New Search Warrants in Holly Bobo case 28 February 2014 #2

[pearl]

Is the GJ made of of special people or ordinary citizens.

And I assume they get a briefing about a case and then all the evidence is laid out and then they decide weather or not to go ahead and indict.

Is that how GJs work.

My state borders TN. 2 types of jurors are summoned when a new court session starts. People are summoned as grand jurors if they will sit with the group that decides whether or not to indict. People are summoned as petit jurors if they will sit to hear trials. All citizens of a county are eligible to be called as either type of juror. A person can be arrested without an indictment if there is enough evidence to support the arrest for the crime. A grand jury indictment is sought by the district attorney. The grand jury then either no bills (does not indict) or true bills (indicts) the accused. The district attorney then prosecutes the case. I have only heard of one instance where a district attorney did not prosecute a true bill of indictment and that was the JonBenet Ramsey case in Colorado. Former civics teacher here in case you're wondering if I know what I am posting.

 

[shefner]

You know, its just tough for me to think about Karen Bobo being ZA's 4th grade teacher. That would have been about 20 years ago. Holly would have been a toddler at the time. I bet KB would never have imagined that one day, this child in her care would hurt her child. How awful.

 

[johnfear]

Hi there:

Grand Juries are mostly convened in secret.

They spend the majority of their time hearing evidence from witnesses.

The average time for a grand jury indictment in my area is very small. This is not published as a time line or in minutes, but the grand jury only meets for a few days and churns out a large amount of "true bill of indictment"s in that time frame. Sometimes it may meet four of its days and hand out more than four hundred indictments in that 30 hours.

A Special Grand Jury generally takes more time to deliberate for a variety of reasons: 1) number of witnesses, 2) number of charges, 3) number of alleged defendants, etc.

It is exceptionally rare that a grand jury returns a "No True Bill" because they require only a considered majority. Depending on where you live, that may be 2/3, or 4/5, etc.

They hear from one side and are considered to be an impartial body themselves. They do not decide innocence or guilt, but they focus on probable cause and further exploration by the judge and jury (collectively acting as a court in trial).

The fact that they recalled a Special Grand Jury and are doing this at 3:00 on a Wed is huge. It isn't some little thing they are asking for. It's probably several people on many charges. Sometimes, in a murder case, you will see one victim killed by three perps who are indicted on 87 counts of murder because of the way it went down and all the different ways prosecutors are seeking to test their own theory before committing.

The Ham Sandwich saying definitely applies to general Grand Juries, but it almost never applies to Special Grand Juries. Mainly because the evidence presented there frequently involves a case with heavy MSM coverage or a long investigation or a large investigative body made up of multiple jurisdictions and agencies.

Hope that helps.

 

[bettiepageturner]

Can someone explain how GJ's work? Who is in this hearing? How much of what goes on in there, will we hear about when it's over?

TIA!!

As far as I now understand... the records will be sealed. The accused does not have a right to counsel before a grand jury, cannot testify, and cannot cross-examine the excuser, who can nonetheless be called in as a witness by the prosecution. However, "targets of investigations have the right to, and can, "request or demand the opportunity to tell the grand jury their side of the story."

The wealth of information here Grand juries in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia has brought my knowledge up from 0 things to as many as 7 things! One of the more interesting ones...

In 1974 the Supreme Court of the United States held in U.S. v. Calandra that "the exclusionary rule in search-and-seizure cases does not apply to grand jury proceedings because the principal objective of the rule is ‘to deter future unlawful police conduct,’ [. . .] and ‘it is unrealistic to assume that application of the rule to grand jury proceedings would significantly further that goal.’" Illegally obtained evidence, therefore, is admissible in grand jury proceedings, and the Fourth Amendment's exclusionary rule does not apply.

So if I'm understanding correctly, the DA can decide whether or not to bring a case before the GJ. Could this decision mean there would be evidentiary concerns in a regular criminal proceeding?

Edit: posted at the same time as johnfear, sorry for any redundancy!

One more edit for a question I couldn't find answered on the wiki... how long has this particular GJ been assembled? Are they kind of "on call" for some indeterminate amount of time, based on the fact that this one wasn't gathered specifically for Holly's case?

 

[ThoughtFox]

Can someone explain how GJ's work? Who is in this hearing? How much of what goes on in there, will we hear about when it's over?

TIA!!

It's the District Attorney who leads the Grand Jury.

They will call witnesses one by one like a regular trial, but in this case the Grand Jury members can ask questions of the witness directly.

