OR OR - David Grubbs, 23, Ashland, 19 Nov 2011

[Missizzy]

You're correct, Mayelf, David was one of those guys who just kind of makes Ashland who and what it is. He will be missed. Besides his family and friends, his co-workers at Shop 'n Kart are in my thoughts and prayers. It's a unique and totally Ashland-y grocery store. The employees are extremely close and it shows. I know they are all aching this evening. They lost a young man whom they loved. I cannot imagine saying goodnight to your co-worker and then learning an hour later that he had been brutally murdered.

Where is this monster lurking in our little town?

Not in Ashland.....but sadly, it is.

Has anyone local heard about a vigil or a celebration of David's life?

 

[InTheGarden]

InTheGarden--Ashland has been struggling to find an amenable solution to our growing number of transient visitors. We seem to have more with the downturn of the economy. We have a very liberal police force (IMO) due to the large tourist influx. We seem to be "on the circuit" for a good number of folks that hang out, panhandle, sometimes busk, and camp illegally. Ashland is an expensive town to live in and to visit. However, we're an accepting group and try our hardest to keep everyone happy. I personally think that the police bend over backwards to work with our visitors. Surely not everyone would agree with me. It's interesting as this problem/challenge seems to come to the forefront every few years. I remember a strong anti-panhandling push about 15 years ago but then it faded only to resurface again. Our lovely downtown plaza can sometimes be intimidating to paying tourists, due to the number of transients. There are ordinances against aggressive panhandling but they are not always obeyed.

About 10 years ago, it was quite common to see young men sporting swords and heading to Lithia Park for SCA events. I haven't seen nearly as much of that in recent years. It's been quite a while since I saw a young man with a sword.

To be clear, I've heard the weapon described both as a sword and as a hatchet. One could conceal a hatchet far more easily in a busy area.

I'm tremendously sorry for the Grubbs family. This was so cruel and heartless.

Missizzy - Thanks for the response. I hope Ashland does get a handle on this transient population. Perhaps some sort of registry program, just so you know who is in your community. I, as a paying tourist just passing through, had to provide personal ID and my car license plate number to the hotel I was staying at. I had to prove to them who I was and they have a record on file. I have to tell you that I would think twice about visiting Ashland alone again.

I read up on another thread about the murder on this same walking trail in Central Point (?) a few years ago. That is a common link to the recent murder. On of the posts stated that transients camp near this trail. Who resides in these camps? How many of these people have violent criminal records? Citizens in your community deserve to know this information for their own protection and the protection of other homeless people who have no criminal backgrounds but are just down on their luck.

Are there any points on the trail where there are surveillance cameras? I would think perhaps near the grammar school. What about lighting? Bike patrols? Children walk that path to school. Parents could get together, set up a program, and take turns walking their children and other children living near them back and forth to school.

In my area we have several popular hiking trails. Safety patrol volunteers hike these trails to provide assistance to fellow hikers as a deterent to crime and to offer assistance for injuries, if needed.

I pray peace is brought back to your community.

 

[gooniequeen]

http://kdrv.com/news/local/231425

This article mentions that the APD has asked other LE along I-5 and "nationally" about similar incidents........

Do they think perhaps they are looking for a serial killer?

 

[Troy's mom]

Hi Everyone.
I have been following the murder of David Grubbs. I feel so angry that another your man is murdered on the Greenway. After Troy was murdered they never patrolled the Greenway. I kept posting on my face book & myspace that the Greenway was not safe. Troy was found off a path ( the bike path) that leads away from the Bear Creek Greenway between the Central Point freeway interchange and Table Rock Road, Near the Pilot truck stop. The Pilot is jessant to the Greenway.

 

[Missizzy]

Obviously, this horrible murder has been on my mind all day. Now that it's been confirmed that David was attacked with a sword or sword-like blade, I've been thinking. Tragically, the poor young man was almost beheaded.

In all the threads I've read of similar crimes, the attacker has been psychotic. The killers seem to be in an alternate reality and are often found standing over the body or nearby, covered with blood. They often make no attempt to flee or to hide their crime. I've read of many who even laugh when approached. However, David's killer disappeared.

From what I've read and heard through local talk, David was not robbed and was struck a number of times by the blade. I have to wonder if he was hit from behind. Possibly he was listening to music and didn't hear the attacker approaching from behind or simply passed him going the other direction and didn't hear the killer turn and follow him.

Murder by sword is not that common. Why would a killer choose this method if he wasn't psychotic? If it wasn't a psychotic break, what's the motive? It's an extremely brutal attack for a fairly busy bike path. I'm having a hard time making sense of this.

