Patsy Ramsey

[Blue Bottle 01]

The reason I am asking this ridiculous question is to make clear that the murder would have to match the ransom note. Right?

To clarify: What was done to the thing that ended up in the small room matches the ransom note.

What we see as murder, to the perp, was a creative act.

The ransom note and what was done to JonBenet (the thing) were both creative acts.

 

[Frigga]

To clarify: What was done to the thing that ended up in the small room matches the ransom note.

What we see as murder, to the perp, was a creative act.

The ransom note and what was done to JonBenet (the thing) were both creative acts.

BBM Please tell me you are not referring to sweet JonBenet as the thing? Please!

 

[bettybaby00]

To clarify: What was done to the thing that ended up in the small room matches the ransom note.

What we see as murder, to the perp, was a creative act.

The ransom note and what was done to JonBenet (the thing) were both creative acts.

How does john factor into everything?

 

[Blue Bottle 01]

BBM Please tell me you are not referring to sweet JonBenet as the thing? Please!

For the sake of understanding the case I do exactly that because that is what happens when a person in power reduces another, vulnerable person to the level of an object in order to use that person. As harsh as that is it is essential in understanding the psychopathic mind.

 

[Blue Bottle 01]

How does john factor into everything?

He had nothing to do with anything until Patsy screamed and showed him the note.

He found the body before 11 am and kept quiet. He fake found it a 1 pm and self deluded that Patsy did not do it in favor of victimhood.

He is driven by a sense of guilt; he feels responsible for Beth's death and JohnBenet's and Patsy's mental state probably for using her for his gratification at the cost of looking past her obvious oddities/pathology.

All of this is my opinion.

Gotta go walk the dog.

Thanks for the great questions you two.

 

[DeDee]

It's possible this psycho wife person suddenly terrified the man who wanted to flee the scene in his plane! After fourteen years of marriage and a Ransom Note, John knew the score.

"It's up to you now, John!"

The fight or flight response creates a strong urgent need for survival.

Perhaps, as suggested, John blamed himself for not stopping his wife when he had witnessed symptoms of trouble brewing. His inability to prevent his daughter's death after losing his beloved daughter, Beth, a few years earlier created more guilt than his soul could bear. Therefore, self protection kicked in big time for JR was a fat cat, ya know.

I prefer dogs. Had a fine Great Pyrenees who possessed the most elegant bark.

 

[DeDee]

Blue Bottle 01, having read your posts for over a year on this particular forum, the psychological profile you've developed for PR fits the crime.

It was my inspiration for a detailed research into the backgrounds' of Patsy and John. JR was a well-accomplished young man in high school. He was equipped to enroll as an officer into the U.S. military. His impressive career since high school was remarkable nee outstanding on many levels.

As a former IDI from as far back as 1996, I always felt this crime was premeditated. Too much circumstantial evidence indicates this to be true and evident which led me to determine, after much reading, research and painstakingly eliminating two or more other possible suspects, that PDI, with forethought and purpose, planned to take her daughter's life on Christmas Night.

Nor was one final sexual assault committed to "cover-up" for the prior sexual assaults.

In fact, the acute abuse was performed, IMO, to highlight the vaginal area. It was painted for us with the vaginal injuries and preposterous size 12 Wednesday Bloomies marked the spot so the prior sex abuse would be discovered and would not be missed by us.

• The sexual abuse was painted for us in blood and marked with ludicrous size 12 Wednesday Bloomies.
• The illustrious word "incest" was earmarked for us in the Ramsey's dictionary.
• The Holy Bible was dbl bookmarked with a ribbon and left open to the Psalms for us.
• The My Twinn Doll [creepy] gift inside a white casket was revealed for us.
• The pineapple set up with crème was marked for us by the victim's duodenum contents. Thankfully!
• The pineapple and tea set up was undeniably displayed on the table for us.
• The importance of the December 25, 1996 death date was marked multiple times for us, ie., engraved in the gold bracelet, printed on the glaring Wednesday Bloomies, the date of death of Little Miss Christmas' etched into her tiny head stone.

