OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#47

[Ann99]

Pike County man missing
Don’t know if this is who they found but he has been missing jmo

Myland, I’m following what you are referring to and I think it may possibly become more interesting as we learn the true identity of this person. Since the body was found in a bag, I would guess it is not a suicide or natural death.
My opinion.
More suspicious because of the nature of the offense of his last ticket, or was it an arrest? Fictitious Reg.
Another fake document?
Theory only - Maybe some people had a “fake document” business going for a long time in Southern Ohio.

 

[Fletcher73]

Fletcher73, welcome! Good to have you and your knowledge of Alaska here to contribute to discussion.

Thank you - it was a shock to realize the innuendo that followed the W4 here, then just to prove Alaska is a small town, I know someone well who participates in two sects associated with FW's.

 

[Ann99]

Jmo but if it is who was missing there may be a link Jmo

My mind is really spinning with possibilities here.
This is all opinion and speculation and maybe I will self report or delete after some thought. Possibly too far fetched.

If this body is identified as being the missing person,
Could it also be the “witness who may not be available?”

 

[Ann99]

Thanks. That’s strange..he had some citations after the date he is reported missing in that article.

‘A Pike County man has been missing since Dec. 9, 2018, according to an incident report filed with the Pike County Sheriff’s Office on Feb. 19.’

Pike County Court
File Date: 12/11/2018
Ticket Number: 4793
Violation Date: 12/07/2018
Violation Time: 7:00
Violation Description: Fictitious Reg

Edit: Myland brought to my attention a few posts down the violation was before. It's the file date that was after.

Speculation. Opinion. Thoughts on the violation?

Violation Date - Dec 7
Violation-Fictitious Reg (I assume fictitious registration?)
? Missing two days later
Body found in bag.
BCI has been called in.

“A Pike County man has been missing since Dec. 9, 2018, according to an incident report filed with the Pike County Sheriff’s Office on Feb. 19.”

Reminder - Wagners arrested November 13, 2018

This development could be nothing...not related, or it could be huge. No way of us knowing at this point in time.

 

[Ann99]

I do not think they were in Alaska in May 2017---my opinion only---because the Jackson Days Inn Trash Pull was done on June 8 , 2017.

We know the Wagner's were gone during the Friday May 12 and Saturday May 13 searches of their former Peeble's farm property and their trailers that were stored at the car lot. They had sold their Peterson Rd. property in March and were not living on it during the searches.

So to me it makes no sense that the Wagner's would be in Alaska in May, then turn around and travel to, and be in, Jackson Ohio on June 8th, then go back to Alaska later in June. They had a conversation with an Alaskan neighbor in June so we know they were in Alaska in June.

I think they took off from Ohio in May (because the heat was on) and did their stay in the Jackson Days Inn and then did their Montana and Missouri property transactions (according to the evidence) and then ended up in Alaska sometime during the month of June.

Just my speculation from what little we have to go on from the evidence released to the media.

Wow. They are keeping an unusually tight ship, considering this case is so high profile.

Oh, and to complicate the month of May 2017 even more, there were, according to the evidence, about a dozen interviews with the Wagner's in the month of May, 2017. 99% of them were audio interviews. That means all these interviews could have been long distance, away from Ohio.........?

Great post, gives us lots to think about. Just shows how important the all inclusive time lines are. Many thanks to all who have contributed to the time lines.
“We know the Wagner's were gone during the Friday May 12 and Saturday May 13 searches of their former Peeble's farm property and their trailers that were stored at the car lot.
They had sold their Peterson Rd. property in March and were not living on it during the searches.”

This makes it more clear to me that property sold in March, and sometime later, prior to May 12/13 their trailers and contents were stored at the nearby car lot.
Why would they have stored contents at car lot?
Why not logically take the trailers and contents to the Flying W Farm for storage.
Makes no sense to store family belongings on a strangers property. Does it.?
And now we know evidence was found in the well on that same property at a later date.

There is something here that we are not seeing/understanding. Something is missing.

 

[Jayejayehilltop]

.NBC news reporting human remains found yesterday in a black trash bag, by mushroom hunters in pike county, Trego and Buchanan rds.

