Match! NY - Caledonia, WhtFem 1UFNY, 13-19, Turquoise Necklace, Nov'79 *Tammy Alexander*

[BaxterDE42]

Ok! You summed it up far better than i with two words - - "human intervention"!
Yep, that is what I mean rather than relysolely on the computer, of which I think mine is about to crash for the third time today. Honestly...you guys and gals are awesome. I will get back to you later in pm and we can possibly discuss your theory on Buckskin girl? I know you have a reason for your belief and I am interested in hearing it.
Meanwhile...got to call a techie....
Blessings to all

 

[Roselvr]

I found Margaret Holst in Namus and DNA is on file so I imagine this is probably a rule out by default...

Sorry I'm so far behind... Even if there is DNA Status: Sample submitted - Tests complete; it means nothing because we can't assume they're even in the same database. Look at Racine WI Jane Doe & Aundria/Alexis Bowman. Racine is held by LE. Alexis's mom Cathy had a heck of a time getting them compared.

If anything, the red hair doesn't match; I also feel Cali's hair was permed. Reading her Charley Project my gut says the guy wasn't telling the truth and that she'll be found closer to home.

I would suggest submitting to get the rule out so we can move past her. I believe SSA has added her to the next submit list. We all have opinions. This is how cases are solved.

Just wanted to update with info. Prior to sending a case report, I had all the photo work done...meaning measurements taken by software for this purpose. Distances between eyes bone structure hairline, etc. All match. Enhanced photos show what appears to be broken or decayed tooth (14) which is listed as a particularly bad tooth for Cali. Although no uniques marks for Cali are listed, I can see a faint dot on lower lip in same area as that of Cali.
Hair is brown and curly which is also consistant. Eye color consistant, as is height. Weight is down a few pounds but never considered in a potential match if the time frame is long.
Cali had tan lines in NOv. Odd? Not if from California which also is one of the three places unique to the pollen screening. SW jewelry just a side but interesting.

Everyone who had an email listing received an email reoprt along with phone calls to Atorney General, California and NY contacts.

PLease! I can't stress this enough. disregard tip lines!!! Most folks working these with the exception of missing children, either ignore thiese tips or completely dismiss them. Make your case short, sweet and as concice as possible but get the attention of your receipient by not only listing consistencies, but by connecting the dots for them. Helen went missing 2 years before Cali was found. She went missing under suspicious circumstances. If she was ditched by a companion, I can see her hitching rides. Also try to find a reason to believe your MP would end up across the country as a UP. If you believe in it (your case)...then sell it and make others believe it. These UP's must have someone looking beyond superficial photos. Learn to research and learn facial structure and how features change due to trauma or decomp. I hapen to know there are very serious researchers here and am thankful every day for it. I will be calling on a couple of you to assist me with my missing relative soon.

NOTE: I am NOT saying this MP is Cali. I am saying I believe it to be based on all of the non-scientific comparisons and research based on the circumstances of both cases. I have done my best to "sell" this possibility to those who make the decision to revisit a scientific review.
If it is not her, then my research is saved for another possible. Never toss out your notes or ideas!

Just another side....I do not understand how Cali's postmortem images got morphed into what I am seeing on DOE!! None of the measurements work and if we go by recons we can be searching an entirely different age group.

There are a lot of people that still have tan lines in Nov. I don't think it means she was in the sun; I think it means her body holds the color longer. For all we know she had a really deep tan in late Aug/ early Sept.

 

[Still_Seek_Answers]

I can add Margaret Holst to the list I am submitting. I think she will be a rule out on dental. I asked Burgess in a email about Cali's teeth, rather or not they were crooked,a couple months ago when I was looking at someone who had crooked teeth, and he says they are not.(See email below) Margaret's Charley profile says she has crooked teeth.

I have asked him twice about Cali's dental chart. If you look at it, it shows tooth # 14 as a postmortem loss. Just not sure how a gunshot above the eye would have removed that particular tooth. It also shows a N (natural tooth), in all 4 wisdom teeth slots. Yet it is typed in that none of her wisdom teeth were erupted? It also shows none of them as impacted. If they were there, then she is probably older than the estimates. It says models were made, so he should be able to find out which is correct with out to much difficulty.

