PA - Leon Katz, infant, murdered, and twin, injured by babysitter, Pittsburgh- June 24, 2024

[Tortoise]

I'd need to wait and see what is presented in court to decide what I think happened to Ari. Virzi could be responsible. I'm not saying she's definitely not. But there are other possibilities IMO besides Virzi.

At any rate, I don't see any reason to decide telling the father about the genital injury and sending him a photo makes it more likely Virzi did it. The mother was asleep and discussing any part of an infant's body with the father just doesn't seem perverted or odd to me as it does to some others who have posted. That was my main point in my earlier post. One concern though based on your post-- visible bruises from force (if that's what these were-- we don't know that for sure) can take some time to form. When were the injuries supposed to have happened if visible bruises were there? So far as I can tell, Virzi only arrived that day and it's not clear she was ever alone with Ari until later in the day when she volunteered to change his diaper. And if the injuries somehow were inflicted early in the day, why had neither parent noticed them? Why had they not heard screams? Had neither of them changed Ari's diaper or changed his clothes that day? Are we 100% sure the belly injury below the belly button isn't due to a hernia?

I'd like to hear the sworn testimony in court re: Ari. I've seen the early quotes from a doctor but there are cases where pre-trial quotes that are widely circulated by the media definitely don't match the person's sworn testimony in court. That can be due to deliberate misquoting, accidental misquoting OR sometimes it's due to the person changing his/her story under oath. And there have been cases where doctors were wrong about injuries being from abuse. I'd also like to see the entire PCA but that doesn't seem to be published yet.
MOO

I'm assuming from the charges that they have been determined by medics not to be older bruises, and that bruising in two locations is likely linked in time and both being deemed suspicious (ie. no hernia or other explanation found). JMO

 

[NCWatcher]

I'm assuming from the charges that they have been determined by medics not to be older bruises, and that bruising in two locations is likely linked in time and both being deemed suspicious (ie. no hernia or other explanation found). JMO

Probably but I'm not comfortable assuming. It's not as though innocent people haven't been charged with crimes. Some are even convicted unfortunately.
MOO

 

[SMK777]

That is helpful. We have gone down lots of wrong rooms because of poorly-written PCA's in other cases. I agree this one seems to say the group outing was "in the afternoon" and Virzi's grocery trip alone occurred after that. She was definitely back by early evening. I don't see any reason to find that odd. Why would the entire group grocery shop with the two infants if Virzi was able and willing to go alone? Why expose the twins to more germs and make an "afternoon outing" even longer?

I also am not sure I think sending a photo to the father was weird. If I was in the situation & NOT responsible for the injury but discovered it, I'd likely think a doctor should be consulted & I'd want to show the urgency. (Although to be fair, we don't know how "red & swollen" the area looked.) I'm not sure I'd just wait around for both parents to be awake, present and together and then say BTW look at this... It sounds like the mother was napping--and I'm not sure if I'd immediately wake up a likely exhausted mother since the dad was right there and awake. (But not changing the diaper himself I see!) Personally I don't see why sending the photo to the father was considered so weird unless we conclude Virzi was definitely responsible for the injury & the photo gave her more kicks. (But with cell phones some people photograph just about everything they see these days.) Surely we can't conclude that calling attention to a baby's genitals to a man is sexual, especially when the man is the baby's father.

I've personally not concluded Virzi is guilty of the genital injury yet. Other posts have mentioned cats and rats. But I'd want to know if the twins' fingernails were trimmed. If the baby's genital area was irritated, I could imagine he might pull and scratch at that area. (Just how long had it been since his diaper was changed given the afternoon outing?) And facial scratches could easily be done by either twin especially if they got agitated by the afternoon trip.
MOO

I share your thoughts. I keep wondering IF the incident had been limited only to the first infant and the genital and other injuries, whether there may have been some reasonable explanation which could have tempered things, especially if attorneys had been consulted.

If the mom was napping and NV changed the diaper, it’s not unreasonable to send a photo to the dad so that he could understand exactly what she was seeing, and understand the urgency of it. I’ve had pet sitters do similar when I’m on vacation.


