OR - PRESIDENTIAL PARDON - Militia members occupy federal building in Oregon after protest #4

[Dr. Know?]

Well, so much for an early verdict. Tomorrow is another day...

 

[Tulessa]

Oh, that's a really interesting broadcast! I waited until this morning to listen so I could give it my full attention. The interview with the woman who wrote the Outside article was very interesting. A much fuller look at David (and his parents).

I learned a little more about Terri Linnel, the FBI informant. I knew she had run for congress a few years ago but not much more. She seems to be a professional weasel, imo. (I have been interested lately in spies and informants. The odds of them working out seem to run at about 1 out of 10 actually helping the FBI, CIA, etc.)

Anyhow,the broadcast gave me lots of food for thought. Definitely worth the time to listen.

The courtroom is dark today.

Ok, you talked me into it.

 

[Tulessa]

That was unreal. I do hope he gets help.

 

[i.b.nora]

So, for some unknown reason, while waiting today for the weekend to pass and for the jury to reconvene, I was reading about voter fraud and ran across an article about Sheriff Jon Lopey of Siskiyou County in California.

The first article I read was here: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/siskiyou-county-tries-toss-lawsuit-voter-intimidation-hmong

&@?%*+£!!!

I am so frustrated at the moment with trying to keep my WS post intact while I refer back to the article I am linking to that after losing most of what I have posted, I am just going to link to this additional article about the sheriff:


Refugees Say Right-Wing California Sheriff Intimidated Them at Gunpoint
The Hmong community of Northern California is suing a lawman obsessed with ‘voter fraud’ for allegedly scaring them away from the polls with assault rifles.
The Daily Beast
By Kelly Weill
09.26.16 10:13 PM ET

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...nia-sheriff-intimidated-them-at-gunpoint.html

Snips

“Siskiyou County has a Hmong community of approximately 1,000 people, most of whom moved there from Minnesota and elsewhere in California in 2015, to a cold welcome from local officials, attorney Brian Ford told The Daily Beast.

Even outside his rural California county, Siskiyou Sheriff Jon Lopey is a force. Lopey is a loud spokesperson against federal land regulations, a stance that allies him with the Bundy family, and has allegedly made local Native Americans uneasy about driving down Siskiyou County roads alone. Lopey is also member of the so-called Constitutional Sheriffs, a right-wing order that includes notorious sheriff Joe Arpaio, and encourages officers to only enforce laws they believe to be constitutional.”

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“But Lopey’s anti-fraud strategy looked like a ground invasion, the Hmong community’s lawsuit claims. Local officers would drive to a Hmong home en mass, armed with assault weapons to question the residents—many of whom are not native English speakers—on their voter registration.

“The sheriff’s taken to wearing this sort of combat gear: big black bulletproof vest, very visible, cargo pants tucked into the boots like if you were in an invading force. The most notable part though are the assault rifles,” Ford said, adding that many of his clients still experience deep trauma from fighting in Vietnam and living in war-stricken Laos.”​

Lots more...

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein
Maxine Bernstein – Verified account ‏@maxoregonian

.#oregonstandoff supporters driving around downtown Portland with bullhorn yelling, "Release the Bundys!' : https://youtu.be/_DHxAhCV-cg


Oregon standoff supporters driving around downtown federal courthouse...

View on web
2:41 PM - 24 Oct 2016

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein
Maxine Bernstein – Verified account ‏@maxoregonian

Jurors in #oregonstandoff case adjourning for day - continuing deliberations tomorrow
4:30 PM - 24 Oct 2016

 

[Cricket99]

I don't know what the jurors options are. Do they have to find all of the defendants guilty of the same crime(s) ? Do they have several choices of what they feel they are guilty of? This could take a long time to sort out.

 

[i.b.nora]

Apparently there are problems with reports of a biased juror:

Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Prosecutor Ethan Knight argued for no interference in jury deliberation process #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge:'It's possible this alleged bias may be associated w/ lack of unanimity on certain charges.' #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge said she can't inquire about what's discussed in deliberations, but sent message back asking juror accused of bias to be id'd by #

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Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Defense lawyer Per Olson argued for juror who reportedly expressed his bias, as reported in note, to be dismissed #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
second jury note #oregonstandoff
Embedded image

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Maxine Bernstein
2h2 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
First jury note #oregonstandoff
Embedded image

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Maxine Bernstein
3h3 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
@LukeEvansSimon not yet - will let you know when I do

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Maxine Bernstein
4h4 hours ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Parties being summoned back to court in #oregonstandoff trial for a jury question #oregonstandoff​

 

[i.b.nora]

This article sort of describes the issue:

Malheur Jurors Question Impartiality Of Fellow Jury Member
by Conrad Wilson Follow and Amelia Templeton
Follow OPB | Oct. 25, 2016 1:20 p.m. | Updated: Oct. 25, 2016 4:19 p.m. | Portland

http://www.opb.org/news/series/burn...rial-juror-impartiality/#.WA_QSoi-nHc.twitter

Federal prosecutors and the attorneys for seven defendants in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge trial reconvened Tuesday afternoon at the U.S. District Courthouse in downtown Portland.

Jurors submitted two questions to U.S. District Court Judge Anna Brown. In a hand-written note, the jurors indicated they may not be able to agree on charges for all seven of the defendants.​

 

[Dr. Know?]

Conrad Wilson ‏@conradjwilson 4h4 hours ago
There was a juror who was seated who said he worked for the BLM as a firefighter 20 yrs ago. This came up during voir dier. #oregonstandoff

Hmm, bias for or against BLM? Sounds against them. Great.

