Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #7

[Wing Ding]

I cannot imagine any scenario that a girl so determined to kill a man that she drove 1,000 miles with weapons, gas, cell phone off in a non descript rental car....arrives then leaves once or twice....then returns to kill him. Makes no sense IMO. If he were mad or scared he could have: fled, called/texted someone, called the cops or even locked all the doors. Then what would she do? All the planning and expense for nothing?

JMO but Travis fell into the familiar pattern one last time. She shows up, sex happens. He eats, cleans floors, washes sheets, while she showers and maybe does her hair and makeup routine. They look at the vacation pictures etc. He wants her to go but doesn't push it because he knows she's leaving for Utah at some point. He's just being polite, doesn't want a fight. She lingers until he finally says he has to shower before his conference call. She suggests some tasteful shower pics to show off his weight loss then she simply must leave, she just can't believe how late it is! He sees the light at the end of the tunnel (she's leaving!) and agrees. She takes 9 minutes of pics then strikes.

That all makes the most sense to me, too.

And her coaxing him into posing for glamour shots in the shower has always been more believable to me than the popular, alternative theory of her sneaking into his bathroom undetected and taking candid pics of him showering. Why? Because he's not holding a bar of soap or a bottle of shampoo, there are no soap suds anywhere, and the shower door is open. Who showers like that for? If you're mission is to scrub Jodi Arias' skin cells off your body, you'd need more than to merely rinse off in a shower with weak water pressure. For that, you'd need to stand in front of an open fire hydrant out on the street corner and have the municipal water pressure send her skin cell cooties flying safely out into the street where they inevitably die from exposure to the elements.

 

[Wing Ding]

Yada, yada, yada... Who showers like that for? Yada, yada, yada...

I don't know what in the world was going through my mind at the time, but the above should read:

Yada, yada, yada... Who showers like that? Yada, yada, yada...

I hate that this forum software's edit feature has a countdown clock attached to it almost as much as I hate not catching my goof-ups.

 

[RickshawFan]

BBM
So true!!

A thought just came to me though.

Her initial plan could have been to take T's camera with her with the sex photos undeleted. By accident of course. Just in case she got caught seen in AZ later on. By roommates, neighbors, passerby. She would be able to say- 'I came to have sex with him as you can see in these photos.'

Yes, like that. The camera was eye candy. I can't imagine that she wasn't stealing it. Instead, because of intervening circumstances, she put it in the wash.

 

[salberg7]

Agree with TexMex in his above post.
The killer was blonde until she left Mesa in April, thus the sex pics couldn't have been taken earlier.

 

[RickshawFan]

Hey Sleuthers - I posted last week about JA's appellate fund being suspended. Well it still looks suspended, does anyone know if the person who started it has absconded with the funds? I really hope so because
a) my week and the next week have been /will be incredibly cr@ppy and I I could do with a sh0t of schadenfreude and
b) It makes me happy to think JA will be throwing fuming temper tantrums in her roach motel cell knowing she's been scammed and her delusions of release are sleeping with the fishes.

I googled "What does suspended bank account mean?"

Possibilities:

Overdrawn (but usually just for a few days, otherwise it's "closed" or ceases to exist.
Fraud
Legal judgment
If the money is suspected of having been laundered
If the account has been closed; it will be suspended for a few days until deposits and payments clear.
If the account holder missed a margin call.
If the rightful owner has died (pending receipt of the legal document that transfers the account to another person, e.g executor)
If the account holder is nefariously shifting money between accounts for murky reasons (e.g. Fraud symptoms)
If someone made a deposit with a bad check
If someone deposited counterfeit cash
If you owe child support
If you stole the money from someone you murdered, either in $$$ or in goods you sold
If the money came from Nigeria
Dispute over ownership of funds
Protect someone who has a reasonable interest in the account
To prevent someone from drawing funds for prison commissary when they have been legally earmarked for another purpose
The prison commissary has a judgment against for insufficient funds.
The state of AZ has an interest in the account that hasn't been made publicly clear

I added some of those myself. I'm going for the last three, plus pretty much all the others in this case.

If has any kind of successful appeal on the murder case, they'll retaliate with a heavy-duty fraud case. Besides, the money is owed to the Alexanders.

 

[RickshawFan]

Hey Sleuthers - I posted last week about JA's appellate fund being suspended. Well it still looks suspended, does anyone know if the person who started it has absconded with the funds? I really hope so because
a) my week and the next week have been /will be incredibly cr@ppy and I I could do with a sh0t of schadenfreude and
b) It makes me happy to think JA will be throwing fuming temper tantrums in her roach motel cell knowing she's been scammed and her delusions of release are sleeping with the fishes.

Just curious. How do you know the account is suspended? Accounts are usually confidential.

 

[salberg7]

Me thinks the website domain expired and no one has yet renewed it. I don't think it means the bank account. There is a fee for a website. Aunt Sue probably hasn't paid for the site to continue.

 

[Hope4More]

That all makes the most sense to me, too.

