Identified! PA - Philadelphia, 'Boy in the Box', WhtMale 4-6, 4UMPA, Feb'57 #2 - Joseph Augustus Zarelli

[aThousandYearsWide]

I am currently researching nearby orphanages and I was wondering a couple of things:

1. Are we sure if our doe was from where he was found or could he be from elsewhere? I know the bassinet box was traced to the local area but that could have already been there discarded for all we know.
2. I have found several message boards to local orphanages. Should someone post on those asking if they ever remembered a boy that went missing?

 

[cherrymeg]

I am currently researching nearby orphanages and I was wondering a couple of things:

1. Are we sure if our doe was from where he was found or could he be from elsewhere? I know the bassinet box was traced to the local area but that could have already been there discarded for all we know.
2. I have found several message boards to local orphanages. Should someone post on those asking if they ever remembered a boy that went missing?

In the message boards do people have bad experiences. It can't hurt to ask. If this happened to a lot of kids it should be a bigger deal.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

Former residents of a now-closed Catholic orphanage in Vermont say nuns killed and tortured foster children
Former residents of a now-closed Catholic orphanage in Vermont say nuns killed and tortured foster children
"They recalled children being thrown down stairs, shaken into shock and beaten over and over while living at the orphanage between the 1930s to 1970s.

One former orphan, Joseph Barquin, said he was fondled by nuns who then mutilated his genitals."

The Boy in the Box had scars on his genitals! I know this is in Vermont though which is approx. 6 hours away. However, abuse in orphanages were happening all over during this time.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

In the message boards do people have bad experiences. It can't hurt to ask. If this happened to a lot of kids it should be a bigger deal.

I commented on an orphanage abuse survivors blog. I asked if anyone ever went missing in the late 50's. He went to one about 30 minutes away from where our doe was found. A few details of his abuse stick out being the nuns punishment for trying to run away was shaving the boys head and our doe's head was recently cut.

 

[cherrymeg]

I commented on an orphanage abuse survivors blog. I asked if anyone ever went missing in the late 50's. He went to one about 30 minutes away from where our doe was found. A few details of his abuse stick out being the nuns punishment for trying to run away was shaving the boys head and our doe's head was recently cut.

Was food withheld?

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

Was food withheld?

Regarding food he mentioned that if he didn't finish everything on his plate a nun would force it down his throat until he vomited.

 

[cherrymeg]

Regarding food he mentioned that if he didn't finish everything on his plate a nun would force it down his throat until he vomited.

Jesus! Nuns were vicious back then. My aunt is a nun and they are pretty chill. When my dad, her brother, was in catholic school they forced you to be right handed sometimes with a ruler.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

What you read is correct. They were not only trusted, but were also respected and relatively well-connected individuals. They were part of a group of people who...enjoyed this sort of thing. You'll encounter all manner of insistence to the contrary regarding M's account of what happened, but her story is consistent, detailed, and contains enough verifiable information to warrant recognition that, at the very least, we know who killed this child.

Do you have some personal knowledge about this case? If so, there is a verification process for insiders.

 

[sloane7777]

Jesus! Nuns were vicious back then. My aunt is a nun and they are pretty chill. When my dad, her brother, was in catholic school they forced you to be right handed sometimes with a ruler.

I was one of those evil left handed kids my middle knuckle is still fatter than the right hand and I still shake when having to measure with a yardstick !!!! But bonus I can write with both , but always write left hand out of spite

 

[cherrymeg]

I was one of those evil left handed kids my middle knuckle is still fatter than the right hand and I still shake when having to measure with a yardstick !!!! But bonus I can write with both , but always write left hand out of spite

I don't think my dad can write with his left. His handwriting is pretty bad. It's weird but the nun's at my aunts convent are some of the nicest people. They are also liberal and and fun. They might be a different generation of nuns. My aunt is 5 years older than my dad. When did they realize the left hand wasn't evil?

 

[sloane7777]

I don't think my dad can write with his left. His handwriting is pretty bad. It's weird but the nun's at my aunts convent are some of the nicest people. They are also liberal and and fun. They might be a different generation of nuns. My aunt is 5 years older than my dad. When did they realize the left hand wasn't evil?

as far as I know they still think that LOL!! oh and my writing is horrible too , so your Dad isn't alone
I think its just the particular churches, High School was a boarding school and those Nuns were great ( we got away with a lot ) but the elementary school was in a more conservative area and good lord they were frightening!!

 

[cherrymeg]

as far as I know they still think that LOL!! oh and my writing is horrible too , so your Dad isn't alone
I think its just the particular churches, High School was a boarding school and those Nuns were great ( we got away with a lot ) but the elementary school was in a more conservative area and good lord they were frightening!!

