GUILTY NH - Abby Hernandez, 14, North Conway, 9 Oct 2013 - #15

[SStarr33]

I hate they delayed the hearing for 30 days. I was hoping that would give us something to chew on.

 

[LookingHoping]

I would greatly appreciate someone who has a masterful understanding of the law, or perhaps works as a lawyer, to explain the use of the term "victim." It is my limited understanding that until a case has been proven and someone has been found guilty of a crime, the term is actually "alleged victim." Can someone please clarify this for me? Because it is in my opinion that once the word victim is used it closes the door to anyone who chooses to keep an open mind. I have done my fair share of jury duty and I have always heard "alleged" used for this reason.

Thank you. eace:

**snipped to what I'm responding to**

I'm not a lawyer, just wanted to say that I think for the purposes of discussion on this site, the definition is in regards to the site and the TOS… When AH was missing, she and her family were considered the victims (Correct me if I'm wrong mods who are reading).

 

[Fireweed]

**snipped to what I'm responding to**

I'm not a lawyer, just wanted to say that I think for the purposes of discussion on this site, the definition is in regards to the site and the TOS… When AH was missing, she and her family were considered the victims (Correct me if I'm wrong mods who are reading).

So to me that does not follow that we cannot discuss whether she was a victim of one particular person or not.

 

[inthedark14]

Okay that is fine, but then why come here and post? I am being totally serious and not sarcastic. Surely this is a place where we shoot around ideas and thoughts with the facts that we have? Right?

And I know a lot of people here sign off with things like "JMO" but to me that is of course a given. We are all posting from our personal accounts with theories about this case. Unless we cite to some other source, everything here is naturally just our opinion.

This is absolutely a place where we shoot around ideas and discuss our thoughts. What is really great about WS, and is unlike any other site I've come across is that this site is here for the benefit of the victim. In this case, the victim is a 15 year old, a child, a minor. This is also a miraculous case because she came home to her family. We don't see that very much. I don't know how much time you've spent looking around the many, many other threads here. There are so many missing, lost, murdered. In my experience, the people who post here are doing whatever they can, even a small post of support is for the victims, their family and those affected by the very horrible things we see here.

The only way I can explain it, and I'm sure I'm not doing it well is that there are people here who follow many cases, most ending in tragedy, some ending in blatant miscarriages of justice, some with no answers at all. I am speaking for myself when I say please give those of us who get offended when people are questioning the validity of a traumatized 15 year old victim's memory or her ability to convey her memories to a sketch artist a break and know that we are here for the victim. It should also be noted that there are people here who have been victims of crimes themselves, so if it seems that they are a little protective of the victim of a crime, they have good reason to be.

Everyone wants answers. As you have told us that you are a lawyer you are aware that the wheels of the justice system move painfully slow. I don't think, on a place where the victim is the very first priority it is unusual that people who have followed many cases here over the years would become somewhat offended when someone questions a victim's motives for everything and anything.

Finally, when we state JMO, MOO, IMO we are showing that we respect the rules of this forum and what we are posting is indeed, our opinion. It may seem redundant to some, but you'd be surprised how many people (like anyone in the world who can google this case and follow the links to WS) would think that what they are reading is fact.

ALWAYS MOO

 

[Mountaingazer]

This forum is not a court of law. I would suggest reading the full TOS for this site and then if you have more questions on the rules post in the correct forum or send a private message to an administrator or a mod. Complaints about how the site is run may be addressed in the same manner and should not be posted in case threads.

 

[Fireweed]

This is absolutely a place where we shoot around ideas and discuss our thoughts. What is really great about WS, and is unlike any other site I've come across is that this site is here for the benefit of the victim. In this case, the victim is a 15 year old, a child, a minor. This is also a miraculous case because she came home to her family. We don't see that very much. I don't know how much time you've spent looking around the many, many other threads here. There are so many missing, lost, murdered. In my experience, the people who post here are doing whatever they can, even a small post of support is for the victims, their family and those affected by the very horrible things we see here.

The only way I can explain it, and I'm sure I'm not doing it well is that there are people here who follow many cases, most ending in tragedy, some ending in blatant miscarriages of justice, some with no answers at all. I am speaking for myself when I say please give those of us who get offended when people are questioning the validity of a traumatized 15 year old victim's memory or her ability to convey her memories to a sketch artist a break and know that we are here for the victim. It should also be noted that there are people here who have been victims of crimes themselves, so if it seems that they are a little protective of the victim of a crime, they have good reason to be.

Everyone wants answers. As you have told us that you are a lawyer you are aware that the wheels of the justice system move painfully slow. I don't think, on a place where the victim is the very first priority it is unusual that people who have followed many cases here over the years would become somewhat offended when someone questions a victim's motives for everything and anything.

