NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #13

[JeannaT]

Without digging through past threads, was all the alcohol she purchased on her roadtrip found in the vehicle? Or just the box of wine.

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No. I think only the box of wine - and the fact that she took all the rest with her - on foot - is what gives rise to the thought there was a tandem car. If she's leaving on foot to hide from the cops it does seem a little odd that she'd carry so much heavy liquid with her.

But after all this time and evidence, I still think what I believed early on. She left the vehicle on foot, went into the woods somewhere and froze to death and has not yet been found. The most compelling evidence for that, to me, is that her cell phone never re-entered a zone where it could receive service. This was back in the day where people didn't really know to ditch a cell phone so you won't be tracked - yet her cell phone last worked at around 5 that afternoon, then she drove into an area without cell service, and then her phone never again was within range of cell service. It's somewhere in the local area where she got out of the wrecked car.

 

[JeannaT]

Wow. A lot more information about this case.
If she was abducted and harmed-- I'm feeling we'll never find out what happened.
Then of course there are other cases where someone thought to be long lost turned up.
Maybe she's hiding in plain sight somewhere with an alias ? It happens.
If that was the case... is there anything that could be used to track her down or lure her from hiding ?
Thinking out loud.

If she was abducted and harmed, I think we have a better chance of finding out what happened than if she wandered into the woods and froze, and now is covered with leaves and debris that accumulate over this amount of time. Some girlfriend, mother, sister, prison acquaintance of the perp, etc., or the perp himself on his death bed is more likely to confess what happened than that she will be located in that dense and vast woods at this point. Sad. I really wish Fred Murray could have some peace and know what happened.

I also wish LE would take mercy on him and tell him what they know. Because they do know more than they're telling, and it just seems kind of mean spirited to not share it with him.

Makes me wish someone would find a leak in that little police department, and pay them big money for access to the records.

 

[mjk2015]

A couple of things.

1.) She wasn't convicted, she pled out. Semantics? Sure. But words matter.

2.) Her father told her to put the rag in her tailpipe to prevent it from smoking. He never said anything about evading police.

3.) Moreover, petty theft, especially the theft of food, is a hallmark sign of severe bulimia. That diagnosis, unlike your charges of ASPD, is actually supported by the testimony of people who knew Maura and shared quarters with her.

People who watched Disappeared and did a little more investigating perhaps feel betrayed by the "All American Girl" image they were sold. I get that. But the full-tilt opposite of what one sees on television is hardly where the truth lies either. Besides, when I read your posts, all I see is someone using the gaunt appearance of a troubled young woman in a grainy black and white photo taken at a rock bottom moment in her young life as a means to justify believing the worst about her. That's the worst kind of armchair sleuthing.

what i meant by "convicted" is that it is a fact; she did engage in criminal behavior. i didn't use the word in its legal sense but i agree, words matter and i should have used another word there.

her father did have intent to evade the police,

That weekend, her father came up from his job in Connecticut to help Maura find a new car. Maura’s 1996 Saturn “kind of blew a cylinder” and was “smoking something fierce,” according to Fred Murray. “I said, ‘You can’t drive this car. The cops will pull you over in a heartbeat,’” he recalls. As a temporary fix, Fred says he suggested she put a rag inside the tailpipe to hide the smoke.

http://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/article/2014/01/28/maura-murray/

she may have stolen food but she also stole non-food items. i discerned her pretty much straightaway, literally within the first couple of paragraphs i read about her story. i had no knowledge of her prior to reading the first-ever article i read. as for her appearance in the mugshot, it reinforced my original perception of her. the more i read and learned about her the more it became apparent that she came from a dysfunctional family and would be the family's "identified patient".