I think elementary school is when they can beat the devil hand out of you. I forget I'm right handed sometimes. With typing your hands are equal and my signature isn't specific.

 

[sloane7777]

Do you have some personal knowledge about this case? If so, there is a verification process for insiders.

Ive read M's story is there a better link to it somewhere that you know of ?, I swear I read a really detailed account that I cant find again.

 

[larsonslair]

Ive read M's story is there a better link to it somewhere that you know of ?, I swear I read a really detailed account that I cant find again.

The earlier pages of this thread give a rather extensive account of what is known publicly. I also recommend David Stout's The Boy in the Box: The Unsolved Case of America's Unknown Child. Beware of sources presenting conflicting (even contradictory) information regarding the case.

 

[T rex]

Ive read M's story is there a better link to it somewhere that you know of ?, I swear I read a really detailed account that I cant find again.

The reason I haven't totally dismissed M's story whether it's true or not is because it is very believable, not at all over dramatic like when someone is making something up just to get attention.
Along with the things she seems to know about this case a few other things get my attention. For instance the vomiting. We know the boy was 4 or 5 years old and was severely malnourished. If you take a young child with a weak stomach and feed them something saucy like baked beans I could definitely see the vomiting.
Another thing is the cause of death. Blunt force trauma. Now I don't know a whole lot about this case and I don't know when that information was released, maybe way back then but I'm just wondering if the boys injuries were consistent with having his head smashed on the floor. I'm gonna guess that they were because LE initially took M's story so seriously.
Just my opinion and I still don't know how much I should believe this person.

 

[sloane7777]

It was such a long time ago ,Details can be fuzzy I wonder if she submitted to a polygraph?

 

[T rex]

I was just thinking these forums are dedicated to finding the names of unidentified people and this thread to finding the name of this boy, but wouldn't it be ironic, depending on the circumstances surrounding his birth, if he never even had one and we were all looking for something that was never really there? Almost like a ghost.
The bright side to this would be that with the DNA capabilities we now have at the least his family could be identified and if any of them took an interest in him, which I assume they would, he could then receive his name.
I know DNA is by far the likeliest way this boy will ever be identified but under just the right circumstances it may be the only possible way.

 

[cherrymeg]

The reason I haven't totally dismissed M's story whether it's true or not is because it is very believable, not at all over dramatic like when someone is making something up just to get attention.
Along with the things she seems to know about this case a few other things get my attention. For instance the vomiting. We know the boy was 4 or 5 years old and was severely malnourished. If you take a young child with a weak stomach and feed them something saucy like baked beans I could definitely see the vomiting.
Another thing is the cause of death. Blunt force trauma. Now I don't know a whole lot about this case and I don't know when that information was released, maybe way back then but I'm just wondering if the boys injuries were consistent with having his head smashed on the floor. I'm gonna guess that they were because LE initially took M's story so seriously.
Just my opinion and I still don't know how much I should believe this person.

If he was beaten earlier head trauma can also cause vomiting. If abuse was normal it can sometimes take hours maybe longer to be fatal. If you starve a child and they eat too fast throwing up would be normal too. M's description of events is plausible. If you look at what is considered mentally unstable it's basically seeing a psychiatrist and being hesitant to go over and over details of this case. If having a shrink makes you unstable than count me in as crazy. Supposedly M has a life and has been successful despite abuse. Giving LE a statement, names and an address and being doubted or called crazy might not be something she wants to go through. If she is a victim too, I can't imagine those memories are easy for her. Digging up those things might bring up stuff she can't deal with.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Does anyone know what is going on with this and The boy in the box and any DNA matches?.It been awhile now.Has anyone tried to contact her or the Vidocq Society to see what happening .I hope and pray we get an update soon. Golden State Killer: The woman instrumental in his capture

May I please bump this up again.Has anyone heard any news on this or any relative DNA matches or and update on him,Can anyone find out?It's been a long time with no update on this DNA or on him.That's very sad.

 

[Roselvr]

May I please bump this up again.Has anyone heard any news on this or any relative DNA matches or and update on him,Can anyone find out?It's been a long time with no update on this DNA or on him.That's very sad.

No, no news has been shared if shes found anything yet. Possible shes stuck because GEDmatch changed their policy. People now have to physically opt in for her, DNA Doe Project and others to be able to match DNA like DDP has been doing


From the article

But word moved fast among law enforcement, and amateur genetic sleuth Barbara Rae-Venter found herself very much in demand.

“I have quite a number of cases … in progress,” Rae-Venter said. “I’m hoping to get results as early as next week.”

One is the “Boy in the Box,” a 1957 cold case out of Philadelphia where an unknown boy aged 3 to 7 years old was found murdered in a cardboard box