I agree with not understanding how Cali's postmortem got morphed into the new recon that NCMEC put out. Not that I am knocking anyone or their talent, but all I can say is...I sure don't see it.

Annie,

There is no mention in any of the documentation that her teeth were uneven. Also I never noted that they were uneven in any photographs.

I'm not sure what vehicle description you are speaking about. There were several mentioned early on in the case but none of them were ever definitively tied to it. No plate numbers were ever provided by the witnesses.

We still do not have any additional facts regarding her ancestry.

I cannot answer whether or not she had mascara. I can tell you that there was no mention of it in the Coroners report or the medical examiners report.

We appreciate the continued assistance. I will have somebody look into the names you provided. Thanks again.

Take care.


Matthew D. Burgess, Chief Deputy
Police Services
Livingston County Sheriff's Office
4 Court St.
Geneseo, NY 14454

 

[Still_Seek_Answers]

We have this information posted on Cali's Facebook page. Roselvr also posted it in the thread back when we first got the information.That post is pretty far back, so I am posting it again to just make it easier.

One thing I would like to point out. Question #7, when we asked about Cali's wisdom teeth, we were told 2 were all the way erupted, one was partially erupted and severely decayed, and the 4th one was still below the gum line. That is a direct contradiction to the information shown in the post above on Cali's dental chart. Also, when Burgess was asked about the truckers, his answer is that there were no truckers who saw Cali hitchhiking, or spoke to her. He states the only person they could find who remembered seeing her was the waitress at the Lima Diner.

Per phone call 10/1 to LE
1. Blood type is A-
2. Shot first in the head then dragged face down into the field. No effort to hide her. Jacket was red. Road was busier then as the interstate was not built yet.
3. Dental isotopes were done in 05 and last year. First suggested Carolina to Texas. Second south west. Indication a lot of corn in the diet.
4. His gut reaction is that she was on the older end of the age range given maturity and fewer food additives then accelerating development.
5. They match primarily with DNA and dentals.
6. Native Am heritage is a possibility but month in the tests can confirm that. They recently flooded the SW with fliers including the reservations but no response.

List of questions to LE 10/3 -

1. Was a tox screen done? We'd like to request a copy of the tox screen, police report and autopsy report. Do we need to use the Freedom of Info act to request it?

A - Tox screen was done and there were no drugs or alcohol in her system. I would be happy to answer any questions you have, but releasing any documents in their entirety may prove detrimental to a prosecution should be ever get to that point. Even though this is most certainly a "cold case", it is still open and being actively investigated.

2. Was it determined where she ate her last meal?

A - It was not determined with certainty, but we believe her last meal was at the Lima Diner. They were the only restaurant within a reasonable distance that served ham and corn the evening before she was found. The witness remembered a male and female coming in and that the female wore a red jacket that appeared too big for her. This witness was unable to positively identify our Jane Doe.

3. Had she ever given Birth?

A - There was no evidence of past or present pregnancy

4. General Hygiene & Hair - Has any info been released on her hygiene beyond her tooth decay? She cared enough to frost her hair approx 4 months before her death. Did the M.E. indicate whether he thought her hair was permed? Did the ME indicate how old her perm was? Did they keep any hair? Was she brushing her teeth? Did she shave her underarms and legs? Remove any facial hairs? Her eyebrows look tweezed, so she had access to a tweezer at some point. If she had been raised or living in the SW as the isotope testing on her teeth as well as the pollen revealed, then most likely she was hitch hiking from area to area. That was common back then. When kids are out on their own, they do not follow the normal routine so knowing the above would be helpful in determining if she was hitching for a while or not. i.e. how long was she likely on her own.

A - Her hygiene appeared to be good. I would surmise that she did brush her teeth, although there was no evidence of any dental care whatsoever. She did appear to have shaved her legs and under her arms. She had minimal facial hair and her eyebrows were normal, not bushy.

5. NECKLACE RELATED - many of us had the same jewelry; it was sold at Grants before they went out of business. Some got theirs through the mail... Was the turquoise checked to see what region it came from? My understanding is that each mine has different "strains". Perhaps that can pinpoint a location.

A - We have sent the necklace to the FBI lab on two occasions, but to my knowledge there has never been a "location" determined for the turquoise.

