OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#48

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
Can you please post a link? I saw pieces of them referenced on here but never saw the source. TY


MSM Source: Audra Levy WXIX Fox 19/ VERIFIED

Scroll document or go to top left and click on [pages] and it will display all 62 pages, includes the 8 Exhibits, just click on any of them to enlarge them.
Motion to Dismiss Fredericka Wagner Charges

Audra Levy
VERIFIED
Cincinnati, OH
Digital Executive Producer — WRTV-TV (Indianapolis, IN)
U.S.
_______________________________________________________________
Audra Levy
@audralevy
IU grad. Cincinnati native. Retweets and follows are not endorsements. Views are my own.
Cincinnati, OHfacebook.com/audralevyJoined December 2008
284 Following
150 Followers
 
Last edited:
Can you please post a link? I saw pieces of them referenced on here but never saw the source. TY
Loomis, is this what you want to see? It's the entire Motion to Dismiss filed for FW (subsequently denied by the judge). It's 62 pages (pdf file).
 

Attachments

  • Motion-to-Dismiss-Fredericka-Wagner-Charges.pdf
    1.4 MB · Views: 12
Shooting from the hip here. Don't even know how to ask. But. Is anyone else concerned that the autopsies were done in Hamilton County, where also Joe Deters offered his help in trying these cases, and we now know FW has big ties to this county, city of Montgomery, and perhaps Loveland? I don't even know the questions anymore, much less the answers. But I have done A LOT of research, and something stinks here. It goes back to one of the three that signed over FWF to FW. JMO

Loomis,
I’m looking at parts of this too.
I live in Montgomery County, am familiar with the names, players in Hamilton, Warren Counties, also the City of Montgomery

MOO, there is no reason to be concerned about the autopsies
Joe Deters, Hamilton County Prosecutor, has been a Prosecutor for a long time and has tried high profile cases. He is in the news frequently.
Not surprising he would have comments about this high profile case.
Not making political statements, just fact.

I am also looking into FW and the origins of FWF in 1976.
Considering that was more than 40 years ago, it is not easy to find info.
other than the one document.
My question is, do you know if those three signed FWF over to FW and if so, when?
Or did they continue to be involved as owners or principals?
If so, for what length of time.
I am thinking ahead to events of 1986.

FrescaandSouthernComfort, do you know the answer to the above questions? Can you comment?

I will self report this post to make sure it is ok as a topic (History of Flying W Farms) that can be discussed. I understand there should be no political comments.
 
Very creepy, isn't it? They don't need to have your computer or cell phone in their possession to do the hacking. It's done remotely. Seems it might also be easy to do if you have social media apps on your phone. So be very careful about links you click on that someone sends you. Via email or via text or messaging.

Some don't even require a link to be clicked. Merely opening a message can be enough.
 
Loomis,
I’m looking at parts of this too.
I live in Montgomery County, am familiar with the names, players in Hamilton, Warren Counties, also the City of Montgomery

MOO, there is no reason to be concerned about the autopsies
Joe Deters, Hamilton County Prosecutor, has been a Prosecutor for a long time and has tried high profile cases. He is in the news frequently.
Not surprising he would have comments about this high profile case.
Not making political statements, just fact.

I am also looking into FW and the origins of FWF in 1976.
Considering that was more than 40 years ago, it is not easy to find info.
other than the one document.
My question is, do you know if those three signed FWF over to FW and if so, when?
Or did they continue to be involved as owners or principals?
If so, for what length of time.
I am thinking ahead to events of 1986.

FrescaandSouthernComfort, do you know the answer to the above questions? Can you comment?

I will self report this post to make sure it is ok as a topic (History of Flying W Farms) that can be discussed. I understand there should be no political comments.



The building of a breeding farm does not happen overnight. Investors are needed and a product
to sell is necessary to interest those with deep pockets. The Wagners were in business before 1976.
Go back to prior owners of the land and a lot of answers to your questions will appear.

A lot of innocent people with no intent to harm, and a lot of cruel individuals without compassion
for others are involved. Son, Bobby was very much a part of the beginning of FWFs horses. The
farm became recognized in part as a breeding farm, due to his efforts.

