NY - First Responders NOT welcome at Ground Zero???

[Trident]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

I often see people holding up posts as the best post of the day. Are we alowed to hold up one as the worst?

 

[Quiche]

Well, if Bloomberg has the audacity to not include them in this remembrance ceremony, then he better get one arranged for his first responders. A very tacky move that ultimately won't resonate well with his constituents. Out of touch. imo

 

[Trident]

Well, if Bloomberg has the audacity to not include them in this remembrance ceremony, then he better get one arranged for his first responders. A very tacky move that ultimately won't resonate well with his constituents. Out of touch. imo

Ya know, I think they need to cancel the whole thing. Who needs a bunch of talking heads, leeching/living off our tax dollars, crying crocodile tears, with or without the families of the dead? If the families of the dead gave this any thought, they might wonder WHAT these talking head politicians ever did to help their fallen relatives. Did the big wigs, the suits, run into those buildings trying to rescue their loved ones? No, I didn't think so. Can anyone come with the name of one politician who lost their life in that fiasco?

Boycott the entire thing, those among us who lost loved ones in that infamy, vote the public leeches out of office. As far as I'm concerned, one first responder is worth 10/20 blood-sucking politicians.

 

[Trident]

Well, if Bloomberg has the audacity to not include them in this remembrance ceremony, then he better get one arranged for his first responders. A very tacky move that ultimately won't resonate well with his constituents. Out of touch. imo

Out of touch? LOL. Can you say, "Just don't give a crap"?

 

[Velouria]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

Wow.

I don't see anything remotely respectful about this post, due or otherwise.

Way to bash the victims here. I'm sure the families of those responders who died take tremendous comfort in hearing that their loved ones were essentially a bunch of fools rushing in.

 

[pghbrandi]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

Unbelievable. I have to ask, are you serious???

 

[hockeymom]

Unbelievable. I have to ask, are you serious???

Ok so if its just for families of the victims,why are politicians attending? Except for Rudy Guilliani,why should any other politician show their mug there?

 

[hockeymom]

Well, if Bloomberg has the audacity to not include them in this remembrance ceremony, then he better get one arranged for his first responders. A very tacky move that ultimately won't resonate well with his constituents. Out of touch. imo

Apparently there is one scheduled,but at a later date. But thats not the same and everyone knows it.
AS far as only family members being invited. Talk to 1st responders,they consider the people they work with their brothers and sisters. They should be there!!! :maddening:

 

[pghbrandi]

Ok so if its just for families of the victims,why are politicians attending? Except for Rudy Guilliani,why should any other politician show their mug there?

I didn't agree with that post that I quoted before. I think the first responders should be there. I don't think it should be a political event. I agree, Guilliani should be there, but that is all.

 

[SugarQueen]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

This entire post makes my heart ache. I will try to respond in the most respectful way possible.

I am horrified that anyone could think the very people there to save lives actually caused deaths ! After all they did and the risks to their own lives the idea that anyone would place blame on them is an insult! Think about what you would want them to do if you, or someone you loved was in one of those buildings.

So first responders should have done what ?? Left ?? Just let it all happen and watch??? We complain people DON"T get involved ... these people did!! They did the job they were sent to do. Their lives will NEVER be the same. Every single one deserves to be honored. Every single one deserves to be there.

 

[TallCoolOne]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

Wow. No words (that wouldn't get me banned for life)

Nope, not gonna do it, just not gonna........

~TCO~ sitting on hands now.

 

[HRCODEPINK]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

Wow...I don't think I will take the bait on this one. But thanks for today's exercise in restraint!

ETA: I will say this: Unlike the rest of New Yorkers, who thankfully weren't (according to your post) murdered by the negligent actions of these people that some call heroes, many of the first responders who made it stayed long after "working the pile" and pulling out the remains of those who didn't make it, all the while being told by our government that they were safe and the fumes and dust they were breathing would not make them sick. Then once it did make them sick, we waited ten years to give them any medical help and excluded cancer from the ailments that would be treated.....and snubbed them. Nice.

And while I suppose there is "always a chance" that a building could fall, in history only 3 steel framed structures have ever fallen due to fire, and all three of them fell that day. Those buildings were built to withstand multiple impacts from planes and I think that to blame the first responders, who didn't have proper radio equipment is a bit misleading.

 

[HRCODEPINK]

Ya know, I think they need to cancel the whole thing. Who needs a bunch of talking heads, leeching/living off our tax dollars, crying crocodile tears, with or without the families of the dead? If the families of the dead gave this any thought, they might wonder WHAT these talking head politicians ever did to help their fallen relatives. Did the big wigs, the suits, run into those buildings trying to rescue their loved ones? No, I didn't think so. Can anyone come with the name of one politician who lost their life in that fiasco?

Boycott the entire thing, those among us who lost loved ones in that infamy, vote the public leeches out of office. As far as I'm concerned, one first responder is worth 10/20 blood-sucking politicians.

BBM: Of course, nothing has been done for the fallen, but this is what they have done for those who are left behind:

http://money.cnn.com/2011/09/02/news/economy/911_health_insurance/

 

[Velouria]

All a politician can do is promise you that, if elected, he will hurt someone else on your behalf.

Oh adi, this is classic. :floorlaugh: So true!

 

[elmomom]

This is a very sensitive issue. I've treid to stay out of it, but I am somewhat personally involved and just cannot keep quiet any longer. I think the problem is that most people, removed from the actual events at the WTC as most if not all of you are, view the ceremony as a memorial of what happened to the country on 9/11.

