Questions you'd like answers to...

[Ambitioned]

the original crime scene photos taken on the 26
In my opinion, this piece of paper is too perfect. There are possible hints of staging within the note.

I've known six year olds to write phonetically but not in the shape on those letters. It almost seems like an adult trying hard to write like a six year old.

 

[Cottonstar]

I've known six year olds to write phonetically but not in the shape on those letters. It almost seems like an adult trying hard to write like a six year old.

I, agree.


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[Cottonstar]

I've known six year olds to write phonetically but not in the shape on those letters. It almost seems like an adult trying hard to write like a six year old.

It seems too “neat”. Look at the heart and star. Both, were on her person, when found.


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[archieil]

yes, lines are very straight.

be informed that it is very probable "intruder" was in her room 3 times: to kidnap her, to grab clothes for her, to put back pillow and so at the end.

It is also possible he saw this paper earlier, was checking papers when searching the house.

It does not look like something written before bed.

If JonBenet was painting a lot with her mother earlier it can be her.

Is this the same red as the heart on her hand?

[edit] It could be another message from the killer. With something like: I have HIV, Santa could bring a star,

Guessing only: 2 sons, HIV, money needed or she wrote it and he has moved it.

kidnap, unintentional murder, different feelings with a possibility he had problems with drinking or similar.

 

[David Rogers]

Do you know where Nedra's response came from? Thanks!

 

[Tadpole12]

re: Topix
13 hours ago... 10/7/2017

Are there? Have they surfaced?

http://www.topix.com/forum/news/jonbenet-ramsey/T81H27BDV07QD3P00/more-photos-are-out

"Seven more photos surfaced yesterday afternoon.
Some people have them. Some of you here probably
have them already but for those that do not,
seek and ye shall find. Jameson or someone else
who has them but does not want them getting out any
further will get this post deleted but I just wanted other
sleuths to know that new photogrphs are out now. " - btc


"The photos are four more crime scene photographs,
a new photo of the 23rd party, different view of the wine cellar,
and a photo that should include Jonbenet but for some reason
it does not. No photos of Burke or any bicycles.
Some will say I'm lying. Don't care. You'll find out.
If you know anyone on these forums, seek them out." - btc

 

[Tadpole12]

AH! So, 'the ten' have them.









(You know who you are, ha.)

 

[singularity]

Ugh. That site got really bad over time. Its not worth going there anymore.

I just read the thread. KC doesn't even understand how the internet works. Tadpole....let's say I send you a message here containing my shopping list, a list of my favorite ice cream flavors, or I give you my email address for us to talk.

How does this show up on google?

Answer:

It doesn't.

Yet according to her, "everything shows up on google".

 

[archieil]

My messages on topix are invisible to others.

I was talking with KC but she does not understand the problem.

I'm not going to fight their policies for others and simple message to moderators does not helped.

regarding basement pictures.

Is there any winecellar or surrounding picture which can suggest the bat was thrown on the ground somewhere there?

 

[singularity]

archieil....

Topix has no real moderators. THat's why the Jonbenet section turned into a cesspool. Not sure what you mean by your posts being invisible. Only examples on forums I know of are if you have been blocked by certain members and/or the staff has placed you in a category where your posts never show up. Neither scenario happens on topix. Besides, you should be able to read them even in one of those scenarios.

Strange....

 

[archieil]

That is what I mean:

Logged in:

Logged out:

 

[UKGuy]

On the subject of photographs, here are some thoughts:

Here is a photograph of Jonbenet's bathroom where Patsy said she fetched the longjohns.

I've always wondered if JonBenet was originally staged in her bedroom then moved to the basement, with the previous staging dispersed to look like flotsam?

Check this photograph of JonBenet's bed.

Another view, note the bedside lamp!

Patsy said she bought JonBenet a brand new bedside lamp on her New York trip in December.

Here is a picture of the other bed, note how nice and neat everything is, including the doll!

There was no ceiling light in JonBenet's bedroom, its place taken by a fan, so does this mean JonBenet had to get out of bed to switch of her brand new bedside lamp when she wanted to sleep?

Or has the scene been staged with the tidy looking bed being the actual bed she was sleeping in, and the other bed used to effect the staging, note there are even reading books lying next to the bedside lamp?


.

 

[singularity]

archieil.....

That is odd. I had no idea any glitches like that happened there. I only posted as a 'guest' but I never saw any members complaining about posts not showing up when signed in. Only complaints on similar topics I remember is how topix would time people out and a post wouldn't go through so they'd have to post it again....sometimes leading to double and triple posts.

No offense but you're poop out of luck. websleuths has a great staff and would help if you(or anyone) had similar problems here. topix is just an unmoderated runaway train with trolls as the conductor and most people have jumped.

Speaking of that screenshot, Heather was/is a great poster. I wish she'd join here.

Back to regularly scheduled programming....

 

[Ambitioned]

On the subject of photographs, here are some thoughts:

Here is a photograph of Jonbenet's bathroom where Patsy said she fetched the longjohns.