Again, when you are looking for funds, you should go to those with deep pockets or those who
knows where the funds can be found. JMO...

JMO, but Joe Deters offer was because Hamilton County had the resources to help a smaller
county.
 
MSM Source: Audra Levy WXIX Fox 19/ VERIFIED

Scroll document or go to top left and click on [pages] and it will display all 62 pages, includes the 8 Exhibits, just click on any of them to enlarge them.
Motion to Dismiss Fredericka Wagner Charges

Audra Levy
VERIFIED
Cincinnati, OH
Digital Executive Producer — WRTV-TV (Indianapolis, IN)
U.S.
_______________________________________________________________
Audra Levy
@audralevy
IU grad. Cincinnati native. Retweets and follows are not endorsements. Views are my own.
Cincinnati, OHfacebook.com/audralevyJoined December 2008
284 Following
150 Followers

Thanks! I had not seen these exhibits at the end!
 
Loomis,
I’m looking at parts of this too.
I live in Montgomery County, am familiar with the names, players in Hamilton, Warren Counties, also the City of Montgomery

MOO, there is no reason to be concerned about the autopsies
Joe Deters, Hamilton County Prosecutor, has been a Prosecutor for a long time and has tried high profile cases. He is in the news frequently.
Not surprising he would have comments about this high profile case.
Not making political statements, just fact.

I am also looking into FW and the origins of FWF in 1976.
Considering that was more than 40 years ago, it is not easy to find info.
other than the one document.
My question is, do you know if those three signed FWF over to FW and if so, when?
Or did they continue to be involved as owners or principals?
If so, for what length of time.
I am thinking ahead to events of 1986.

FrescaandSouthernComfort, do you know the answer to the above questions? Can you comment?

I will self report this post to make sure it is ok as a topic (History of Flying W Farms) that can be discussed. I understand there should be no political comments.

Thank you. That makes me feel alot better. I had not heard anything bad about Joe D.

I don't think the discussion about FWF will be a problem with the moderators because it has been in MSM and is public record.

The article below gives the 3 names.

Fredericka Wagner: A look at her property and assets
 
The building of a breeding farm does not happen overnight. Investors are needed and a product
to sell is necessary to interest those with deep pockets. The Wagners were in business before 1976.
Go back to prior owners of the land and a lot of answers to your questions will appear.

A lot of innocent people with no intent to harm, and a lot of cruel individuals without compassion
for others are involved. Son, Bobby was very much a part of the beginning of FWFs horses. The
farm became recognized in part as a breeding farm, due to his efforts.

Again, when you are looking for funds, you should go to those with deep pockets or those who
knows where the funds can be found. JMO...

JMO, but Joe Deters offer was because Hamilton County had the resources to help a smaller
county.

Thanks FSC. I will keep researching.
 
Thank you. That makes me feel alot better. I had not heard anything bad about Joe D.

I don't think the discussion about FWF will be a problem with the moderators because it has been in MSM and is public record.

The article below gives the 3 names.

Fredericka Wagner: A look at her property and assets
Just a little research and no conclusions. My opinion, back in 1970’s large tracts of land in this area were probably readily available for a reasonable price.
I’ve looked into these 3 names and didn’t get very far. Just because they are on the FWF registration, does not mean they were the land owners. idk. Or maybe one of them was.
R.E.T. appears to be the an Attorney who may be the son on of a former Mayor of Nor wood which is about 8 miles from City of Montgomery Ohio. Nothing on the other 2.
 
You're welcome, CC. I share anything new I find new these days. But back in Aug 2018, I had no doubt this property and FW's was searched.

Yes, apparently LE was keeping it quiet/out of the news media. Assume that was because they were finalizing everything prior to making arrests. According to the timeline, wasn't that around the time the GJ convened or ended?
 