This is not a string of coincidences. This is an incomplete list of the incriminating evidence indicating premeditation for the murder of 6yo JonBenét Ramsey at Christmas 1996 by her own mother.

The circumstantial evidence points to premed. There was no accident involved with the perpetrator's actions.

It agrees with my theory that John was surprised as he!! to hear his wife scream for him on December 26 at 5:35, or just ninety minutes before his flight to go see his older children for Christmas, that his 6yo angelic daughter was missing as she points to a three page illustrious fabrication of how JonBenét would be found dead [probably because of him if she blamed him for prior SA] written in her preferred black Sharpie pen on her very own white pad.

 

[DeDee]

BBM Please tell me you are not referring to sweet JonBenet as the thing? Please!

It took me a while to forgive BB for using words like "object" and "thing" even though I knew the purpose and intention.

It is an expression of JonBenet as an inanimate object or how the perpetrator saw the victim. IOW, in PRs mind's eye, JonBenét had become "that child". That possession. The blonde. That trophy. A Winner on Display. The Performer. Her salvation. Her victory.

For crying out loud, Patsy bleached her 5yo daughter's hair platinum blonde to win contests.

Can we validate the bleaching of the young child's hair color without admitting it is an emotionally abusive treatment of this little girl?

Further, is it wrong to find it reprehensible and abusive of Patsy to cover the child's mattress with a plastic cover and thin, single bottom cloth sheet so when the child sleeps through a wetting episode she soaks the sheet and her clothing and remains in that state until she awakens?

I find it mean, cruel, harmful, ineffective, vindictive, and punishing, for the controller of the punishment of a child to be left to wet a bed that could remain wet for hours until awakened. Patsy stopped allowing JonBenét to don a pull up at night so the little 6yo could feel her urine's wetness that the diapers normally contained hidden for comfort and protection.

It makes more sense JB would prefer a nighttime protection of dryness the pull ups offered. Is that cruel punishment? Or is it soft abuse?

The child suffered UT infections due to poor hygiene and what knot. Are these abusive signs of poor parenting or lack of proper parenting skills?

 

[gramcracker]

IA with this post ^ but balk at accepting the premeditation by PR. I think it would have gone more smoothly and the staging would have been less obvious if it was premeditated. ie: nothing used that was in the home. a smooth intruder who came fully equipped, a verifiable point of entry, no trace of the source of the implements for the garrote/the vaginal stab/the RN and nothing left behind, especially the body

she did the best she could within the limitations on her time and travel that night/morning, but it wasn't good enough. I also think if it was premeditated it would have occurred during a season w/o snow/frost when the lack of footprints wouldn't be so obvious, and w/ JR out of town. ie: the intruder striking when the wife/kids were alone

 

[Venom]

^ True. Maybe something happened that became a catalyst for it occurring then.

 

[Blue Bottle 01]

It's a mistake to assume there was staging to decieve anyone that found the body. Everything that was done had only to please Patsy. It was her game, her rules. Whether or not any aspect of it would influence another person in any was was not part of the game. IMO.

 

[chlban]

I have always leaned toward PDI and did it alone, including the staging. I agree that John's really was awakened as he claimed with Patsy's scream.

I also think that the truth started to creep in pretty early after reading the note and recognizing not only Patsy's handwriting but her overall style.

The idea that he kept quiet out of guilt certainly makes sense.

The only part I do not believe is that it was premeditated. I think it would have been "done" better if it had been. I still lean more toward a variation on the Steve Thomas theory. Patsy reacted in rage, severely injured JB and then the rest was cover up and self preservation.

The only other viable theory, IMO is that Burke inflicted the head injury and Patsy took it from there.

I think Patsy had some emotional problems and certainly some personality disorders, but I don't really think she was pshycotic.

All JMO

 

[Venom]

It's a mistake to assume there was staging to decieve anyone that found the body. Everything that was done had only to please Patsy. It was her game, her rules. Whether or not any aspect of it would influence another person in any was was not part of the game. IMO.