I've always wondered if JonBenet was originally staged in her bedroom then moved to the basement, with the previous staging dispersed to look like flotsam?

Check this photograph of JonBenet's bed.

Another view, note the bedside lamp!

Patsy said she bought JonBenet a brand new bedside lamp on her New York trip in December.

Here is a picture of the other bed, note how nice and neat everything is, including the doll!

There was no ceiling light in JonBenet's bedroom, its place taken by a fan, so does this mean JonBenet had to get out of bed to switch of her brand new bedside lamp when she wanted to sleep?

Or has the scene been staged with the tidy looking bed being the actual bed she was sleeping in, and the other bed used to effect the staging, note there are even reading books lying next to the bedside lamp?


.

Very interesting! Sure begs the question. Which sheets were tested?

 

[Cottonstar]

yes, lines are very straight.

be informed that it is very probable "intruder" was in her room 3 times: to kidnap her, to grab clothes for her, to put back pillow and so at the end.

It is also possible he saw this paper earlier, was checking papers when searching the house.

It does not look like something written before bed.

If JonBenet was painting a lot with her mother earlier it can be her.

Is this the same red as the heart on her hand?

[edit] It could be another message from the killer. With something like: I have HIV, Santa could bring a star,

Guessing only: 2 sons, HIV, money needed or she wrote it and he has moved it.

kidnap, unintentional murder, different feelings with a possibility he had problems with drinking or similar.

Patsy stated she put the pillow where it was on JonBenét’s bed.


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[Cottonstar]

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[Cottonstar]

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[singularity]

On the subject of photographs, here are some thoughts:




I've always wondered if JonBenet was originally staged in her bedroom then moved to the basement, with the previous staging dispersed to look like flotsam?
.

Obviously I'm in the group that believes the initial attack took place on the 2nd floor in Jonbenet's room and may have progressed into JAR's room(or vice versa).

Having said that, if we consider the helter skelter nature of these various rooms as mere staging, where do we draw the line? Are the trinkets on the floor staging or is does it signify a child at play who was interrupted? Was the trophy just tossed without much thought or did it get thrown during a dispute? List goes on.

What do you see on that bed that makes you believe it is staging, her body moved to the basement, and then "dispersed flotsam"?

IMO...the condition of JAR's room (on the surface) does not show any typical signs of staging. It shows someone interrupted, we see a sense of urgency with drawers pulled out, etc. Or do you consider these things to potentially be a form of staging? Now the moving of items from his room down into the hellhole would technically be staging but why not more cleanup after the fact? Shut the closet, shut the drawers, tidy up that bed, etc.


Like I said, where does the line get drawn and more importantly, why?

Here is a picture of the other bed, note how nice and neat everything is, including the doll!

THis isn't really all that surprising. That bed was rarely slept in.

Or has the scene been staged with the tidy looking bed being the actual bed she was sleeping in, and the other bed used to effect the staging,

That is a huge leap. For the sake of this conversation let's say you're right. Does it really change anything?

note there are even reading books lying next to the bedside lamp?

Yes there are but also note that if you are going to place a few books in that spot, that's the only place they will fit.

 

[Cottonstar]

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[UKGuy]

Obviously I'm in the group that believes the initial attack took place on the 2nd floor in Jonbenet's room and may have progressed into JAR's room(or vice versa).

Having said that, if we consider the helter skelter nature of these various rooms as mere staging, where do we draw the line? Are the trinkets on the floor staging or is does it signify a child at play who was interrupted? Was the trophy just tossed without much thought or did it get thrown during a dispute? List goes on.

What do you see on that bed that makes you believe it is staging, her body moved to the basement, and then "dispersed flotsam"?

IMO...the condition of JAR's room (on the surface) does not show any typical signs of staging. It shows someone interrupted, we see a sense of urgency with drawers pulled out, etc. Or do you consider these things to potentially be a form of staging? Now the moving of items from his room down into the hellhole would technically be staging but why not more cleanup after the fact? Shut the closet, shut the drawers, tidy up that bed, etc.


Like I said, where does the line get drawn and more importantly, why?


THis isn't really all that surprising. That bed was rarely slept in.

That is a huge leap. For the sake of this conversation let's say you're right. Does it really change anything?

Yes there are but also note that if you are going to place a few books in that spot, that's the only place they will fit.

singularity,

Well I'm with you on thinking stuff happened in JonBenet's bedroom or another room, etc.

Also I tend to draw the line if what I'm speculating on does not fit in with surrounding items.

What do you see on that bed that makes you believe it is staging, her body moved to the basement, and then "dispersed flotsam"?

If you contrast the two photos one bed is a mess the other is neat and tidy, how so?

So I got to thinking, after re-reading Patsy's interview again, then looking at the photos, Hey JonBenet should be in the bed with the lamp next to it? Like Patsy buys size-12's for her niece but gives them to JonBenet and she buys a new bedside lamp for JonBenet's room but puts it next to the guest bed, what is going on?

