Indepmo, yes, that is the area- the grain elevator is 1310 Fairfax. Just a tiny bit south of there, it appears there is a large dredge or wash which *looks* to me like it was carried past Riverfront, the Chouteau, and then finally deposited just past the Randolph area along with a lot of debris. Does that make sense or am I looking at it wrong?
SAR mapping/satellite of the river
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Indepmo, yes, that is the area- the grain elevator is 1310 Fairfax. Just a tiny bit south of there, it appears there is a large dredge or wash which *looks* to me like it was carried past Riverfront, the Chouteau, and then finally deposited just past the Randolph area along with a lot of debris. Does that make sense or am I looking at it wrong?
You must be referring to the Kaw river? I-70 runs over it just at the curve.
This whole area took a beating from the flood of 1993.
I have a lot of video on old 8mm that I would love to put online some day. I drove all over town filming the flooded areas in 93 all the way from KC west to Lexington. MO.
I'm not sure what "sinkhole" you are talking about though.
If you could give me a google map link I will take a look at it.
This whole area took a beating from the flood of 1993.
I have a lot of video on old 8mm that I would love to put online some day. I drove all over town filming the flooded areas in 93 all the way from KC west to Lexington. MO.
I'm not sure what "sinkhole" you are talking about though.
If you could give me a google map link I will take a look at it.
I'll give it a shot, indepmo. My laptop hates google with a passion, lol.
Yes, I-70 runs over it. It's almost directly across from Holland Park, just a touch S.
N of there is where it appears there was a lot of initial flooding (where 169 is adjacent?) and then moved downstream.
The sinkhole or dredge or whatever we want to call it looks to be almost right exactly at the KS/MO border, adjacent to Holland Park.
Would love to see the filming of the 93 flooding in the area! Likely a better representation than the army corps, lol.
In da Middle
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The flood of 93 was awful! If you look at the ball park that is on the border between North Kansas City and Riverside(very southeast end of Riverside) on 9 hwy. the water was all the way to the highway. The creek in this neighborhood was running backwards from the river water invading. That was a surreal sight. 9 hwy in Parkville, the part that runs e/w was totally underwater with several feet of water over it. There were many areas here you couldn't get to without going many miles around or just plain couldn't get to because it was under water. The railroad was pretty much devastated for a long time. Many of the tracks were impassable for a long time with water over them, then they had to replace the tracks after that. This year wasn't quite as bad, but those people who were directly affected by 93 were very worried and some did get wiped out again.
I saw that on satellite, In da Middle. Looks terrible.
No wonder the Army Corps is so reluctant to chat.
Your mention of the creek in your neighborhood is why I am kinda fixated on the different waterways and what happens with the rise and fall of heavy rains, floods, etc.
It's unbelievable where water can take debris, when the water is particularly unstable and volatile.
What would normally be downstream, can sometimes end up way upstream. What might normally be on a bank, may be pulled into a sinkhole.
Water is one heck of a powerful thing.
Went to the airport and Harrah's tonight and looked closely.
The road that takes you to Harrah's off 210 has Jersey barriers so don't see how you could use that area to access the Missouri River or backwater. No place to park and walking would get attention.
I still think crossing 210 on foot to get to the River would be incredible tough.
The road that takes you to Harrah's off 210 has Jersey barriers so don't see how you could use that area to access the Missouri River or backwater. No place to park and walking would get attention.
I still think crossing 210 on foot to get to the River would be incredible tough.
Hi DeAnn,
I believe there are several access points both just north and south of there (or should I say east and west?) if you are following the river? Do you mind me asking what route you took to Harrah's? TIA.
We used 210 going to Harrahs (came in from the west) and left on 210 going east.
But I think we're talking apples and oranges.
