OK OK - Stephen “Steve” Lee Murphy, last seen in Claremore sometime in 1976, not reported missing until July 2022

[carbuff]

Bingo! Not our guy. Whew.

 

[Snoangel26]

@Snoangel26 Do you know what his juvenile record was for?

From what the one detective told me it was for burglary. I do know his fingerprints were ran and nothing has came up.

 

[Snoangel26]

He went AWOL from the Marines?
Why would he have been cuffed?

Assuming the story MP’s mother relayed to his siblings was true then she or whoever she may have heard it from had to have have gotten it from a marine if not Stephen himself, right?

If he did in fact go AWOL from the Marines wouldn’t there have been a warrant issued for his arrest? Or perhaps he thought they’d come looking for him and therefore assumed a new identity.


Just theorizing.

I believe his mother fabricated the story. I think by doing that it was easier to dismiss him.

 

[megs1477]

How certain are you about the birthdate? Have you seen it on an official document?

Another rule out: Stephen Lee Murphy, Orlando, FL DOB: 11/1957

 

[Snoangel26]

How certain are you about the birthdate? Have you seen it on an official document?

Another rule out: Stephen Lee Murphy, Orlando, FL DOB: 11/1957

I'm sure of the birthdate.

 

[megs1477]

I'm sure of the birthdate.

Thank you. I wasn't trying to doubt your research. I have come across a lot of the work you have done looking for answers. I am used to genealogy, where oral family history is a source of many dates that turn out to be slightly different than they were recalled.

 

[Snoangel26]

Thank you. I wasn't trying to doubt your research. I have come across a lot of the work you have done looking for answers. I am used to genealogy, where oral family history is a source of many dates that turn out to be slightly different than they were recalled.

I completely understand that. His sister gave me a different birthdate. So I searched for the date she gave me and came up with nothing on it. I think when trying to get them to recall things from long ago got to take alot of what they say with a grain of salt.

 

[Snoangel26]

My last effort to get military records for Stephen came back with no help. If I send in some sort of proof of death then they will reevaluate my request. I don't know how to give them that proof when I don't even know for sure. So now I'm at a loss at what I should do. Maybe I should have him declared deceased.

 

[AliceInPain]

My last effort to get military records for Stephen came back with no help. If I send in some sort of proof of death then they will reevaluate my request. I don't know how to give them that proof when I don't even know for sure. So now I'm at a loss at what I should do. Maybe I should have him declared deceased.

bbm
I was thinking about that the other day but I thought it might come out insensitive.
I have no idea how that works, if it costs money or what is involved.
But I thought maybe more resources would open up for you and anyone investigating, I don't think they just take "He's deceased" as an explanation.
You have a detective working on the case who hasn't found him, no one in the family has seen him for some 40 years... You get odd answers when you ask family.
But I don't know if it also would close some other doors, such as DNA comparisons. And would the missing people sites remove his case?
Maybe someone else here knows more what that process involves.

 

[Snoangel26]

bbm
I was thinking about that the other day but I thought it might come out insensitive.
I have no idea how that works, if it costs money or what is involved.
But I thought maybe more resources would open up for you and anyone investigating, I don't think they just take "He's deceased" as an explanation.
You have a detective working on the case who hasn't found him, no one in the family has seen him for some 40 years... You get odd answers when you ask family.
But I don't know if it also would close some other doors, such as DNA comparisons. And would the missing people sites remove his case?
Maybe someone else here knows more what that process involves.

I would like to open more doors but I also don't want to close the current doors.

 

[Laughing]

My last effort to get military records for Stephen came back with no help. If I send in some sort of proof of death then they will reevaluate my request. I don't know how to give them that proof when I don't even know for sure. So now I'm at a loss at what I should do. Maybe I should have him declared deceased.

Spooky, but this may be an effective tactic!

SSA Handbook § 1721

When is a missing person presumed dead?

www.ssa.gov

1721.When is a missing person presumed dead?​

We presume a person is dead if he or she has been missing from home and has not been heard from for seven years or more. This presumption applies regardless of the reason for the absence.
Once the presumption applies, it can only be disputed if we:

1. Prove the person is alive; or
2. Provide an explanation that explains the individual's absence and continued life.

2014 Oklahoma Statutes :: Title 58. Probate Procedure :: §58-941. Presumption of death - Issuance of letters testamentary or of administration.

law.justia.com

2014 Oklahoma Statutes
Title 58. Probate Procedure
§58-941. Presumption of death - Issuance of letters testamentary or of administration.​

Universal Citation: 58 OK Stat § 58-941 (2014)

Presumption of death - Any person missing from his usual place of residence and whose address is unknown by his family or those who, in the ordinary course of events, would be expected to know his whereabouts, who is continuously absent and unheard of for a period of seven (7) years or longer, shall be presumed to be dead and the district court, after the expiration of such period, shall have jurisdiction and authority to declare such person to be legally dead and to issue letters testamentary or letters of administration upon the estates of such persons.


Laws 1937, p. 5, § 1.

