PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #2

[Pyrite]

That's not normal in other, safer regions.

I think Izzylizzy is right, buying might have been more seamless for him. But why is it seamless for anyone?

Why is it typical to pick up 50 rounds designed to rip apart innerds? If it would be for a shooting range, wouldn't that be the safer place to sell them?


MOO

A lot of people don’t shoot at a shooting range that’s attached to a store. They may shoot at a gun club, on private property in the country, or state or federal lands that allow shooting. I buy my ammo 1000 rounds at a time, since you do get a volume discount. And Walmarts is a lot cheaper than most gun shops.

 

[Justice101]

My condolences to the deceased and their families, truly no words for how awful every shooting in America is.

Has it been confirmed that the officer who approached the shooter on the roof was an actual police officer, and not hired security for the event? That piece is so interesting to me - with how long people in the crowd were warning and recording the shooter on the roof, surely a police officer would have radioed it in or called for back up immediately? Was the person who approached the shooter someone with less training for this type of critical urgency?

From what I read the time between him initially being seen, reported and then shooting was maybe only 2 minutes.

The shooter did not need much time to set up, the magazine in his rifle ready to go and just needed to laydown and get his target in his scope sight glass.

Hindsight is always 20/20, so don't take this as criticism.... in hindsight, the officer should have shot the guy first thing but he apparently confronted him and TC turned around and made the LE officer take cover.

I'm sure that officer is torturing himself for not acting more decisively.. but he was probably more like wondering why someone was wanting to watch Trump from the roof and may not have even known at first he had a rifle.

Pure speculation on my part just based on thinking thru this.

UPDATE: I just saw some phone video.. Shooter was on the roof for 114 seconds before shots fired.

You can see him trying to slide up the incline to the apex of the roof. If the officer seen running around the building trying to get a look at him had just somehow been able to contact the Secret Service snipers, this could have been avoided maybe.

This makes my blood boil.

 

[Inthedetails]

It wasn't the purchase of the ammo itself, it was who was buying it for what type of firearm and the local political scene of the day and all the next week.

I agree. It's not the QUANTITY that is the point, imo, but that we are getting info to piece together the timeline of his actions before the crime.

Timelines help.

jmo

 

[Pyrite]

It wasn't the purchase of the ammo itself, it was who was buying it for what type of firearm and the local political scene of the day and all the next week.

Why would who was buying it send up a red flag? The shooter seems to have no history of mental illness or criminal record, as far as has been reported.

 

[Izzylizzy]

One box wouldn't raise any eyebrows, in my opinion. What I found curious is he bought them THAT DAY. I find that rather interesting, though not sure what conclusions, if any, we can draw.

Was shooting into a crowd a fantasy plan that at the very last minute he decided to go ahead with since the Trump rally was convenient?

He took his dad's gun so I guess this also shows his dad didn't store ammo with the gun.

Or, did the kid practice in the days before the rally and run out of ammo?

jmo

BBM:

So far we only know what his father said.
We have no idea and may never know the circumstances surrounding the gun buy.
We only knew about the Crumbley's 9mm handgun purchase for EC because JC and EC both posted about it on social media .
I don't even know it TMC had a social media trail that LE is investigation?

 

[Inthedetails]

BBM:

So far we only know what his father said.
We have no idea and may never know the circumstances surrounding the gun buy.
We only knew about the Crumbley's 9mm handgun purchase for EC because JC and EC both posted about it on social media .
I don't even know it TMC had a social media trail that LE is investigation?

Yes, I should have written, "It appears from reporting that he took his father's gun" or something like that. We don't actually know for sure.

jmo

 

[Izzylizzy]

I'm surprised he waited until that day to buy the ammo actually. I'd have thought he would have already had it stored somewhere.

Who knows?
It could have been as common as needing your paycheck before you can make any new purchases?

 

[Izzylizzy]

Yes, I should have written, "It appears from reporting that he took his father's gun" or something like that. We don't actually know for sure.

jmo

That could have been the father's first line of defense.

 

[kuromiiiilove]

Why would who was buying it send up a red flag? The shooter seems to have no history of mental illness or criminal record, as far as has been reported.

