Oscar Pistorius - Sentencing - 7.6.2016

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Did the neighbours identify Reeva as the source of the screams?

Is this a serious question?

How on earth could four people who'd never met Reeva identify her as being the source of the screams? Is that what it would take for you to accept that Reeva was the person doing the screaming - positive identifications from people who didn't even know she existed until she was dead?

How realiy, really bizarre .

I was responding to this :

THE FACTS? What about the neighbours hearing Reeva screaming in fear of her life, blood curdling screams , like a home invasion was taking place.

Since Reeva wasn't identified by the neighbours as the source of the screams, it's not a fact that they heard Reeva screaming in fear of her life. That's all I was pointing out
 
Since Oscar already did 1 year. Then he will be paroled in 2 years. Which totals the 3 years needed for parole.

Now Masipa said there was no witnesses of violence before hand.

But what happened to the guy that was staying there or whatever. Is she not surprised that the in house person didn't testify and can't be found.

Or am I mistaken about the supposed house guest/worker?

This is a fresh sentence with time already served accounted for.

His quest wasn't there that night but there are tales of his mysterious housekeeper , Frank. Who was apparently outside OP's house after the event when friends, ambulances etc were arriving
 
Since Oscar already did 1 year. Then he will be paroled in 2 years. Which totals the 3 years needed for parole.

Now Masipa said there was no witnesses of violence before hand.

But what happened to the guy that was staying there or whatever. Is she not surprised that the in house person didn't testify and can't be found.

Or am I mistaken about the supposed house guest/worker?

No, the year he did was factored in to mitigation against the 15 year MMS; Masipa did not give him credit for time served. He has three years to go, minus a few days.
 
Did the neighbours identify Reeva as the source of the screams?

Is this a serious question?

How on earth could four people who'd never met Reeva identify her as being the source of the screams? Is that what it would take for you to accept that Reeva was the person doing the screaming - positive identifications from people who didn't even know she existed until she was dead?

How realiy, really bizarre.

Incidentally (using your logic) did any of those witnesses identify the screamer as Pistorius? Nope. And that is considerably more relevant and telling.

One person making a mistake in what they've heard is par for the course (like Van der Merwe) - but FOUR people making the identical set of mistakes at the SAME time? Highly improbable.

They all said they heard the unmistakable sound of a woman screaming. But that's not the most damning thing.....they also all unanimously reported hearing two voices at the same time - a male and a female.

And they didn't wait until after they'd read the newspapers the next morning to claim this....they were telling people that before they even knew Pistorius was involved.

Factor in too the role that hearing a male AND a female played in getting the two couples to come forward at all. Dr Stipp...based on hearing a male and a female.....was specifically concerned that there had been a family murder and he was worried there were children involved. That's why he went to the house in the first place.

Burger/Johnson, who never met or spoke to the Stipps, also only came forward based on hearing a male AND a female. They weren't going to bother but once they heard Pistorius' version they knew it couldn't be true.

So....really, how credible is it to have two couples, some distance apart, making two identical (and fairly massive) mistakes in what they were hearing at exactly the same time?

Then let's look at the evidence for Pistorius screaming like a woman. Well, there is none. But there is some that supports the notion that he doesn't.
The Stipps and the VDMs both heard voice tests coming from Pistorius' house some time later. They both said it sounded like a man trying to scream at different pitches.

That must have been Pistorius screaming and he clearly couldn't manage it. He also testified to making a recording of himself screaming which, despite promises, never made it into evidence. If there were tapes of Pistorius screaming like a woman, Roux would have played them to all the ear witnesses. The closest he got was getting a woman to try and sound like a man screaming like a woman.

Oh, "And I've never screamed like that before, Milady" was outstandingly - almost comically - lame. Either Pistorius has unusual enough vocal cords that he can produce (whatever the situation) noises that are high enough to sound exactly like a woman, or he does not.

Obviously, he does not.

I simply do not know how it is even possible for anyone to look sensibly and objectively at the above facts and conclude that the most probable explanation for what everyone heard that night is that a scared, barely mobile man was stumbling down a pitch black corridor, off to confront an intruder and screaming like a woman while also shouting like a man - all in the few moments before a woman (who would have screamed like a woman had she known she was being approached by a man with a gun) was shot dead.

C'mon....let's get real for once.

Well said!
 
Yep, it's KM.

Aimee believes OP and Reeva had a loving relationship, and no one can prove otherwise.:facepalm:
.

I believe she also said she knew the truth despite not being there!

Or

Maybe there's another version we don't know about ...
 
This is a fresh sentence with time already served accounted for.

