NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #11

[walkingdeadgirl]

Vasi's hit and run took place less than a mile from where maura was working.

Maura could've parked her car (initially) in the parking lot reserved for security that is right in front of the front door to the dorm maura was working at. It would've taken her 5 seconds to walk from the dorm to her car.

Even though Maura also lived less than 20 seconds from the dorm she was working at, if I had the opportunity to park my car right by the front door of the dorm i was scheduled to work at (so i could take a quick break at some point during my shift) I would take advantage of that instead of parking my car miles away.

Maura's shift was 8 p.m. to 2 a.m. She is required by law (I beileve) to get a break during her shift.

That is quite interesting, Scoops. Do you think Maura or her Saturn were involved in the hit and run on Vasi?

 

[scoops]

That is quite interesting, Scoops. Do you think Maura or her Saturn were involved in the hit and run on Vasi?

It's something that I haven't been able to rule out.

I always thought, that it would've been a sure-fire trigger for Fred to whisk into amherst and help his daughter deal with the issue. He probably would've been there that friday night, if not for a big snow storm that hit amherst on Friday and cancelled school and all athletic events. If maura did indeed hit vasi, I don't think she would've tried to keep it from her father, I think she would've reached out to him and he would abruptly head for her campus to try and help her.

But on the subject of what upset Maura that thursday night:

She was not on a phone at the time of her meltdown.

Trying to link her getting upset as a result of a phone call is just not accurate. It's speculation.

Police lifted a comment from the witness statement filled out by Maura's supervisor in which Maura's supervisor mentioned Maura saying "My sister" when asked what was wrong.

Police are the ones that have attempted to tie maura being upset to a phone call.

The FACT is maura broke down at her desk and was not on a phone at all when she was found. Maura, who didn't ever tell the supervisor any detail about what had upset her, could've easily just made something up on the fly to get the supervisor to back off from questioning her.

 

[Fireweed]

It's something that I haven't been able to rule out.

I always thought, that it would've been a sure-fire trigger for Fred to whisk into amherst and help his daughter deal with the issue. He probably would've been there that friday night, if not for a big snow storm that hit amherst on Friday and cancelled school and all athletic events. If maura did indeed hit vasi, I don't think she would've tried to keep it from her father, I think she would've reached out to him and he would abruptly head for her campus to try and help her.

But on the subject of what upset Maura that thursday night:

She was not on a phone at the time of her meltdown.

Trying to link her getting upset as a result of a phone call is just not accurate. It's speculation.

Police lifted a comment from the witness statement filled out by Maura's supervisor in which Maura's supervisor mentioned Maura saying "My sister" when asked what was wrong.

Police are the ones that have attempted to tie maura being upset to a phone call.

The FACT is maura broke down at her desk and was not on a phone at all when she was found. Maura, who didn't ever tell the supervisor any detail about what had upset her, could've easily just made something up on the fly to get the supervisor to back off from questioning her.

Yeah, once I saw the timeline, I was no longer sure that it was the phone call that upset Maura. I think she said "my sister" so that the supervisor would not ask anymore questions, i.e. "hey this is private family stuff."

 

[scoops]

Yeah, once I saw the timeline, I was no longer sure that it was the phone call that upset Maura. I think she said "my sister" so that the supervisor would not ask anymore questions, i.e. "hey this is private family stuff."

Just a few minutes before Vasi was found laying in the road, Maura was on her cell phone talking to her boyfriend.

Was Maura on break?

She was not technically allowed to talk on her cell phone while working. I know many young women and the second they get off of work or out of a class, they pull out their cell phones.

Granted, Maura did talk to her sister on her cell phone while working around 10:10 p.m., so obviously, she bended the rules a little bit.

But why so much has been made about a 10 o'clock 20 minute phone conversation between Maura and her sister is beyond me.

Police would also know that Maura talked to her boyfriend around 12:07 a.m.

She was found upset around 1 a.m.

To me, if you were really trying to link a phone call as to what upset Maura, my attention (as an investigator) would be on that seven minute phone call between Maura and billy after midnight, not the phone call between the two sisters hours earlier.

Something is just not right about that.

Vasi's hit and run aside, why have all police references to a phone call that upset Maura that night have to do with the 10 'o clock call and not a mention about the call after midnight between Maura and billy.

 

[Fireweed]

Because she and Billy had a "great relationship" remember? I mean, she was planning on getting married to him and everything, so there is just no way that she disappeared without calling anyone! If we link her being super upset to Billy, then maybe, just maybe we might question the whole story that the family has put out there.

