Possibly related cases (GB4, Manorville, Bittrolff victims, & others)

[diamond29]

I know the murders you are talking about. I'm a Canadian resident and oftener wondered if the murders here are somehow connected. We have the highway of tears ...mostly native women being murdered. Edmonton Alberta and Toronto Ontario have also had murders against prostitutes. They are questioning if they are dealing with a serial killer in Edmonton. The bodies I believe are in 4s as well. Is it possible that his job would bring him around different states and countries. Could it be someone who relocates between seasons.

 

[FindHG]

I know the murders you are talking about. I'm a Canadian resident and oftener wondered if the murders here are somehow connected. We have the highway of tears ...mostly native women being murdered. Edmonton Alberta and Toronto Ontario have also had murders against prostitutes. They are questioning if they are dealing with a serial killer in Edmonton. The bodies I believe are in 4s as well. Is it possible that his job would bring him around different states and countries. Could it be someone who relocates between seasons.

:welcome5: diamond29, to Websleuths. Thank you for joining and for bringing up the possibilities. A search came up with these thread, and others that pertain as well. I look forward to your participation and ideas.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Project-Kare-Is-this-Edmonton-s-Serial-Killer

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?439-Western-Canada-s-Highway-of-Tears

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?441-Missing-victims

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?440-Deceased-Victims

Am hoping this helps. Please let Steleheart, bessie, other mods, or me, know if we can help you navigate and post.

 

[stx722]

I agree that most serial killers have very simple (albeit, very deranged) MOs, but the Zodiac was one who didn't. He sent the police indecipherable letters that have still not been solved to this day. Some ppl think his identity may be revealed inside of one of them. I don't think so though, he's (or was, he's most likely dead by now) obviously highly intelligent.

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NYC Zodiac and the Zodiac in California were different perps. The NYC perp was somehow inspired by the "original."

 

[bessie]

I know the murders you are talking about. I'm a Canadian resident and oftener wondered if the murders here are somehow connected. We have the highway of tears ...mostly native women being murdered. Edmonton Alberta and Toronto Ontario have also had murders against prostitutes. They are questioning if they are dealing with a serial killer in Edmonton. The bodies I believe are in 4s as well. Is it possible that his job would bring him around different states and countries. Could it be someone who relocates between seasons.

Personally, I think there's a distinct possibilty that one of the LISK killers (GB4) roams, either for work (i.e., long haul trucker, carny), or leisure. I also tend to believe Shannan's death is unrelated to GB4, and her killer was local. In a nutshell, IMO, we're looking at two, possibly three, LISK's. JMO

 

[maddalena1]

I find myself wondering about the number four as well and how the directional elements play into it. I may be totally reading to much into the bodies directionality. Do we have details about the direction of body placement beyond that of those in Atlantic city (which were facing east)? My brain is looking at that and saying " GB is east of Atlantic City (and the AC murders occurred chronologically prior to those in GB" so.. What I am interested in braining on is if LISK is indicating a link between 4 murders to 4 directions (N,S,E,W) by posing the bodies facing the direction of his next location of choice (Hypothesizing the Toronto cases are connected [which I presently have no evidence of] were the GB bodies facing North?)? I have not had enough time to go through crime scene data. SO I may be entirely off the rails. But, I think this needs to be investigated and shouldn't be to complicated to quash if photographs are available.

Could it be ritualistic murder? Shannon did go missing on beltane? Hope fbi looks at it.

 

[justagirl247]

Ok so I haven't read this whole thread yet so if this is something already suggested I'm sorry but I wanted to post it before it slipped my mind... So I heard or read that one theory was that the child victim could have possibly been the killers on child and the women that was matching it could have been his wife or girlfriend .. Couldn't they do a dna test the type where it would tell young other blood relatives I'm assuming similar to the technology they use for ansestory sites? I've seen somewhere that they have identified other people by finding blood relatives and being able to identify them.... Just a thought but I honestly feel like half the battle would be to identify the ones that are not yet then it might be more clear if it is more then one killer

 

[FindHG]

Noting location in association with a waste treatment plant. This one is across the Island from Gilgo Beach.

https://goo.gl/maps/PvHMkWXNyEP2

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.825825,-73.6558377,188a,20y,183.75h,83.55t/data=!3m1!1e3 tilt map link

Town of North Hempstead - Solid Waste Management Authority, 802 West Shore Road
Port Washington, NY 11050
40.818428, -73.657432

 

[dc20015]

Extremely doubtful. The Occult, Satanism, etc etc etc are rare to nonexistent factors in any sort of crime period. The Satanic Panic of the '80s turned out to be basically one huge urban legend. Even with people who come out and claim these were motivators, one has to take it with a grain of salt as it sometimes is a part of their defense to make them seem crazy or brainwashed.