His quest wasn't there that night but there are tales of his mysterious housekeeper , Frank. Who was apparently outside OP's house after the event and friends, ambulances etc were arriving
It's odd that Frank wasn't woken up by all the screaming, gun shots and cricket bats - but was somehow dressed and waiting outside as people started arriving. What woke him up? I guess that's something we'll never know, just like we won't know what it was CP deleted from the murderer's phone, or what was in Reeva's handbag that AP helped herself to. It's as if the murderer was protected right from the very beginning, starting with Frank.
 
No, the year he did was factored in to mitigation against the 15 year MMS; Masipa did not give him credit for time served. He has three years to go, minus a few days.

Link please.

Because just because she factored the year in for her decision. That doesn't mean that the year doesn't count as credit towards the sentence.

So please don't let Masipa's mumble jumble distort the fact of the law of time served. Jmo.

Because when she gave his butt 5 years.

No one knew that she knew that he would be up for a parole hearing in only 10 months. Jmo.

So unless a link is provided to where Massipa says that his year in jail doesn't count towards the new sentence. Then I'm not trusting anything.

Especially since Massipa loves to play word games to the public. But then she documents her own recommendations to the parole board in private. Jmo
 
1) Jub Jub was found guilty of culpable homicide 2) He's a rich celebrity, money and fame is the determining factor of a sentence, it appears 3) As awful as Jub Jub and his companion's reckless and negligent actions are, they did not aim to kill and injure innocent people. But they certainly deserved a harsher sentence, imo.

OP, otoh, aimed his gun and shot 4 lethal shots into a tiny cubicle, he KNEW his actions would kill whoever was inside that closet. There is a huge difference, imo.

Whatever. Jub Jub killed four kids and maimed more, he gets ten years (or eight, not sure). OP kills his girlfriend, he gets six years plus one year served. I was just commenting on the screwed up LIBERAL SA judicial system, when you compare the body count. I don't believe either man was sentenced appropriately. Life is cheap it seems in SA (unless you are a rhino).
 
Link please.

Because just because she factored the year in for her decision. That doesn't mean that the year doesn't count as credit towards the sentence.

So please don't let Masipa's mumble jumble distort the fact of the law of time served. Jmo.

Because when she gave his butt 5 years.

No one knew that she knew that he would be up for a parole hearing in only 10 months. Jmo.

So unless a link is provided to where Massipa says that his year in jail doesn't count towards the new sentence. Then I'm not trusting anything.

Especially since Massipa loves to play word games to the public. But then she documents her own recommendations to the parole board in private. Jmo

Barry Bateman on twitter. Check that and there are others. <modsnip> if she had wanted time served to apply she would have said so.
 
I was responding to this :

THE FACTS? What about the neighbours hearing Reeva screaming in fear of her life, blood curdling screams , like a home invasion was taking place.

Since Reeva wasn't identified by the neighbours as the source of the screams, it's not a fact that they heard Reeva screaming in fear of her life. That's all I was pointing out

Your question is really no less nonsensical, to be honest. Clearly, that poster was using "Reeva" in place of "the woman about to be shot". It's nice to name the actual victim of this crime from time to time rather than the fake "pity me, pity me" one.

And really, all you're doing is disputing "Reeva" rather than "female" - and that is highly pedantic.
 
Barry Bateman on twitter. Check that and there are others. <modsnip> if she had wanted time served to apply she would have said so.

Please stop kidding us. Lol.

Massipa doesn't put the fine print on twitter. Lol.

She would have simply said that she is giving him 6 years with the eligibility of parole in 3 years. But its not counting the year already served.


So did Masipa tell him this at court? That he won't be eligible until after serving 3 years and that 1st year doesn't count?

Did she actually say this that day?

Did she?

When did she tell Oscar that his year in jail meant nothing towards the new sentence.

 
Please stop kidding us. Lol.

Massipa doesn't put the find print on twitter. Lol.

She would have simply said that she is giving him 6 years with the eligibility of parole in 3 years. But its not counting the year already served.


So did Masipa tell him this at court? That he won't be eligible until after serving 3 years and that 1st year doesn't count?

Did she actually say this that day?

Did she?

When did she tell Oscar that his year in jail meant nothing towards the new sentence.


<modsnip>



Barry Bateman
@barrybateman
Jul 6
@SmollyTetelo had she not, she would have said in judgment "6yrs minus the one already served".
View conversation ·
Barry Bateman
@barrybateman
Jul 6
@SmollyTetelo as I understand the judgment, Masipa considered year in prison and house arresting when reaching 6yr term,
View conversation ·
 
Has anyone ever noticed that not a single Pistorian has ever, ever even attempted to address the "two voices" conundrum?

