PA - Kenzie Houk, 26, pregnant, murdered, Wampum, 20 Feb 2009

[JaneInOz]

This is rural PA people, you would be hard pressed to find a home WITHOUT a gun. You can't take these people's guns from them.

Who exactly was taking care of these children? An 11 year old getting himself and a 7 year old ready for school?? The mother pregnant AGAIN? Living with the boyfriend? Where is the other father?
I'm sick of people having children they don't want and can't take care of. Not saying she deserved this, but this family needs to take responsibilty for what happened.

THe Mother that was pregnant again as you put it was not the boys mother - but his step mother

 

[drew]

THe Mother that was pregnant again as you put it was not the boys mother - but his step mother

Yes I know that and that has nothing to do with anything.

 

[JaneInOz]

Yes I know that and that has nothing to do with anything.

It has EVERYTHING To do with it...have you read all the reports ?

 

[less0305]

ITA, OBE. These are frightening times we're living in and as I said, we will see spikes in violent crimes all over the US. Still, that doesn't necessarily explain why we're seeing children commit murder. IMO, there is a deeper reason for that which is not tied to the current economic environment. This is what we need to figure out.

As my mother has said for years - music, videos, movies, video games, TV. Kids are bombarded with violence at every turn. We're raising kids who are desensitized by violence. It's only going to get worse. I never wanted to sound like my mom, but as I've gotten older and raised my kids I gotta say...she was right.

 

[drew]

It has EVERYTHING To do with it...have you read all the reports ?

You are missing my point and yes I read the reports, this is a local story for me.

 

[MeoW333]

I live in southwest Georgia and the unemployment rate is higher than the national average. We have seen an escalation in violent crime the last few months.

I am more alert than ever before and I live in a neighborhood where crime doesn't happen but that doesn't mean it can't. No one is safe no matter where they live. I think everyone should be extremely careful. When so many hands are idle the devil will do his work.

imoo

I agree and combined with the desensitization of society..

 

[Tonia]

"He actually told my son that he wanted to do that to her," said Houk's brother-in-law, Jason Kraner. "There was an issue with jealousy." (That statement right there should have been dealt with.)

Defense attorney Dennis Elisco said he plans to ask Monday for the boy to be released on bail and for the case to moved to juvenile court. Elisco and police said they had no clear motive for the shooting.

The boy's father, Christopher Brown, is "a mess" and had no indication his son had a problem with Houk, Elisco said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090222/ap_on_re_us/pregnant_woman_killed

 

[wildTrose]

This is rural PA people, you would be hard pressed to find a home WITHOUT a gun. You can't take these people's guns from them.

Who exactly was taking care of these children? An 11 year old getting himself and a 7 year old ready for school?? The mother pregnant AGAIN? Living with the boyfriend? Where is the other father?
I'm sick of people having children they don't want and can't take care of. Not saying she deserved this, but this family needs to take responsibilty for what happened.

How do you know this baby wasnt wanted? and there isnt anything wrong with an 11 year old getting himself ready for school....so what she was living with her boyfriend they were engaged! cause ive lived with mine for 5 years now...and have no plans of getting married...ive been divorced 21 years and wont get married again
the other father why would he be there? he might be deceased or they are divorced
why are you being so hard on this family? if you want to be upset about them then be upset they had guns in the house..not that she was pregnant or the kids got themselves ready for school...

 

[passionflower]

local web site.........

http://www.insidebutlercounty.com/i...egional-headlines/2923-homicide-investigation

 

[Openmind]

If you live in a rural area, the assertion is people need their guns, but if you live in an urban areas the contention is, with so much crime, people need to arm themselves for protection. CAP, Child Access Prevention, laws do not prevent people from owning guns. These laws are about securing guns out of the reach of children. If you have a license to carry a gun, you have that gun on you and the gun is secure. I have serious problems with leaving guns in places where children can access them unsupervised. In the case of the eight year old that has pled guilty to murdering one man and now this eleven year old boy that is accused of murdering this woman and baby, if they did not have a gun accessible to them, I doubt these victims would be dead today. Remember the quote, "God made man, but Samuel Colt made them equal." Guns are give unbridled power to anyone and everyone despite their size, mental condition -- and age.

Just so you know, I am a strong supporter of the 2nd Amendment. It is our right to own a gun, but it is our obligation to handle those guns responsibly. In my home, our guns are stored in a locked gun safe. My problem is the easy access the children in these tragic events had to guns. The assumption because I use guns correctly, and I have instructed my child on how to use a gun then they must be emotionally and psychologically aware of the full ramifications of gun usage. It does not factor in the impulsivity of a child to sometimes act recklessly or perhaps react in anger.

 

[Trino]

How can society continue to deal in juvenile detention with younger kids who commit murder? Juvenile courts and detention IMO weren't really meant to deal with youngsters who killed. Youthful murderers just can't be housed with kids who are out of control or those charged with much lesser crimes.