 

[i.b.nora]

Websleuths shuts down tomorrow, Wednesday at 6 pm Eastern / 3 pm Pacific for a long overnight maintainence session.

I have a feeling something bigly will happen in this case tomorrow, after three.

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein
Maxine Bernstein – Verified account ‏@maxoregonian

Ammon Bundy's lawyer filed motion this am to dismiss Juror 11 or declare mistrial #oregonstandoff https://www.scribd.com/document/328983202/Bundy-Motion-to-Dismiss-Juror

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein
30m30 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Defense lawyers got word prosecutors plan to stipulate/ agree to dismiss juror 11 #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
32m32 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Prosecutors returning to courtroom #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
33m33 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Wampler's lawyer Robert Salisbury:'From my perspective you can't leave a guy on the jury who says 'I'm biased.' " #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
35m35 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge cited this 9th Circuit Court ruling Terry Christensen v. US #oregonstandoff
Embedded image

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Maxine Bernstein
41m41 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Jury in #Oregonstandoff trial is continuing to deliberate as lawyers confer #Oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
45m45 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge:'There is not any clear way forward that is not fraught with risk.' #Oregonstandoff

 

[Sillybilly]

To accommodate all the new people coming to Websleuths because of the docuseries we are moving to a much bigger and faster server.

This is just a reminder that the Websleuths forum will be down starting Wednesday (tomorrow) at 6 PM Eastern. We hope to be back up by Thursday morning.

Members can check for updates on Twitter and Facebook.

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein
1h1 hour ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Alternate juror 18 is heading to Portland from Central OR and will be ready to start Thurs am #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
1h1 hour ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge just sent jury home for day after she told all in courtroom that she had to dismiss Juror 11 #oregonstandoff

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[Sillybilly]

Oregon Occupation Trial Draws Crowds, But Still No Verdict


October 26, 2016·1:38 PM ET
Kirk Siegler
Rebecca Hersher
Updated at 2:30 p.m. ET

[...]

On Tuesday, Oregon Public Broadcasting reports, jurors sent a note to U.S. District Court Judge Anna Brown asking whether they needed to agree on a decision concerning all seven defendants.

"If we are able to agree on a verdict for three of the defendants; but are at a stand-off for the others, does our decision for the three stand? Or does this become a mistrial for all the defendants?" the jurors wrote.

[...]

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine’s article on Wedesday October 26th court events:

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/10/federal_judge_dismisses_a_juro.html

“The judge thanked Juror 11 for his service and told him his dismissal does not mean he's done "anything wrong or anything untoward.''

"But the problem is, a question was raised and it can't be resolved without me questioning every one of you about your deliberative process,'' the judge said, and that's unacceptable and could violate federal rules.

The jurors sat stone-faced, displaying no visible emotion. They were allowed to leave for the day by noon Wednesday, ordered to return Thursday morning.

Defense lawyer Robert Salisbury, who represents defendant Jeff Banta, said the judge made the right call.

"From my perspective, you can't leave a guy on there who says, 'I'm biased,''' Salisbury said.

Andrew Chongseh Kim, a Concordia University law professor, said the judge's decision may have avoided a potential appeal, should there be a conviction, at least on this matter.

"Dismissing Juror 11 helps ensure the defendants' right to a fair trial and the appearance of a fair trial,'' Kim said.

-- Maxine Bernstein​

Don't know if it will show up for everyone but I rather enjoyed the Toy'sR Us ad that came with the article.

 

[KaaBoom]

Maxine Bernstein
1h1 hour ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Alternate juror 18 is heading to Portland from Central OR and will be ready to start Thurs am #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
1h1 hour ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge just sent jury home for day after she told all in courtroom that she had to dismiss Juror 11 #oregonstandoff

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This is pretty weird. Does anyone know of another case where a jury complained to a judge and got one of the jurors thrown off the case during deliberations? I can't think of any other case of it. The entire thing sounds kind of inappropriate to me. I always thought that once jurors started deliberating, they had to come to a verdict, regardless of their disagreements. Now it sounds like if they don't agree with one of the jurors they can ask the judge to remove them. At this point nothing would surprise me about this jury. I have feeling there could be more surprises before this is over.

 

[i.b.nora]

This is pretty weird. Does anyone know of another case where a jury complained to a judge and got one of the jurors thrown off the case during deliberations? I can't think of any other case of it. The entire thing sounds kind of inappropriate to me. I always thought that once jurors started deliberating, they had to come to a verdict, regardless of their disagreements. Now it sounds like if they don't agree with one of the jurors they can ask the judge to remove them. At this point nothing would surprise me about this jury. I have feeling there could be more surprises before this is over.

I don't know about Federal trials but the Scott Peterson trial comes to mind when the jurors complained about other jurors after deliberations had begun. IMO, this guy should never have been allowed on the jury in the first place. It seems he was biased and unable to set that aside. Therefore, unfair to BOTH sides, imo.

 

[i.b.nora]

Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Juror 1 , past presiding juror, asked if they keep same presiding juror. Judge said, 'no....because your prior deliberations don't count.'

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Maxine Bernstein
51m51 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge to jury: 'Disregard entirely' past deliberations #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
53m53 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Jury going until 5:30 pm today; not meeting on Fri #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
54m54 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge: 'Starting over may seem frustrating . Do not let it discourage you .' #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
57m57 minutes ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge told jurors 'do not speculate' or 'discuss' the reasons why they're a new panel of 12 jurors #oregonstandoff

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Maxine Bernstein
1h1 hour ago
Maxine Bernstein ‏@maxoregonian
Judge welcomed Juror 18, reminded new panel of 12 jurors to 'start anew on everything.' #oregonstandoff