 

[scoops]

Because she and Billy had a "great relationship" remember? I mean, she was planning on getting married to him and everything, so there is just no way that she disappeared without calling anyone! If we link her being super upset to Billy, then maybe, just maybe we might question the whole story that the family has put out there.

No I understand what you are saying.

But I am talking about the police mostly.

Why are the police (leading everyone to believe) that they are convinced a phone call Maura had with her sister hours earlier is what led to her becoming upset.

Is it a tactic.

Did police not want the public to even know about the 12:07 a.m. to 12:14 a.m phone call that Maura made to her boyfriend on her cell phone that night?



Back to the vasi angle.

The campus newspaper, the Daily Collegian broke with the story of vasi being hit on the very same day Maura went missing.


Now to be fair, there are two newspapers in Amherst and while I can't pull up the archives from the Amherst bulletin for some reason, they may have ran with the vasi story before that Monday.

Point is, would Maura seeing an actual article about the hit and run in the paper, spook her to leave (if she indeed had been involved in the hit and run)?


The article did mention that vasi had been upgraded from critical condition to serious condition.

 

[Fireweed]

I have often wondered if the police have simply been sloppy about what they say to the press. The thing that fascinates me is that Maura's family, though critical of LE, has never once bothered to correct this.

 

[Lolacat]

One thing that doesnt add up for me is the Billy situation. Ok, so Maura's relationship with Billy was rocky and the phone call she got that night that made her so upset was from Billy. She also left an old email on top of the boxes that she packed which alledgedly indicated that Billy had cheated on her. So, she was mad with Billy? .....and yet, in her email to him on the day she disappeared she says "I love you more stud" and she also took the necklace he had given her with her on her trip to NH. Why? If a guy had cheated on me I would not be carrying his damn necklace around- it would be smashed into a million pieces and thrown in the trash. Was it valuable perhaps? is that why she was keeping it? Nothing seems to make sense here.

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

It's something that I haven't been able to rule out.

I always thought, that it would've been a sure-fire trigger for Fred to whisk into amherst and help his daughter deal with the issue. He probably would've been there that friday night, if not for a big snow storm that hit amherst on Friday and cancelled school and all athletic events. If maura did indeed hit vasi, I don't think she would've tried to keep it from her father, I think she would've reached out to him and he would abruptly head for her campus to try and help her.

But on the subject of what upset Maura that thursday night:

She was not on a phone at the time of her meltdown.

Trying to link her getting upset as a result of a phone call is just not accurate. It's speculation.

Police lifted a comment from the witness statement filled out by Maura's supervisor in which Maura's supervisor mentioned Maura saying "My sister" when asked what was wrong.

Police are the ones that have attempted to tie maura being upset to a phone call.

The FACT is maura broke down at her desk and was not on a phone at all when she was found. Maura, who didn't ever tell the supervisor any detail about what had upset her, could've easily just made something up on the fly to get the supervisor to back off from questioning her.

I was under the impression she was upset after a phone call.

she had one phone call from her sister K around 10ish, then another one around 12ish, then around 1ish she broke down.

the 12ish call is the one that no one seems to know (or want to say) who she was talking to, and the one I think that is more likely to have contained something to have upset her.

as far as her saying "my sister", I agree with you that she probably just said that to have something to say. She was a private person, and kind of into lying. I mean, once you get into something, it becomes kind of second nature to do, you know?

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

One thing that doesnt add up for me is the Billy situation. Ok, so Maura's relationship with Billy was rocky and the phone call she got that night that made her so upset was from Billy. She also left an old email on top of the boxes that she packed which alledgedly indicated that Billy had cheated on her. So, she was mad with Billy? .....and yet, in her email to him on the day she disappeared she says "I love you more stud" and she also took the necklace he had given her with her on her trip to NH. Why? If a guy had cheated on me I would not be carrying his damn necklace around- it would be smashed into a million pieces and thrown in the trash. Was it valuable perhaps? is that why she was keeping it? Nothing seems to make sense here.

Obviously nothing I'm about to say is 100% because I didn't actually know Maura, or her friends, or Billy, or her family. Reading about her, and how people described her and her personality, I have an idea she could have easily been the type of person to graduate to the type of woman who was accepting of the occasional slap on the face from dear old Billy. jmo.

