PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #3

[fluffypaste]

The worst aspect of this is that it will encourage others to make similar attempts, possibly further attempts on Trump or attempts on other politicians. One of the biggest assets the Secret Service had was that they projected an aura of invincibility that deterred people from even trying.

There will be people who take from this the lesson that they just need to have slightly better aim.

 

[Luna20]

I fail to see how this is relevant to the protection of President Trump. The area looks like it could handle a crowd, however, it has been established that the shooter wasn't among the crowd for the last 20 minutes, instead he was on the roof of the building where he shot from. I am questioning why wasn't there ground surveillance around the buildings? If they didn't have enough security with guns to man the roof tops, surely someone could have at least walked and watched from the ground even if they were only local police assigned to traffic control.

Agree. Why wouldn’t they have security on the ground level? It’s a public event and any number of things could come up. A fight, theft, loosing your group, heat stroke etc.

 

[Chimera]

they did call him (or text) without response, that was part of the reason why they were concerned IMO

On the day of the rally, his parents attempted to reach out to Crooks to find him. He didn’t respond.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/19/politics/trump-rally-shooter-searches/index.html

Ok, thanks for the link !

I'd read about the parents calling LE, but missed that they'd also called TC.
Omo.

 

[no greed]

From graduation til his death the shooter really changed his looks. From clean cut looking teen to a long haired. I’m sure his parents noticed the rebellion. Does anyone know who the van from Arizona belongs to? Did he get picked up at home by an unknown?

I am wondering about information on this van as well. Do you know of any main stream reporting or investigation about it?

 

[Chimera]

The worst aspect of this is that it will encourage others to make similar attempts, possibly further attempts on Trump or attempts on other politicians. One of the biggest assets the Secret Service had was that they projected an aura of invincibility that deterred people from even trying.

There will be people who take from this the lesson that they just need to have slightly better aim.

Bbm.
Past tense.

All good points made, though !
Omo.

 

[Maumau1616]

That's an angle worth considering. I wondered if maybe his parents were Trump fans, and he wanted to get back at them. Taking his dad's gun could have been an attempted slap in the face -- it was your gun that shot Trump, dad. MOO

Right, but his searching of the many other leaders (royals, Biden, SS director) seems to suggest he was interested in anyone with power. MOO

 

[OldAce]

I mean initially I thought he likely got as far as he did because he blended in. Typical rally attendee kind of thing, but now that we know he showed up and parked at a nearby gas station (I posted an article a couple days ago about that), with a 5 foot ladder and now a bike somewhere in the vehicle or on it. I'm going to guess most rally attendees don't show up with a ladder or a bike. lol We know some LE were watching him due to the range finder, but what about the ladder and the bike? If would be funny if someone didn't die and others get injured. It's like what else are we going to learn about this kid.

Actually; a bike and short manageable ladder would not be remarkable to me in that event setting. A young man, rode his bike down to attend, and had the foresight to have a way to be able to see over the crowd of spectators... Now the rangefinder..That would be a different conclusion.

 

[bestill]

I had read that he called when he noticed his son and one of his guns was missing. But that begs the question... how did he know his gun was missing? If they were locked up, as they should have been IMO, something would have driven him to go check on his weapons stash to see if they were all accounted for. I can't imagine it was really obvious one was missing, like if he had them all on display on a wall or something, and it was glaring that one wasn't in its spot on the wall. So that makes me think something triggered his father to go take a look at his stash, and count to see if they were all there. But why? Did he suspect something?

Matthew Crooks realized his 20-year-old son, Thomas Matthew Crooks, and an AR-style rifle were missing shortly after shots were fired at the former president at a campaign rally on Saturday in Butler, Pennsylvania.

Dad of Trump shooter called police after attack when son missing

Father of gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks owns ‘dozens’ of firearms, law enforcement officials say

www.independent.co.uk

I read on this thread that the parents called 911 before Trump started speaking. Does anyone else remember reading that?

Video: How Trump’s Security Failed to Stop an Assassination Attempt

Videos, audio and photographs of the attempted assassination of former President Donald J. Trump at an election rally shows how a clear threat emerged minutes before the shooting, and how law enforcement failed to protect Mr. Trump.

www.nytimes.com

New Details on Shooter in Donald Trump Assassination Attempt

About 20 minutes before shots rang out, the Secret Service was notified about a suspicious person with a range finder.

www.2news.com

The headline should read "The Security assigned to Trump..." This was not Trump's personal security team. JMO

 

[Maumau1616]

re. any prior convictions, I'd imagine that would have been found by his employer when he applied for the job, given he worked at a nursing home (and working with vulnerable people would likely require a background check first).

what I also find a bit odd is that he needed to search for photos of trump, biden, and the royals. did he not know what they looked like...?

Thomas Matthew Crooks: What we know about Donald Trump's attacker

The 20-year-old registered Republican purchased ammunition the day of the rally, authorities say.

www.bbc.com

 

[Pyrite]

Yet, the parents were concerned that day. I'm puzzled by that. I can't remember a time I was concerned about my 20yos on a random Saturday afternoon to repeatedly try to reach them. If I had a specific reason, then that's different. What was their reason....we're missing that info.

jmo

If one of my kids, when they lived with me, borrowed one of my guns to go to the range, I would expect them to come home after they were done shooting. Pennsylvania maybe isn’t as high crime as California , but leaving a gun in the car for hours isn’t something I would want them to do.