One proviso is that it could all be coincidence and the tidy bed is JonBenet's, except on Christmas night she was in what became the messy bed.

Yes it could be JAR's room has been staged or it might simply represent unfinished business, e.g. a prior staging now abandoned.

If you accept JonBenet made it to her bed, e.g. her hair was dressed for bed, then stuff happened in/on her bed. I'm thinking the other bed was used to lay JonBenet out on, clean her up, redress her etc? This results in this bed becoming messy, untidy and a dump of unintended forensic evidence, e.g. bloodstained pillow?

So eventually the bed JonBenet had intended to sleep in was made up, her doll was placed on it, along with some of her clothes, so to give a nice authentic domestic feel. Outside of a homicide scenario this need not apply.

I can definitely see Patsy's hand at work here.

That is a huge leap. For the sake of this conversation let's say you're right. Does it really change anything?

Yes, for some on the fence it can help to highlight that some aspects of her bedroom might have been staged, e.g. the messy bed should not really look like that if an intruder snuck into JonBenet's room and lifted her from her bed, how come all the mess, just on one bed of course? I'm suggesting this might result from an abandonded prior staging, e.g. removal of evidential items, then re-arranging stuff to look a random mess, e.g. pillow. pink top, and duvet askew, why?

Yes there are but also note that if you are going to place a few books in that spot, that's the only place they will fit.

Sure, but it does look as if this is the bed JonBenet normally slept in?

A preliminary conclusion is that JonBenet's bedroom alike the wine-cellar has been staged, not a surprise if you want to backup your RN !

I'll drop this in here as it illuminates some recent discussions:
John Ramsey, Boulder Police Department Interview 1998, excerpt

21 MIKE KANE: Okay. When you saw

22 JonBenet in longjohns that morning, what did you

23 think? It wasn't her pajamas.

24 JOHN RAMSEY: On the morning I

25 found her?

0691

1 MIKE KANE: Yes. (INAUDIBLE.)

2 JOHN RAMSEY: I remember she had

3 the top on, she had worn to bed, that she had

4 worn when I laid her down. Her lower body was

5 clothed, but I don't remember, seems like it was

6 a white pull-up.

7 MIKE KANE: Like longjohn type?

8 JOHN RAMSEY: Like longjohns,

9 right.

10 MIKE KANE: Not pajamas?

11 JOHN RAMSEY: No.

12 MIKE KANE: Think about that.

13 JOHN RAMSEY: No, they were like

14 white tights or something. As I remember. And

15 she looked normally dressed. She looked --

16 MIKE KANE: Was she -- you know

17 what longjohns are?

18 JOHN RAMSEY: Yeah.

19 MIKE KANE: What are under --

20 (INAUDIBLE)?

21 JOHN RAMSEY: Yeah, they might

22 have been, I am sure, you know, I mean you have

23 them, but I mean my memory of it is they were

24 white, she had it looked like she had underwear

25 on under those. She looked normal in that

0692

1 respect. I didn't see any -- clothes weren't

2 askew.

3 MIKE KANE: Without dragging out

4 photographs or anything like that, but would she

5 normally have, when Patsy put her pajamas on put

6 a pair of long underwear on her?

7 JOHN RAMSEY: She might have. I

8 mean, it was, you know, it was winter. Usually

9 when she conks out like that, before she gets to

10 bed, we get her comfortable, but we don't get

11 her nightgown on her all the time. So like

12 Patsy obviously left that shirt on. I don't

13 remember if she had those tights on or the

14 longjohns on under her black pants. Patsy just

15 took the black pants off and put her bed or she

16 pulled those on, but...

17 MIKE KANE: What I am getting at,

18 the person that did this had put her in those.

19 JOHN RAMSEY: Oh.

20 MIKE KANE: I mean would those be

21 unusual for her to be wearing --

22 JOHN RAMSEY: No, they wouldn't.

23 MIKE KANE: -- longjohns?

24 JOHN RAMSEY: It's with the feet?

25 MIKE KANE: I am not talking pajama

0693

1 bottoms, I am talking about longjohns that are

2 just, you know, like the proverbial flap on

3 back. I am not saying they had it, they had a

4 flap, but those kind of --

5 JOHN RAMSEY: It wouldn't be, no,

6 it would be unusual for her to have those on.

7 Leggings, kind of just a regular nightgown. She

8 didn't always wear a nightgown to bed. If she

9 was awake when she went to bed, she got into a

10 nightgown and brushed her teeth, got into bed.

11 But if she was asleep, we usually just tried to

12 make her comfortable, make sure she was warm.

13 Didn't go into the trouble of getting her into a

14 nightgown, necessarily. Sometimes she had a tee

15 shirt on.

So John is asked directly about the longjohns and he says he saw them, but nobody mentions they belong to Burke Ramsey, proverbial flap aside.

My take is BPD have twigged to JonBenet wearing Burke's longjohns, and think it is significant?