 

[observation]

It will be interesting to see if and how Neal Falls plays into some connections with other areas. They surely got his DNA. Looking forward to hearing more about him.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neal_Falls


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[Niamert lyrehc]

Personally, I think there's a distinct possibilty that one of the LISK killers (GB4) roams, either for work (i.e., long haul trucker, carny), or leisure. I also tend to believe Shannan's death is unrelated to GB4, and her killer was local. In a nutshell, IMO, we're looking at two, possibly three, LISK's. JMO

That's what I think too, with the exception of SG.

I agree she may have been murdered by a local but I think it could've been an accidental death due to exposure or overdose (with cover up).

I also think that AC4 is related to GB4 while the dismembered victims have a different killer altogether, (The Manorvile Butcher) or two.

It's just mind boggling and completely terrifying but I think this makes the most sense. IMVHO

 

[Salsa]

I was reading all the theories of 4 bodies. His killing field was disrupted in 2010. He may not have stopped at 4 if it wasn't discovered. The dismemberment of the other bodies show more anger and rage. It is hard to guess if they are connected without knowing what was done to the 4 girls in burlap. Were they strangled and dropped. That would be less rage then what Bundy did to his victims after strangling, he would continue to desecrate the bodies. I wish there was more information available to the public.

 

[Hatfield]

That's what I think too, with the exception of SG.

I agree she may have been murdered by a local but I think it could've been an accidental death due to exposure or overdose (with cover up).

I also think that AC4 is related to GB4 while the dismembered victims have a different killer altogether, (The Manorvile Butcher) or two.

It's just mind boggling and completely terrifying but I think this makes the most sense. IMVHO

It really is mind boggling. I keep flip flopping on some things.

JMO
At the moment I agree that the AC4 and GB4 are related.

With SG I wonder if there was a group of high society types that would hire a prostitute for an all night anything goes sex party and they would drug the person to get them to submit to whatever sick fantasies they had.

Things got out of hand and whoever was the ring leader of the group felt they had to kill her.

The way I can see where SG may have been tied to the other murders is if maybe this same group of people did this all the time and maybe the ring leader kept it from the others that he was murdering the victim at the end and some of them didnt know that was happening at first. They may have suspected it but most felt they were invincible because they would always leave before anything really bad happened. Plus if they had a LE member or Ex-LE member as one of their group then they felt invincible in that way too as far as the law goes.

When SG was found it made all of them realize that they were part of something much worse than they had thought. It could explain the suicide and could explain the phone call the doctor made to the mom to come up with an excuse why he drugged her. Dr may have felt an autopsy would uncover she had been drugged so he gets ahead of it with his excuse.

As more bodies get uncovered in the same area then the rest of the group disband and never meet again. Could explain why the killings seem to have stopped after SG was found.

I could also see where SG may have been a different situation altogether.

I do think the 911 tape has some very important information on it and hope someday that the tape contents can be given to the right people that can further the case.

 

[noche_de_luna]

(it is customary for Muslims to take off their footwear and wash their feet before they go to mosque)

While I see your point, I think the girls were shoeless because they were engaged in sexual activity, nude and without shoes.

Another thought, maybe LISK likes "hooker heels" and saves them as trophies.

 

[Hatfield]

While I see your point, I think the girls were shoeless because they were engaged in sexual activity, nude and without shoes.

Another thought, maybe LISK likes "hooker heels" and saves them as trophies.

Thats a good possibility if the shoes have never been found.

If the killer took the time to put clothes back on the victim then it seems that he made a personal choice to not put the shoes on too.

 

[IrishHitman1011]

Has anyone wondered or found connection between LISK and the murders in chilicothe Ohio?

 

[FindHG]

Has anyone wondered or found connection between LISK and the murders in chilicothe Ohio?

:welcome: IrishHitman1011. I think it has come up before. Thank you for joining and for taking the time to pitch in. I hope you continue to participate. I hope the thread below helps.

OH - Chillicothe Missing/Murdered, Possible SK

Please, let me know if you have any questions on how to find threads or anything else on Websleuths. http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?589-THE-KILLING-SEASON where you'll find other pertinent threads, such as these:

Or the active LISK threads here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?445-Long-Island-Serial-Killer

 

[capricorn76]

Have the autopsy results ever been released or discussed? Also what about the baby? The baby was wearing jewelry and was described as non-caucasian, what does that mean? My guess is that the child was most likely of Mexican descent/or some other Latin heritage. I am Mexican and know what we buy jewelry for our babies. And another thing I highly doubt the mother Jane doe #3 actually took her child to visit a trick. Not sure if anyone is going to read this. But i feel that by knowing the victims it might lead back to the killer otherwise why else would the killer take the extra effort to hide any identification marks, such as in the case of the mother who had a tattoo and the killer (i read) tried to take it off...hmmm

 

[GINK]

The one thing I took away from viewing parts 5 and 6 is to me, their not the work of LISK. He used a fire arm where LISK gets his high off the control and hands on taking life.

