Paralyzed deer hunter chooses to end life support

[southcitymom]

I can tell you sitting here today, in good health..
I would not want to live as a quadriplegic. I'd rather be dead. I never want to be a burden on my loved ones and I wouldn't want to be in a nursing home.
I'd be outta here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

I feel the same way, L. And I have been clear about this with those who might ever have to make that decision. I understand and respect this man's decision. I completely support a human being choosing to pass from this life when confronted with devastating health issues.

 

[tezi]

Reader thanks for the link

snipped from article.

Through it all, Shultz said, her brother never wavered in his decision to die.

"I just remember him saying so many times that he loved us all and that he lived a great life," she said. "At one point, he was saying, 'I'm ready. I'm ready.'"


I see him as being a very brave man.

I do too!

He had always said that he didn't want to be on life support or other extraordinary measures, this wasn't a spur of the moment thing. We don't know how long he was out of the pain meds before he made the decision and he lived for several hours; at any time he could have changed his mind.

BBM: Yes, he could have changed his mind, in those five hours.

75 people -family and friends- were in the hospital with him when he died. His pregnant wife, his intensive care nurse sister, etc. I think those who knew him best would know if this decision was made too soon. And since he apparently made his wishes known long before the accident, I have no problem with this.

BBM: Me either.

SBM BBM

I think some people in that position, esp. those who have already has serious discussions w. family & friends, and esp, esp, esp those who have executed written advance directives expressing wishes not to continue life w. certain technology or certain impairments, would see it as altruism.

If this man wished the best for his wife and child, isn't it possible that
he wanted them to be free to have a life not centering around him, bedfast, on a ventilator, etc. possibly for years, w. no or virtually no recovery or regaining of health/movement, etc?

Not saying this would or should be the case for anyone else injured like this, or suffering from other dehabilitating disease, etc.
Just saying it should be an option. And in this case, unlike so many others, he got a chance to reaffirm his wish.

That said, I agree the medical prognosis was reached pretty quickly.

Advance medical directives and health care powers of attorney may be a good topic for The Jury Room? Going there to start a thread. :seeya.

BBM: Exactly. I think he didn't want to be a burden to his family, especially his wife and new child.

I can tell you sitting here today, in good health..
I would not want to live as a quadriplegic. I'd rather be dead. I never want to be a burden on my loved ones and I wouldn't want to be in a nursing home.
I'd be outta here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

BBM: Me either, and I don't want to have to be attached to life support equipment either. I wouldn't want to burden my loved ones in that way.

I feel the same way, L. And I have been clear about this with those who might ever have to make that decision. I understand and respect this man's decision. I completely support a human being choosing to pass from this life when confronted with devastating health issues.

BBM: I completely support a human being's decision to make the choice to die with dignity.

O/T: It's great to see you posting SSM! I have missed you!

 

[gitana1]

I finally read the article (well, a different one, but I'm sure the info is the same)...this guy was a father to be? And you mean to tell me he said, "Nah. I'd rather be dead than see the birth and watch the life of my child"?

I don't buy it. He couldn't have been in his right mind. And if he was...I'm sorry. That sounds pretty selfish to me. Then again, suicide is, in itself, a selfish act, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised. To have left his child to never know his/her father, and to leave the child's mother without the benefit of not having to go it alone....? What is the thinking there? Was he so altruistic that he felt he would be doing them a "favor"...so they could have a "normal" life, if he was out of the picture?

He did not commit suicide. He chose not to prolong his life via artificial means. HUGE difference.

I think that if the 75 people who surrounded him with love and support as he died and who loved him best understand and don't have a problem with this, especially his pregnant wife, who are we to tell him she was selfish? And how is sticking around, suffering and immobile, to see the birth of one's child, selfless?

100 years ago, this man would have had no choice at all. Perhaps 100 years from now, technology will advance to such a degree that we can
live as a disembodied head in a dish. Are we then going to be telling people that it is selfish to not want life saving measures employed so we can be just a live head in a dish?

This man's decision was supported by his family and friends as well as a medical team who must take bioethics in medical school and deal with end of life issues on a daily basis. I'm sure they knew exactly how cognizant this man was. For medical malpractice issues, you better bet these doctors would not have been eager to allow something so fatally irreversible without being able to prove exactly how cognizant and level headed he was, when he said he wanted no more life saving measures employed.

 

[Pensfan]

If he had a cervical spine injury, he wasn't on high doses of pain meds because he couldn't feel external pain. In addition, opioids decrease respirations.