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

My mind is really spinning with possibilities here.
This is all opinion and speculation and maybe I will self report or delete after some thought. Possibly too far fetched.

If this body is identified as being the missing person,
Could it also be the “witness who may not be available?”

You’re kidding me right? The remains they found would have nothing to do with this case.

 

[Ann99]

You’re kidding me right? The remains they found would have nothing to do with this case.

No I’m not kidding.
And I don’t see how you can make that statement.
Neither you nor I know if there is a relation to this case since the remains have not been identified.
Maybe there is a link. Maybe there is not.
We will see. If there is no relation at all, I will admit I was wrong in my speculation.

 

[Jayejayehilltop]

No I’m not kidding.
And I don’t see how you can make that statement.
Neither you nor I know if there is a relation to this case since the remains have not been identified.
Maybe there is a link. Maybe there is not.
We will see. If there is no relation at all, I will admit I was wrong in my speculation.

I agree Ann99, it very well have something to do with this case. Alot of strange things have happened in pike county.

 

[ChickaDee221]

Chick, here's some links for you, just in case you haven't seen them. I understand your trying to get "up to speed."

Timeline: 2016 Pike County massacre

Media & Timeline NO DISCUSSION - Pike Co, OH 8 Family Members Murdered

Angela Wagner Supplemental Discovery Evidence

Discovery Jake Wagner

Exhibit 1 Wagner, Fredericka Includes some of her GJ testimony

Newcomb Discovery Rita Newcomb, Angela's mother

Thank you!!

 

[ChickaDee221]

Pike County man missing
Don’t know if this is who they found but he has been missing jmo

This guy is not listed in the AG missing adults section on the OH AG website.

***I can't find anything saying he was found, though.

 

[Tiff23fr]

There is also a missing 15 year old female from August 2018 but I haven't heard anymore about her. Off to see what I can find out.

This is not too far from where they found another body a few years ago.

I'm not sure how far it is from this. I immediately thought of the missing women though.


Body Found Not Far From Where Several Ohio Women Vanished | HuffPost

 

[almond]

A video done, by a woman in another group, this past weekend of Pike county and the victims properties...also a bit of BBL.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

There had to have been some yelling, crying, pleading (imo). The dogs would have been on alert to protect those children that had been with then since they were pups.
Maybe it's just wishful thinking on my part. That if something were to happen in my home, our dogs would be there for the kids.

IMO they let the dogs outside as they came in. As a result a closed door would have prevented the dogs from attacking the killers.


Welcome to Websleuths!!!!

 

[Scakes]

I hadn't considered that they may have wanted to delay the scenes being found or for someone else to find them. I somewhat felt they knew BJM would show up that morning. What are your thoughts on why they might want to delay the scenes being found?
If they were listening to phone conversations, they likely heard the one between Tony and CSR about DR's faucet which ended with they would see each other at BBL. I would guess if CSR didn't show up that morning then Tony would have checked on him. That's just a guess though. Still seems someone would have figured it out in those earlier hours as she did.

"Down the road, Chris Sr. and Tony talked by phone about getting a part to fix Dana’s faucet. The conversation was brief. Neither a man of many words. They signed off, saying they would see each other the next day at work at Big Bear."

The window being open has me baffled. I feel like there was a reason also. I keep going back to BJM and her finding them. CRSR and GR were moved to the back, the dog food bag is right by the door. Something seems off about her finding them.
The following is JMO and I want to be very clear, I am NOT saying BJM had anything to do with the murders. I just feel like her being there that morning wasn’t to just feed dogs and chickens. Why did she go pick up friends before she went there? The police seemed to really think she was hiding something in the very beginning from what I’ve read. Something else I read seemed like it didn’t fit also. When talking about KRs cameras, LM says that he had cameras all over that place and BJM knew this because she cleaned his camper. He’s a single guy, living in a secluded camper that didn’t even have running water. Other than emptying trash, what else would really need cleaning ? His address was listed as one of the sites that was growing marijuana IIRC
Could it be possible that BJM wasn’t there to feed animals ? And was instead there to tend to the grow ? The people she picked up may have been there to help her. I can understand if that’s why she was not forthcoming to the police and in turn why they questioned her so hard in the beginning. Maybe at some point she helped KR and that’s how she knew of his cameras.
I’m sure she wasn’t going to tell the cops hey I’m here to water the weed and turn grow lights on and off. I’m sure that after finding the grow operation LE was also wondering if she had any ties to it.
I always questioned why she went there to feed his animals. Couldn’t he do it before he went to work like most people do ?
The Wagners knew she’d be there but maybe they didn’t want her to be the one to find them. Maybe they moved the bodies to the back thinking she wouldn’t even go in the house and if she did, she would just grab what she needed and leave.