I think a lot of people are failing to realize how entrenched ‘gun culture’ is in America’s rural communities. People view shooting and hunting as recreational sports here, and they’re generally treated as such. I’m not saying that’s how it should be or commenting on gun control measures, simply pointing out the existing attitudes around guns and recreational shooting in rural communities. There would be no red flags, because it’s entirely normal for a young man to go hunt or to the range on the weekends.

 

[Chimera]

Trump supporters tried to warn cops about gunman

New video shows a Trump supporter alerting a police officer to the presence of a gunman on a roof close to where the ex-president was speaking in Butler, Pennsylvania, on Saturday evening.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Multiple attendees loudly call out the location of Crooks to police officers but still the shooter was able to get off multiple shots.

Butler County Sheriff Michael Slupe confirmed that a local police officer did attempt to confront Crooks on the rooftop, moments before the gunfire rang out, but that he ducked for cover when the rifle was trained on him.

A spokesman for the Secret Service has said that the securing the perimeter of the event is the responsibility of local law enforcement.
Green and red bolding mine.
Hmm.

Green bolded : I guess it's easy to say what we would've done ....
But I wish the local LEO had immediately let the secret service know TC was on that roof.

How long (imo this is important) from the first rally attendee notifying LE to the first shots fired by TC ?
A long enough time lapse that the SS should've been warned ?

Red bolded : Do not like to think that anyone is in cya mode, however....
It's agonizing to think the death of Corey and the injuries to the other two men and to the former president Trump could've been avoided.
Corey's death was preventable.
Omo.

 

[Justice101]

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13635097/Secret-Service-trump-assassination-Thomas-Matthew-Crooks.html?openWebLoggedIn=true¶m_reg_source=openweb¶m_targetUrl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%2Fnews%2Farticle-13635097%2FSecret-Service-trump-assassination-Thomas-Matthew-Crooks.html%3FopenWebLoggedIn%3Dtrue¶m__host=www.dailymail.co.uk¶m_regSource=openweb¶m_geolocation=us&base_fe_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%2F&validation_fe_uri=%2Fregistration%2Fp%2Fapi%2Ffield%2Fvalidation%2F&check_user_fe_uri=registration%2Fp%2Fapi%2Fuser%2Fuser_check%2F&isMobile=false

Multiple attendees loudly call out the location of Crooks to police officers but still the shooter was able to get off multiple shots.

Butler County Sheriff Michael Slupe confirmed that a local police officer did attempt to confront Crooks on the rooftop, moments before the gunfire rang out, but that he ducked for cover when the rifle was trained on him.

A spokesman for the Secret Service has said that the securing the perimeter of the event is the responsibility of local law enforcement.
Green and red bolding mine.
Hmm.

Green bolded : I guess it's easy to say what we would've done ....
But I wish the local LEO had immediately let the secret service know TC was on that roof.

How long (imo this is important) from the first rally attendee notifying LE to the first shots fired by TC ?
A long enough time lapse that the SS should've been warned ?

Red bolded : Do not like to think that anyone is in cya mode, however....
It's agonizing to think the death of Corey and the injuries to the other two men and to the former president Trump could've been avoided.
Corey's death was preventable.
Omo.

Eta : Sorry I'm not sure why the link looks like that ?

If the shooter was seen on the roof for 114 seconds and if you look at the FBI snipers once the shots are fired, they are already aiming at that roof so it does look like word was given to the snipers but they were just a few seconds late to taking him out.

The bigger question in my mind was how in the world was TC able to get up on the roof with a rifle. I still think he probably hid it in the large tall spruce trees in the back and then climbed up on the saddle roof and then onto the main apex roof.

But the back of those buildings should have been secured by other officers. Was TC hiding in the spruce tree himself?

This is just unbelievable for him to have been able to do this.

 

[SMK777]

This is just unbelievable for him to have been able to do this.

SBM
And it was very nearly a “mission accomplished”!