So do you think she wanted to be caught? Or did she even care about that? What do you think she'd have done if charge...Admit it?

Sorry for all the questions, I just like to pick your brain about your theory. No offense but you post rather evasive sometimes and it's hard to get what you're trying to say. :seeya:

 

[Blue Bottle 01]

If you know anything abut crime you know that there is the element of criminals wanting recognition and attention to the point of wanting to get caught. It's a sliding scale sort of like the "death wish". The scale starts out with a person wanting unconsciousness and it slides all the way to wanting death or seemingly to want it.

In Patsy's case I go with the r n greeting; Listen carefully! And her later plea for the discovery of "who did this". I also think she was fascinated by what was happening to her and to some degree went with it willingly and she seemed to invite the world into her stage play with the 911 call. The actress in a drama wants an audience.

 

[Blue Bottle 01]

The word premeditated is not quite right. It's not like planning a trip. That is too rational. It's more like a collection of compulsive thoughts assembled together with intrusions by the unconscious.

The inspiration in part was found in literature and that is the red flag for psychosis. I refer you to Mark David Chapman and The Catcher In The Rye.

 

[Venom]

So it wasn't premeditated per say. But her thoughts and conscience led her to everything that was done? So she wasn't AWARE of it so much as it was in her unconscious mind?

Am I on the right track?

 

[Frigga]

Can you tell us a bit more about Chapman and the book? A synopsis maybe? I would really appreciate it.

Also, now I am intrigued with this Muriel Spark. Can you share some insight there, as well?

 

[gramcracker]

Chilling letters written by John Lennon's killer to his arresting officer are on sale for a cool $75,000.

Former NYPD cop Stephen Spiro has finally decided to part with the four notes Mark David Chapman wrote to him from prison following Chapman's cold-blooded murder of the ex-Beatle.

In the typed notes, Chapman often expresses a fondness for Spiro and asks him to read "The Catcher in the Rye," hinting that the novel could explain what sparked the Dec. 8, 1980 murder.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...ler-mark-david-chapman-sale-article-1.1267243

After Mark David Chapman shot and killed John Lennon, he calmly opened up Catcher in the Rye and proceeded to read it — before being apprehended. John Hinckley, the man who attempted to kill Ronald Reagan, also was in possession of the book.

Catcher in the Rye depicts Holden Caufield, a 17-year-old boy who narrates from a mental hospital. The book recounts events over a two day period that happened a month earlier.

To those who do not cope with a mental illness, the plot of Catcher in the Rye seems depressing, and it is. But by the book’s end, it is apparent that events being described are actually the happiest moments in Caufield’s recent memory. What he describes is something that he remembers fondly as joyous and happy.

http://atomicpoet.wordpress.com/2012/01/31/is-catcher-in-the-rye-an-assassination-trigger/

IMO the difference here is that Chapman/Hinckley sought fame/notoriety and had no problem with being known as killers; it was what they wished for. whereas PR twisted, turned, squirmed, lied and maneuvered every possible thing to NOT be known as a killer

is BB's comparison that killing JB was the happiest moment of PR's life? if so, I don't get it, she could not proclaim it ... and it was a pyrrhic victory*
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

*a victory or goal achieved at too great a cost; a victory that is won by incurring terrible losses; a victory in which the victor's losses are as great as those of the defeated

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Pyrrhic+victory

 

[Venom]

Not sure if I "get" it......but PR herself wanted the drama, to be the center of attention. The mother of America's Princess, tragically murdered on Christmas night, was at center stage.

 

[bettybaby00]

Not sure if I "get" it......but PR herself wanted the drama, to be the center of attention. The mother of America's Princess, tragically murdered on Christmas night, was at center stage.

I feel the same. although I don't think she committed this crime purposely for the drama & attention, more like once the spotlight was turned on she saw it as the performance of a lifetime, and through it, she could convience us she was innocent.