 

[Kimster]

Hi Everyone.
I have been following the murder of David Grubbs. I feel so angry that another your man is murdered on the Greenway. After Troy was murdered they never patrolled the Greenway. I kept posting on my face book & myspace that the Greenway was not safe. Troy was found off a path ( the bike path) that leads away from the Bear Creek Greenway between the Central Point freeway interchange and Table Rock Road, Near the Pilot truck stop. The Pilot is jessant to the Greenway.

Hi Linda! :hug: Thank you for weighing in. You were on my heart when I read about this most recent victim. I know it must bring it all back for you. :tears:

 

[Snoopster]

http://binged.it/rIDvoF

Here's a link to the bird's eye view of the area where David was found. Does anyone know the specific spot? There appears to be a small parking lot by the tracks just beyond the tennis courts. There is a small grouping of trees, some of which look to be evergreens (I presume that the deciduous trees have lost their leaves there by now?), where someone could be somewhat hidden from view.

There are some similarities here with Taylor Van Diest's case. The 18 year old girl was brutally attacked and left for dead on Halloween in a small town in British Columbia at around the same time of day as David, as she walked along a path by some railway tracks.


My sincerest condolences to all of you locals, and, in particular, those of you who knew David. What a shock to the community this must be.

 

[berseriousplease]

Hello all (my first post), I live very close (within a 1/4 mile) to where the murder took place so naturally my girlfriend and I are super freaked out. I've hardly been able to sleep at night, and when I do I can't help but think this psycho is probably within a mile or two of me... It's so infuriating that a person could have such little regard for another.

@Snoopster- Yes I know the area very well. From what I could see on the newscasts, the spot looked to be on the bike path next to those two white container looking things in your map. If David was coming home from work as suspected, he'd have been heading west on that path. There are innumerable places where someone could lurk in that area. However, even if David had heard someone coming up behind him he may not have thought anything of it since that path is so frequently traveled. Bikers, joggers, etc all use it so often. They say it had been a half-hour later when the body was found, but honestly that surprises me considering how busy I know that path to be. It would surprise me if even 5 minutes went by without seeing someone.

My thoughts-
-This person is clearly mentally disturbed; no sane person could carry out such an act. Everything they've shown about David, how kind he was, his lifestyle, all of it leads me to think the killer didn't know and didn't care who he was.

-The time of day this happened makes me think it wasn't premeditated. Even though it would have been somewhat dark, that path is so busy that this was an extremely reckless act. That makes me think that whoever did this not only resides in the area but carries a weapon regularly. Transients carry weapons, and the bike-path is heavily traveled by transients.

Wasn't it only a few months ago there was a mentally-disturbed transient with a lengthy criminal record arrested for harassing and menacing two teenage girls, screaming "I'm going to kill you" just a couple hundred yards down the exact same bike-path? That's hard to ignore.

My hope is that police have much more to go on than they're letting-on, and playing it close to the vest hoping the killer slips up. I find myself staring at people on my street and looking over my shoulder as I get in my car. I just want this person caught.

Many condolences to David's family. Nobody deserves this.

 

[berseriousplease]

http://www.bendbulletin.com/article/20110819/NEWS0107/108190364/

"Man who threw rocks at girls released"

Served two weeks of an 8 months sentence before being released due to overcrowding. I saw him walking near safeway in Ashland just 3 weeks ago. Usually wears a large dark-blue coat.

edit 1pm- Well I just saw him downtown and he was wearing all the same stuff he's usually wearing, which includes white pants :\ That kinda blows my theory.

 

[scaryworldwelivein]

another thought would be that the killer got off I-5 at Ashland Street (exits from I-5 going both North and South from I-5). A few gas stations, places to eat here. Decided to look around, started driving West on Ashland Street. Decided to turn at the cemetery, heading north on Normal, saw the dead end sign on normal and turned left(west) on Homes (corner of Hunter park). Turned at the first right into the park. Parked at the end of the driveway in the parking lot behind the tennis courts, watched the activity on the bike path. Hid in the bushes (treed area, just north west of tennis courts). Very windy that night, rainy and cold. Waited until David passed by, heading West. Took his opportunity, not seeing anyone else on the path. Ambushed David from behind.
Took the murder weapon, got back in the car, headed back to the freeway, taking all evidence with him.

 

[gooniequeen]

"There was a machete attack about 100 miles north in the small town of Sutherlin, but police have ruled out any connection"

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap...yKHSaw?docId=c7f0e864efed45f1bb33b7efc16b7a45

wonder why they ruled out a machete attack that close.....must look into that.