 

[DoctorRose]

Just want to agree that TC’s demographics or appearance wouldn’t have raised any flags for the people selling ammo. He looked like a typical guy his age who’s into hunting or whatever. Him fitting into stereotypes in our minds is hindsight. He’s just some dude who walked into a store at that point.

Also I wouldn’t be shocked if the person working there wasn’t aware of the rally or not thinking about it. Imagining myself working behind a counter I’d probably just be bored and off in lala land lol.

 

[DoctorRose]

SBM
And it was very nearly a “mission accomplished”!

Yeah way too close. It reminded me that once on the golf course I was really startled and angry because a golf ball whizzed by my ear and the people behind us didn’t yell “fore”. I was like that could have taken me out omg.

Cannot imagine a bullet grazing my ear. Idc who you are, that is going to scare the wits out of you and make you do some reflecting. I’m interested to see if DT’s speeches take on a new flavor, and I also hope he has mental health support in place if he needs it.

 

[Chimera]

Bringing my post over from the first thread :

US - Shots fired at Donald Trump rally in Pennsylvania as former president is seen with blood across his face, 13 July 2024

There are two buildings in the background. The one he shot from is the one in front of the other. See how the roof rises slightly (reducing the roof's slope) partway down its length?... The shooter was lying alongside that rise on the other side of the peak of the roof. That is likely why he...

www.websleuths.com

" Even if the perp accessed the roof fully outside of the rally perimeters, i.e., the area people had to pass through metal detectors --- then that was too small !
Roughly 150 yards was the distance from the perp to Trump, or 450 feet; and the perimeter was less than that, as it didn't include the buildings to the side ?

Since a bullet can travel much farther than that, why not secure as large a distance as a perp could reasonably shoot someone ?
They needed someone on that roof and prob. the building & roof behind that one as well.
This could have been even worse if there'd been more than the single perp.

I'm questioning if the secret service decided the area outside of the staging and crowd areas didn't need beefed-up security; and they thought the other buildings didn't pose a threat ?
And if so, why ?

My opinion and am saying this a layperson without experience in security --I would have made sure any rooftops had secret service in place as a precaution.
Too close and too tempting for a deranged shooter.
Omo."
Even if it was solely the local LE's responsibility, and not the secret service --I'm assuming the SS and possibly the PA LE would've known the other two buildings needed to be secured on their rooftops as well ?

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13635097/Secret-Service-trump-assassination-Thomas-Matthew-Crooks.html

'This isn't a big place, there's not a lot of buildings around here, why is everything not covered.'
If a rally attendee/ordinary person observed a lack in security, wouldn't the secret service already known and taken steps in advance.
At the very least, if the person in charge of the SS had assumed the local LE was in charge of the other buildings-- I'd have checked to make sure everything was fully protected, including all nearby buildings.
Omo.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Why would who was buying it send up a red flag? The shooter seems to have no history of mental illness or criminal record, as far as has been reported.

Because when a prior president/president comes to town the security rules change and on the surface TMC fit the profile of a mass shooter.
As I said " I guess no red flags were raised" when he purchased the ammo.

 

[DoctorRose]

I wonder if because it was such an open space they didn’t really think of anyone using that smallish building as a vantage point. They were kindof in the middle of nowhere at a fair grounds.

 

[Elley Mae]

Snipers train to shot at great distance, possible this sniper was looking past that building. When looking through a scope all you see is through the scope. There was a second sniper possibly also serving as a spotter that also didn’t see the shooter.

Jmo

 

[Chimera]

If the shooter was seen on the roof for 114 seconds and if you look at the FBI snipers once the shots are fired, they are already aiming at that roof so it does look like word was given to the snipers but they were just a few seconds late to taking him out.

The bigger question in my mind was how in the world was TC able to get up on the roof with a rifle. I still think he probably hid it in the large tall spruce trees in the back and then climbed up on the saddle roof and then onto the main apex roof.

But the back of those buildings should have been secured by other officers. Was TC hiding in the spruce tree himself?

This is just unbelievable for him to have been able to do this.

Bbm.
Agreed ; esp. the bolded.
TC never should've been able to access anyplace near this event whilst armed !
Omo.

 

[JDG]

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