This is not what is scheduled, and not what is the wish of the families of those killed at the WTC.

This is their first, and only, time to honor their lost ones at the site dedicated to their memory, and for many of the families, this is the ONLY place at which their loved one is to be memorialized. The haven't remains to bury, this is their loved one's gravesite and final resting place.

This is about the people who died and a Memorial to them. It is not a memorial to all of our glorification of how we were affected, or who was a hero and who was mayor. It is about and for those that died.

Most of what has been done, built, designed, planned, decided, erected, etc etc has been decided by a foundation made up of family members of the deceased. (that does include family members of first responders who died.) This was not Bloomberg's decision, it was not the decision of a politician, it was not anything other than what the FAMILIES chose to honor their DEAD relatives.

I'm so tired of all the drama. These people deserve to have their memorial. It does not belong to me, or to you, or to the country. It is theirs and I, for one, think trying to dictate what should happen on their memorial is DISRESPECTFUL.

 

[Peazzzer]

O wow what a slap in the face to the 1st responders who lost so many along with thier health. I say kick out the politicians. 1st responders your country men and women commend you even if your own city wont.

 

[Peazzzer]

Unbelievable! Tallcoolone can I sit w you? Thank g I read your post! I thought I had really lost it.

 

[hockeymom]

This is a very sensitive issue. I've treid to stay out of it, but I am somewhat personally involved and just cannot keep quiet any longer. I think the problem is that most people, removed from the actual events at the WTC as most if not all of you are, view the ceremony as a memorial of what happened to the country on 9/11.

This is not what is scheduled, and not what is the wish of the families of those killed at the WTC.

This is their first, and only, time to honor their lost ones at the site dedicated to their memory, and for many of the families, this is the ONLY place at which their loved one is to be memorialized. The haven't remains to bury, this is their loved one's gravesite and final resting place.

This is about the people who died and a Memorial to them. It is not a memorial to all of our glorification of how we were affected, or who was a hero and who was mayor. It is about and for those that died.

Most of what has been done, built, designed, planned, decided, erected, etc etc has been decided by a foundation made up of family members of the deceased. (that does include family members of first responders who died.) This was not Bloomberg's decision, it was not the decision of a politician, it was not anything other than what the FAMILIES chose to honor their DEAD relatives.

I'm so tired of all the drama. These people deserve to have their memorial. It does not belong to me, or to you, or to the country. It is theirs and I, for one, think trying to dictate what should happen on their memorial is DISRESPECTFUL.

I agree with your post as far as this should be about the families and if it is their wishes that no first responders and no clergy are present,then I would bow to them. My question to you then,is it they who decided or Mayor Bloomberg? I find it hard to believe families would give 2 hoots about any politicains or "dignitaries" as the Mayor put it, in attendence. I wouldn't. I'd want it to be a familys only event,no press, no hoopla,just the people who have no grave to visit.

 

[Velouria]

This is a very sensitive issue. I've treid to stay out of it, but I am somewhat personally involved and just cannot keep quiet any longer. I think the problem is that most people, removed from the actual events at the WTC as most if not all of you are, view the ceremony as a memorial of what happened to the country on 9/11.

This is not what is scheduled, and not what is the wish of the families of those killed at the WTC.

This is their first, and only, time to honor their lost ones at the site dedicated to their memory, and for many of the families, this is the ONLY place at which their loved one is to be memorialized. The haven't remains to bury, this is their loved one's gravesite and final resting place.

This is about the people who died and a Memorial to them. It is not a memorial to all of our glorification of how we were affected, or who was a hero and who was mayor. It is about and for those that died.

Most of what has been done, built, designed, planned, decided, erected, etc etc has been decided by a foundation made up of family members of the deceased. (that does include family members of first responders who died.) This was not Bloomberg's decision, it was not the decision of a politician, it was not anything other than what the FAMILIES chose to honor their DEAD relatives.

I'm so tired of all the drama. These people deserve to have their memorial. It does not belong to me, or to you, or to the country. It is theirs and I, for one, think trying to dictate what should happen on their memorial is DISRESPECTFUL.

And some of us think it's DISRESPECTFUL to make a point of UNinviting the first responders who risked their lives, many of whom are suffering poor health as a result of their heroism that day.

Are the costs associated with this memorial being assumed by the city or by the family foundation?

 

[Fairy1]

With all due respect, there probably would have been significantly fewer deaths if they had NOT all run into the buildings. It was not a wise thing to do and whoever made that decision was not exercosing good judgement. There was not a lot they could have done anyway, fighting a fire in a building that high is extremely difficult. By all heading up the fire escapes, they would have been slowing down people on the way down, and they probably killed significantly more people than they saved as a result of that. Not to mention themselves. Most of those emergency workers killed likely died because they were milling around at the base, not actually doing anything particulary neccessary. In a situation like that the sensible thing would have been to clear the area around the building because a collapse is allways a strong possibility under those circumstances, and then send in a much smaller team, not more than 50, to do whatever needed to be done to supervise the evacuation.

As for there being "a 1000" subsequent deaths, I doubt that. Emergency workers were not the only ones exposed to the dust cloud, so was half of manhattan, and if there was a subsequent deaths among emergency workers there would have been hundreds of thousands among New Yorkers in general.

In any case, the ceremony is held for the families of those who died, so that would inlcude the families of the emergency workers. But, most of the people who currently work for New York emergency servers would have joined in the decade since 9/11, so why do you think they should be attending the ceremony when they weren't even there?

Wow. Just WOW.