 

[mjk2015]

i spent a few hours over the weekend reading about Maura Murray and her family.

she made it as close as five miles away from her planned destination: vermont. i find it very highly unlikely and improbable that she was a spontaneous, unplanned victim of a random heinous crime like abduction and murder. i realize that just about anything is possible and it can't be ruled out with certainty but i can't take my eye off the facts that,

1. she planned to go to vermont
2. she was actively carrying out that plan
3. she was within 5 miles of reaching her destination

another very interesting thing that caught my eye was the spiritual / soul matter between her and her father. check this out,

Not Without Peril: The Extended Chapter

while her destination was vermont, she technically crashed and disappeared in new hampshire.

see father and daughter lost in new hampshire?

it's almost as if their souls have formed an extended chapter in the book she loved. she and her father had spent time together hiking in new hampshire. she disappeared there and her father subsequently spent years there, looking for her. i'd like to know more about their relationship and the sort of things they did and talked about while hiking in new hampshire. it could be beneficial to solving her mystery.

we sometimes prophecy in our lives. if her father thinks back to the sort of things they did and talked about while hiking in new hampshire he might have an epiphany of innate knowledge. that's how the spirit works.

aside of those things, one thing i'm really stuck on is the email she sent to her school about a death in the family. she said she would contact them when she returned.

 

[Skigirl]

She may have been close to the Vermont border, but she was more than 5 miles from her destination. And I doubt she planned the accident.

i spent a few hours over the weekend reading about Maura Murray and her family.

she made it as close as five miles away from her planned destination: vermont. i find it very highly unlikely and improbable that she was a spontaneous, unplanned victim of a random heinous crime like abduction and murder. i realize that just about anything is possible and it can't be ruled out with certainty but i can't take my eye off the facts that,

1. she planned to go to vermont
2. she was actively carrying out that plan
3. she was within 5 miles of reaching her destination

another very interesting thing that caught my eye was the spiritual / soul matter between her and her father. check this out,

Not Without Peril: The Extended Chapter

while her destination was vermont, she technically crashed and disappeared in new hampshire.

see father and daughter lost in new hampshire?

it's almost as if their souls have formed an extended chapter in the book she loved. she and her father had spent time together hiking in new hampshire. she disappeared there and her father subsequently spent years there, looking for her. i'd like to know more about their relationship and the sort of things they did and talked about while hiking in new hampshire. it could be beneficial to solving her mystery.

we sometimes prophecy in our lives. if her father thinks back to the sort of things they did and talked about while hiking in new hampshire he might have an epiphany of innate knowledge. that's how the spirit works.

aside of those things, one thing i'm really stuck on is the email she sent to her school about a death in the family. she said she would contact them when she returned.

 

[Caffeine]

Only Maura knew her true destination.

Reasonably, we can speculate it was VT but she called a few different places about lodging, so there's no indication of an exact place she planned on going.

With that said, I do believe she had something in mind but whether or not she shared that with anyone, we don't know. A young woman traveling that far, by herself, to stay by herself does seem unusual but ultimately I think something happened after the crash that led to her demise.

 

[mjk2015]

She may have been close to the Vermont border, but she was more than 5 miles from her destination. And I doubt she planned the accident.

correct. her destination in vermont was further away but she got as close as 5 miles to the state line. that's significant and meaningful. there is evidence that she planned to go to vermont: the directions she printed and the fact that she was 5 miles from the state line. i don't think she was headed to vermont to kill herself there, and i don't think the accident was a suicide attempt. from what i've read, the place she crashed is a hot spot for accidents. when i learned that information, i abandoned the idea that she may have been traveling with an accomplice (who would've been traveling behind her or ahead of her in another car). unless she's traveled that road before and knew it well, it seems unlikely that she planned the accident for any reason.

edit: i'm stuck thinking about it, just remembered something.

a caller on the night of the accident reported seeing a man in the vehicle smoking a cigarette. did maura smoke? maybe it was her, not a man.

 

[DakotaMayi]

that's twice now you've taken an unwarranted shot at me.

there's no assumption at all: Maura was a liar and a thief and an alcoholic from a dysfunctional family. her father taught her evasion (evading the police) while endangering her (obviously, it speaks to the family dynamics). those are spoken as neutral facts. i opened people's eyes to see it.

the mugshot (it is a mugshot) is blatantly obvious and self-evident. countless other people have remarked about her appearance yet you're bent to take a shot at me for bringing it to people's awareness.

in what i've read, i'm also not the only person who discerned some pathology in her (psychopathy or sociopathy). as i've said before, and i maintain my view, i see her as an unmasked and blooming sociopath. you can dislike my view but getting personal with me about it and taking shots at me is an emotional reaction.

did you know that Billy was assigned to be her mentor (for the trouble she was in) but later became her boyfriend? a sociopath would do something like, manipulate a mentor into becoming one's boyfriend, in order to control his mentorship of her.

you might not see it that way, but please do refrain from any further unwarranted attacks against me for speaking my views on her case.

edit: just curious. did her father ever try to get her help for her alcoholism / alcohol abuse?

