Australia Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat, 4 Feb 2024 *Arrest* #11

[Rocket333]

Even if the phone pinged at 5pm, it may have been in the dam earlier.

What do you mean? How did it turn on?

 

[Rocket333]

He might also have ideas of staging the phone elsewhere.

Do you mean by leaving it at the dam or do you mean his plans to place it somewhere else were thwarted?

 

[Scooby-Doo]

I suspect this perp has just been lucky with the body so far. I don't think any of this shows great thought.

IMO it seems to be the thing of late for the murder to dispose of evidence all over the place - which turns out to be stupid. in several cases the perp has been caught on CCTV doing dumpster runs.

In this case, the reason to hide the body at all, is to conceal forensics, but the other stuff - there is likely no need to conceal any of it.

But why not dump her phone with the body ? Considering it had all her personal ID in it.

To be able to carry out such an organised crime without detection, evidence, including hiding a body from numerous searchers and police, suggests that if he is in fact guilty, then he was more than likely coherent at the time and not severely drug-affected.

 

[AussieSherlock]

I still don't understand why throw the phone at all? If he is on the way to disposing of the body, why risk a stop and not just dispose of the phone with the body?

The smart thing would be to disable the phone and dispose of it with her body at the same time, otherwise it increases the chances of getting caught.

And If he is on the way back, and suddenly realises he still has the phone, why choose that location when he could easily destroy the phone completely ?
And having a phone wallet with all of Samantha's ID including driver's licence left in place is strange to me.

What also intrigues me, the accused was so meticulous in hiding her body, murder weapon, and other evidence relating to the crime. But then totally careless and nonchalant about the phone.

Things can change, too, as more evidence is collected since Samantha disappeared seven months ago

Just a thought, what if they actually found the phone earlier eg at Mount Clear? And they kept that up their sleeve or what if they didn’t find her phone but just pretending to have found it there … then they recorded the accused in remand or they have an undercover intel planted to see if he talks in remand , or possibly surveilling others to see if he/they said anything eg “that’s not where I hid the phone” or “that’s not where the phone was” etc.

Also “artifacts “ could be just random things in her wallet eg small photo, keys, ID, lip balm, cards, etc.? Even AirPods too?

Or if that is her phone found in the dam then yes really odd if it indeed was found at that dam, all items together , that he chose to dump them in such an exposed place that could have has many people including the property owners watching him from the house window as I pointed out in my post with images and links two pages ago. he could have at least picked a smaller more discreet side street , or indeed hide it all with the body or dispose of things individually and better so they would never be found. He was someone who grew up in the general area, he should have known it would get hotter weather and possibly dry up the water in the shallow dam. All quite bizarre and somewhat irrational … IMOO

Also sorry so can someone clarify, as we know Apple devices have the “Find My” service, and according to Find your lost Apple device or AirTag with Find My - Apple Support (IN)
It says :
“

If Find My displays “No location found” or "Offline”​

• If Find My can’t display the current location (because the phone is turned off or is otherwise not sending its location), Find My will show the last location sent by the device or the last known location on the Find My network.

And
“The Find My network is an encrypted, anonymous network of hundreds of millions of Apple devices that can help find your stuff, even when it’s offline. Nearby devices send the location of your missing device to iCloud securely, so you can find it in Find My. It’s all anonymous and encrypted to protect everyone’s privacy.”


So sorry am I reading that correctly that if they tried to find her phone it may have shown a last location based off other passers by along that road who also have the Find My app installed or an Apple device ? If so could it have possibly therefore indicated that rough area along that road as the last location and then stopped and therefore they speculated the phone was discarded around that rough area hence requesting to search the properties earlier on.

And perhaps she had AirPods too that were found that also has Find My installed ?

Or maybe I’m wrong .

Thoughts anyone?

 

[SouthAussie]

But why not dump her phone with the body ?

Who HAS dumped the victim's phone with their body?

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Who HAS dumped the victim's phone with their body?

If the accused has murdered Samantha, and he has dumped her body somewhere, why not dump her phone with her body?

 

[SouthAussie]

If the accused has murdered Samantha, and he has dumped her body somewhere, why not dump her phone with her body?