I think he was her first long term, serious relationship. she loved him, he took care of and protected her, just like daddy. I think he was strong willed and firm with her, just like daddy, and she did what he told her to. he was the aggressor, and she was passive. She might get mad at him for things, but at the end of the day, she loved him and he took care of her. I think she really needed and wanted a protector, and she saw that in Billy. When he cheated (by some accounts, more than once), she took him back, though clearly remained angry/hurt by passive aggressively leaving that email on her bed, and by doing her own bit of cheating. but she didn't leave him. that probably never entered into her mind. it probably never would have. one part of her probably felt very, very trapped, especially with the crazy mother mixed in. (she disturbs me greatly...it's almost as if there were THREE people involved in their relationship.) another part of her felt very protected, exactly what she wanted.

I think she was having a huge inner conflict with herself, with people planning out the rest of her life for her ZOMG PICKET FENCE, and that feeling safe and good, but also knowing she would have no control over anything, and always being the "take him back" girl.

the same email she said "I love you stud" she also said something like "honestly I didn't want to talk to anyone today" which really means "I didn't want to talk to YOU". usually when people feel the need to inject the word "honestly" into a sentence, it indicates that what they are about to say is untruthful.

so she leaves out the cheating email, but she takes the necklace and the stuffed animal from Billy when she goes. and doesn't tell him anything about where she is going. maybe her plan was to make him worry, or maybe she planned on letting him know when she got there. the two behaviours combined just show how conflicted she remained about that whole entire relationship. she loved him, but she also kind of hated him, too.

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

No I understand what you are saying.

But I am talking about the police mostly.

Why are the police (leading everyone to believe) that they are convinced a phone call Maura had with her sister hours earlier is what led to her becoming upset.

Is it a tactic.

Did police not want the public to even know about the 12:07 a.m. to 12:14 a.m phone call that Maura made to her boyfriend on her cell phone that night?



Back to the vasi angle.

The campus newspaper, the Daily Collegian broke with the story of vasi being hit on the very same day Maura went missing.


Now to be fair, there are two newspapers in Amherst and while I can't pull up the archives from the Amherst bulletin for some reason, they may have ran with the vasi story before that Monday.

Point is, would Maura seeing an actual article about the hit and run in the paper, spook her to leave (if she indeed had been involved in the hit and run)?


The article did mention that vasi had been upgraded from critical condition to serious condition.

do you have that call log?

I think whatever finally spooked her to leave (because I think it was like a witches brew pot, waiting to over-boil) took place in the presence of FM. She had already been researching places to go by the time that article would have come out.

 

[Lolacat]

Obviously nothing I'm about to say is 100% because I didn't actually know Maura, or her friends, or Billy, or her family. Reading about her, and how people described her and her personality, I have an idea she could have easily been the type of person to graduate to the type of woman who was accepting of the occasional slap on the face from dear old Billy. jmo.

I think he was her first long term, serious relationship. she loved him, he took care of and protected her, just like daddy. I think he was strong willed and firm with her, just like daddy, and she did what he told her to. he was the aggressor, and she was passive. She might get mad at him for things, but at the end of the day, she loved him and he took care of her. I think she really needed and wanted a protector, and she saw that in Billy. When he cheated (by some accounts, more than once), she took him back, though clearly remained angry/hurt by passive aggressively leaving that email on her bed, and by doing her own bit of cheating. but she didn't leave him. that probably never entered into her mind. it probably never would have. one part of her probably felt very, very trapped, especially with the crazy mother mixed in. (she disturbs me greatly...it's almost as if there were THREE people involved in their relationship.) another part of her felt very protected, exactly what she wanted.

I think she was having a huge inner conflict with herself, with people planning out the rest of her life for her ZOMG PICKET FENCE, and that feeling safe and good, but also knowing she would have no control over anything, and always being the "take him back" girl.

the same email she said "I love you stud" she also said something like "honestly I didn't want to talk to anyone today" which really means "I didn't want to talk to YOU". usually when people feel the need to inject the word "honestly" into a sentence, it indicates that what they are about to say is untruthful.

so she leaves out the cheating email, but she takes the necklace and the stuffed animal from Billy when she goes. and doesn't tell him anything about where she is going. maybe her plan was to make him worry, or maybe she planned on letting him know when she got there. the two behaviours combined just show how conflicted she remained about that whole entire relationship. she loved him, but she also kind of hated him, too.