Don't worry. The ignore button is a friend in this situation. You are more than titled to your view. Thanks for posting the photo, you give me information I never had before on Maura so your bringing a lot to the thread.

Apparently I am disappointed in Maura for not being the person portrayed in 'Disappeared.' Not what I said at all.

Hmm.. I have never heard about her getting help for it/re Fred getting her help. Would be good to know though if anyone else can enlighten!

 

[Skigirl]

Only Maura knew her true destination.

Reasonably, we can speculate it was VT but she called a few different places about lodging, so there's no indication of an exact place she planned on going.

With that said, I do believe she had something in mind but whether or not she shared that with anyone, we don't know. A young woman traveling that far, by herself, to stay by herself does seem unusual but ultimately I think something happened after the crash that led to her demise.

Caffeine, In what other states did she look for lodging if not all in Vermont? Can you please provide a link to the information to which you are referring? Thanks.

 

[Caffeine]

Caffeine, In what other states did she look for lodging if not all in Vermont? Can you please provide a link to the information to which you are referring? Thanks.

Well for sure we know two, she called 800-GO-STOWE in VT and Linda Salamone's rental in North Conway, NH. Her dad also speculated Bartlett, NH as a destination...so that's why I say we don't really know her exact destination.

 

[mjk2015]

Well for sure we know two, she called 800-GO-STOWE in VT and Linda Salamone's rental in North Conway, NH. Her dad also speculated Bartlett, NH as a destination...so that's why I say we don't really know her exact destination.

yes, she looked into place in NH too but because she was 5 miles from the vermont state line you can conclude that her destination was vermont (she printed directions to vermont). vermont is definitely where she was headed. she was 5 miles away. where in vermont, dunno. maybe stowe, maybe burlington.

 

[Steleheart]

Caffeine, In what other states did she look for lodging if not all in Vermont? Can you please provide a link to the information to which you are referring? Thanks.

Well for sure we know two, she called 800-GO-STOWE in VT and Linda Salamone's rental in North Conway, NH. Her dad also speculated Bartlett, NH as a destination...so that's why I say we don't really know her exact destination.

Here is at least one early link referencing her inquiry into the Bartlett NH Condo. The call to the Salamones was the last call she made that day et they were not contacted by LE.

http://dailycollegian.com/2005/01/26/missing-students-parents-angry-over-police-investigation/

 

[DakotaMayi]

http://www.patriotledger.com/news/2...rs-in-disappearance-of-hanson-woman-continues

 

[exsxpx310]

Is there a picture of the car with a rag in the tailpipe? I want to know if the rag was stuffed in the tail pipe or just hanging out. Because the only reason I believe a rag would be placed there is to stop exhaust gases from escaping the tailpipe. If there is a leak along the pipe, exhaust gases might permeate into the cabin of the car.

 

[Raging Ranter]

Only Maura knew her true destination.

Reasonably, we can speculate it was VT but she called a few different places about lodging, so there's no indication of an exact place she planned on going.

With that said, I do believe she had something in mind but whether or not she shared that with anyone, we don't know. A young woman traveling that far, by herself, to stay by herself does seem unusual but ultimately I think something happened after the crash that led to her demise.

Her proximity to the Vermont border means very little. Headed north from Amherst MA, she'd have taken Interstate 91, which follows the Connecticut River valley along the NH/VT border. She'd have taken this route to points north, regardless of whether her destination were in VT or in the White Mountains of NH.

Now, considering she left I91 and was travelling toward the White Mountains on Route 112 when she lost control of her car, it is far more likely that her destination was in the White Mountains, as opposed to VT. Had she intended to go to Burlington or Stowe, she would not have had reason to leave the Interstate and travel down Route 112 towards the White Mountains.

