Found Deceased OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #6 *Arrests*

[Seattle1]

Funny though how they felt like they were in the right to commit these murders but yet didn’t want to be held accountable or answer for what they had done in court. If they think they did nothing wrong then why not be upfront about what they had done? Why not show the court the same pride they showed Cora’s daughter after the day of? Why hide the evidence if you don’t have anything to be ashamed of? I guess a part of themselves recognized that for all the power and control they thought they held as Sovereign Citizens who could unabashedly resorted to violence to supposedly protect their interests, they didn’t have enough of it to get the OBI off them, to avoid time in prison or to not be made face the public and the victim’s family members and representatives in court.

^^rsbm

Actually, long before they appeared in Court, TA was first to give a taped confession upon arrest-- telling authorities that she was responsible for the deaths. IMO, she was proud of her actions and wanted the word spread far and wide that she was some self proclaimed martyr who killed for her grandchildren when she really killed for a possession-- something she believed she owned, and feared she was about to lose. In true form, TA , the evil leader, made certain she was the first to talk.

IMO, TA's partner, TC, fueled this fire because he believed they could get away with it. He'd been able to throw his weight (and money) around the county his entire life. For example, as late as July 2023, TC was arrested and charged with Feloniously Pointing a Firearm but less than a month later -- the charges were dismissed by the same Cimarron County DA George Leach "in the interest of justice."

As for Cora, CT, and PG -- they were just minions, good soldiers, rising to the test of their leaders. We know Cora pointed a gun at the head of her daughter when she tried calling her brother, mystery surrounded CT following the death of his son on CT's property, and PG is allegedly responsible for the vicious stabbing of victim VB.

So there we have it.... MOO

Found Deceased - OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #5 *Arrests*

Here is a link that refers to the black car.

www.websleuths.com

 

[Muddy K]

have not read this case before.... did this start as a child custody dispute?

It did. This is a cruel, depraved double homicide not easily summed up, IMO.

 

[Herat]

It did. This is a cruel, depraved double homicide not easily summed up, IMO.

It was a huge conspiracy to commit murder that involved people that didn't need to be involved at all. Secret group meetings, purchasing phones, attempts at alibis.

One very depraved woman could not just walk away from an immoral plan but had to take everyone down with her.

 

[AppleTreeGreen]

^^rsbm

Actually, long before they appeared in Court, TA was first to give a taped confession upon arrest-- telling authorities that she was responsible for the deaths. IMO, she was proud of her actions and wanted the word spread far and wide that she was some self proclaimed martyr who killed for her grandchildren when she really killed for a possession-- something she believed she owned, and feared she was about to lose. In true form, TA , the evil leader, made certain she was the first to talk.

IMO, TA's partner, TC, fueled this fire because he believed they could get away with it. He'd been able to throw his weight (and money) around the county his entire life. For example, as late as July 2023, TC was arrested and charged with Feloniously Pointing a Firearm but less than a month later -- the charges were dismissed by the same Cimarron County DA George Leach "in the interest of justice."

As for Cora, CT, and PG -- they were just minions, good soldiers, rising to the test of their leaders. We know Cora pointed a gun at the head of her daughter when she tried calling her brother, mystery surrounded CT following the death of his son on CT's property, and PG is allegedly responsible for the vicious stabbing of victim VB.

So there we have it.... MOO

Found Deceased - OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #5 *Arrests*

Here is a link that refers to the black car.

www.websleuths.com

True she did confess after her atreat and but earlier when she was questioned by LE she told claimed VB called to say she was running late and then ended up being a no-show. I agree she was proud of her actions but then why hide the bodies and why lie to LE? When it came to VB, JK, the judge and even her son she was not above trying to arrange their deaths or to threaten their lives and well-being following a perceived slight, disobedience or deviation from her own self-interests. If she thinks VB, JK and her son WR have to be held accountable for their perceived crimes and that it is in her right to do so why does she not apply the same logic to herself? The police have to arrest her before she confesses and it takes LE 5 days before they recover the remains of VB and JK. It does not appear that TA have any thought to the suffering families of JK and VB who were desperately searching for them. Does TA not think her victims are owed to have her transgressions against them answered for the same way she does? Especially because she is in the right and does not even see herself truly guilty but a martyr, as false as her self-belief is? I agree she sees her grandchildren as possessions and may even see others, particularly her adversaries, as sub-human since she doesn’t hold them to the same standard as herself.