Finally, when we state JMO, MOO, IMO we are showing that we respect the rules of this forum and what we are posting is indeed, our opinion. It may seem redundant to some, but you'd be surprised how many people (like anyone in the world who can google this case and follow the links to WS) would think that what they are reading is fact.

ALWAYS MOO

All those sentiments are fine to me, and I totally understood why there would be a day or two of just pure jubilation on the board that Abby was back, but is that now all that this board is about? Really? It is no longer about sleuthing but is rather a place to praise someone or to be a victims-support board? I do not find any of those things to be unworthy of discussion or of thought, I am simply questioning if this is the place to do that. If this is a crime victim's survivor support board, or a place to talk about how much we love the victim and their family, then I really think that the title of the website should be changed. I am being 100% serious here.

I feel that so much great sleuthing gets shut down here by people who segue into either lavishing praise on the victim and their family, or by people who go off on a tangent about how they know from experience how horrible this stuff is.

Again, and I cannot emphasize this enough, those are both totally noble and great things to discuss. But this is a place to sleuth a crime. There are other places to express those sentiments.

And of course I totally expect that people will throw this in my face in six months time when Kibby is convicted, so I will repeat myself one last time: I do not think that this is the forum to just praise and pray for victims. That is fine for a reasonable time, but it has been two weeks, there are still things about this case that are mysterious, and I think it is totally reasonable and fair that people who come to a site called WEBSLEUTHS want to actually sleuth the case.

I am sure that there are loads of places online that deal only with religious, spiritual, and survivor stuff.

 

[inthedark14]

All those sentiments are fine to me, and I totally understood why there would be a day or two of just pure jubilation on the board that Abby was back, but is that now all that this board is about? Really? It is no longer about sleuthing but is rather a place to praise someone or to be a victims-support board? I do not find any of those things to be unworthy of discussion or of thought, I am simply questioning if this is the place to do that. If this is a crime victim's survivor support board, or a place to talk about how much we love the victim and their family, then I really think that the title of the website should be changed. I am being 100% serious here.

I feel that so much great sleuthing gets shut down here by people who segue into either lavishing praise on the victim and their family, or by people who go off on a tangent about how they know from experience how horrible this stuff is.

Again, and I cannot emphasize this enough, those are both totally noble and great things to discuss. But this is a place to sleuth a crime. There are other places to express those sentiments.

And of course I totally expect that people will throw this in my face in six months time when Kibby is convicted, so I will repeat myself one last time: I do not think that this is the forum to just praise and pray for victims. That is fine for a reasonable time, but it has been two weeks, there are still things about this case that are mysterious, and I think it is totally reasonable and fair that people who come to a site called WEBSLEUTHS want to actually sleuth the case.

I am sure that there are loads of places online that deal only with religious, spiritual, and survivor stuff.

Well I'm sorry that my sentiments and the expectations of this website are not to the liking of some. There's a fabulous post below that explains it further and you can read the full TOS here if you wish. The Mod's will always be happy to help as well, they're always available to explain anything you need to know.

This forum is not a court of law. I would suggest reading the full TOS for this site and then if you have more questions on the rules post in the correct forum or send a private message to an administrator or a mod. Complaints about how the site is run may be addressed in the same manner and should not be posted in case threads.

 

[gnsndr33]

With all this back and forth going over and over the same comments makes coming to this thread dreadful. I love all the opinions but when there the same ones over and over it gets old. It's not doing Abby or any of us any good. Sorry I had to get that off my chest.

 

[gnsndr33]

Sorry I'm sure this is already posted but when I'd his next court date?

 

[Fireweed]

Well I'm sorry that my sentiments and the expectations of this website are not to the liking of some. There's a fabulous post below that explains it further and you can read the full TOS here if you wish. The Mod's will always be happy to help as well, they're always available to explain anything you need to know.

I read the TOS and I still cannot figure out what here is victim-bashing. And again, your (or anyone else's) sentiments about stuff that surrounds a crime are absolutely fine and completely worthy of acknowledgement and discussion. I am only questioning if this is the place to do it. Praising a victim's strength and resilience is a wonderful thing to do, but this is a sleuthing board. If I ask a reasonable question, i.e. why is the sketch so much different than Kibby, then I personally do not think that this is the board to shut down a discussion like that with something like, "we should just be glad Abby is back!". That is not what this board is about. This is a place to sleuth. There are surely loads of places all over the internet where people have discussions that only focus on something like that. I am not "bashing" the victim by trying to start a discussion about why the sketch and the suspect look so different. Quite frankly I am getting a little irked at being accused of being a victim basher when I bring something like that up. It is perfectly reasonable and logical thing to sleuth here.

