NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #16

[hollyblue]

It would be interesting to know if that check was found in his room in St. George.

Maybe the check was cashed and we just weren't told. I'm sorry, but after so many things that we have been told has been skewed or tweaked, I think we have to consider all avenues. Nothing personal.....just fact. We have been viewed as "outsiders" with no caring for SK and I think CC's post shows otherwise....there are people here who think about Steven everyday and wonder where he may be.

I still hold that it's extremely odd that two people..approximately the same age, same faith, go missing within the same week and one of them that had lived in the SLC area returned within that same week and not a wisp of either since. Add to that fact the conflicts of when and where he was seen during that week. Yes it could be a coincidence...but that would even make the odds greater. When was the last time that happened? If there was some kind of connection...we have never been told ...just like what they found on his computer. They have never said what was found on Josh/Susan's computer's either...nor the info about Susan's separate bank account. JMO

 

[hollyblue]

Huh? We talking about the same Utah here?

No, I'm just teasing with that -- but for some people, no, you can't find it in the state where your parents and family live. I don't think one has to go too far out on a limb to interpret his move to St. George as trying to get as far away from his family as he could without breaking ties. If that didn't work -- well, nothing left but a permanent break.

This is what I keep thinking. We try to apply logic to the problem, and it's not a logical problem. It's more likely an emotional and psychological one. We don't need to figure out what makes sense. We need to figure out what Steven was thinking, feeling, and trying to accomplish, even if it doesn't make sense to us from the outside. We need to get inside his head.

Yeah, I know. How?

Your observations are spot on, IMO. Funny (comical) people are usually very emotional. They pick up and feel (associate) very much with the people and going ons around them. Very "fined tuned" you could say. Musicians very much the same. People who are more logical thinking would not be able to get past the realism----even though it also is a perception. I agree the "worldly" comment may be over done, but if Steven were idealistic in his thinking...that doesn't match with logical either. The world is not as it could/should be.

 

[believe09]

thank you rd!!!

FWIW, I think that there might be some value to concentrating on the Whitney Ranch area and that final ping as a possible location for Steven. I may have missed it, but can any of the locals here weigh in on spots within sbakker's "triangulations" that might be a good place to conceal SK???

If nothing else, we can add some value and energy I think if we can come up with a realistic search area that has not been apparently searched to date. Let's not count ourselves out yet.

The bus ride did a good job of highlighting a search for an alive Steven-what about another approach for a Steven who may not be able to communicate for himself?

 

[hollyblue]

That's very likely. What concerns me is what happened in his life after he got to St. George. Not only didn't he seem to forge strong bonds in his new community, but it seems he had lost or greatlly decreased touch with friends from his past. That worries me.

I think he was trying through the church, but I would like to know if he had any social life outside of church functions. As for the friends in his past, I just think it was a fact of them moving on with their lives of new family..ie: wife and kids. Not much in common and he prolly felt like a 5th wheel if invited to their functions. Curious how close of friends he was with GW. This they had in common. To me, the question is why no regular job? If he wanted a wife and family...he wasn't showing too much fortitude in providing the avenue to it was he? Unless he was socking money away to be with someone, somewhere that was not on the approval list. JMO

 

[hollyblue]

thank you rd!!!

FWIW, I think that there might be some value to concentrating on the Whitney Ranch area and that final ping as a possible location for Steven. I may have missed it, but can any of the locals here weigh in on spots within sbakker's "triangulations" that might be a good place to conceal SK???

If nothing else, we can add some value and energy I think if we can come up with a realistic search area that has not been apparently searched to date. Let's not count ourselves out yet.

The bus ride did a good job of highlighting a search for an alive Steven-what about another approach for a Steven who may not be able to communicate for himself?

What about the roofs? Odd, but possible. I would think most places would do at least a check for maintenance problems ever once in awhile, but you never know.

I just watch a show on David Ray Parker and his "Toy Box" tonight and just wondered if and how many of these nutballs were around LV. It's reactions this young woman received that make me understand why people like Steven may have had trouble with logic.
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/david_parker_ray/1_index.html

 

[carbuff]

Could we ask the PI or the family if there's anything they'd like us to research?

 

[sbakker]

I think he was trying through the church, but I would like to know if he had any social life outside of church functions. As for the friends in his past, I just think it was a fact of them moving on with their lives of new family..ie: wife and kids. Not much in common and he prolly felt like a 5th wheel if invited to their functions. Curious how close of friends he was with GW. This they had in common. To me, the question is why no regular job? If he wanted a wife and family...he wasn't showing too much fortitude in providing the avenue to it was he? Unless he was socking money away to be with someone, somewhere that was not on the approval list. JMO

I wish we could hear from a family member some real facts about sk's background. Was he a loner? Did he have any medical problems? Is there any possibility of bi-polar, depression, ADD, aspherger's.

A few of his friends hav e said that he had some oddities they noticed, but I want to know just what he was like. People want to be kind, I understand, but.... I want to know more, it would help. Did people call him to hang out? Did he go to the movies, dances, dinner, with anyone? Who were his friends in St. George? Can any of his ward friends, respond to these things, if they know anything about his social life?