I disagree with supporting this man's desire to be extubated. He was given the prognosis, but not plenty of time to think about it. Like all high cervical injury patients, he would have respiratory infections and UTIs and could have changed his end of life directives within weeks or months of this accident (Don't give me any more antibiotics, bronchodilators, and mucolytics, so I will soon die.) It wasn't like he HAD to make this decision TODAY because an opportunity (a respiratory illness or urinary tract infection) for him to change his mind (and therefore, die) was never going to occur again. The majority of people who attempt suicide state that they were glad they didn't die.

 

[Roxye]

Then again, suicide is, in itself, a selfish act,

This case wasn't about suicide. This man made his choices clear BEFORE he was injured. BEFORE! This family brought him out of the coma for THEM, not HIM. Now THEY will feel no guilt.

Peace to all involved.

ETA. Suicide is not always a selfish act. From my personal experience, it is sometimes a loving act of a person that wishes to no longer subject those around them with heartache they are suffering. (My Nanny killed herself 19 years ago minus 4 days for this very reason.)

 

[jjenny]

If he had a cervical spine injury, he wasn't on high doses of pain meds because he couldn't feel external pain. In addition, opioids decrease respirations.

I disagree with supporting this man's desire to be extubated. He was given the prognosis, but not plenty of time to think about it. Like all high cervical injury patients, he would have respiratory infections and UTIs and could have changed his end of life directives within weeks or months of this accident (Don't give me any more antibiotics, bronchodilators, and mucolytics, so I will soon die.) It wasn't like he HAD to make this decision TODAY because an opportunity (a respiratory illness or urinary tract infection) for him to change his mind (and therefore, die) was never going to occur again. The majority of people who attempt suicide state that they were glad they didn't die.

I presume that majority of people who regret suicide attempts are able bodied. This guy was going to be a quadriplegic.

 

[angela]

Several months ago there was a similar situation in my family. My aunt's ex husband (they had been married for many years and had divorced but were still very close) was in a car accident. He was not wearing a seatbelt and hit the windshield. He was paralyzed from the neck down. After a week in ICU, he requested life support be removed. It was and he passed that day. I was so stunned because I couldn't imagine making that decision. It took me a while to be comfortable with his decision but ultimately it was his decision and what he wanted.

 

[Sonya610]

I also think that personal spiritual beliefs and beliefs concerning the afterlife play a big part in the decision to stop life support etc.... These days "life" has turned into it's own religion so to speak (especially among many American religious folks) but for some folks the afterlife is a very real thing.

In history and in other modern cultures people accept death as inevitable and not something to be avoided at all costs.

I presume that majority of people who regret suicide attempts are able bodied. This guy was going to be a quadriplegic.

Also notice the word "attempt". A lot of attempted suicides are half-hearted to begin with (not all but a lot). Many of the serious attempts are in fact successful, and if they aren't the person does it right the second time and doesn't sit around saying how they "are so glad they are still alive".

 

[Jacie Estes]

I personally don't believe that this was a suicide. When someone is diagnosed with an illness, or suffers a catastrophic injury, this incident becomes a part of their 'tapestry of life'. The thoughts, desires and tenets of their life factor into how they are from that moment forward. Any action on their part is an amalgam of what is past, what is occurring at the time and what will happen in the future. Outsiders may be uncomfortable with the decision made, but in the end, the decision was right for this man who was injured, for his wife, his family and his extended family and circle. I can only respect his decision; I don't for a second doubt that his child will be loved and supported by all of those around. He knew what was right for him and it was his choice but it wasn't suicide. IMHO

I don't say this lightly; I have had my own glimpse of mortality and I want the choice to decide for myself and I have to extend that to everyone else faced with that decision.

 

[MnkeyBznes]

A friend of mine was in a horrific accident at Port Everglades in Florida this last spring. He was the only 1 that survived. 2 other men that were also in the accident died at the scene. Dr.'s said he was brain dead and the only thing functioning in his body was his heart and only because CPR was given. They said he would never breathe on his own and would be in a vegetative state for life. He was on life support and they were gonna pull the plug, only waiting until family could arrive to say goodbyes. He had expressed many times he would not want to live like this. They decided to wait a little while until the swelling in the brain stem went down. He was in a coma for months, breathing being done by machines, etc. Well here we are 8 months later and he has been discharged from the hospital. He still suffers some brain injury but is getting better every day. He had to have part of 1 leg amputated, he is blind in 1 eye, but he is ALIVE and getting better every day. I got to see it with my own eyes when he recognized his son and told him that he loved him. My point is don't be too hasty to make permanent decisions. Our bodies can do miraculous things sometimes if given a chance.

 

[Kool-Aid]

My only problem with this is that he didn't want to at least see his child and for his child to see him? =(

 

[Nova]

I feel the same way, L. And I have been clear about this with those who might ever have to make that decision. I understand and respect this man's decision. I completely support a human being choosing to pass from this life when confronted with devastating health issues.