 

[gooniequeen]

ruled out because the sutherlin attack took place within the same hour as David's murder in Ashland.

 

[Missizzy]

I too am an Ashlander and I know it's possible that someone got off I-5 to commit this crime but it seems like a long shot. The area is busy and not that easy to find unless you know where to look.

I'm fairly certain that JT has been thoroughly checked out about this murder. JT is well known around town (especially around Shop 'n Kart, where David worked) and was found responsible for the Oak Knoll fire which destroyed 11 homes last year. He's known to suffer from schizophrenia and to refuse medication. This year, he was charged with throwing something onto the freeway from the overpass and with throwing rocks at young girls. Because Oregon has so few resources for the mentally ill, JT lives on the streets. I would think he was the first man checked out. But even with his many crimes, I've yet to sense that any were committed with malice or violence. What happened to the girls was frightening but I don't think he intended to seriously hurt them. JMO.

I've also learned that a comment in early articles about LE wanting to speak to two young men seen in the area has been removed as they came forward. They happen to be sons of a friend of our family and were simply watching the crime scene be processed.

My biggest concern is that this seems like a psychotic act and I simply cannot understand how a person who committed a crime of such brutality could vanish into our community. The local police have set a community information forum for next week.

 

[scaryworldwelivein]

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/11/25/9023948-slaying-horrifies-tourist-town-known-for-shakespeare-plays

http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=r0yd8r4s8mx3&lvl=18.47062312689116&dir=353.4015203925181&sty=b&where1=Hunter%20Ct,%20Ashland,%20OR%2097520&form=LMLTCC


after looking at the picture (first link) as well as the link (second) of the area. It seems that the murder took place right behind the parking lot, next to the tennis courts.

Missizzy, when I read your posts, I get more info than what the press gives out. Thank you. Who do you think did it?

 

[Missizzy]

It's sad to read the article linked above as I know most of the "kids" interviewed about David. And notice how true to Ashland every one is. They will not lock their doors and give up their sense of safety. That's why people choose Ashland, right or wrong.

One thing I've heard from some of my adult kids contradicts a section of the article, however. I've heard that there are indeed some sort of cut marks on trees. Obviously, it's hard to know how old they are but they said they were quite obvious.

We have frequent SCA "battles" in Lithia Park but I've never heard of them being staged at Hunter Park. Has anyone else?

 

[Missizzy]

Scary--I honestly have no idea. The brutality of the crime doesn't fit with so many other details, unless it was committed by a person experiencing a psychotic break. But those poor folks typically have no idea what they've just done. I'm reminded of Harold Montague:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95689"]Las Vegas 4 month old dead in axe attack - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

I'm not feeling very safe with so many of my family members living within blocks of that spot, nor the proximity to Walker School.

 

[Snoopster]

Hello all (my first post), I live very close (within a 1/4 mile) to where the murder took place so naturally my girlfriend and I are super freaked out. I've hardly been able to sleep at night, and when I do I can't help but think this psycho is probably within a mile or two of me... It's so infuriating that a person could have such little regard for another.

<snip>

I don't blame you for being freaked out!! I can imagine you constantly looking over your shoulder. Even though the risk isn't as significant as it feels, it is a definite risk. To all of the people in the Ashland area, please stay safe.

Hopefully this predator will be taken off your streets soon.

 

[Troy's mom]

No one is safe anywhere. I live in a very nice development. I do not walk even just down the street after dark.

 

[Snoopster]

No one is safe anywhere. I live in a very nice development. I do not walk even just down the street after dark.

I'm sorry to hear that you don't feel safe walking down the street after dark, Linda. I agree that no place is 100% safe, however I would say that there are many areas of North America that are 99% safe when walking down the street. I don't expect 100% guarantee of safety walking down my street, but I have to say that I quite willingly walk around my neighbourhood at night. We even leave our doors unlocked, other than when we are asleep. I have lived here for 20 years and no one has ever been attacked. So what are the odds? It's such a small percent of people that are attacked.

Yes, there are many places where the odds are much worse, including some areas of the city where I live, but I don't want to blow the risk out of proportion to reality.


One thing I have learned, though, is that there are many more perverts out there, that might want to harm children, than I had realized. That is so sad. While I feel safe, I don't necessarily think that children are.

 

[Missizzy]

The issue of deciduous leaves was raised upthread. No, they have not all fallen yet. Some trees are almost bare but far more have at least half their leaves. Ashland is ablaze right now with scarlet and amber.