After they hear the testimony of various people, the DA will ask if they believe there's enough evidence to proceed with criminal charges. That's what they are probably going to announce at the Presser this afternoon because that's the purpose of a Grand Jury.

http://www.tndagc.org/vwh.htm

Grand Jury
A case transferred to circuit court by "binding over" must then be presented to the GRAND JURY, a group of thirteen citizens chosen from the jury panel. One of these thirteen is the fore person and will preside over the grand jury.
The grand jury hears testimony from witnesses in a private session. Neither the defendant nor his lawyer will be present at the grand jury hearing. A representative of the district attorney general's office may be present when witnesses present their testimony, but the grand jury's voting must be done in secret. If twelve of the thirteen grand jurors believe a crime was committed by the defendant, they will charge or " indict" the defendant for that crime. The formal charge by the grand jury is called an INDICTMENT. Sometimes this charge is also referred to as a "true bill".
When the grand jury refuses to indict someone, its action is sometimes referred to as a "no true bill." When the Grand Jury returns a "no true bill' against a defendant, then that person cannot be brought to trial.

NOTE: Remember that they aren't saying the person involved is "guilty" or "innocent." They just have to agree that there is enough evidence to proceed with a trial.

 

[bettiepageturner]

"The grand jury right may be waived, including by plea agreement. A valid waiver must be made in open court and after the defendant has been advised of the nature of the charge and of the defendant's rights."

Does this mean ZA (or whoever else) has already been made aware of the charges and has chosen not to plea? I understand why we/the media wouldn't know this yet, just trying to understand the timing and procedures since this is such a special case.

 

[johnfear]

"The grand jury right may be waived, including by plea agreement. A valid waiver must be made in open court and after the defendant has been advised of the nature of the charge and of the defendant's rights."

Does this mean ZA (or whoever else) has already been made aware of the charges and has chosen not to plea? I understand why we/the media wouldn't know this yet, just trying to understand the timing and procedures since this is such a special case.

I think the special grand jury here means that not everyone is aware of it. For instance, if an older relative who owned some property and had provided material assistance to a crime were to be influential in the community and need to be charged with a conspiracy to or an accessory after a crime...they might be one of the reasons.

The grand jury right being waived strikes me as post-arrest, pre-indictment when a probable cause hearing and speedy trial rights are in effect.

 

[texasgirl2]

I really appreciate you guys--johnfear, bettiepageturner, ThoughtFox and Pearl

Thank you for helping me to understand this process a little better.

 

[~n/t~]

If indictment is returned an arraignment will take place next Tuesday at 1 pm.

-Jordan Buie

 

[a.allison]

BREAKING: Grand Jury now in session, WSMV reports. #HollyBobo

https://twitter.com/willnunley

 

[~n/t~]

BREAKING: Grand Jury now in session, WSMV reports. #HollyBobo

 

[ThoughtFox]

One really high-profile case that kept getting "no true bills" was Jerry Sandusky in Pennsylvania. I think it went to a Grand Jury at least three times over ten years before they finally indicted him.

 

[Bravo]

I scrubbed a door. Sigh........the waiting......off to find something else mundane :scared:

 

[AnonymousD]

So... has ZA's location changed? Or any of the others arrested?

eta: Checked VL says ZA has been transferred to 'unknown agency'

Is this new?

BBM

Someone mentioned that upthread. Last night? Yesterday?


Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - SPOTLIGHT CASE New Search Warrants in Holly Bobo case 28 February 2014 #2

 

[iluvmua]

Is this what the 4;00 presser is about a GJ announcement or are they going to say that they have found holly's remain and/or evidence that points to her being desceased.

 

[Bravo]

One really high-profile case that kept getting "no true bills" was Jerry Sandusky in Pennsylvania. I think it went to a Grand Jury at least three times over ten years before they finally indicted him.

Wowsers. Thanks for that. I didn't know.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Yes, Your Honor....the Grand Jury finds just cause to indict the said ham sandwich. We also find the turkey sandwich to be an accessory after the fact. Now "lettuce" proceed to the arrest portion, where we "mayo" give the details of the arrest to the public.

Please slow down with this proceeding, Shef! I need to "ketchup"!

 

[AnonymousD]

WREG News Channel 3 ‏@3onyourside 3m

Family of #HollyBobo will not be at 4pm news conference. Family friend will speak for them. Grand jury meeting now
http://link.wreg.com/1ncNiZp

 

[Starry Night]

How much discovery from a Grand Jury Indictment is available to a defense attorney after the fact?

 

[ThoughtFox]

"The grand jury right may be waived, including by plea agreement. A valid waiver must be made in open court and after the defendant has been advised of the nature of the charge and of the defendant's rights."

Does this mean ZA (or whoever else) has already been made aware of the charges and has chosen not to plea? I understand why we/the media wouldn't know this yet, just trying to understand the timing and procedures since this is such a special case.

The other day when ZA was in Sessions Court he said he didn't have an attorney yet. So he probably doesn't know about the charges yet.

If he's in isolation and not getting phone calls (which I suspect is true) then he probably doesn't know much. He can probably guess, though, knowing about the searches.

But he'll get a lawyer one way or the other. Either his family will hire one, or the court will appoint one. Or who knows - this is such a high profile case some local attorney may step forward and defend him just for the publicity.