old boy is just under five feet tall.

MOO
 
I just don't see how a twelve year old would have the room to turn a complete 180 degrees in that confined a space. A six year old? Sure. But the average twelve year old boy is just under five feet tall.

MOO
He seems to have been small for his age per the medical examiner’s report which says his father described him as “slightly underdeveloped” and seeing an endocrinologist. 70 lbs. was his estimated weight, height 4 ft. 8 inches tall.
 
He seems to have been small for his age per the medical examiner’s report which says his father described him as “slightly underdeveloped” and seeing an endocrinologist. 70 lbs. was his estimated weight, height 4 ft. 8 inches tall.
I was probably that height when I was doing a bunch of camping with Brownies and Guides, and there is no way in heck I could have tumble turned in my sleeping bag, which was sized for an adult.

MOO
 
He seems to have been small for his age per the medical examiner’s report which says his father described him as “slightly underdeveloped” and seeing an endocrinologist. 70 lbs. was his estimated weight, height 4 ft. 8 inches tall.
This makes me upset. If he had a growth hormone deficiency it could have affected him mentally as well. This child needed real medical physically & mentally. Not this place.

 
He seems to have been small for his age per the medical examiner’s report which says his father described him as “slightly underdeveloped” and seeing an endocrinologist. 70 lbs. was his estimated weight, height 4 ft. 8 inches tall.
so not only was he just 12 (the youngest camper there) but also small for his age. And he was "escorted" there by two grown males hired by his parents.

While I personally would never make such a decision as a parent I do pray for his. I imagine they will question that decsion every day for the rest of their lives.

rest easy CJH
----------------------------
A medical examiner’s report released with the autopsy findings said the boy who died had ADHD, anxiety, migraines and social challenges, including “a very hard time making friends.”
Autopsy report rules 12-year-old's death at camp for troubled adolescents a homicide
 
Wasn't altered. Bivy's have layers. This poor child ripped a layer trying to find oxygen.

I posted in this thread long ago that it became murder the minute they locked that zipper with the alarm as the child wouldn't have been able to escape a fire etc.

Just like locking the doors to a theatre with people inside and then a fire breaks out, I hope to H-E-Double-Toothpicks that someone is charged and held accountable for this child's horrifying, uncalled for end.

Multiple people need to charged with the death. And everyone at that facility and facilities like it should be charged with child abuse for doing this to the children who don't die. This is 10000000000% child abuse.

I'll say MOO, but I don't see how it could be seen any other way.
 
This makes me upset. If he had a growth hormone deficiency it could have affected him mentally as well. This child needed real medical physically & mentally. Not this place.


A medical examiner’s report released with the autopsy findings said the boy who died had ADHD, anxiety, migraines and social challenges, including “a very hard time making friends.”

Makes me wonder if he had other diagnoses not mentioned, too.

To be fair to his parents, we don't know what other kind of help/programs they have tried and what they actually thought they were paying for at this camp.
Maybe they were skillfully promised he would be taught social skills, self esteem, and all that they dearly hoped he could have, while enjoying nature with peers. MOO. I give them the benefit of the doubt.
 
Makes me wonder if he had other diagnoses not mentioned, too.

To be fair to his parents, we don't know what other kind of help/programs they have tried and what they actually thought they were paying for at this camp.
Maybe they were skillfully promised he would be taught social skills, self esteem, and all that they dearly hoped he could have, while enjoying nature with peers. MOO. I give them the benefit of the doubt.
I too feel for his parents. I think they may have been sold a bill of goods. As I said, their decisions wouldn't be mine. But I pray for them. They will likely blame themselves for their decision to send him for the rest of their lives.
 
I too feel for his parents. I think they may have been sold a bill of goods. As I said, their decisions wouldn't be mine. But I pray for them. They will likely blame themselves for their decision to send him for the rest of their lives.
My heart breaks for all his loved ones, especially his parents.

MOO, the troubled teen industry in this country was designed to prey on loving & desperate parents who already feel like they’ve failed their child.

The parental desperation is absolutely targeted for exploitation, MOO, and mostly only anemically (at best) regulated.

Our kids, troubled or not, deserve so much better.
 
My heart breaks for all his loved ones, especially his parents.

MOO, the troubled teen industry in this country was designed to prey on loving & desperate parents who already feel like they’ve failed their child.

The parental desperation is absolutely targeted for exploitation, MOO, and mostly only anemically (at best) regulated.

Our kids, troubled or not, deserve so much better.

It is. When you've taken all the steps the kid's school has suggested (individual therapy, family therapy, meds, PHP daytime mental health programs, gotten an IEP/504 plan, week long inpatient stay) and your kid is still not going to school/or is failing/or is in trouble constantly with the school or the law, you start to feel desperate. There's short term residential therapy, but there aren't a ton of them, they have loooooong waiting lists, and insurance often doesn't cover them fully. Plus--most of them only accept kids who agree to go, no involuntary. And if you have a slightly older teen--you've got a time limit. About age 17 is when suddenly a lot of places don't consider your kid a teen any more but they aren't 18 so they can't be in adult programs. So you have a year there where you still have full parental rights--but few places that will work with that age group. If your kid is using drugs or alcohol, it's all even more complicated. You feel like you have a ticking time bomb in your hands, everyone around you is telling you that you must fix "the problem" immediately, but no one and nothing is actually helping in a concrete way. And you are terrified for your child to the point where you can barely think of anything else.