It's not what I am trying to point out. It seems that killers frequently separate the phone from the victim. Which is why I asked that question.

Eg: Greg Lynn didn't need to dump Russell's and Carol's phones elsewhere, seeing that he desecrated their remains. But he did dump them elsewhere.
Jill Meagher's phone disappeared, but Bayley was fool enough to keep the SIM from her phone.

Maybe sometimes they are afraid something incriminating is on the phone. Maybe sometimes they want to lay a false trail. Maybe (in the case of the Aussie brothers murdered in Mexico) the killer wants to give the phone to his girlfriend.

The police are endlessly searching for missing and murdered people's phones, it seems. Which is why they are getting better and better at tracing them and finding them.

imo

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Just a thought, what if they actually found the phone earlier eg at Mount Clear? And they kept that up their sleeve or what if they didn’t find her phone but just pretending to have found it there … then they recorded the accused in remand or they have an undercover intel planted to see if he talks in remand , or possibly surveilling others to see if he/they said anything eg “that’s not where I hid the phone” or “that’s not where the phone was” etc.

Also “artifacts “ could be just random things in her wallet eg small photo, keys, ID, lip balm, cards, etc.? Even AirPods too?

Or if that is her phone found in the dam then yes really odd if it indeed was found at that dam, all items together , that he chose to dump them in such an exposed place that could have has many people including the property owners watching him from the house window as I pointed out in my post with images and links two pages ago. he could have at least picked a smaller more discreet side street , or indeed hide it all with the body or dispose of things individually and better so they would never be found. He was someone who grew up in the general area, he should have known it would get hotter weather and possibly dry up the water in the shallow dam. All quite bizarre and somewhat irrational … IMOO

Also sorry so can someone clarify, as we know Apple devices have the “Find My” service, and according to Find your lost Apple device or AirTag with Find My - Apple Support (IN)
It says :
“

If Find My displays “No location found” or "Offline”​

• If Find My can’t display the current location (because the phone is turned off or is otherwise not sending its location), Find My will show the last location sent by the device or the last known location on the Find My network.

And
“The Find My network is an encrypted, anonymous network of hundreds of millions of Apple devices that can help find your stuff, even when it’s offline. Nearby devices send the location of your missing device to iCloud securely, so you can find it in Find My. It’s all anonymous and encrypted to protect everyone’s privacy.”


So sorry am I reading that correctly that if they tried to find her phone it may have shown a last location based off other passers by along that road who also have the Find My app installed or an Apple device ? If so could it have possibly therefore indicated that rough area along that road as the last location and then stopped and therefore they speculated the phone was discarded around that rough area hence requesting to search the properties earlier on.

And perhaps she had AirPods too that were found that also has Find My installed ?

Or maybe I’m wrong .

Thoughts anyone?

We don't know what the police know
But something doesn't sit right for me with finding her phone, it seems almost out of the blue, the phone is found, in and in near perfect working order.
With a camera crew who are on hand to capture perfect photos of the phone in its wallet, for everyone to see. And the police high-fiving and jumping for joy !!! Lol
There are so many possibilities that we aren't privy to
Was it a plant ? Had the police found it earlier ? Did Samantha actually take her phone, seeing she was only going for a quick run ?

 

[Scooby-Doo]

It's not what I am trying to point out. It seems that killers frequently separate the phone from the victim. Which is why I asked that question.

Eg: Greg Lynn didn't need to dump Russell's and Carol's phones elsewhere, seeing that he desecrated their remains. But he did dump them elsewhere.
Jill Meagher's phone disappeared, but Bayley was fool enough to keep the SIM from her phone.

Maybe sometimes they are afraid something incriminating is on the phone. Maybe sometimes they want to lay a false trail. Maybe (in the case of the Aussie brothers murdered in Mexico) the killer wants to give the phone to his girlfriend.

The police are endlessly searching for missing and murdered people's phones, it seems. Which is why they are getting better and better at tracing them and finding them.

imo

But not to throw her phone in a random dam with all her traceable contents, which can easily be found

 

[SouthAussie]

But not to throw her phone in a random dam with all her traceable contents, which can easily be found

As I said before, the police are getting better and better at finding dumped phones. Because they are looking for the victim's phone in every case that I can think of.