Your're right. These are all very good points. I must try not to look at this situation through my own filter. Just looking around at my female friends, its blatantly obvious that women often go for men either just like their fathers, OR, the complete opposite to them. We often seek out whats familiar to us, even if its dysfunctional. I wonder why she left the old email about Billy's cheating out- was it meant to convey a *message*?

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

I think so. I think it was a passive aggressive attempt to say she was still not over his cheating, that everything wasn't all perfect and roses. IMHO, Maura struggled a lot to speak the truth if it would cause conflict, so that was as close as she was going to come to bringing up something Billy thought was all worked out.

 

[Gene S.]

I wonder why she left the old email about Billy's cheating out- was it meant to convey a *message*?

Certainly it meant that she believed there was a good chance that someone other than her would be the next person to enter her dorm room. Whatever her plan was, she thought the email would offer some explanation to Billy, her family, and/or her friends about why she had done whatever she had done.

 

[Fireweed]

Certainly it meant that she believed there was a good chance that someone other than her would be the next person to enter her dorm room. Whatever her plan was, she thought the email would offer some explanation to Billy, her family, and/or her friends about why she had done whatever she had done.

Yeah it was a passive-aggressive way of saying "You worried since you have not heard from me in days? Well you should be! It is all your cheating *advertiser censored* fault!"

Recall that Maura spent a lot of time on the phone with Billy Sunday early morning. He refuses to discuss what they talked about, but based upon the email and the trip north, I am going to assume that their relationship was in major meltdown mode at that point.

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

Yeah it was a passive-aggressive way of saying "You worried since you have not heard from me in days? Well you should be! It is all your cheating *advertiser censored* fault!"

Recall that Maura spent a lot of time on the phone with Billy Sunday early morning. He refuses to discuss what they talked about, but based upon the email and the trip north, I am going to assume that their relationship was in major meltdown mode at that point.

BR has refused to say very much, at all, for someone he was engaged to be engaged to be engaged to be engaged to...something or other. When he talked about the 5amish phone calls Maura made from Fred's phone, and said that she seemed upset about something else, I think that was sort of the truth. She was upset about something else, and she wasn't saying what it was, but I think he probably knew, anyway...he just wasn't going to tell anyone that it was him. "yeah, well, she was kind of upset about the accident, but you know, I'm a serial cheater and a Bossy McBosserson, and she was pretty upset about that, too." I don't see him confessing that, ever.

 

[Fireweed]

I mean Maura calls Billy all upset the day before she leaves and leaves a cheating email from him on her packed up stuff. It seems fairly obvious that he was the main reason she skipped town. The car accident made a bad situation worse, but Billy must have been the main cause of her depression.

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

yes, I think that people take the word of his mother all too quickly, how they were so happy and going to get married and live happily ever after, and she loved him so much, so they discount the fact that she left that email out for people to see.

I think that their relationship was a very large part of what was causing her distress on a constant, unrelenting basis.

I don't care if she DID email him saying "I love you stud" before she left. that, to me, just proves what I said before, that she was a passive, don't rock the boat person, getting along and keeping things calm. but she didn't want to actually talk to him...she avoided his call.

if I had to whip out my crystal ball and go guessing without evidence, I'd say that he cheated on her yet again, and that was that. If only she had just punched him in the face instead of running. jmo.

 

[ZooSleuth]

I have a question about the Saturn. Why is it that newer photos that JR posted of it, it appears that the windshield is in perfect condition, yet the older photos show the crack in the windshield on the top driver's side corner? Might the windshield have been taken in for evidence?

Also it was mentioned that the Saturn had extensive body damage prior to wrecking it before her disappearance. Was this damage ever explained?

 

[walkingdeadgirl]

I have a question about the Saturn. Why is it that newer photos that JR posted of it, it appears that the windshield is in perfect condition, yet the older photos show the crack in the windshield on the top driver's side corner? Might the windshield have been taken in for evidence?

Also it was mentioned that the Saturn had extensive body damage prior to wrecking it before her disappearance. Was this damage ever explained?

I don't know why the windshield isn't cracked in those photos. Maybe the family fixed it?

No, the damage was never explained, though an auto body expert confirmed the damage and supposedly a police officer also knew about the damage. I've also read that Maura was going to be both questioned about the Vasi accident and charged for the accident in FM's car, had she not disappeared. I haven't been able to confirm these statements, other than an interview that JR did with the officer from the Toyota accident who said she would most likely be charged.