But it’s the catastrophic death of the second infant in her care, coming right on the heels of the first, which just throws everything off the rails and makes this case so baffling and downright bizarre. I’m sure the parents and physicians had to have thought the same. It just changes everything.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

That is helpful. We have gone down lots of wrong rooms because of poorly-written PCA's in other cases. I agree this one seems to say the group outing was "in the afternoon" and Virzi's grocery trip alone occurred after that. She was definitely back by early evening. I don't see any reason to find that odd. Why would the entire group grocery shop with the two infants if Virzi was able and willing to go alone? Why expose the twins to more germs and make an "afternoon outing" even longer?

I also am not sure I think sending a photo to the father was weird. If I was in the situation & NOT responsible for the injury but discovered it, I'd likely think a doctor should be consulted & I'd want to show the urgency. (Although to be fair, we don't know how "red & swollen" the area looked.) I'm not sure I'd just wait around for both parents to be awake, present and together and then say BTW look at this... It sounds like the mother was napping--and I'm not sure if I'd immediately wake up a likely exhausted mother since the dad was right there and awake. (But not changing the diaper himself I see!) Personally I don't see why sending the photo to the father was considered so weird unless we conclude Virzi was definitely responsible for the injury & the photo gave her more kicks. (But with cell phones some people photograph just about everything they see these days.) Surely we can't conclude that calling attention to a baby's genitals to a man is sexual, especially when the man is the baby's father.

I've personally not concluded Virzi is guilty of the genital injury yet. Other posts have mentioned cats and rats. But I'd want to know if the twins' fingernails were trimmed. If the baby's genital area was irritated, I could imagine he might pull and scratch at that area. (Just how long had it been since his diaper was changed given the afternoon outing?) And facial scratches could easily be done by either twin especially if they got agitated by the afternoon trip.
MOO

I am in agreement with you on many of these points. I simply cannot "prove" her guilty with anything brought forward yet.
The strangeness is just too strong here.
At least more facts are coming out, but we still do not know enough.

I also want to study more about what the attorney, Mark Freeman has stated. He is a litigator. He is far to the other side of what is currently being stated about what happened here. BUT, the "other side" IS what we always do have to explore. (thanks @Curious Me for highlighting the information)

“The idea that an injury is likely the result of child abuse is deeply embedded — it’s been taught for so long,” he said. “And a lot of doctors are not familiar with the newer literature which shows how unlikely it is that such injuries are from deliberate acts.”

He said the American Academy of Pediatrics has “done a 180” since 2001, when they said that a “constellation of injuries” was unlikely to come from falls.

Lawyers to seek death penalty for student accused of killing friend’s baby

Prosecutors will fight to see Nicole Virzi, who is facing charges for the murder of six-and-a-half-week-old Leon Katz, executed if she is found guilty

www.thetimes.com

 

[SMK777]

I am in agreement with you on many of these points. I simply cannot "prove" her guilty with anything brought forward yet.
The strangeness is just too strong here.
At least more facts are coming out, but we still do not know enough.

I also want to study more about what the attorney, Mark Freeman has stated. He is a litigator. He is far to the other side of what is currently being stated about what happened here. BUT, the "other side" IS what we always do have to explore. (thanks @Curious Me for highlighting the information)

“The idea that an injury is likely the result of child abuse is deeply embedded — it’s been taught for so long,” he said. “And a lot of doctors are not familiar with the newer literature which shows how unlikely it is that such injuries are from deliberate acts.”

He said the American Academy of Pediatrics has “done a 180” since 2001, when they said that a “constellation of injuries” was unlikely to come from falls.

Lawyers to seek death penalty for student accused of killing friend’s baby

Prosecutors will fight to see Nicole Virzi, who is facing charges for the murder of six-and-a-half-week-old Leon Katz, executed if she is found guilty

www.thetimes.com

Yes, the attorney statement in red is very interesting. If limited to the first infant, I would wonder as others have if the baby may have had untrimmed nails, and if there were some kind of genital infection, whether he may have pulled and scratched at it himself (again, I’ve had cases where my pets did this type of thing, rubbing and scratching an infected area, thus causing redness, swelling , and bleeding. I also had an incident many years ago when my own son was teething, where he caused his lips to redden and swell from furiously rubbing the sore gums.).