6. AGE RELATED - What was taken into consideration to get her age range? We know wisdom teeth; were growth plates used too? What was the age change from 20 to mid teen based on?

A - There was an original autopsy done at that time by a local doctor who was our County Coroner. There was a follow up exam done as well by someone from the Monroe County Medical Examiners Office. The original doctor thought 19-21 yrs. old. The second examiner estimated her to be 16-18 years of age and described her as "mid to late adolescence". I do not believe growth plates were used in any of these estimates. X Rays done at that time showed what the doctor described as a "lack of bone development for someone over 18 years old". He then estimated her at 16 years of age, plus or minus 2 years.

7. TEETH RELATED - What type of dental work was performed by a "foreign" dentist? Had her Canines come all the way down?

A - I have no idea what you mean by foreign dentist. She had never had any type of dental care. Two wisdom teeth had erupted, another was severely eroded and the fourth was still below the gums. Yes, her canines were all the way down.

8. CLOTHING RELATED - Brands and sizes and gender of shirt, pants, and shoes. Brand of panties and size. Did her shoes fit her? Size of her pants, shirt, panties and shoes. Were the pants also mens pants?

A - Her pants were a size 7. Bra was 32C. Blouse was a medium. Jacket was a large. There were no labels or size located on her panties. Shoes were a size 8. I have no information on fitment. I would say the pants were not mens due to size (7)

9. DINER RELATED - What was the name of the Diner ( in LIMA?)? How far from where she was found? Was she wearing the same outfit when at the diner? Since the waitress described the guy she was with, did they act like they knew each other?

A - Lima Diner was the name. The distance from where she was found to the Diner is just under 9 miles. The waitress noted the red jacket that appeared too big for her. The waitress noted that she appeared younger than the male she was with and the waitress assumed maybe they were brother and sister. She did not note any unusual behavior between the two.

10. TRUCKER RELATED - How many truckers actually remembered seeing her hitching? Where was the truck stop that the trucker saw her at (at 20 and 5 or somewhere else?)? How many thought her destination was Boston Mass Vs NY? How many truckers actually admitted seeing her the night before?

A - We checked every restaurant and truck stop headed east between Hopewell, NY (Ontario County) and Caledonia. We did not locate anyone other than the waitress at the Lima Diner who had any information. I am not aware of any truckers that saw her.

11. MISC - What part of her body was the spent slug found under? Since the slug was found under her the shot had to have exited her body, so most likely was the last shot. Were attempts made to get touch DNA off her clothing? If she was drug by feet into the cornfield, there should be touch DNA on her somewhere. The slug being under her says to me, the killer did not turn her over. Yet, no harm in checking that since one of us will have him on the phone anyway, right?

A - The slug entered her back and exited under her left arm near her breast. The slug was located while sifting the dirt under the body. Its location was consistent with the exit wound. We believe she was shot in the head at the shoulder of the road. Then dragged into the field by the feet face down. She was then shot again in the back. There was no such thing as touch DNA back then. Therefore, the evidence was not handled like we would today. Touch DNA was completed on the evidence, but was done recently.

12. Will they consider sending her DNA to 23andme to get ancestry line done? It is $99; they may be able to have it donated. It very well could provide a lead to her family name via matching cousins or siblings. Will provide info

A - Maybe. I would want more information first. We would need to know if we can provide a DNA profile as opposed to a swab. Due to the circumstances, we don't have a swab to send them. but there is already a profile for her based on our exhumation in 2005.

 

[DrDMike]

I wonder what events were going on around the area during the week of her death.

 

[rainwater]

Can missing person reports for juveniles be purged when the person does (or would have) turned 18, if they are not found? Is there a federal law that addresses that? Or is it left up to each individual state or LE department to decide what to do-keep the MP report or purge it?

 

[CarlK90245]

Can missing person reports for juveniles be purged when the person does (or would have) turned 18, if they are not found? Is there a federal law that addresses that? Or is it left up to each individual state or LE department to decide what to do-keep the MP report or purge it?

Yes, that was a problem back in the 70's when this happened. If a child was assumed to be a runaway, their missing person file was purged when the child turned 18. Their family has presumed that there was a missing persons file on them, when in fact, there isn't. And as those family members die, then there is absolutely no record or memory of the missing persons at all.