Again, I don’t think BJM was involved in any way with the murders. I also don’t think growing weed is the end of the world. I have stage 3 IBC and I’ve been known to partake from time to time.

 

[rsd1200]

Regarding that photo of the W4 with two kids on a river, said to be Kenai, Alaska, taken in late May or early June 2017, provided by AW/JW to a journalist who published it in an Ohio news article...
JMO
...but I don't think it was taken in May/June, or at least not that time-frame in AK. I've lived here nearly 40 years, and by mid-May alders are fully-leafed and bright green - and those trees don't appear to have leaves -
plus those trees look too tall for AK, compared to the buildings nearby. MOO

Anyway, by way of introduction, I've lurked here for years and appreciate all the work and talent here to dig out the details of this complicated case.

Also, on the AW Discovery, it lists "Brentley NCH CAC, 1 video" which has been discussed, but not resolved.
I think it refers to a video done at Nationwide Children's Hospital, an interview of BR by the Child Advocacy Center for LE.

My understanding is the CAC uses this approach to determine what happened when investigating crime or abuse of young victims, so the child has a safe place to tell what happened, in a situation that avoids re-traumatizing, and the video interview is also used to develop treatment.

Hope this helps - if it is an interview with little BR, then it being included in the AW discovery is consistent with something a keyed on by another poster, that is, it was AW's idea to make sure the babies weren't killed, too.

Thank you for your input! Welcome!

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Good idea
https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/332439538747-0-1/s-l1000.jpg

My 2 Cents.......

According to the Wagner's pastor, the Wagner's wept over dogs. And of course they breed dogs.
So there is a strong affinity for dogs and you can see that in the way all the dogs were left alive and uninjured.

But I don't think the Wagner's had to hurry and get the dogs used to them because all the dogs had been familiar with at least Jake for years. According to LM Jake came to his house for all the Holidays and Jake lived with the Rhodens off and on as part of the family.

These dogs would not see him as a threat at all. However, yes they would bark at first but then calm down when they could see and smell who it is.

We know Kenny had one dog, Chris Sr. had 2 that BJM mentioned, and LM mentioned Dana having a dog or dogs. Jake lived with Dana so that takes care of her dogs, Dana lived right next to Chris Sr's home so that would take care of his dogs, and Kenneth lived a few miles down the road from the Flying W Farms so it would be convenient to stop by there and see Brownie.

But did Frankie have a dog? BJM didn't mention it. The dogs are a big clue and always have been. The dogs show that the killers had been around and inside the Rhoden properties.

This is circumstantial evidence, but they left a trail of a lot of circumstantial evidence. Circumstantial evidence builds up and is enough to be convicted on. Finding parts to make a silencer is circumstantial, but with forensic evidence it can become direct evidence.

Buying boots that are the same size and make of a footprint is circumstantial. But if you have the killer's actual boot in your possession, and it matches, that is direct evidence.

Wanting custody is circumstantial, but I believe the actual forged custody documents constitute direct evidence. Again, My 2 Cents.....

BBM
According to the Wagner's pastor, the Wagner's wept over dogs. And of course they breed dogs.
So there is a strong affinity for dogs and you can see that in the way all the dogs were left alive and uninjured.

Keep in mind that dogs are pack animals. They run in a pack and they attack in a pack. They sleep in a dog pile. If one gets up and moves the others get up and move with it. If one goes to the bowl to eat the others go to eat also. If one runs for the car to get in and get a ride they all run for it.

Kind of like an enmeshed family.

I know this from the experience of having four (yes I said four) dogs that are four different breeds. A boxer/Boston terrier mix (Boxterrier) a Min Pin, A Cherweiner and a chihuahua.

JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

Also, on the AW Discovery, it lists "Brentley NCH CAC, 1 video" which has been discussed, but not resolved.
I think it refers to a video done at Nationwide Children's Hospital, an interview of BR by the Child Advocacy Center for LE.

My understanding is the CAC uses this approach to determine what happened when investigating crime or abuse of young victims, so the child has a safe place to tell what happened, in a situation that avoids re-traumatizing, and the video interview is also used to develop treatment.

Hope this helps - if it is an interview with little BR, then it being included in the AW discovery is consistent with something a keyed on by another poster, that is, it was AW's idea to make sure the babies weren't killed, too.

Thank you Fletcher....We now know what that evidence is, B's interview from Nationwide Children's Hospital-- Child Advocacy Center in Columbus. So I checked to see if CR, B's mom, said something about it and she did:


".....By 5 p.m., Brentley was tired and hungry. He left for home with his mom when she got a call from the BCI to take her son to Nationwide Children's Hospital in Columbus, where he was interviewed.

"They let him draw it out,'' she said. "It kind of looked like scribbles. But the way he talked, he didn't really seem to see anything."

That was the last time authorities have spoken with Brentley. She gave a statement that night, and then a couple weeks later police also took DNA from her -- routine in such cases..... "
Pike County 3-year-old: 'I picked up daddy's hand, and it just fell'

****** There could be something important on that video ******

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

No I’m not kidding.
And I don’t see how you can make that statement.
Neither you nor I know if there is a relation to this case since the remains have not been identified.
Maybe there is a link. Maybe there is not.
We will see. If there is no relation at all, I will admit I was wrong in my speculation.

Please give me a break lol. Not everything is related to this case drrrrrrrrr

 

[Tiff23fr]

The window being open has me baffled. I feel like there was a reason also. I keep going back to BJM and her finding them. CRSR and GR were moved to the back, the dog food bag is right by the door. Something seems off about her finding them.
The following is JMO and I want to be very clear, I am NOT saying BJM had anything to do with the murders. I just feel like her being there that morning wasn’t to just feed dogs and chickens. Why did she go pick up friends before she went there? The police seemed to really think she was hiding something in the very beginning from what I’ve read. Something else I read seemed like it didn’t fit also. When talking about KRs cameras, LM says that he had cameras all over that place and BJM knew this because she cleaned his camper. He’s a single guy, living in a secluded camper that didn’t even have running water. Other than emptying trash, what else would really need cleaning ? His address was listed as one of the sites that was growing marijuana IIRC
Could it be possible that BJM wasn’t there to feed animals ? And was instead there to tend to the grow ? The people she picked up may have been there to help her. I can understand if that’s why she was not forthcoming to the police and in turn why they questioned her so hard in the beginning. Maybe at some point she helped KR and that’s how she knew of his cameras.
I’m sure she wasn’t going to tell the cops hey I’m here to water the weed and turn grow lights on and off. I’m sure that after finding the grow operation LE was also wondering if she had any ties to it.
I always questioned why she went there to feed his animals. Couldn’t he do it before he went to work like most people do ?
The Wagners knew she’d be there but maybe they didn’t want her to be the one to find them. Maybe they moved the bodies to the back thinking she wouldn’t even go in the house and if she did, she would just grab what she needed and leave.

Again, I don’t think BJM was involved in any way with the murders. I also don’t think growing weed is the end of the world. I have stage 3 IBC and I’ve been known to partake from time to time.

I agree with your assessment on her not being forthcoming about the weed. I have wondered if the bodies were drug to the room so she would in fact follow the trail.

Sorry if this gets too visual. The logic may not even be feasible.
If I imagine someone dragging a body, I imagine them walking backwards. The body and trail of blood would go over any of their own steps/footprints as it was dragged on the ground (any possible prints would now be smeared out). BJM would then walk through the streaks/blood leaving her own foot prints.

I think the W's wanted this to appear drug related and if BJM and friends were there to tend to the crop, they played into the plan in this possible scenario. (Drug Undercurrent)

I think BJM and Angela may have been close in the past. I wonder what their relationship was in the months before.