PA PA - Judy Smith, 50, Philadelphia, 10 April 1997

[kemo]

I still think about this case. A real mystery.

I could be just a misidentification. Apparently it was done by dental examination. I wonder how "error prone" they are.

That shopkeeper sure remembered a lot of details about a customer she had six earlier. The details did seem to point to Judy Smith.

Unless she was carrying a lot of cash, she must have had a credit card, but apparently the husband never received a bill. Could she have had a "secret" account?
The NC Sherriff made some sort of a "no comment" when asked if the shopkeeper reported that the woman was traveling with anyone else. I interpreted that to mean that there was a man and he was the object of the investigation.

There were reports in Philadelphia that a woman fitting Judy's description was seen walking aimlessly" around the city the day she disappeared. If, as I suspect, she was "taking a vacation from her marriage", it is strange that she didn't tell her adult children (by her first husband) or any of her friends, coworkers or relatives. Since she would expect them to be very worried, I find this very strange. I wonder if there wasn't a mental illness issue involved.

There are a few articles that can be linked from this thread. I wonder if LE is withholding some critical information that might answer a few questions.

 

[JeannieC]

Interesting case. Certain drugs can cause skrewed results on a polygraph. The examiner will notice this on the pretest screening and determines if the person can take the test.

Personally, if it were me and it could mean my life I wouldn't want to take a test that had to be judged by a different method.

There are other reasons not to take the test.....


Who should NOT take a polygraph test:

•Anyone who is being forced to take it.
•Any person with a serious heart condition, unless his doctor has given written approval. A pregnant women, unless her doctor has given written approval.
•Any person who is determined to be mentally incompetent. Any person who has a respiratory illness or cold. Any person who has nerve damage or paralysis.
•Any person who has had a stroke or is an epileptic. Any person who is in pain (i.e., toothache, headache or a recent injury).


I'm not defending him. I don't know why he refused.

This is a real mystery!

 

[kemo]

The fact that husband refused to take the poly seems a little "hinkey". He was a lawyer however and he may have concerns about it. A false negative can cause a lot of trouble. Overall, it seems that he is pretty much in the clear. If Judy was actually on the 7:30 flight, he just didn't have the opportunity to do it. He did invest a lot of time, effort and expense looking for her and it was one of his flyers he sent out that led to her identification. I would think that if he had something to do with her death, he would have "neglected" to send one to the area where the body was found. He may have represented their relationship as "great" when they were really having problems.

 

[CMac2]

What's the real reason the hubby won't take the lie detector test? First he said he'd do it on a couple of conditions- that the FBI administered the test, and that the local police would seek FBI assistance in solving the mystery after he took the test. Unfortunately, the FBI had made it perfectly clear (at that time) that this case did not meet the criteria of getting them involved. I understand he'd WANT the FBI involved, but if they had already said no, why keep pushing the issue? If they can't investigate, they can't investigate.

Later, he agrees to take the lie detector test (sort of), but can't, due to medication. I think that's awful convenient.

I believe Judy went to Philadelphia to meet her husband for their planned trip. I wonder if they got into a fight that night or early the next AM- it could have been about anything- and maybe she packed up her stuff and left (this would explain the usage of her plane ticket but also the lack of clothing/cosmetics in the hotel room in Philadelphia). It would also explain the lack of concrete sightings of Judy in Philadelphia. She may have left almost as quickly as she'd arrived. I think the sightings of Judy around Philadelphia that day were all of the homeless woman that she resembles in appearance (the fact that no one could say for sure it was HER they saw, along with reports of a woman looking disoriented, etc- sounds to me like its more likely the homeless person, perhaps suffering a mental disorder- that they saw, and not Judy herself).

What I can't figure out is how she got to NC. I think she probably went willingly, but why? It doesn't seem she had ties to the area, or reason to go there. I keep reading rumblings about potential trouble in her marriage... but neither the kids nor her hubby seem willing to cop to that fact.