That is less of a problem now, but back then, it resulted in a lot of unidentified teens remaining UID for decades. Many of these have only been resolved recently.

 

[Nameless Helper]

Any idea when the purging of records at 18 stopped?

 

[ebonydarkness]

I wonder what events were going on around the area during the week of her death.

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~./gdead/79.html
There was a Grateful Dead show in Buffalo the day she was found. No indications Cali was a fan though.

 

[Still_Seek_Answers]

I may be wrong on this, so I am hoping someone else can remember. I think we can thank John Walsh that the record purging stopped? With the disappearance of Adam (July,1981), came the creation of NCMEC (june,1984)and the fight to change the laws surrounding missing children had been created. We had a few of our better known serial killers in the public eye by then and people became aware that predators were out there. I think that is when they stopped being "just runaways" and suddenly became missing children. We also had the nightmare of realizing many children had vanished from foster care, seemingly unnoticed. That came to light when the body of a young girl was found, decapitated, and while it turned out she was not in foster care, at first it was believed she was.

Anybody else recall?

 

[Roselvr]

I may be wrong on this, so I am hoping someone else can remember. I think we can thank John Walsh that the record purging stopped? With the disappearance of Adam (July,1981), came the creation of NCMEC (june,1984)and the fight to change the laws surrounding missing children had been created. We had a few of our better known serial killers in the public eye by then and people became aware that predators were out there. I think that is when they stopped being "just runaways" and suddenly became missing children. We also had the nightmare of realizing many children had vanished from foster care, seemingly unnoticed. That came to light when the body of a young girl was found, decapitated, and while it turned out she was not in foster care, at first it was believed she was.

Anybody else recall?

We know that Ohio purged Michelle Knight's record when they couldn't touch base with her mother. Michelle Vanished on August 23, 2002; so it seems that each state has it's own rules. Let's hope that they all learned a lesson when the Ohio girls escaped.

We also know that there are still paper missing files in some file cabinets and storage after Howard Hardin was identified April 2013 as a John Doe found shot execution style in Knox TN 30 years ago. Hardin had been reported missing in 1981 to the Knoxville Police Department by his girlfriend. His remains were found Jan. 12, 1982; wearing the same clothes that were in his missing persons report. It totally blows my mind that they did not connect the 2 back then.

NCMEC The formation of the National Center for Missing & Exploited Children was spurred by notable child abductions, such as the 1979 abduction of six-year-old Etan Patz from New York City, and the 1981 abduction and murder of six-year-old Adam Walsh from a shopping mall in Hollywood, Florida. Because police had the ability to record and track information about stolen cars, stolen guns, and even stolen horses with the FBI's national crime computer, it was believed that the same should be done with children. In 1984, the U.S. Congress passed the Missing Children's Assistance Act, which established a National Resource Center and Clearinghouse on Missing and Exploited Children. On June 13, 1984, the National Center for Missing & Exploited Children was formed by President Ronald Reagan in a White House ceremony to maintain those resources. The national 24-hour toll-free missing children's hotline 1-800-THE-LOST was also established.

 

[Still_Seek_Answers]

In both of those cases, LE was dealing with missing adults, I think? The laws surrounding missing adults are very different than those surrounding missing children. Those laws still have a long way to go. Missing adult cases need to be taken equally as serious, and that information needs to be kept also.(JMO) I do recall that it was the disappearance of Adam Walsh that drew national attention to the issues parents faced when a child disappeared. I think the Missing Child Protection Act is the one that made it mandatory for LE to take a MP report on a child, even if they were believed to be a runaway, and to maintain that record until that child was either found safe, or deceased.

Paper files still vanish, and sometimes valuable information still gets lost. At times we still run into cases from the 70's where a child was not reported. We still have many ;aws that need updated, especially with all the changes in technology. However, the system that is in place now is so much better than the one we had in the 70's.

 

[Roselvr]

In both of those cases, LE was dealing with missing adults, I think? The laws surrounding missing adults are very different than those surrounding missing children. Those laws still have a long way to go. Missing adult cases need to be taken equally as serious, and that information needs to be kept also.(JMO) I do recall that it was the disappearance of Adam Walsh that drew national attention to the issues parents faced when a child disappeared. I think the Missing Child Protection Act is the one that made it mandatory for LE to take a MP report on a child, even if they were believed to be a runaway, and to maintain that record until that child was either found safe, or deceased.