As I have mentioned, I was on the Disability Advisory Comittee in Ut. Many clients, that seemed normal and tried to make it in the work world , and socially, were falling off the edge. People say: "oh they seemed so happy, so confident, so with it". And then to find out, how difficult it was for them to make it mentally day to day. "I thought they had lots of close friends". Then to find out how lonely they really were.

If we knew more of what made sk tick, or people in St. George could give us more info.

 

[laytonian]

Could we ask the PI or the family if there's anything they'd like us to research?

I did, last week. Unfortunately, they are no longer responsive to us.

 

[sbakker]

I did, last week. Unfortunately, they are no longer responsive to us.

Oh, that is really sad. I am suprised they are not responsive to you, or those that have been so dedicated. But I am not in their shoes.

 

[laytonian]

Gosh, its so hard to know what direction to go. Do we try to look more into St. George friends, co-workers, neighbors? I mean, we really do not know who he knew in NV.

I saw a cold case on our local news this week, about a gal who was shot in 1979. The case was reopened last year, and the detective got a new tip, of who it was. So we never know when somebody or something may happen. Just have to keep news about sk circulating.

Wouldn't it be nice if there were missing people in newpapers with their pics everyday? And easy websites with pics of missing people, and people could leave messages if they saw them?

Boy, what money could do...

Why not an "Missing Persons" cable TV or network show. Not AMW (mostly criminals)....but an hour show that featured five-minute segments about missing people FROM ONLY ONE OR TWO AREAS. Like "This week on Missing Persons, we're going to talk about five cases from Las Vegas and five from Cincinnati".....so people IN those areas would be tempted to watch, and the spread would be far enough that people in other areas would, too.

As for missing persons websites: I fear there are already too many generic "these people are missing" websites, by lots of well-intentioned, big-hearted people. I believe one, very good, well-done website with accurate data is better than many incompletes.

I'm not talking about individual case websites, which can be updated as the case progresses; I'm just talking about those that still have people listed as missing, who've been found. And there's more than you'd think. carbuff and I found several, just researching the "similar cases" page entries.

...and yes, I'm talking about city/county pages, too. In Utah, the state has a missing persons case page. Now some cities have their own, too.

Why can't all of these agencies get together and cooperate on NAMUS and findthemissing.org?

....and if it's namus, why isn't their URL namus.org???

/soapbox (sorry)

 

[laytonian]

Oh, that is really sad. I am suprised they are not responsive to you, or those that have been so dedicated. But I am not in their shoes.

The mission was successful.

 

[laytonian]

thank you rd!!!

FWIW, I think that there might be some value to concentrating on the Whitney Ranch area and that final ping as a possible location for Steven. I may have missed it, but can any of the locals here weigh in on spots within sbakker's "triangulations" that might be a good place to conceal SK???

If nothing else, we can add some value and energy I think if we can come up with a realistic search area that has not been apparently searched to date. Let's not count ourselves out yet.

The bus ride did a good job of highlighting a search for an alive Steven-what about another approach for a Steven who may not be able to communicate for himself?

Should we figure that the tip ("placing" SK in the area south of the Henderson Exec Airport) was a purposeful wild goose chase, to deflect attention from an actual crime scene?

Does that mean the hills east of the Whitney Ranch area (coincidentally the area of that last phone ping) would be a logical search area.

The "walking map" between those two points, shows us a few things:
1 - It's nearly a straight line
2 - It's unlikely he walked that far
3 - It's an area where remains have been found, previously
4 - IIRC, isn't it a more criminally-active part of town than SCA?
5 - It's far from where people would/did search for him.

 

[carbuff]

Should we figure that the tip ("placing" SK in the area south of the Henderson Exec Airport) was a purposeful wild goose chase, to deflect attention from an actual crime scene?

Does that mean the hills east of the Whitney Ranch area (coincidentally the area of that last phone ping) would be a logical search area.

The "walking map" between those two points, shows us a few things:
1 - It's nearly a straight line
2 - It's unlikely he walked that far
3 - It's an area where remains have been found, previously
4 - IIRC, isn't it a more criminally-active part of town than SCA?
5 - It's far from where people would/did search for him.

I think not -- because as long as there was nobody searching in or looking at that area, there wasn't any need to deflect attention. That would only be necessary if searchers were getting too close to the real scene.

 

[laytonian]

I think not -- because as long as there was nobody searching in or looking at that area, there wasn't any need to deflect attention. That would only be necessary if searchers were getting too close to the real scene.

Not a full-blown search, obviously -- but it takes less than a minute to find a Z living right near the area of that last ping.

If someone was looking for Z, wouldn't they be contacting all the Zs in Vegas, where he supposedly had family?

 

[laytonian]

I left with this overwhelming feeling of sadness. The first thing that my husband said when we got in the car (not knowing what I had chosen to contemplate on during our session) was, "Have they found your man yet?" Yes, he calls Steven "my man" because I have spent hours reading here and also telling him about the little research I have done.

Really! My husband calls him "your guy" or "your buddy", because SK is like a third person in our home. I've assured him that this is a motherly reaction to a young man who touches the heart in so many ways.

