GUILTY NY - Shanta Myers, 36, Brandi Mells, 22, & 2 kids slain, Troy, 26 Dec 2017 *Arrest*

[shana]

Chaos in court as questions are raised about charges in Troy homicide

The article under the above headline has been updated. Of note:

Rensselaer County District Attorney Joel Abelove took unusual legal steps Thursday to keep two men accused of slaying four people in a Lansingburgh apartment locked up after an anticipated grand jury indictment was hamstrung by what sources described as a potentially improper police interrogation.

Lots of comments from Defense counsel are within the revision as well.

~jmo~

 

[shana]

bbm...

This is my understanding too. Upon first reading it, I was scared that some technicality was going to prevent the DA from bringing a case at all. But sounds like they just did a bit of legal maneuvering in order to give themselves another 6 days to get things figured out. I do think and hope that maybe Mann is talking.

Based on reports of his 'breakdown' at the end of the hearing, I've thought since the original court date that Mann was going to flip on White. I suspect he is doing exactly that; and as a result, the new 1st-degree Murder charge was brought against White with specifics (named victim and circumstances).

~jmo~

 

[Gardenista]

Chaos in court as questions are raised about charges in Troy homicide

The article under the above headline has been updated. Of note:

Rensselaer County District Attorney Joel Abelove took unusual legal steps Thursday to keep two men accused of slaying four people in a Lansingburgh apartment locked up after an anticipated grand jury indictment was hamstrung by what sources described as a potentially improper police interrogation.

Lots of comments from Defense counsel are within the revision as well.

~jmo~

Yikes!

 

[drama_farmer]

That's basically how I understand it. I assume they will present this in a different way to the next grand jury. This buys them another six days.

Supposedly these guys had taken the bus back after the crime as it was on video...my question is...a knife was used on four people, wouldn't they have blood on them?

It is interesting that they are claiming White was the one to murder them. Why? Are they trying to get Mann to talk?

Thanks for that link. This stood out to me:

Although released on his own recognizance, a parole issue will keep White's alleged accomplice, 24-year-old Justin Mann, behind bars as well.

I'm surprised they'd release a suspect accused of such serious crimes on his own recognizance. It reads as if he'd be free (from jail) if not for the parole violation, but I wonder if they realized he would be held because of that violation, making the "OOR" a moot point. I believe I read a remark a few days back alluding to the fact that Mann (as opposed to White) actually showed some emotion during their first court appearance.

Perhaps he is willing to assist in the investigation, and that cooperation earned him a "release" on own recognizance, at least initially.

Speculating here: the cops could have done the usual "hey, we're willing to work with you here, but this parole issue, it's a separate thing, our hands are tied, etc. . "

 

[shana]

It seems to me that there is likely a lot of interrogation of the accused suspects and that one is cooperating. After all, these two are also the only live witnesses to what transpired within the basement apartment. Obviously LE cannot accept without question Mann's assertions and so they are busy corroborating his story with evidence at the scene. It follows that Defense counsel - White's in particular - is challenging Mann's statements. LE needs time to build its case and I'm glad they earned it today.

~jmo~

 

[Gardenista]

It seems to me that there is likely a lot of interrogation of the accused suspects and that one is cooperating. After all, these two are also the only live witnesses to what transpired within the basement apartment. Obviously LE cannot accept without question Mann's assertions and so they are busy corroborating his story with evidence at the scene. It follows that Defense counsel - White's in particular - is challenging Mann's statements. LE needs time to build its case and I'm glad they earned it today.

~jmo~

But it is Mann who had the improper interrogation which is why there was no indictment

 

[shana]

But it is Mann who had the improper interrogation which is why there was no indictment

Yes, allegedly potentially improper, at least according to White's counsel.

~jmo~

 

[shana]

I think the burglary charge alone, not necessarily as a parole violation, would keep Mann behind bars in and of itself.

We are watching a dance of prosecuting attys and defense lawyers here, imo. It will all shake-out in good time. The victims deserve justice, even though it may not be achieved so quickly as many may have hoped. It take TIME to build a proper case to bring to a GJ or to a Prelim, and this case is still fresh. The accused deserve fairness and strong advocates as well.