Cora tells her daughter VB was no longer a problem anymore and degraded her and the type of parent she was. She clearly think she was in the right and justified too. Yet she rather threaten her daughter with a gun and intervene when she was met with the police than hold herself and the other four accountable and give an account for themselves why they were in the right. She preferred to keep the truth buried and threaten her daughter’s life, which is ironic considering this parent had the audacity to judge VB as mom while pulling a firearm on her own flesh and blood.

And I get it, the accused or perps are not legally obliged to confess to any or all crimes they committed. I would just imagine if you are this proud over such a heinous crime and feel like your actions were in the moral and legal right then the idea of getting arrested or going court should not be as daunting as a prospect, especially when you compare them with what your victims went through based on your convictions justifying such extreme and violent tactics and actions on others.

 

[Seattle1]

And I get it, the accused or perps are not legally obliged to confess to any or all crimes they committed. I would just imagine if you are this proud over such a heinous crime and feel like your actions were in the moral and legal right then the idea of getting arrested or going court should not be as daunting as a prospect, especially when you compare them with what your victims went through based on your convictions justifying such extreme and violent tactics and actions on others.

^^rsbm

For TA, I think it's all about disrespect. She does not respect the law of the land and has her own ideas of government. and believes in her own form of justice. Surely, she wasn't going to participate in helping with her arrest by turning herself in, or leading authorities to the bodies of the victims!

But once they hade her in custody, she also wasn't going to be interrogated but instead cut them off at the knees by confessing, taking responsibility. Now it's just a poker game for TA. May the best hand win, is how she thinks of her defense. And if she catches a break, she'll take it. JMO

 

[Chimera]

Cause of death revealed after two Kansas moms murdered

The bodies of Veronica Butler, 27, and Jilian Kelley, 39, were discovered in a cow pasture inside a chest freezer on April 14.

www.dailymail.co.uk

In new police reports, investigators reveal Butler was stabbed to death. It's unclear how Kelley died.

So cruel, upfront and personal.
No news yet about Kelley's passing.
Omo.

 

[PommyMommy]

Cause of death revealed after two Kansas moms murdered

The bodies of Veronica Butler, 27, and Jilian Kelley, 39, were discovered in a cow pasture inside a chest freezer on April 14.

www.dailymail.co.uk

In new police reports, investigators reveal Butler was stabbed to death. It's unclear how Kelley died.

So cruel, upfront and personal.
No news yet about Kelley's passing.
Omo.

See page 2 at the link.

Cullum, in part, got permission from the landowners to dig the hole for the burial site and dug the hole with his skid steer the day before the murders. He stabbed and killed Kelley and drove: the bodies of Butler and Kelley to the burial site. He put his clothing in the burial site and buried Butler and Kelley inside a freezer in the previously dug hole. His clothing, found at the burial site, contained his and Kelley's DNA. The accessories to the knife, found at the burial site, were found in his home.

STATE'S BRIEF IN SUPPORT OF CONSOLIDATION FOR PRELIMINARY HEARING

 

[PommyMommy]

SEP 13, 2024

Aunt of mother who was killed shares memories, calls for legislation

While much of the country learned the name Veronica Butler after she went missing, her aunt sat down with KOCO 5 to talk about the woman she wants to be remembered.

www.koco.com

“Her kids were her world; her kids were her life. Everything she did was for her kids,” Thompson said. “She’d get in the pool with them, she’d blow bubbles with them, whatever it was, she was there with them.”

“She’s loved, and she will never be forgotten. And that’s exactly what we say. She’s very loved and never forgotten,” Thompson said.

Thompson told KOCO 5 that she and her brother are pursuing legislation to try to prevent another situation like this from happening again. They’re trying to get that ready for the upcoming legislative session.

 

[Rhenish]

I hope that all four of these clowns get the death sentence. All four were complicit with the deaths of Jillian Kelly and Veronica Butler. Shame on all four of them. Child custody disputes, ugh, does not need to go to the level of murder. At the end of the day, how well are the children doing? The children have lost everyone and everything, especially their innocence. And these idiots, did they really think they could get away with this, apparently so! The children always pay. So sad. And, two young and beautiful women went to early graves, lost their lives and in horrific ways. All four must pay for they are murderers and selfish self-satisfying idiots.

 

[CuriousCricket]

SEP 13, 2024

Aunt of mother who was killed shares memories, calls for legislation

While much of the country learned the name Veronica Butler after she went missing, her aunt sat down with KOCO 5 to talk about the woman she wants to be remembered.

www.koco.com

“Her kids were her world; her kids were her life. Everything she did was for her kids,” Thompson said. “She’d get in the pool with them, she’d blow bubbles with them, whatever it was, she was there with them.”