They're all "Oh well, Mrs VDM thought Oscar sounded girlie so it's possible that everyone else did too" - leaving aside that Mrs VDM never heard anyone screaming anyway.

But that Dr Stipp, Mrs Stipp, Mrs Burger AND Mr Johnson all very clearly heard two voices at the same time....that of a male and a female.

Not a whisper about that.

Simply no explanation for that, is there?

Oh wait....yes there is......Oscar yelled at Reeva who screamed and then got shot.
 
Whatever. Jub Jub killed four kids and maimed more, he gots ten years (or eight, not sure). OP kills his girlfriend, he gets six years plus one year served. I was just commenting on the screwed up LIBERAL SA judicial system, when you compare the body count. I don't believe either man was sentenced appropriately. Life is cheap it seems in SA (unless you are a rhino).
I agree, life is cheap.
There are serious flaws in SA, beginning with their police procedures and judiciary system. It is only now coming under scrutiny from the outside.
 
I feel the apology in court was forced on them, too impersonal. He had been told they weren't ready. What part of that did he not understand?

I agree - the finding of remorse is problematical, both legally and factually.

Not only did the Steenkamps feel that Pistorius's apology was insincere, but, also, IMO remorse is not a compelling circumstance, as it would hardly be exceptional for a person who murdered his girlfriend in the mistaken belief that she was an intruder to feel remorse. Also, Masipa will have known from caselaw that an apology has to be verbalised in court in order for it to count as remorse which would lend support to the Steenkamps' view that it wasn't genuine.

From S V Matyityi (2010): 'There is moreover, a chasm between regret and remorse. Many accused persons might well regret their conduct but that does not without more translate to genuine remorse. Remorse is a gnawing pain of conscience for the plight of another. Thus genuine contrition can only come from an appreciation and acknowledgement of the extent of one&#8217;s error. Whether the offender is sincerely remorseful and not simply feeling sorry for himself or herself at having been caught is a factual question. It is to the surrounding actions of the accused rather than what he says in court that one should rather look. In order for the remorse to be a valid consideration, the penitence must be sincere and the accused must take the court fully into his or her confidence. Until and unless that happens the genuineness of the contrition alleged to exist cannot be determined. After all, before a court can find that an accused person is genuinely remorseful, it needs to have a proper appreciation of inter alia: what motivated the accused to commit the deed; what has since provoked his or her change of heart; and whether he or she does indeed have a true appreciation of the consequences of those actions...'
 
<modsnip>



Barry Bateman
@barrybateman
Jul 6
@SmollyTetelo had she not, she would have said in judgment "6yrs minus the one already served".
View conversation ·
Barry Bateman
@barrybateman
Jul 6
@SmollyTetelo as I understand the judgment, Masipa considered year in prison and house arresting when reaching 6yr term,
View conversation ·

Lol. You are still kidding us with the twitter thing. Lol.

So here we go.

Oscars first sentence was vacated due to the new charge that he had to be sentenced for.

This means that the 5 year sentence no longer counts.

But it doesn't mean that part of the sentenced served doesn't count. Jmo.

So please remember that since the old sentence of 5 years doesn't count. The state still needs to recognize the time already served which was 1 year.

Also remember. You can't resentence someone on the same case without giving them credit for time served on that case. Jmo.


So bottom line. Oscar will be eligible for parole in 2 years.

And if Massipa didn't want that year served to count. Then she would have given him 8 years with eligibility in 4 years. Since he already did a year.

Which would then mean that a true 3 years have to be served. Jmo
 
Lol. You are still kidding us with the twitter thing. Lol.

So here we go.

Oscars first sentence was vacated due to the new charge that he had to be sentenced for.

This means that the 5 year sentence no longer counts.

But it doesn't mean that part of the sentenced served doesn't count. Jmo.

So please remember that since the old sentence of 5 years doesn't count. The state still needs to recognize the time already served which was 1 year.

Also remember. You can't resentence someone on the same case without giving them credit for time served on that case. Jmo.


So bottom line. Oscar will be eligible for parole in 2 years.

And if Massipa didn't want that year served to count. Then she would have given him 8 years with eligibility in 4 years. Since he already did a year.

Which would then mean that a true 3 years have to be served. Jmo

I will go with Mr. Bateman. Thanks anyway!
 
I will go with Mr. Bateman. Thanks anyway!

I love you Viper.

Happy Sunday.

We agree to disagree. It doesn't matter.

I'm just glad to always count on your tenacity with a case.

Much love my friend.
 
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