Name one other case in which Prosecutors were ready so soon after such a complicated crime. I'll wait. ;-)

~jmo~

 

[HastingsChi]

I knew we were in store for a heap of more heartbreak. Savage. The whole thing is just savage.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

It's astonishing that people here refuse to consider the possibility that they got the wrong guys... I'm not claiming they are the wrong guys but with zero evidence it is foolish to rule that possibility out.

One at least wonders if this forum would be so adamant if the suspects were white.... 《This is NOT directed at anyone particular》

 

[HastingsChi]

Ok so wait.... I'm confused. All they have as evidence is video?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Apparently in that part of NY a video of two gentleman riding the bus together whose record is not pristine is all it takes when the case attains significant media coverage putting a lot of pressure on police to make an arrest.

 

[shana]

It's astonishing that people here refuse to consider the possibility that they got the wrong guys... I'm not claiming they are the wrong guys but with zero evidence it is foolish to rule that possibility out.

One at least wonders if this forum would be so adamant if the suspects were white.... 《This is NOT directed at anyone particular》

I hear you...but...just what evidence would you expect LE to publicize so early in the process?

As for the racial issue, I'll leave that alone...for now, anyway. :-/

~jmo~

 

[Inthedetails]

It's astonishing that people here refuse to consider the possibility that they got the wrong guys... I'm not claiming they are the wrong guys but with zero evidence it is foolish to rule that possibility out.

One at least wonders if this forum would be so adamant if the suspects were white.... 《This is NOT directed at anyone particular》

What leads you to think they got the wrong guys?

 

[shana]

Apparently in that part of NY a video of two gentleman riding the bus together whose record is not pristine is all it takes when the case attains significant media coverage putting a lot of pressure on police to make an arrest.

Apparently? OK. Are you serious?

Again, I hear you...but...can you cite other cases in this jurisdiction wherein suspects were wrongfully charged based on such flimsy evidence as you suggest?

The two riding the bus were tracked from the crime scene to Mann's 'residence' in Schenectady, from what I've understood. Yes, the pressure is on for arrests, but that doesn't mean that LE rushed to tack it on these two.

~jmo~

 

[thekarmabus]

Apparently in that part of NY a video of two gentleman riding the bus together whose record is not pristine is all it takes when the case attains significant media coverage putting a lot of pressure on police to make an arrest.

I don’t think that’s all it took. Patience. Let’s see what the evidentiary hearing provides.
It’s a chess game .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Yemelyan]

The grand jury reconvened today and indictments for both James White and Justin Mann have come in....

http://news10.com/2018/01/05/judge-...f-the-men-accused-in-troy-quadruple-homicide/

It wasn't just video evidence that LE had, sounds like there was also criminal possession of stolen property.

 

[Yemelyan]

Here are more details and a second article:

"Mann and White are each facing nine counts of first-degree murder, four counts of second-degree murder, one count of burglary, one count of robbery, and two counts of criminal possession stolen property."

Quoted from http://news10.com/2018/01/05/grand-jury-hands-up-indictments-in-troy-quadruple-murder/

 

[Midge Montana]

I'm not understanding the nine counts of first-degree murder.
Who are the other 5 victims, or do you think that's a typo?

 

[Inthedetails]

Here are more details and a second article:

"Mann and White are each facing nine counts of first-degree murder, four counts of second-degree murder, one count of burglary, one count of robbery, and two counts of criminal possession stolen property."

Quoted from http://news10.com/2018/01/05/grand-jury-hands-up-indictments-in-troy-quadruple-murder/

Someone help me out with the charges.

Four victims and two perps...where does the nine counts of 1st degree murder come from?

jmo

 

[Yemelyan]

Someone help me out with the charges.

Four victims and two perps...where does the nine counts of 1st degree murder come from?

jmo

I am not a lawyer. Someone can help me out but to my understanding the number of victims does not matter. It could be based on the prosecution's alternative theories of the crime? So there's the fact that they killed the victims while committing a felony, thats one count of 1st degree murder right there. And then if it's also murder with multiple victims, that's another count. And so forth. Hopefully someone will chime in and let us know if I'm on the right track.

 

[2Hope4]

Well now. Interesting day. 9 counts of first degree and 4 counts of second degree murder for 4 people. That's 13 counts of murder for 4 people. Were the victims expecting twins and triplets? That's 3 counts of murder for each person! I get that the theory of what happened might not be known at this point, and I have seen cases where the jury decides if it was first degree or second degree in their verdict so both charges are there. But IMO, this is bizarre!