Is it really possible that she left for NC of her own free will, upset for whatever reason with her spouse, and met with foul play once she arrived? If that's not what happened, it seems the only other viable explanation would be that her husband harmed her... but how does one get from Philadelphia to North Carolina and back again in time to A) raise no flags and B) leave absolutely no trail? Regardless of whether he drove here there or they flew there, ID has to be presented, etc. How would he have gotten past that?

I think it possible that hubby and Judy got into an argument upon her arrival (or shortly thereafter) in Philly, which is what motivated her to leave. I don't know why she went to NC, but clearly, she did. Perhaps Hubby knows it would cast a negative light on him to admit that they fought and she left, enough to make him prime suspect #1, and maybe has opted to leave those details out? I think the key is in finding any sort of tie between Judy and Buncombe County. It's not the sort of place you find on a map and think to yourself, "Aha! I'll disappear there!" all randomly and such.

 

[gaia227]

I still think about this case. A real mystery.

I could be just a misidentification. Apparently it was done by dental examination. I wonder how "error prone" they are.

That shopkeeper sure remembered a lot of details about a customer she had six earlier. The details did seem to point to Judy Smith.

Unless she was carrying a lot of cash, she must have had a credit card, but apparently the husband never received a bill. Could she have had a "secret" account?
The NC Sherriff made some sort of a "no comment" when asked if the shopkeeper reported that the woman was traveling with anyone else. I interpreted that to mean that there was a man and he was the object of the investigation.

There were reports in Philadelphia that a woman fitting Judy's description was seen walking aimlessly" around the city the day she disappeared. If, as I suspect, she was "taking a vacation from her marriage", it is strange that she didn't tell her adult children (by her first husband) or any of her friends, coworkers or relatives. Since she would expect them to be very worried, I find this very strange. I wonder if there wasn't a mental illness issue involved.

There are a few articles that can be linked from this thread. I wonder if LE is withholding some critical information that might answer a few questions.

Nice to see people talking about Judy's murder again.

Kemo - I believe the reports of the woman in Philly who was seen wandering around was identified and it wasn't Judy. Admittedly - it has been a few months since I re-read the articles posted but I do remember somewhere in there reading it was a case of mistaken identity.

Her hubby had attended like a weight loss camp in NC a couple years earlier which was the only connection anyone could make with NC - and to muddle the matter further where she was seen was pretty far from the place her husband had went. If anything, in my opinion - that connection to NC points to the husband more than it does to Judy runnning away there and meeting foul play. I don't really know what to think. It seems like the hubby had pretty solid alibi's during the time he was in Philly. The whole thing about Judy having to get a later flight to Philly because she forgot her luggage seems a big 'hinky' to me. No one on the flight could remember seeing her. I think if her husband did kill her, he did it in the days leading up to the trip to Philly, made up the story about her luggage, packed her bags himself and took with him when he went and ultimately used the trip as his alibi because everyone believed that Judy went with him. Unfortunately, this is one of those cases where I don't know if it will ever be solved.

 

[kemo]

gaia,
I didn't know that the "wandering woman" in Philly had been identified. I'll try to check this out. It is my understanding that a Dr. who had a set on the later flight next to Judy's assigned set identified Judy Smith as having been on the flight. If that is true, I think it pretty much rules the husband out.

If the "woman on the flight" isn't definite, it leaves open the possibility that the husband drove her to NC, killed her and drove back to Boston. It would require him to be gone for two days minimum. When did anyone last see Judy and could the husband's whereabouts be verified after that.

One thought I had is that the husband could have killed her somewhere, either in Boston or Philly, and moved her remains later to NC. I'm not sure how this would fit in with known facts. I think it is very unlikely this happened in Philly as his time is very well accounted for and he would be on unfamiliar turf. If the Dr's sighting holds up, I just don't see how he could be involved.

Something I am interested in is the clothing that she was wearing when she was found. Did this come from home or did she buy it later?