It still took them 3 months to find Sam's phone. And I wonder if they would have found it if PS had thrown it into the middle of the dam, as opposed to chucking it from a distance so it landed closer to the dam's edge.

 

[Scooby-Doo]

As I said before, the police are getting better and better at finding dumped phones. Because they are looking for the victim's phone in every case that I can think of. It still took them 3 months to find Sam's phone.

We don't know If it was planted there, we don't know if it was only recently put there either ? And we don't know if the accused has been linked to the phone ? You're jumping ahead a bit ?

 

[Dotta]

I wonder if there are the accused's fingerprints or touch DNA on the phone or the phone's cover/wallet.

All these cards and the surface of the cover seems a little bit rough so maybe DNA is nestled somewhere there.

I don't think the accused was wearing gloves.

PS
Idaho4 suspect left a SINGLE touch DNA inside the knife's cover, even if it was carefully cleaned by him.

If there are fingerprints/DNA,
no wonder Police were celebrating.
Even Police Officer Doggie was barking happily and wagging its cute tail

JMO

 

[Bats]

If the accused has murdered Samantha, and he has dumped her body somewhere, why not dump her phone with her body?

The accused may have gone to great lengths to dispose of her body and wouldn't want a phone giving up that hiding place. The accused may not have known the ins and outs of how police track digital signatures.

Or, if the accused had have left the phone with her, why hide the body at all?

To me, it's fairly logical that a killer would separate the phone from other evidence, such as a body.

 

[Scooby-Doo]

The accused may have gone to great lengths to dispose of her body and wouldn't want a phone giving up that hiding place. The accused may not have known the ins and outs of how police track digital signatures.

Or, if the accused had have left the phone with her, why hide the body at all?

To me, it's fairly logical that a killer would separate the phone from other evidence, such as a body.

I don't agree, that's my opinion, Yes, the accused has gone to great lengths to allegedly dispose of her body, but didn't care about allegedly throwing her phone randomly into someone's dam with all her ID cards.
And there is so much more evidence collected from a body and the accused was an electrician, who probably had a good understanding in telecommunications technician, like his father

 

[Bats]

I don't agree, that's my opinion, Yes, the accused has gone to great lengths to allegedly dispose of her body, but didn't care about allegedly throwing her phone randomly into someone's dam with all her ID cards.
And there is so much more evidence collected from a body and the accused was an electrician, who probably had a good understanding in telecommunications technician, like his father

Are you suggesting the accused expected the phone to be found?

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Are you suggesting the accused expected the phone to be found?

We don't know if the accused put the phone there ?

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Are you suggesting the accused expected the phone to be found?

We don't even know If the accused put the phone there. We don't know anything about the phone, except it belongs to Samantha

 

[Bats]

We don't even know If the accused put the phone there. We don't know anything about the phone, except it belongs to Samantha

That's true, of course.

I'm trying to understand the previous question you posed...

"Why not dump her phone with her body?"

Can you please explain?

 

[mrjitty]

Who HAS dumped the victim's phone with their body?

right. many of these perps do things which i am sure seem smart at the time but are actually stupid.

we see dumping of evidence at multiple locations in various cases on here and it has often helped to convict the perp even when the evidence was not recovered because the journeys can’t be explained.

as pointed out there is no particular reason to dump the victims ID and phone separately.

but this goes to the question why do perps stage the crime scene at all.

the usual answer is that they aren’t professional or experienced so make lots of mistakes.

Smarter killers often don’t stage the crime at all.

 

[mrjitty]

As I said before, the police are getting better and better at finding dumped phones. Because they are looking for the victim's phone in every case that I can think of.

It still took them 3 months to find Sam's phone. And I wonder if they would have found it if PS had thrown it into the middle of the dam, as opposed to chucking it from a distance so it landed closer to the dam's edge.

Probably it would have taken a much higher end search of the dam to find the object on the bottom.

you often need a bit of luck in cases like this because rural areas are big and finding the evidence hard even if not well hidden.