Something for you to consider, at any rate?

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[AliceInPain]

Spooky, but this may be an effective tactic!

SSA Handbook § 1721

When is a missing person presumed dead?

www.ssa.gov

1721.When is a missing person presumed dead?​

We presume a person is dead if he or she has been missing from home and has not been heard from for seven years or more. This presumption applies regardless of the reason for the absence.
Once the presumption applies, it can only be disputed if we:

1. Prove the person is alive; or
2. Provide an explanation that explains the individual's absence and continued life.

2014 Oklahoma Statutes :: Title 58. Probate Procedure :: §58-941. Presumption of death - Issuance of letters testamentary or of administration.

law.justia.com

2014 Oklahoma Statutes​

Title 58. Probate Procedure​

§58-941. Presumption of death - Issuance of letters testamentary or of administration.​

Universal Citation: 58 OK Stat § 58-941 (2014)

Presumption of death - Any person missing from his usual place of residence and whose address is unknown by his family or those who, in the ordinary course of events, would be expected to know his whereabouts, who is continuously absent and unheard of for a period of seven (7) years or longer, shall be presumed to be dead and the district court, after the expiration of such period, shall have jurisdiction and authority to declare such person to be legally dead and to issue letters testamentary or letters of administration upon the estates of such persons.


Laws 1937, p. 5, § 1.

Something for you to consider, at any rate?

jmho ymmv lrr

I think it would be something to consider here too, I'm just worried his DNA /dentals/ fingerprints etc if there are any would disappear, and NamUs for example would remove him from their sites.
I think Charley Project has some declared deceased persons on there but that's all.
Then it's only Othram, DNA Project etc out there and that's only if he's actually deceased. And he may not be.

One thing I didn't see or I missed it @Snoangel26 did you upload to all the DNA sites you can?
He was young when he disappeared, he may have other curious kids out there.

 

[megs1477]

I have done a lot of research over the years, and I have never come up so empty.

The only thing that came to mind is an uncle of mine who left shortly after his daughter was born. He used a fake name and SSN for the next 30 years because he owed so much child support. @Snoangel26 do you have any idea if your mother possibly filed anything against him that would result in him owing support?

 

[Snoangel26]

I have done a lot of research over the years, and I have never come up so empty.

The only thing that came to mind is an uncle of mine who left shortly after his daughter was born. He used a fake name and SSN for the next 30 years because he owed so much child support. @Snoangel26 do you have any idea if your mother possibly filed anything against him that would result in him owing support?

According to the divorce papers I got he was ordered to pay $100 a month. That was in 1980. When she filed she had to put notice in the newspaper.

 

[Snoangel26]

I think it would be something to consider here too, I'm just worried his DNA /dentals/ fingerprints etc if there are any would disappear, and NamUs for example would remove him from their sites.
I think Charley Project has some declared deceased persons on there but that's all.
Then it's only Othram, DNA Project etc out there and that's only if he's actually deceased. And he may not be.

One thing I didn't see or I missed it @Snoangel26 did you upload to all the DNA sites you can?
He was young when he disappeared, he may have other curious kids out there.

I have uploaded my DNA to all available sites. No other children showed up.

 

[Snoangel26]

I think it would be something to consider here too, I'm just worried his DNA /dentals/ fingerprints etc if there are any would disappear, and NamUs for example would remove him from their sites.
I think Charley Project has some declared deceased persons on there but that's all.
Then it's only Othram, DNA Project etc out there and that's only if he's actually deceased. And he may not be.

One thing I didn't see or I missed it @Snoangel26 did you upload to all the DNA sites you can?
He was young when he disappeared, he may have other curious kids out there.

I have searched the social security death index. Multiple times. No luck there.

 

[doublestop]

According to the divorce papers I got he was ordered to pay $100 a month. That was in 1980. When she filed she had to put notice in the newspaper.

Do you know if she ever received any payments?

 

[Snoangel26]

Do you know if she ever received any payments?

I would say no she didn't. But I honestly really don't know.

 

[megs1477]

According to the divorce papers I got he was ordered to pay $100 a month. That was in 1980. When she filed she had to put notice in the newspaper.

The PI or Detective may be able to tell you if there is a warrant that may have caused him to assume a fake identity.

Another rabbit hole I just found myself in relates to information requests. I know you had no luck with the requesting his specific records without SSN, etc. What about requesting records for all AWOL/Deserters for the time period you think he might have been in the military. This request from last year made me think that may be possible. I believe the MuckRock site will help you file the FOIA and get the fees waived. Missing Person Files

 

[Snoangel26]

The PI or Detective may be able to tell you if there is a warrant that may have caused him to assume a fake identity.

Another rabbit hole I just found myself in relates to information requests. I know you had no luck with the requesting his specific records without SSN, etc. What about requesting records for all AWOL/Deserters for the time period you think he might have been in the military. This request from last year made me think that may be possible. I believe the MuckRock site will help you file the FOIA and get the fees waived. Missing Person Files

Thank you for this. I'll look more into it