After my own research and watching the Killing Season, I dated when AC killers last victim is reported missing, Then looked at when the first Long Island murder occurred, then the date of the last LISK murder date.

Then I had noticed Ohio serial killings began right after LISK murders ended, This is relevant because all 3 places had virtually same types of killings, victims same all struggling prostitutes, drug addicted women. Similar dumping of bodies near water, all 3 states victims were parted out in different townships, counties. The wrapping or covering bodies in similar way though slightly different but consistent.

All 3 state's victims seem to highlight series of 4 bodies, though others too, but the 4 body theme is in AC Gilgo and Ohio. Ohio is about 540 miles from ny, so maybe the LISK has a work schedule that afforded him time to travel to Ohio, do what he does and returns unmissed. I strongly believe a photo of a person of interest shown in locations in Ohio that is of a person from ny or nj might get hit. Also I would cross reference records such as dmv, Golf courses as I believe there is a golf theme in a profile of person of interest for LISK. NJ records too. These are just basic now because there are so many specific details that support this theory. The Killing Season series and the talk show was very well done, these people care about every victim no matter what.

Though I have the theory of LISK AC and Ohio, I did learn a few things that I wouldn't have by just doing my own studies, research. Though no one knows me here, I have a strong history on working highly controversial cases between 2006 through 2011. then stopped as it took it's toll on me. This case someone asked my opinion and I didn't have one. So, I was propelled into learning everything from everywhere and I have a lot more to organize.

 

[dc20015]

The one thing I took away from viewing parts 5 and 6 is to me, their not the work of LISK. He used a fire arm where LISK gets his high off the control and hands on taking life.

After my own research and watching the Killing Season, I dated when AC killers last victim is reported missing, Then looked at when the first Long Island murder occurred, then the date of the last LISK murder date.

Then I had noticed Ohio serial killings began right after LISK murders ended, This is relevant because all 3 places had virtually same types of killings, victims same all struggling prostitutes, drug addicted women. Similar dumping of bodies near water, all 3 states victims were parted out in different townships, counties. The wrapping or covering bodies in similar way though slightly different but consistent.

All 3 state's victims seem to highlight series of 4 bodies, though others too, but the 4 body theme is in AC Gilgo and Ohio. Ohio is about 540 miles from ny, so maybe the LISK has a work schedule that afforded him time to travel to Ohio, do what he does and returns unmissed. I strongly believe a photo of a person of interest shown in locations in Ohio that is of a person from ny or nj might get hit. Also I would cross reference records such as dmv, Golf courses as I believe there is a golf theme in a profile of person of interest for LISK. NJ records too. These are just basic now because there are so many specific details that support this theory. The Killing Season series and the talk show was very well done, these people care about every victim no matter what.

Though I have the theory of LISK AC and Ohio, I did learn a few things that I wouldn't have by just doing my own studies, research. Though no one knows me here, I have a strong history on working highly controversial cases between 2006 through 2011. then stopped as it took it's toll on me. This case someone asked my opinion and I didn't have one. So, I was propelled into learning everything from everywhere and I have a lot more to organize.

When you say he are you talking about Neal Falls using a gun? It is my impression he mainly used that at first to scare Heather and get her to comply. Then he tried to strangle her, which is up close and personal. Nobody knows how LISK subdued the girls in order to kill them.

 

[deedee21]

Have the autopsy results ever been released or discussed? Also what about the baby? The baby was wearing jewelry and was described as non-caucasian, what does that mean? My guess is that the child was most likely of Mexican descent/or some other Latin heritage. I am Mexican and know what we buy jewelry for our babies. And another thing I highly doubt the mother Jane doe #3 actually took her child to visit a trick. Not sure if anyone is going to read this. But i feel that by knowing the victims it might lead back to the killer otherwise why else would the killer take the extra effort to hide any identification marks, such as in the case of the mother who had a tattoo and the killer (i read) tried to take it off...hmmm

Im starting to think that Peaches is the toddlers mother. The mother was never entered into NAMUS. Why? Maybe shes already there. I dont believe Peaches mother called the tattoo artist. I dont believe she discovered the death of her daughter on Americas Most Wanted. And I dont believe she abandoned her daughters remains. On the otherhand, there is a killer who likes to play with phones. Did the killer ask someone to make a call for him? With the caller not realizing the implications.