I suppose there could be a theory that the first infant’s emergency caused the second one, from escalation of chaos and panic. If the parents were very upset and rushing out to the ER, NV may have felt that the visit was turning into a disaster and that all hell was breaking loose.

I’m just trying to stay open to all possibilities and take into consideration what the defense attorney is saying.

 

[taylorss]

Wow this case is something!! almost never find myself saying this, but how about we just skip the trial & move right to the capital punishment by starving dogs phase
MOO

 

[LifeIsAMystery]

Oh, oops, I get it. Sorry, they must mean the brother of the twin. View attachment 527609​

View attachment 527608

I just need to know now how NV ended up back being left with Leon after she had been at a grocery store by herself, somehow sent a photo of the genital injuries to the father, then got left back at the family's home with the one twin.

​

DBM

 

[taylorss]

The idea that violent injuries to helpless tiny essentially immobile infants are caused by child abuse is "deeply embedded" because it's clearly & indisputably true.

"The idea that my client is responsible is deeply embedded" is how defense attys admit the obvious & try to gaslight.

A six-week old baby can't even turn over on his own.

 

[SMK777]

I think it was reported that she had encouraged them to go out to dinner for their first anniversary and Father's Day, assume that is where they were when she sent him the photo, and she was with babies in their apt. Was in an article upthread, will look for link. MOOO.

NV claimed the mom was napping when she sent the dad the phone photo of the genital injury.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I think it was reported that she had encouraged them to go out to dinner for their first anniversary and Father's Day, assume that is where they were when she sent him the photo, and she was with babies in their apt. Was in an article upthread, will look for link. MOOO.

We really need a much more precise timeline. I , now, am more confused about exact information.
The neighborhood walk.
Her grocery store visit. Why does this matter? What did she buy?
When Mother napped. How long.
Where WAS NV when she fell asleep. When
Where was Dad, when received text images. When.
Was the anniversary dinner planned or was it spontaneous.
Had they EVER had a babysitter? (We all know how worried we are when we FIRST leave our infants)
How much do infants finger nails grow at 6 weeks old.

I'm just providing a stream of consciousness of how much is still unsettling to me.
So obviously moo moo moo.

 

[NCWatcher]

We really need a much more precise timeline. I , now, am more confused about exact information.
The neighborhood walk.
Her grocery store visit. Why does this matter? What did she buy?
When Mother napped. How long.
Where WAS NV when she fell asleep. When
Where was Dad, when received text images. When.
Was the anniversary dinner planned or was it spontaneous.
Had they EVER had a babysitter? (We all know how worried we are when we FIRST leave our infants)
How much do infants finger nails grow at 6 weeks old.

I'm just providing a stream of consciousness of how much is still unsettling to me.
So obviously moo moo moo.

Much is unsettling to me too.

About the only question listed above I can absolutely answer is about babies' fingernails. Some babies are born with long fingernails that need immediate trimming. Others need their nails trimmed weekly or even more often in the first few weeks of life because they can accidentally scratch their faces, eyes, etc even before the nails harden up. And I'd guess twins might scratch each other too. Obviously I don't know about these babies but I'd think they would have needed trims by 6 weeks even if they were born prematurely. (I don't know that they were but multiples often are.)

Trimming Your Baby's Nails (for Parents)

Cutting your little one's nails can be a bit scary. Here's how to do it safely.

kidshealth.org

MOO

 

[fred&edna]

How did the mother of the twins and Virzi become acquainted? How long had they been friends? Had they spent time together before this? And, how long had Virzi been in their home before this abuse and death occurred? Have there been any detailed reports of the backstory here?

 

[SMK777]

How did the mother of the twins and Virzi become acquainted? How long had they been friends? Had they spent time together before this? And, how long had Virzi been in their home before this abuse and death occurred?

The attorney for NV stated they’d been good friends for 5 years and that the couple considered NV a “trusted friend” which presumably is why they allowed her to babysit.

 

[fred&edna]

The attorney for NV stated they’d been good friends for 5 years and that the couple considered NV a “trusted friend” which presumably is why they allowed her to babysit.

Thank you! I am curious how many times they visited each other.

This is a very strange and horrific case