There is a road that you take from 210 to Chouteau Trafficway to the casino. You turn onto it by the gas station just before the Missouri River bridge. It's called Riverboat Casino way or something like that. I had thought that side road (again the road that's off Chouteau that leads to the casino) would have access to the river or a backwater area. It really doesn't. Don't remember the exact name but let's call it "Casino Way" for the sake of discussion LOL.
That was my theory for the easiest access to the river from the Lister home but in looking closely last night I don't think Casino Way could.
Now off 210 is another matter but I still don't think anyone could walk from lister to the river and back. A car would be needed.
Thanks DeAnne. That (I think?) was the side road I was thinking of- it's more of a service type road isn't it? I need to look at the map again. I thought there was access just past the gas station.
ITA, on foot not in the least likely.
KsStormy
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It is about 2 & 1/2 minutes drive straight south on Brighton from the home to the river. Idepmo posted a video that shows the most simple route.I was surprised when I went there just how close to the river the home is.
No. Casino Way or Riverboat Way or whatever it is called is the main road to and from the casino. Heavily trafficed. Not a service type road.
Now off road is a service road. We once used it to get to the lounge at the casino where some friends were performing in a band and we had backstage access. I don't know exactly where it goes once it winds past the casino toward the river but as I recall it is controlled access and the general public can't use this road but others might can say better.
Right- that's the road I was referring to as a service rd. It's kind of like a frontage rd between the main rd (past the gas station- headed to the casino) and the river? I think that's what I'm looking at anyway. :waitasec:
I think it may be used by service vehicles for access to the banks? But I'm looking at a map, not local- so could be totally off.
If you want to send me the map, I'll take a look at it.
A road winds from Choteau to the casino. Near the casino a second road branches off toward the river. It appears to be a service road. No idea about banks. No banks around the casino/gas station that I know of.
bottom line...two roads, not one as you seem to think.
Wish I could drop a map on here LOL
This is a helpful map detailing the neighbors house numbers, occupants and relation to the Irwin home and the dumpster which is behind the homes numbered #63 & #70.
http://neighbors.whitepages.com/sear...s City, MO
The above is posted in sticky-maps, posted by Just K...I have found the map very helpful, thought it might help here? HIH
http://neighbors.whitepages.com/sear...s City, MO
The above is posted in sticky-maps, posted by Just K...I have found the map very helpful, thought it might help here? HIH
RANCH
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Your link is broken. Try this one.
http://neighbors.whitepages.com/sea...treet=3620 N Lister Ave&where=Kansas City, MO
Oriah, was going back to and from KCI yesterday.
Looked even closer. Brighton does run underneath 210 in a way that would grant access toward the river banks.
But on the north side of the river it's a very steep bank that would be hard to get up and down on foot with a dead baby imo. The south bank is much flatter.
So for those theorizing about the Mo River I think the south bank would be easier but that would require a car.
I won't rule out the north bank as the access point but I think that's very problematic and practically impossible.
Looked even closer. Brighton does run underneath 210 in a way that would grant access toward the river banks.
But on the north side of the river it's a very steep bank that would be hard to get up and down on foot with a dead baby imo. The south bank is much flatter.
So for those theorizing about the Mo River I think the south bank would be easier but that would require a car.
I won't rule out the north bank as the access point but I think that's very problematic and practically impossible.
Wanting2Help
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O/T
They found Fred's remains, he didnt appear to have a thread....
http://www.missourinet.com/2012/01/12/trooper-guthries-remains-found-audio/
In da Middle
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bbm
Yep! This is what I have been stating from the start. Especially when you add the darkness factor. IMO if the river was used, it was not in the immediate area. There are so many more areas that are easy access to the river, but right here is not one of them unless you know the area very well. If anybody used the river in the immediate area, IMO it was NOT DB, but would have to be somebody who was used to walking the area down there. I don't think she fits this category. And all of the families vehicles and her brothers are all accounted for after being searched by the FBI dogs so their cars were not the ones used if a dead baby was transported by vehicle.
When was the brother's vehicle searched? This is news to me and very interesting news.