 

[JeannieC]

Judy's remains were found at about 4 PM on Sept 7 by hunters in Bumcombe County, Piscah National Forest, about a third of the way up the side of a mountain, in an area known as Hominy Valley. This was near the Stoney Point picnic area.

They found a partially buried skeleton wrapped in a blue blanket and bones scattered over about a hundred-yard area by animals picking at the remains.

"The skeleton still had on long, insulated underwear, blue jeans and hiking boots," says Buncombe County Sheriff Bobby Medford. "There was nothing in the pockets. No wallet. No identification at all."

Near the body investigators found a blue vinyl backpack. Inside were winter clothing and $80 cash. Authorities also found a shirt buried nearby, with $87 in the shirt pocket. She was not wearing her wedding rings.

The remains were sent to the North Carolina medical examiner's lab in Chapel Hill. The body was that of a white female, probably between the ages of 40 to 55, and the woman had "real bad arthritis in her right knee," . The ME's office offered no cause of death.

It might have remained that way forever, if not for Jeffrey Smith's dogged pursuit of his wife and a hunch by a North Carolina doctor.

For months, Smith had been spending his days and nights calling law enforcement officials and medical facilities all over the country, faxing pictures of his missing wife, trying to convince people to help him find her.

One of those fliers apparently made its way to the Angel Medical Center in Franklin, NC, 65 miles west of Asheville. There, an emergency room doctor named Parker Davis saw it and connected the information about Judith Smith to a Sept. 9 story he'd read in the Asheville Citizen-Times about a body found by hunters in the woods.

On Sept. 25, Davis faxed the article to Philadelphia Police.

Det. James Sweeney read the fax and contacted Sheriff Medford's office. Sweeney gave the sheriff Jeffrey Smith's phone number, and Smith arranged to have his wife's dental records sent to North Carolina to see if they could find a match."Judith Smith had extensive dental work," says Sheriff Medford. "The body had extensive dental work. It was a match."


Read the entire article from the "Philadelphia CityPaper - City Beat":
http://archives.citypaper.net/articles/100297/cb.smith.shtml

It also shows a picture of Jeffrey Smith and Judith's son Craig. From the picture it looks like Jeffrey Smith was a very large man and probably couldn't have done any hicking in the mountains.

 

[Kimster]

:rose: Judy is our featured cold case from 6/19 to 6/26/2011 :rose:

Praying this develops new clues! raying:

 

[SunnieRN]

Odd, that after 10 years together as a couple and 8 months in to a marriage, that a friend called it a tenuous relationship. It sounds like they had separate lives within their marriage. Most likely, along with their separate phones, they had separate bank accounts and credit cards also.

As for forgetting her drivers license, if she planned to shop by check or credit card, she would have needed her ID.

There was the Dr, on the flight, three employees of the hotel and a bus driver who saw her in Philly. This to me says she did arrive, with her red backpack. How much cash did she have with her? What clothing items may she have had in her backpack?

If LE don't feel that the two nurses in NC are a lead, I think that means they are looking for someone in particular that she may have been seen with. The clerk at the Christmas store said she was talking, relaxed and gave her personal information.

Last point. How many sandwhiches did she buy? Could give an idea as to whether or not she was with someone else at that time.

I don't think her husband is guilty, but I think she had a boyfriend who may be.

 

[rlc]

Maybe they had a fight, she said she wasn't going, or he told her he did not want her to go. So he ends up on the first flight. She decides she is going anyway, and ends up on the second flight. When she arrives in Philly, he is less than enthusiastic. Or maybe he is behaving inappropriately with a female coworker. Or the fight otherwise continues. This could explain why she was seen on a different flight, seen in the hotel, but not actually seen with her husband (he even went to breakfast without her). She is upset, and upset that he goes about his day without her even though she is upset. She starts out on the bus tour, but decides to do something dramatic. Maybe she encounters someone on the bus tour who tells her about Biltmore and is heading that way, and in an emotional, impulsive decision, she goes along with them. Or maybe she goes by herself (though this brings the question of where the gray sedan came from, even if she took a bus to North Carolina, she somehow found the gray sedan).