Anyway, my point. I just keep having an overwhelming feeling that whatever happened to Steven started around Evening Lights. I guess I'm back to round one...maybe I'll get lucky and someone finally got sloppy.

And also...SK went to the temple prior to his disappearance...within weeks. I just don't believe that he decided to become homeless, maybe he decided something, but not that, during his session.

...and within four days, actually. It seems odd that within hours of that temple visit, he's at the ranch belonging to the parents of a girl he dated "a few times". (That ranch is so far off-route from Wendover or SLC, it makes no sense to drive there as a side trip from either of those places.)

It seems that if he went to Northern Nevada for other purposes, he wouldn't have been able to cruise around at will with someone else's "stuff" -- and then take two days to deliver cash to someone. It'd be all one long trip without time for a sidetrip. IMO.

Hmm....just thought of something: that "friends say he went there to look for a job". Maybe that's what he was texting about, after he walked away from the car? AND that the "looking for a job" began after visiting RV and learning that there was no future in that direction. "Might as well move on....."

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

The mission was successful.

So did you hear something new?

An employee of RK posted on his own Facebook page recently regarding SK and encouraged his friends to join the SK Facebook page to help get the word out. He said RK is his boss. Anyway, sounds like the family is still actively searching...they just don't have any direction.

You can find the post by searching SK on Facebook and adding RK's first name to the google search.

 

[hollyblue]

I wish we could hear from a family member some real facts about sk's background. Was he a loner? Did he have any medical problems? Is there any possibility of bi-polar, depression, ADD, aspherger's.

A few of his friends hav e said that he had some oddities they noticed, but I want to know just what he was like. People want to be kind, I understand, but.... I want to know more, it would help. Did people call him to hang out? Did he go to the movies, dances, dinner, with anyone? Who were his friends in St. George? Can any of his ward friends, respond to these things, if they know anything about his social life?

As I have mentioned, I was on the Disability Advisory Comittee in Ut. Many clients, that seemed normal and tried to make it in the work world , and socially, were falling off the edge. People say: "oh they seemed so happy, so confident, so with it". And then to find out, how difficult it was for them to make it mentally day to day. "I thought they had lots of close friends". Then to find out how lonely they really were.

If we knew more of what made sk tick, or people in St. George could give us more info.

Up until October he would have had some money coming in and we don't know how much he was earning passing out flyers or even how long he had been doing it. But, either way, unless he had unknown money socked away somewhere, there wouldn't have been much financially to support socialization. Taking someone out to dinner and to a movie would have been a big chunk out of what little income he had coming in. That's what strikes me so odd of him not capturing a job. What if anything was he doing socially...it had to be hard to just stay in his room or hang around the house with a roommate he had nothing in common with? He had opportunities in church functions, but to take someone out on a date, it would have been a little hard and a little uncomfortable for a man in his position. I'm sure SK found it hard to start to his life over again, but he did have the church and the people there around him and from what we have, he was very involved. And according to Naegle, there were no medical or mental issues. If he did just walk away, he had walked away from family and close friends in April and finally the church too in December, so some expectation was not being met..again? That's why I think if he did just walk away, he would not be involved in the church. It would be the first avenue they would try in finding him and if he really did not want to be found, he would avoid it. Puzzling...to say the least to everyone except SK if this is what he chose.

 

[believe09]

I believe SK was swept up into something that began in St George, as in the initial contacts were made there. I have a hard time believing that he knowingly put himself in the position of being on the outside of the law, but I do believe unintentionally he may have ended up being on the opposite side of his beliefs. I think he innocently left a trail that will lead back to the person(s) he was involved in, and that we do not have enough information to figure out who it is....clearly LE does not have enough info because they have ALL of the cards, and they have not been able to move on it.

So I ask myself given what we do know, can we make an educated guess as to where evidence might be? The phone has not been used that we know of outside of the last ping-so either it was tossed in the Whitney Ranch area....perhaps into a dumpster or out a window on the highway??? Or maybe there is a better chance that we can make a guess as to where SK might be if he were in that area.

Laytonian, your thought process is working for me....fwiw.

 

[believe09]

Now, the bus ride-it was a search for a live Steven based upon tips presumably. Wish we knew if it was new tips or the ones from January....I cannot imagine the heartache of this family.

I mean in April they were looking for a body and in June/July they were looking for a live person.

They must have whiplash from all of the emotions...

 

[laytonian]

Now, the bus ride-it was a search for a live Steven based upon tips presumably. Wish we knew if it was new tips or the ones from January....I cannot imagine the heartache of this family.

I mean in April they were looking for a body and in June/July they were looking for a live person.

They must have whiplash from all of the emotions...

I think it was a combination of all the "sightings" that had come in: Best Buy/Home Depot, bus tip at Craig & MLK, IHOP tip on Boulder Hwy, and others we don't know about. From looking at the bus maps, all those "sightings" (and likely others we don't know about) were along bus routes and on major streets/shopping areas.

It was also a good way to round up and check them all out, at once. We saw gsmith post from the search about an IHOP, so I think that was still on their minds.

AND.....if I were them, I'd rather be hopeful about the "sightings" than all of the more dire indications.