 

[Fireweed]

Sorry I'm sure this is already posted but when I'd his next court date?

Some time in September (probably middle of September).

 

[Steleheart]

<snipped>
BBM

Former Conway Lt. Chris Perley, who left the force in April after 29 years, has known 34-year-old Nathaniel Kibby since the kidnapping suspect was 12 years old.


"He was smart, but he was also brutally myopic in whatever view he had," Perley said. "You could not shake him or redirect him in the way he saw the world."

Read more: http://www.wmur.com/news/conway-pol...s-with-nathaniel-kibby/27294166#ixzz3A2tz7RA5



LOL


:cow:

 

[CatFancier]

Some posters feel very protective of Abby and don't like any negative posting about her. This is their right. She has been through a lot and most of us have trudged along daily for her.

Others feel comfortable throwing out that maybe she ran off or invited NK or whomever in some way because we don't yet know the facts of the case.

Either way, as long as this is as far as it goes because at this time, this is as far as MSM goes, it's all good. We are each entitled to our opinions.

 

[newguy123]

When I see the sketch which was released and then pictures of the man they arrested, I had trouble connecting those dots, since the sketch and photos of NK don't look alike to me. Some people see resemblances, others don't. To me the important thing was information from AH herself (which I am guessing was subsequent to the sketch release) led them to the arrest. Maybe I should care how the sketch led to the arrest......maybe I'm missing something major here......but to me the important thing is, in theory, they got the guy.
I don't know her mental state upon arrival at home. I don't know how hazy (or clear) her memory was at the time of the sketch. For all any of us know, she was sedated at home after her ordeal. Perhaps that blurred her recollections........which came clearer after some rest. (I know I may be grasping at straws, but just giving her the benefit of the doubt here).
Since I can't see the connection between the sketch and the arrest, I have to believe (blindly???) that other info. which has not been made public came to light.

 

[Fireweed]

When I see the sketch which was released and then pictures of the man they arrested, I had trouble connecting those dots, since the sketch and photos of NK don't look alike to me. Some people see resemblances, others don't. To me the important thing was information from AH herself (which I am guessing was subsequent to the sketch release) led them to the arrest. Maybe I should care how the sketch led to the arrest......maybe I'm missing something major here......but to me the important thing is, in theory, they got the guy.
I don't know her mental state upon arrival at home. I don't know how hazy (or clear) her memory was at the time of the sketch. For all any of us know, she was sedated at home after her ordeal. Perhaps that blurred her recollections........which came clearer after some rest. (I know I may be grasping at straws, but just giving her the benefit of the doubt here).
Since I can't see the connection between the sketch and the arrest, I have to believe (blindly???) that other info. which has not been made public came to light.

Exactly. We don't know all those things, which is why when someone expresses that, I think it is wonderful that we continue to discuss and sleuth those unknowns, instead of shutting that dialogue down.

 

[Coquette]

Some posters feel very protective of Abby and don't like any negative posting about her. This is their right. She has been through a lot and most of us have trudged along daily for her.

Others feel comfortable throwing out that maybe she ran off or invited NK or whomever in some way because we don't yet know the facts of the case.

Either way, as long as this is as far as it goes because at this time, this is as far as MSM goes, it's all good. We are each entitled to our opinions.

Thank you for the thoughtful post. I appreciate both your compassion for Abby and your understanding that not everyone will see or explore things in an identical fashion.

By reading some recent comments I can see some desire to control the narrative and suggest going elsewhere because they do not agree with a line of questioning or an opposing view. I am hopeful that this is not the norm here and am grateful to know that all opinions are welcome.

 

[Hejlena]

So...no new information, then?

 

[Fireweed]

So...no new information, then?

Depends on where you last left off...

 

[Not Without Peril]

The fact that some of us DO think that [the sketch] looks like him should put to rest the idea that Abby provided incorrect or intentionally false info to LE.

I respectfully disagree. Kibby has blue eyes. That is not my opinion; my browser determined that his eyes are various shades of blue, including this one. Therefore, when Abigail said that the man presumed to be Kibby had brown eyes, her statement was incorrect.

By the way, I have not seen any person, here, dispute the fact that Kibby has blue eyes. You would agree that he has blue eyes, right? And that Abigail incorrectly identified his eye color as brown?

 

[Hejlena]

I'm probably going to regret this, being kind of a drive by poster and all, but does anyone think Abby was too terrified to give a correct description? That maybe she or her family were threatened, and that may have something to do with her level of "cooperation" cited by LE when she first came home?

Kibby's whole "I have guns here" thing was to test his place with LE, IMO. Bravado.

But somehow LE put two and two together after the sketch. Put two and two together with information provided by Abby.