And that's when these wilderness programs get you. Heck, they even pop up in Psychology Today's results when you use their database to look for residential programs. And once you've searched online for anything regarding this topic, you'll get ads for the places everywhere. Schools or therapists recommend them when they feel like you've gone through all your options, but often don't have direct experience with any particular one. And if someone has heard even one success story from a relative or a friend of a friend or even on a message board, a parent is a lot more likely to hold onto that as a truth and be willing to ignore all the negative reviews and personal anecdotes. Because at that point, parents feel like there are no options left.

Luckily for my son, we didn't have to go past short term residential--and even that was a gut wrenching, highly researched decision, esp during the first months of a freaking pandemic. But I remember that places like these wilderness camps were suggested to us by well meaning but uninformed people.
 
I am not a fan of these types of camps. It is a thinly veiled dumping ground for kids, teens, with a "treatment plan" to get insurance to pay for "mental health care".

Most of the people who work at these places are the lowest type of staff, not much above minimum wage. I have worked at a few places, and there are excellent ones that do great work. They are expensive, and staffed with professionals who have licenses. And then the ones that are just for profit, staffed with cheap labor.

How do parents know which ones are good? Research. Ask questions. Go there before you send your child. If they say that isn't allowed, it is not a good place.
 
The medical examiner’s report said the child’s father explained he had enrolled his son at this camp “for behavioral and addiction problems” because the child “would get physical” with his parents and siblings (but he also said the child had “a typical sibling relationship” with the family’s other 2 children, so I am not sure what “getting physical” actually means or how frequent or severe such behavior was) and because the child “has had social issues and has a very hard time making friends.”

The father noted the child had ADHD and anxiety but no illicit drug history or suicidal ideation. So to treat a child without any history of substance use/abuse (and unless having “trouble making friends” constitutes a “behavioral problem”) I wonder why the child’s parents chose THIS camp as opposed to any number of other ones that might’ve been better suited to help neurodiverse adolescents move through the world and navigate interpersonal relationships more calmly and confidently. How do these places marketing themselves to appeal to both parents of children who have legitimate substance abuse issues and/or serious behavioral issues (i.e. self-harm/outward-directed aggression) AND to parents who just want a rugged outdoorsy camp experience to help their socially awkward, physically weak pre-teens “man up”?
 
The medical examiner’s report said the child’s father explained he had enrolled his son at this camp “for behavioral and addiction problems” because the child “would get physical” with his parents and siblings (but he also said the child had “a typical sibling relationship” with the family’s other 2 children, so I am not sure what “getting physical” actually means or how frequent or severe such behavior was) and because the child “has had social issues and has a very hard time making friends.”

The father noted the child had ADHD and anxiety but no illicit drug history or suicidal ideation. So to treat a child without any history of substance use/abuse (and unless having “trouble making friends” constitutes a “behavioral problem”) I wonder why the child’s parents chose THIS camp as opposed to any number of other ones that might’ve been better suited to help neurodiverse adolescents move through the world and navigate interpersonal relationships more calmly and confidently. How do these places marketing themselves to appeal to both parents of children who have legitimate substance abuse issues and/or serious behavioral issues (i.e. self-harm/outward-directed aggression) AND to parents who just want a rugged outdoorsy camp experience to help their socially awkward, physically weak pre-teens “man up”?
Wait, the father said he enrolled his son in this camp due to behavioral and addiction issues but he also said the child had no history of illicit drug use? Does that mean the child was addicted to drugs that had been prescribed to him? I’m confused.
 
Wait, the father said he enrolled his son in this camp due to behavioral and addiction issues but he also said the child had no history of illicit drug use? Does that mean the child was addicted to drugs that had been prescribed to him? I’m confused.

Adderall is used for ADHD and is addictive if used improperly.


Note at the bottom of the article two ads for addiction treatment centers for youths.
 
Just an idea: I wonder if by "addiction" they mean a gaming/media/phone addiction? Teens battling this may become physical/violent when you take it away or turn it off, and may resort to sneaky behavior or even running away in order to find access. It is a real addiction.

ETA: Vaping is also a big issue nowadays, and it's starting in middle school.
 
Just an idea: I wonder if by "addiction" they mean a gaming/media/phone addiction? Teens battling this may become physical/violent when you take it away or turn it off, and may resort to sneaky behavior or even running away in order to find access. It is a real addiction.

ETA: Vaping is also a big issue nowadays, and it's starting in middle school.

That crossed my mind too, and I’m glad you mentioned the possibility of gaming/media/phone addiction. It’s definitely a serious problem. This article goes into detail…

Thankfully. There weren’t any ads for treatment centers.

As you also mentioned, vaping is a big issue now with kids as young as 12.
 
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