I do, too. But the original link made it sound like they woke him up and said "You're paralyzed from the neck down--do you want to live?" Almost anyone's first reaction would be "No."

Just to be clear, I support the right of anyone to take his/her own life. But if s/he is to be enabled by family and medical personnel, then I want to be sure the patient is making a clear and informed choice.

And, personally, I don't put a lot of stock in what he said before or what I might say right now. It's easy to choose death when you think the issue will never arise.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

"EXCLUSIVE - 'I would have changed his diapers like a baby again': Mother of paralyzed newlywed tells of heart-wrenching moment she agreed to grant his wish to die just a day after he broke his neck"

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-hunter-speak-decision-die.html#ixzz2kGvnIe3V

 

[al66pine]

Blondie in Spokane
Thanks for link to the newer Daily Mail article.

Excerpt:
"His families believes that he fell while climbing into his stand and laid beneath the tree completely paralyzed, with his neck broke, for nearly five hours before help came.
"He left his wife about 4.30pm. He was due home about 7pm, after dark. ..... His phone rang over, and over again in his pocket. It was set to vibrate, but he couldn't feel it - much less reach down and answer it.

"About 9pm, Abbey called her father and Tim's father and asked them to look for him.
"Thirty minutes later, Mr Bowers was standing over his son's twisted body. ....

"And he said "Dad, my neck is broke. I heard it crack." He knew how much trouble he was in,' Mr Bowers said. ​

"Tim's family believes that it was during those hours that he made his peace with with God and decided that he was ready to die. SBM BBM
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2496311/Tim-Bowers-Parents-paralyzed-Indiana-hunter-speak-decision-die.html#ixzz2kH29Rape

The above excerpt suggests he laid on the ground conscious for 5 hours
and had time to think about it when he knew it was very serious,
even he was taken from the scene and before he was put into a coma
(although it's possible he 'drifted' in and out). ​

FWIW, considering the source (dailymail.com)
JM2cts and I may be wrong.

 

[al66pine]

Hunter previously expressed wishes to 3 people, including his wife, on 3 separate occasions.

"...before the accident, he confided to Abbey, to a hunting buddy and to his cousin – all on separate occasions – that he would sooner die than spend the rest of his life in a wheel chair or confined to a hospital bed.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2496311/Tim-Bowers-Parents-paralyzed-Indiana-hunter-speak-decision-die.html#ixzz2kH9gDZkt​

FWIW, considering the source (dailymail.com)

​

 

[ClaireNC]

(respectfully snipped)

The above excerpt suggests he laid on the ground conscious for 5 hours
and had time to think about it when he knew it was very serious,
even he was taken from the scene and before he was put into a coma
(although it's possible he 'drifted' in and out). ​

FWIW, considering the source (dailymail.com)
JM2cts and I may be wrong.

I agree with your assessment. We are a family of hunters and have 126 acres that we hunt on. We have very strict rules about people checking in every 1/2 hour while in the stands. My husband falling out of a tree stand is one of my biggest fears.

(We also have built really safe enclosed tree stands, just for this reason.)

 

[tlcya]

I so support this man's right to make this decision and aplaud his family for allowing him to do so.

We have come so far with medicine and life prolonging treatments and devices. That is a wonderful thing for those who wish to take advantage or them. But for those who truly, genuinely do not feel these things will afford them the quality of life that will make it worth their while to accept such treatments and devices, that same wondrous advancement can become a prison, holding them hostage. And that is not okay.

One of the basic human rights I feel very strongly about defending is a person's right to leave this world with dignity and some sort of say in the matter. People with catastrophic injury or illness should have every right to make the decision this man did.

Godspeed sir.

 

[oh_gal]

Did he express these wishes after he found out he was going to be a father? Just curious.

 

[al66pine]

oh gal,
You asked
Did he express these wishes after he found out he was going to be a father?

See my post 34 about what he said to his father when his father found him on the ground. After falling from the tree stand, the hunter was conscious afterward, apparently for as long as 5 hours, thought his neck was broken and had time to think about it.

I don't believe above info - about laying on ground for hours conscious -was in the initial article linked in thread.

JM2cts.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

I once Private Duty nursed a man in his 50s who was a C-5 - C-6 quad for almost 25 yrs. as a result of a car accident. He had his own addition built onto the family home, paid for by the insurance company. He had nurses or nurses aides 24/7.

This man had optimal care and an optimal living situation. He had a loving and supportive family. He was a smart guy and had a pretty darn good sense of humor. We got along well.

It is not a life that I can imagine anyone wanting to live.