In any case other people act different then the people you are closest too. You can’t expect them to react the way you would. I’m sure the parent’s had a reason to be concerned, but I would be very surprised if the reason was they thought their son was killed trying to kill ex president, current candidate Trump, unless they saw the pictures after the assassination attempt and recognized their son.

 

[Tricia]

Coming up tonight, Friday, July 19th, at 10:30 PM Eastern, former Secret Service agent Jim Rathmann will be our guest on Websleuths YouTube Live. He can discuss what happened and what didn't happen. Join us on YouTube, and feel free to jump into our chat to ask questions. Click on the box below to join us live tonight.

 

[Maumau1616]

The odds and ends we've read, it seems to point to the fact the parent's felt some cause for concern. I wonder if it will ever come to light.

Well, I'd imagine TC's parents were concerned about his mental health (given they're counsellors and would more easily pick up on subtle behavior changes). If they then realized he may still be in possession of Dad's gun and were unable to contact him, calling 911 with concerns about him being missing makes a lot of sense to me. MOO.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Bold above by me -

Maybe others have already shared this info, but local reporters (CBS affiliate in Pittsburgh) interviewed the Butler Township Manager, Tom Knights, in a July 17 broadcast (link below). Mr. Knights said that Butler Township Police informed SS 2 days prior to the rally that they (Butler Township) didn't have the man-power to do anything but cover traffic at and around the event. The interview segment also states that SS did not confirm nor reply to that message. The reporter is initially unclear who the officers inside the building were: at first mention in the interview, she just calls them "police," which doesn't narrow it down for us here, but later calls them "local SWAT team members," and the Township Manager confirms that.

I will point out that there are both a Butler *Township* Police Department (the Farm Show facility is in that township) and a Butler *City* Police Department (Butler is the city where the hospital is that the former President was taken to). In other parts of PA, it's possible for a "township" and a "borough" (or city) to have the same name but totally separate governance and services (even though geographically, the borough may be completely surrounded by the township). But a search for Butler PA SWAT doesn't turn up any clear info (except a page for the Sheriff in Butler County, OHIO) about who the SWAT team works for.

Maybe someone else understands more clearly.

Interview link:

(This appears on the station's verified YouTube channel on July 17 - admins, please delete if YouTube's off-limits here)

Butler City is the County seat and is a part of Butler Township. At the event, Butler Township police primarily did traffic duties. The majority of the venue is in adjacent Connoquenessing Township, and that township uses the Pennsylvania State Police as its local law enforcement. Therefore, the state police agency filled several law enforcement duties during the event instead of the Butler Township police.

Meridian neighborhood awaits impact of Trump rally

BUTLER TWP — It was caution tape, souvenirs, parking opportunists and flags on Meridian and Buttercup roads Saturday morning, as the neighborhood anticipated the rally at the Farm Show to be attended ...

www.butlereagle.com

 

[Donswife48]

Why didn't all the agencies have some channel for communication? I'm just now reading that the majority of personnel protecting the former president were not U.S. Secret Service (USSS) agents. Instead, they were drawn from HSI. The agents were unfamiliar with standard protocols typically used at these types of events, according to the allegations. I'm sure that they are fine and fit for the duties, but they needed to be able to communicate with each other. Majority of Trump security detail were not Secret Service, whistleblowers tell Sen. Hawley

 

[Gemmie]

Why didn't all the agencies have some channel for communication? I'm just now reading that the majority of personnel protecting the former president were not U.S. Secret Service (USSS) agents. Instead, they were drawn from HSI. The agents were unfamiliar with standard protocols typically used at these types of events, according to the allegations. I'm sure that they are fine and fit for the duties, but they needed to be able to communicate with each other. Majority of Trump security detail were not Secret Service, whistleblowers tell Sen. Hawley

Yeah, I brought that same question up. Were they able to communicate with SS if something went down?

 

[Donswife48]

Yeah, I brought that same question up. Were they able to communicate with SS if something went down?

I first heard on a news channel that they all were on a channel they could communicate with, but I haven't found anything written, so while I think it's highly likely, I can't prove it.

 

[Gemmie]

Coming up tonight, Friday, July 19th, at 10:30 PM Eastern, former Secret Service agent Jim Rathmann will be our guest on Websleuths YouTube Live. He can discuss what happened and what didn't happen. Join us on YouTube, and feel free to jump into our chat to ask questions. Click on the box below to join us live tonight.

Did anyone watch and take notes of anything of interest? I was busy with dinner but interested in what was discussed!

 

[MassGuy]

I first heard on a news channel that they all were on a channel they could communicate with, but I haven't found anything written, so while I think it's highly likely, I can't prove it.

I heard that there was a centralized command post that facilitated communications between all the parties involved. There was definitely some sort of communications breakdown here.