So...then...how did she die? Most likely, the owner of the gray sedan, assuming she was not the one driving it and there was an owner. If not, could the stab wounds have been self-inflicted? Far-fetched, but is it impossible that self-inflicted stab wounds could have brought animals to prey, and that animals could have "partially buried" the remains?

 

[McSpy]

This is from one of the articles in the links above:


"Jeffrey Smith says he is as much at a loss as investigators to explain what led Judy to the Blue Ridge Mountains. To his knowledge, she had no friends or relatives in that region. Her only connections, he says, were a week-long trip to Raleigh-Durham to visit Jeffrey at a weight-loss facility several years ago, and a drive to Tennessee or Virginia (Smith and his stepson Craig differ in their recollections) with a patient of Judy's who wanted to visit relatives there."

I wonder when the last time her children saw her alive. Could her husband have killed her months prior to the Philly trip? Did anyone actually witness their marriage?

It isn't unusual for weight loss spas to have outings such as hiking trips.

 

[McSpy]

gaia,
I didn't know that the "wandering woman" in Philly had been identified. I'll try to check this out. It is my understanding that a Dr. who had a set on the later flight next to Judy's assigned set identified Judy Smith as having been on the flight. If that is true, I think it pretty much rules the husband out.

If the "woman on the flight" isn't definite, it leaves open the possibility that the husband drove her to NC, killed her and drove back to Boston. It would require him to be gone for two days minimum. When did anyone last see Judy and could the husband's whereabouts be verified after that.

One thought I had is that the husband could have killed her somewhere, either in Boston or Philly, and moved her remains later to NC. I'm not sure how this would fit in with known facts. I think it is very unlikely this happened in Philly as his time is very well accounted for and he would be on unfamiliar turf. If
the Dr's sighting holds up, I just don't see how he could be involved.

Something I am interested in is the clothing that she was wearing when she was found. Did this come from home or did she buy it later?

I can't rule the husband out. He refuses to take a lie detector test. Why doesn't he get it over with? He's actually hindering the case, because LE seems to be concentrating on him.

 

[McSpy]

Nice to see people talking about Judy's murder again.

Kemo - I believe the reports of the woman in Philly who was seen wandering around was identified and it wasn't Judy. Admittedly - it has been a few months since I re-read the articles posted but I do remember somewhere in there reading it was a case of mistaken identity.

Her hubby had attended like a weight loss camp in NC a couple years earlier which was the only connection anyone could make with NC - and to muddle the matter further where she was seen was pretty far from the place her husband had went. If anything, in my opinion - that connection to NC points to the husband more than it does to Judy runnning away there and meeting foul play. I don't really know what to think. It seems like the hubby had pretty solid alibi's during the time he was in Philly. The whole thing about Judy having to get a later flight to Philly because she forgot her luggage seems a big 'hinky' to me. No one on the flight could remember seeing her. I think if her husband did kill her, he did it in the days leading up to the trip to Philly, made up the story about her luggage, packed her bags himself and took with him when he went and ultimately used the trip as his alibi because everyone believed that Judy went with him. Unfortunately, this is one of those cases where I don't know if it will ever be solved.

I agree. Her forgetting her ID and having to take another flight seems hinky, especially after she turns up missing and then found dead. I can see why LE has been looking at him with suspicion. Maybe, he hired a drug addict, who resembles Judy to take the flight for $$$$$.

 

[McSpy]

Debbie Miller
Normally you purchase your ticket in advance; first go to the "check in counter" where you check your luggage and obtain your boarding pass. You then go to the boarding area. To enter the boarding area, you must pass through the security check where your i.d., boarding pass and all carry-ons are screened (you also pass through a metal detector).

At that point, if you were unable to board, missed youir flight, or changed your mind, you would have to return to the check-in counter to make other arrangements. If there is a later flight with available seats (at the last flight of the day to major destimations usually has empty seats) the airling will normally accomodate. The airline would probably just let the checked luggage go through.