MSM Source: Audra Levy WXIX Fox 19/ VERIFIED

Scroll document or go to top left and click on [pages] and it will display all 62 pages, includes the 8 Exhibits, just click on any of them to enlarge them.
Motion to Dismiss Fredericka Wagner Charges

Audra Levy
VERIFIED
Cincinnati, OH
Digital Executive Producer — WRTV-TV (Indianapolis, IN)
U.S.
_______________________________________________________________
Audra Levy
@audralevy
IU grad. Cincinnati native. Retweets and follows are not endorsements. Views are my own.
Cincinnati, OHfacebook.com/audralevyJoined December 2008
284 Following
150 Followers

Has anyone else noticed that FW testified before the Pike County GJ on two different dates?

July 14, per the attachment above of transcript of her testimony to prosecutor Canepa.

July 24, 2018

https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...ecutions/PikeCountyAdditionalIndictments.aspx

She testified about the BPVs on July 14. She was charged with obstruction of justice and perjury based on her July 24 testimony.
 
JMO

If you are referring to the first full paragraph on page 5 that starts, "Earlier this week on Monday, March 11.....", I think the July 14 date at the end of the quote is a typo. Notice it says [sic] immediately after July 14.

sic1
/sik/
adverb
adverb: sic
used in brackets after a copied or quoted word that appears odd or erroneous to show that the word is quoted exactly as it stands in the original
 
Has anyone else noticed that FW testified before the Pike County GJ on two different dates?

July 14, per the attachment above of transcript of her testimony to prosecutor Canepa.

July 24, 2018

https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...ecutions/PikeCountyAdditionalIndictments.aspx

She testified about the BPVs on July 14. She was charged with obstruction of justice and perjury based on her July 24 testimony.

Excellent catch. I thought it was only once! She could have brought in her "receipts" the 2nd time she went in to testify---you know---the receipts she said she had made copies of because she knew she'd be asked about them.

I still can't figure that out, Fred saying she made copies then not having them. Angela Canepa actually said that: "you would think she would know where she bought them from if she copied them." (not exact word for word quote)
 
Testifying Before a Grand Jury ( Fred did not hire her attorney until after her GJ Testimony. As you can see from this article, that was a big mistake...2 Cents)
  • a prosecutor believes that a witness has information about a crime committed by a third party, and wants to elicit that information to secure an indictment against the third party, or
  • a prosecutor regards a witness as a target (a person suspected of crime) and wants to develop evidence against the witness.
People called before a grand jury as witnesses do not have to be warned that they are or may become targets. Miranda-type warnings are not required, and, unless they are specifically given immunity (that is, promised that they won't be charged based on their testimony), any testimony witnesses provide to a grand jury may be used against them in a later prosecution.

Finding Out: Target or Witness?
Defense lawyers can often confer with the prosecutor to find out whether a client is the target of a grand jury investigation. If so, the defense lawyer may try to work out a deal in which the target agrees to testify before the grand jury in exchange for immunity from prosecution.

Immunity from Prosecution
The prosecution can give a witness “immunity” in response to a legitimate refusal to testify based on the Fifth Amendment, or in response to a deal worked out with the defense attorney. The prosecutor can offer one of two forms of immunity, depending on factors such as the seriousness of the immunized witness’s own criminal conduct:

  • Transactional immunity means that the person given immunity cannot be prosecuted for any crimes related to the subject matter of the testimony.
  • Use immunity means that the witness given immunity may in the future be prosecuted for a crime related to the topic discussed in this witness’s testimony, but the immunized testimony itself cannot be used in the future prosecution.
Prosecutors often give immunity to compel small fish to testify against big fish. For example, a prosecutor may give a small-time drug dealer immunity in exchange for the dealer’s testimony against the drug lord from whom the dealer purchased the drugs. A witness who refuses to testify after being given immunity can be held in contempt of court by a judge and jailed.

(For much more on immunity, see Immunity From Prosecution.)

Right to Counsel?
Lawyers are not permitted to accompany clients into the grand jury room. Grand jury proceedings are closed, and witnesses are not entitled to be represented by counsel during the proceedings. Lawyers may, however, remain in a nearby hallway, and witnesses may leave the room to consult with their lawyers as needed. Lawyers sometimes advise their clients to exercise this right before answering every question. For example, a witness might repeatedly say, “I respectfully request permission to leave the room to consult with my lawyer before I answer that question.”
 