Paper files still vanish, and sometimes valuable information still gets lost. At times we still run into cases from the 70's where a child was not reported. We still have many ;aws that need updated, especially with all the changes in technology. However, the system that is in place now is so much better than the one we had in the 70's.

Yeah; I had forgotten Michelle was 22 when she went missing. I thought she was younger.
I hate to admit that I do remember Adam Walsh's son going missing; but that is all I do remember since I did not have a loved one that went missing. I started doing this when Believe found me at another forum in the people search section; asked me to help out on a case.

 

[traacker13]

View attachment 54742

I can add Margaret Holst to the list I am submitting. I think she will be a rule out on dental. I asked Burgess in a email about Cali's teeth, rather or not they were crooked,a couple months ago when I was looking at someone who had crooked teeth, and he says they are not.(See email below) Margaret's Charley profile says she has crooked teeth.

I have asked him twice about Cali's dental chart. If you look at it, it shows tooth # 14 as a postmortem loss. Just not sure how a gunshot above the eye would have removed that particular tooth. It also shows a N (natural tooth), in all 4 wisdom teeth slots. Yet it is typed in that none of her wisdom teeth were erupted? It also shows none of them as impacted. If they were there, then she is probably older than the estimates. It says models were made, so he should be able to find out which is correct with out to much difficulty.

I agree with not understanding how Cali's postmortem got morphed into the new recon that NCMEC put out. Not that I am knocking anyone or their talent, but all I can say is...I sure don't see it.

Annie,

There is no mention in any of the documentation that her teeth were uneven. Also I never noted that they were uneven in any photographs.

I'm not sure what vehicle description you are speaking about. There were several mentioned early on in the case but none of them were ever definitively tied to it. No plate numbers were ever provided by the witnesses.

We still do not have any additional facts regarding her ancestry.

I cannot answer whether or not she had mascara. I can tell you that there was no mention of it in the Coroners report or the medical examiners report.

We appreciate the continued assistance. I will have somebody look into the names you provided. Thanks again.

Take care.


Matthew D. Burgess, Chief Deputy
Police Services
Livingston County Sheriff's Office
4 Court St.
Geneseo, NY 14454

After seeing the dentals for both, I have to agree with you. It looks like Margarets upper front teeth are pretty crooked and her left incisor is very crooked. Cali ' s front teeth look pretty straight and more rounded than Margaret's.

 

[traacker13]

Still Seeks Answers

Do you know if they suspected Cali of having any genetic disorders or anything of that sort?

The reason I ask is that her facial features are somewhat unique - small, upturned nose, wide set eyes, flat nasal bridge...

 

[Roselvr]

Still Seeks Answers

Do you know if they suspected Cali of having any genetic disorders or anything of that sort?

The reason I ask is that her facial features are somewhat unique - small, upturned nose, wide set eyes, flat nasal bridge...

The photo you have as your avatar is the one that looks the least like Cali. Major Burgess said the one below was the most accurate.

 

[CarlK90245]

The photo you have as your avatar is the one that looks the least like Cali. Major Burgess said the one below was the most accurate.

If Burgess has postmortem photos that are more representative of her true look, I wish he would publicize them. Based on the PM photos that are out there, I think this new NCMEC image looks much less like her than the old NCMEC version (that Traacker just replaced).

 

[traacker13]

Thank you! I've updated it.

 

[traacker13]

Thank you, Carl K. I definitely agree with you.

 

[CarlK90245]

If Burgess has postmortem photos that are more representative of her true look, I wish he would publicize them. Based on the PM photos that are out there, I think this new NCMEC image looks much less like her than the old NCMEC version (that Traacker just replaced).

Thank you, Carl K. I definitely agree with you.

In general, this NCMEC artist is very good at creating lifelike images of people, but not so much at accurately depicting their facial features.

IMO, this image of Cali, and the same artist's depictions of Walker County Jane Doe, Racine Jane Doe, 1974 Long Beach CA (Shoreline Drive) Jane Doe, and many others aren't very close at all.