You are required to show picture i.d. at the security check. In 2003, I flew with my 20 year old son who forgot his. They put us through a "rigorous" check, asked a lot of questions, but did let him board. This makes me suspect that Judith was not actually denied entery to the plane, she just "assumed" she would be denied entry. (this is consistant with Jeffery's" statement "Judy realized she'd left her driver's license at home"). I find this a little odd that they didn't at least try to work something out like my kid did, him being a lawyer and all. Obviously we don't have all the facts but it seems like she
gave up a little to quick. That why I suspect this was a rouse on her part to take a later flight.

The Cityview article suggest that she obtained a ticket for the 7:30 flight, someone made it through security with her i.d. and sat in her assigned seat, and someone, apparently a DR, recognized her from the flight. Assuming the facts of the article are essentially cort, I must conclude that Judith was on the flight and did make it to Philly that night.

At some point after that, she embarked on her fatal trip to NC but her
husband clearly remained in Philly. I don't see where he could have participated in her death. The investigation must be directed at how she got to NC and who did she encounter on the way. It looks like, by effectivly concealing this trip from not only her husband but her friends and family, she has covered up her tracts for Law Enforcement.

Maybe, she met someone through the internet and met them in Philly or beyond. Perhaps, she was going to return to the hotel, but got kidnapped by this person or talked into the NC hiking trip. The internet was the wild west back then. People are a tad more savvy about meeting strangers online these days. This begs the questions if she used the internet and if her computer and phone records were checked. If her phone records and computer records were checked, then it either looks like a random kidnapping or her husband was responsible. It doesn't look like LE has found an affair or secret friend yet. I seriously doubt she was having mental problems, unless she had a freak accident on her shopping trip in Philly (fell and hit her head).

 

[cocomod]

:rose: Judy is our featured cold case from 6/19 to 6/26/2011 :rose:

Praying this develops new clues! raying:

Thanks Kimster for featuring this case! This case is certainly as fascinating as it is mysterious.

 

[Darcyline]

Wow, this is a weird case. Every scenario I come up with sounds like a poorly written movie premise that most people would roll their eyes at. The best I came up with is she had a boyfriend or love interest, for some reason it was easiest for them to meet in Philly, had a fight with husband, she then decided to run away with boyfriend/love interest and since she was mad didn't tell anyone, and then that boyfriend/love interest....wanted to take her hiking and then decided to kill her for some unknown reason.

Like, even as I type that it sounds stupid. I am just having trouble even imagining scenarios that make all the facts fit.

 

[Lera213]

Well suppose hub suggested her go take a day or two shopping to NC (hub left the nc part out because he knew that would look suspicious) while he is doing his conference thing. Rented a car under an assumed name, she goes down there, shopped, and stuff. Husband's hired person, or someone in NC (stranger) saw her shopping, she must have met some person or couple, maybe asked where is a good place to say cheap? Person said you should camp up in this area it is beautiful blah blah blah, horses up there too blah blah blah.

She goes there, no tent wanted to sleep in her car moves to different location then some local came across her and did his dirty deed.

I don't know but hub could have hired someone and set it up. I know he doesn't look guilty and not saying he is only trying to come up some plausible theory. I failed.

 

[SunnieRN]

One of the articles said her children saw her the day before she left. This would mean, that her husband had to be at a conference, even speaking at one session, while driving his wife to NC, letting her take time to shop and killing her.

If he is responsible, he hired someone to kill her, imo.

 

[JeannieC]

This is just a thought but if they had only been married for 8 months I wonder if she still had her driver's license in her previous name or if she kept her old license (which might not have expired yet), and rented a car in that name. Possibly she used a credit card with her old name. Of course the bill would still have gone to the house and her husband would have seen the charges and told the police, unless he was involved.

 

[McSpy]

The detectives found that she had no cosmetics in the Philly hotel room, which is very odd, since she was supposedly expected at a cocktail party in the evening. Most 50 year old women wear some make-up to that type of an occasion.