Last edited:
I don't know much about this horrible hacking stuff, awful, but remembering the night of these horrible murders, the mom got a disturbing call at work from her daughter that made her cry I think. Would LE know word for word that conversation? I hope that they all got caught not for their criminal stupidity alone, but for their deviousness.
 
I don't think we're seeing complete discovery lists on any of them. Do they legally have to publicly publish all?
This is a good question, I don't know what legally must be disclosed to the press/public.
At best though, we must realize that what we are seeing are the summary pages of hundreds of pages of evidence.
 
Agree, we're just seeing random lists from discovery, based on the information a news reporter is using in a particular news story. Most of the discovery docs we have access to are from news reporters who link to them for reference. There are probably other discovery docs that we haven't seen.

Any locals want to go down to the Pike County CH and pick up some copies of all the discovery docs? I'll be happy to chip in $$ for any copying fees, etc. :)

Not sure how else to get access?
Now, don't quote me on this, but I think I remember reading that Websleuths will reimburse users for the cost of some court related documents.
If not, I'd be willing to chip in. Problem for me is that I don't live anywhere near Pike County.
Another thought might be to contact a MSM reporter that has been writing/airing articles about the murders. It seems they have some sort of access to official documents that we don't. If nothing else, at least they could guide us as to where to look.:)
 
Testifying Before a Grand Jury ( Fred did not hire her attorney until after her GJ Testimony. As you can see from this article, that was a big mistake...2 Cents)
  • a prosecutor believes that a witness has information about a crime committed by a third party, and wants to elicit that information to secure an indictment against the third party, or
  • a prosecutor regards a witness as a target (a person suspected of crime) and wants to develop evidence against the witness.
People called before a grand jury as witnesses do not have to be warned that they are or may become targets. Miranda-type warnings are not required, and, unless they are specifically given immunity (that is, promised that they won't be charged based on their testimony), any testimony witnesses provide to a grand jury may be used against them in a later prosecution.

Finding Out: Target or Witness?
Defense lawyers can often confer with the prosecutor to find out whether a client is the target of a grand jury investigation. If so, the defense lawyer may try to work out a deal in which the target agrees to testify before the grand jury in exchange for immunity from prosecution.

Immunity from Prosecution
The prosecution can give a witness “immunity” in response to a legitimate refusal to testify based on the Fifth Amendment, or in response to a deal worked out with the defense attorney. The prosecutor can offer one of two forms of immunity, depending on factors such as the seriousness of the immunized witness’s own criminal conduct:

  • Transactional immunity means that the person given immunity cannot be prosecuted for any crimes related to the subject matter of the testimony.
  • Use immunity means that the witness given immunity may in the future be prosecuted for a crime related to the topic discussed in this witness’s testimony, but the immunized testimony itself cannot be used in the future prosecution.
Prosecutors often give immunity to compel small fish to testify against big fish. For example, a prosecutor may give a small-time drug dealer immunity in exchange for the dealer’s testimony against the drug lord from whom the dealer purchased the drugs. A witness who refuses to testify after being given immunity can be held in contempt of court by a judge and jailed.

(For much more on immunity, see Immunity From Prosecution.)

Right to Counsel?
Lawyers are not permitted to accompany clients into the grand jury room. Grand jury proceedings are closed, and witnesses are not entitled to be represented by counsel during the proceedings. Lawyers may, however, remain in a nearby hallway, and witnesses may leave the room to consult with their lawyers as needed. Lawyers sometimes advise their clients to exercise this right before answering every question. For example, a witness might repeatedly say, “I respectfully request permission to leave the room to consult with my lawyer before I answer that question.”

I'm almost certain I read in one of the articles around the time of the arrests that Owen was a long time family attorney. She and at least one of the others have used him in various ways for years. Then again, she really thought everyone would think she's an honest, God fearing, old, woman. She probably believed everyone would think as highly of her as she thinks of herself.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
184
Guests online
3,541
Total visitors
3,725

Forum statistics

Threads
603,557
Messages
18,158,598
Members
231,767
Latest member
Yoohoo27
Back
Top