“She’s loved, and she will never be forgotten. And that’s exactly what we say. She’s very loved and never forgotten,” Thompson said.

Thompson told KOCO 5 that she and her brother are pursuing legislation to try to prevent another situation like this from happening again. They’re trying to get that ready for the upcoming legislative session.

SEP 13, 2024

Aunt of mother who was killed shares memories, calls for legislation

While much of the country learned the name Veronica Butler after she went missing, her aunt sat down with KOCO 5 to talk about the woman she wants to be remembered.

www.koco.com

“Her kids were her world; her kids were her life. Everything she did was for her kids,” Thompson said. “She’d get in the pool with them, she’d blow bubbles with them, whatever it was, she was there with them.”

“She’s loved, and she will never be forgotten. And that’s exactly what we say. She’s very loved and never forgotten,” Thompson said.

Thompson told KOCO 5 that she and her brother are pursuing legislation to try to prevent another situation like this from happening again. They’re trying to get that ready for the upcoming legislative session.

Can anyone help me understand what kind of legislation could do that? This is an absolutely horrific crime. We all agree on that. But what legislation can control evil and the seeming belief that an individual can have anything they want without regard for rights of another person? Any ideas?

 

[Inthedetails]

Can anyone help me understand what kind of legislation could do that? This is an absolutely horrific crime. We all agree on that. But what legislation can control evil and the seeming belief that an individual can have anything they want without regard for rights of another person? Any ideas?

I think the legislation would be about safe places to do child-custody exchange. In this case, the exchange was made at a desolate and remote location that made it easy for the perps to attack the victims without witnesses or cameras. The exchanges should done in places that ensure safety.


jmo

 

[CuriousCricket]

I think the legislation would be about safe places to do child-custody exchange. In this case, the exchange was made at a desolate and remote location that made it easy for the perps to attack the victims without witnesses or cameras. The exchanges should done in places that ensure safety.


jmo

Public locations would be a step toward safety. The problem, though, is that they were cut off before reaching the drop-off point. A safe location might help, but can't guarantee anyone truly determined won't waylay a parent on the way to the exchange location nor follow from the safe space. It also doesn't guarantee parents or grandparents won't make private arrangements.

 

[kccorona]

Public locations would be a step toward safety. The problem, though, is that they were cut off before reaching the drop-off point. A safe location might help, but can't guarantee anyone truly determined won't waylay a parent on the way to the exchange location nor follow from the safe space. It also doesn't guarantee parents or grandparents won't make private arrangements.

I understand this case has its abnormal factors that certainly seem to have been driven by the blinding hate of one woman, but I do think if there were a supervised exchange in a place some kind of paid official were overseeing the process, it would have made this a bit more complicated for TA to plan and pull off- there would’ve been the added layer of the ladies not arriving to the location and authorities being immediately aware (although IIRC Jillian’s husband and maybe Veronica’s boyfriend raised the alarm quickly). Yes, they were intercepted before getting to their agreed upon location, but even their agreed upon location was an abandoned gas station on the outskirts of town, without anyone to really notice what was going on, or ensure a supervised process.

 

[Inthedetails]

Public locations would be a step toward safety. The problem, though, is that they were cut off before reaching the drop-off point. A safe location might help, but can't guarantee anyone truly determined won't waylay a parent on the way to the exchange location nor follow from the safe space. It also doesn't guarantee parents or grandparents won't make private arrangements.

I was answering a question about what the legislation could possibly be about, not writing the legislation itself.

jmo

 

[doublestop]

I note that TA got the others to do the dirty work of the actual murder, while she just bought supplies, etc.

 

[ClearAhead]

Public locations would be a step toward safety. The problem, though, is that they were cut off before reaching the drop-off point. A safe location might help, but can't guarantee anyone truly determined won't waylay a parent on the way to the exchange location nor follow from the safe space. It also doesn't guarantee parents or grandparents won't make private arrangements.

If TA hadn’t been able to cancel the supervisor who was otherwise supposed to be there waiting with TA and the children when the exchange was to occur, TA’s plot would’ve been thwarted. But TA just simply asked her to take a couple of weeks off to remove her presence and then TA was able to set the trap on road.

IMO there’s a gap in having court-appointed supervisors coupled with casual and changed arrangements lacking any oversight or communication with all the parties involved. Legislation could improve that. MOO

 

[Inthedetails]

I note that TA got the others to do the dirty work of the actual murder, while she just bought supplies, etc.

She was the master manipulator and they were the dupes she used. Even if she "just" bought supplies, she put the murders into action and that is dirty work just as much as theirs. imo

jmo