The story said this boy is out on bail. To whom? The father? How is the father going to deal with such problems?

 

[wildTrose]

he is being held without bond

 

[passionflower]

The 4 year old daughter was able to run to tree trimmers in the area and tell the story to get help.
I am thinking if JR ws awake & saw anything of Haleigh kidnapping, he to would be able to tell the story!

 

[passionflower]

Wampum is a very tiny rural farm area. I have driven through the 'village'........
Hunting is #1 out there. But I think a child has to be 12 to hunt with an adult.
Guns are in almost every home around that area. IMO

 

[Openmind]

One thing I have seen in the last decade is a changed view our children. Many parents see their children as peers, and there is an assumption that because I, the adult, am happy with my new life and all the collective changes then my child is right there with me adjusting and adapting along with me. I see children less protected, valued for their innocence, or given the time to grow and mature. Too many parents want their children be their best friend, and then want those children to understand when they get a new best friend. Everyone says children are resilient but that does not mean they do not need stability, consistency, and protection from behaviors and information inappropriate to their age. Children do not have the life experiences to judge many of the events around them to understand their true longterm impact on their lives. There are more remarriages, frequent changing relationships, blended families, and a society that inundates our children with information about violence, sex, and self serving behaviors. We are going to have more and more insecure and desensitized children that will make impulsive decisions that they don't even understand.

 

[southcitymom]

How can society continue to deal in juvenile detention with younger kids who commit murder? Juvenile courts and detention IMO weren't really meant to deal with youngsters who killed. Youthful murderers just can't be housed with kids who are out of control or those charged with much lesser crimes.

The story said this boy is out on bail. To whom? The father? How is the father going to deal with such problems?

I personally think younger juveniles who murder should be dealt with in the same manner that we deal with other out of control kids. Why do you say detention isn't meant to deal with youngsters who kill? It deals with youngsters who rape and assault and molest. I do not put young children who murder in a different category. I do not know a lot about our juvenile detention system, but would think there would be counseling available to all in it.

 

[Linda7NJ]

This is rural PA people, you would be hard pressed to find a home WITHOUT a gun. You can't take these people's guns from them.

Who exactly was taking care of these children? An 11 year old getting himself and a 7 year old ready for school?? The mother pregnant AGAIN? Living with the boyfriend? Where is the other father?
I'm sick of people having children they don't want and can't take care of. Not saying she deserved this, but this family needs to take responsibility for what happened.

OMG! I can not believe....shaking head....

If an 11 year old is not capable of getting himself and a 7 year old sibling up and dressed and off to school to give his about to pop any minute step mother a break then there's something wrong with him!

GODD GREIF! He was 11, not 5 or 6!

How can you possibly say this couple didn't want or didn't care for their children, if you bother to actually read the links provided you would never say such a horrible thing about a MURDER VICTIM and her unborn murdered baby.

 

[Trino]

OH MY GOD

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jfUUCNd8ljeuLU4Qr3BF_5pwHXlwD96GBSSO0
SNIPPED !!!!!
IS DESINGED FOR CHILDREN That is RIDICULOUS

And no need to be registered MORE RIDICULOUS

Here is a photo of a YOUTH 20 guage Shotgun

http://images.google.com.au/imgres?...firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&sa=N

And then I found this - a list of all the guns MADE FOR CHILDREN

http://www.ocshooters.com/Gen/kidshooting/youth-firearms.htm

SIGH

People that live in suburban and city areas have little idea how rural people live. It's a different world. Rifles and sport shooting are about as necessary as owning a car (truck), and, yes, most kids start early.

Hand guns/concealed weapons are more the weapon of choice for urban areas where they can be used for self-defense, and maybe this is where many urbanites get the message that guns and violence against others are related.

Shooting and killing in urban areas is much more prevelant than in rural America. To a rural owner it's more about hunting and sport. Occasionally, something horrible happens, but most rural gun owners are responsbile individuals. Maybe you don't agree and this is not to say I would purchase one of these rifles, but if you understand rural lifestyle (and the NRA), you can get a better idea why someone would use the website you posted.

 

[passionflower]

If I am hearing our local news correct, mother never woke up.
Mom was shot while sleeping.
11 year old was smart to think of alibi, he was ready for school, got 7 year old up to go to school who slept through this.
(Smart enough to use pillow as a silencer, as seen on TV)?????
5 year up woke up later and ran for help, crying her mom was dead..............
neighbors say 11 yr. old boy was 'rough'...........does that mean bully?

 

[Openmind]

Rural or urban, you have to know the influences that are affecting your child and their life. Lumping everyone together to try and explain away how or why these children have guns ignores the causes of why they came to kill with those guns. Thirty years ago, guns -- and often loaded guns -- used to be left in unlocked trucks in just about every rural community across America. Not anymore and there are reasons why.

Thirty years ago, rural or urban, I bet most kids did not come home to empty houses or got themselves off to school in the morning. Society has changed.