We can add to that the known fact that the White Mountains range was a place dear to her heart, and also that she had made contact with condo accommodations in Bartlett NH (phone call confirmed by police). Those facts, when considered along with her direction of travel on 112 at the time of the accident, leave little room for a potential VT destination. She did some web searches for Stowe and Burlington VT, that is true, but ultimately her path does not indicate VT.

 

[Raging Ranter]

I'll add my own theory here, and it's not a unique one: I believe she panicked at the possibility of a DUI charge, ran off into the woods, and died of the elements. People argue she'd have left tracks in the snow, and that the area was "extensively searched". In fact, there is a lot of wildlife in that area, including a lot of big game. Anyone who's seen a deer trail through the woods in winter knows how trampled and hard packed these trails can be. She easily could have ran down such a trail on hard pack, and left very little for tracks. A little thaw or bit of fresh snow, or even fresh deer tracks overnight or the next day or two, would have obscured whatever slight tracks she left behind.

As for the extensive searching, Robert Kovack disappeared in a heavily wooded area of Virginia in September 1998, and was also the subject of an extensive ground search after his car was found at the side of the road. They found his body only this past March, about 700 feet from the bridge near where his car was found. The ID of the remains haven't been officially confirmed yet, but an article said the body was found with his ID on it, and law enforcement strongly believe it is his body. That's 18 years his body lay about 700 feet from the road. It happens.

 

[Skigirl]

I'll add my own theory here, and it's not a unique one: I believe she panicked at the possibility of a DUI charge, ran off into the woods, and died of the elements. People argue she'd have left tracks in the snow, and that the area was "extensively searched". In fact, there is a lot of wildlife in that area, including a lot of big game. Anyone who's seen a deer trail through the woods in winter knows how trampled and hard packed these trails can be. She easily could have ran down such a trail on hard pack, and left very little for tracks. A little thaw or bit of fresh snow, or even fresh deer tracks overnight or the next day or two, would have obscured whatever slight tracks she left behind.

As for the extensive searching, Robert Kovack disappeared in a heavily wooded area of Virginia in September 1998, and was also the subject of an extensive ground search after his car was found at the side of the road. They found his body only this past March, about 700 feet from the bridge near where his car was found. The ID of the remains haven't been officially confirmed yet, but an article said the body was found with his ID on it, and law enforcement strongly believe it is his body. That's 18 years his body lay about 700 feet from the road. It happens.

I think it's just as possible that she ran off into the woods as it is that she was abducted, and totally agree that she probably left the scene hoping to avoid a DUI. I've never understood the assertion that there were no tracks and therefore she must have left in a vehicle. Wasn't it snowing (therefore, her tracks would have been covered up as soon as they were made)? I also think she could have run up the road (where footprints would have been subsequently destroyed by wheel tracks and plowing) and there are so many places she could have hopped off the road that finding tracks next to the road would have been like finding needles in a haystack.

 

[Hapworth]

I think too that her remains will be found not so far from the accident sight. Its very easy to lose your bearings in a forest, especially in the dark of night. I've walked into a forest in daylight, following a trail. I left the trail and walked several feet away. When I turned around to head back, I paused....no matter which direction I looked, everything appeared to look the same. I panicked. It took me a bit of time to find my way back to the trail. I intially headed in the wrong direction but luckily heard and saw other trail walkers. My point is...alone, dark, in a forest, no trail to follow, Maura could have headed in one direction thinking she was near the road when in fact she was heading deep into the forest range. To lose your bearings only takes a few moments and a few steps.

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[Tssiemer]

I think too that her remains will be found not so far from the accident sight. Its very easy to lose your bearings in a forest, especially in the dark of night. I've walked into a forest in daylight, following a trail. I left the trail and walked several feet away. When I turned around to head back, I paused....no matter which direction I looked, everything appeared to look the same. I panicked. It took me a bit of time to find my way back to the trail. I intially headed in the wrong direction but luckily heard and saw other trail walkers. My point is...alone, dark, in a forest, no trail to follow, Maura could have headed in one direction thinking she was near the road when in fact she was heading deep into the forest range. To lose your bearings only takes a few moments and a few steps.

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Plus she had been drinking.


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[Skigirl]

Plus she had been drinking.


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Until I saw your post, I was going to say the same thing. Potentially drunk or tipsy, plus had just had an accident; that could lead someone to be disoriented pretty easily.