And her coaxing him into posing for glamour shots in the shower has always been more believable to me than the popular, alternative theory of her sneaking into his bathroom undetected and taking candid pics of him showering. Why? Because he's not holding a bar of soap or a bottle of shampoo, there are no soap suds anywhere, and the shower door is open. Who showers like that for? If you're mission is to scrub Jodi Arias' skin cells off your body, you'd need more than to merely rinse off in a shower with weak water pressure. For that, you'd need to stand in front of an open fire hydrant out on the street corner and have the municipal water pressure send her skin cell cooties flying safely out into the street where they inevitably die from exposure to the elements.

LOL on what it would take to blast off all traces of the ...

 

[Hope4More]

Me thinks the website domain expired and no one has yet renewed it. I don't think it means the bank account. There is a fee for a website. Aunt Sue probably hasn't paid for the site to continue.

I agree. Probably because no more money is coming in, and hasn't for a very long while. The matching fund thing was a fraud. Whatever money exists probably is in the one's of thousands, no where near the $100 plus thousands claimed.

 

[Hope4More]

Agree with TexMex in his above post.
The killer was blonde until she left Mesa in April, thus the sex pics couldn't have been taken earlier.

She definitely dyed her hair before leaving Mesa (there are texts between the and TA about what he thought of the new color), so theoretically, on that count, the photos could have been taken before June 4. IMO they weren't, though, because I don't think TA would have been OK at that point with having them be taken.

 

[Hope4More]

That all makes the most sense to me, too.

And her coaxing him into posing for glamour shots in the shower has always been more believable to me than the popular, alternative theory of her sneaking into his bathroom undetected and taking candid pics of him showering. Why? Because he's not holding a bar of soap or a bottle of shampoo, there are no soap suds anywhere, and the shower door is open. Who showers like that for? If you're mission is to scrub Jodi Arias' skin cells off your body, you'd need more than to merely rinse off in a shower with weak water pressure. For that, you'd need to stand in front of an open fire hydrant out on the street corner and have the municipal water pressure send her skin cell cooties flying safely out into the street where they inevitably die from exposure to the elements.

I'd find it easier to believe Travis agreed to the shower photos beforehand if they'd been taken immediately or at least shortly after the sex photos. The transition from one to the next would have made much more sense, would have been of a piece, it would have been difficult for him to say no.

But hours afterwards? I don't think so. The absence of soap and shampoo just suggests to me that she waited until he was in the shower, then locked up Napoleon, grabbed his camera (which had probably been returned to his study), and took up her backpack containing a post-murder change of clothes to stash in his closet, and her purse, where she'd put the gun and knife.

There were no signs of soap and shampoo because Travis had already washed by the time she entered the bathroom with the camera in her hands.

 

[TexMex]

She definitely dyed her hair before leaving Mesa (there are texts between the and TA about what he thought of the new color), so theoretically, on that count, the photos could have been taken before June 4. IMO they weren't, though, because I don't think TA would have been OK at that point with having them be taken.

Plus he got his camera a month after she left Mesa

 

[Hope4More]

Playing devil's advocate here: He knew he had viruses at least around the beginning of June, he had Taylor Searle (?) clean it and Spybot was reinstalled. He (or she) was able to access e-mail at the last usage of the laptop, so it couldn't have been too disabled.

Her leaving at mid-point in the day isn't the only way for Zach not to have seen her, she had gotten very good at hiding in T's place - heck, Zach didn't even see Travis between 3 and 4.

I simply don't think Travis would have any kind of a day with her after the 26th, at least not willingly. I think it's quite likely the only time he did see her that day was when he was naked in the shower, turned and saw she had been taking pics of him.

True that, that about viruses already being there (though Taylor didn't help him clean the computer in May or June, he told TA to just buy another one). I still think it's possible, though, she messed with the computer when she accessed it around 4:30am.

And true that she could have simply hid somewhere in his house, including in the storage area of his garage. When I say she left, what I mean is that Travis thought she'd left, not that she necessarily went to her car and drove anywhere, though given his neighborhood, that's possible too, IMO, because she wouldn't have had to drive very far at all to keep watch on his house.

As for the rest. IMO the truth is somewhere in between the scenario that he responded to her arrival with casual nonchalance, hung out for hours, and agreed to the shower photos, and the scenario that she knew he was so done with her that she had no choice but to surprise him in the shower, and there was no interaction at all that day before the shower.

I think he WAS done with her, which is why she called him on June 2 to try to soften him up enough that she could follow through on her plan of sex then murder in the shower.

I don't think she managed to get TA to forgive her, or for things to go back to normal, and I think one proof of that is that he didn't respond to her additional multiple attempts to reach him by phone as she travelled closer, and because it's clear to me that not only wasn't he expecting her, but that she waited until he was asleep to enter the house.

How she talked him into sex is less mysterious to me than the 4 hour gap afterwards, which is why I think Travis believed she'd left at some point, most likely because she needed to dodge Zach seeing her/knowing she was there.

And the shower photos. I think her original plan was to ask him to redo the shaving photos (she laid the groundwork for that beforehand, telling him by text in May she wanted that redo), then to transition to also taking photos in the shower. I think she'd planned it that way precisely because she knew he wouldn't agree beforehand to naked photos of himself in the shower.

IMO it's significant that there aren't any shaving photos, because I think it means she asked him and he refused (remember her stumbling through the shaving versus shower photo testimony?), which is all the more suggestive to me that TA did NOT agree to the shower photos beforehand, and IMO, "agreed" to them when she ambushed him in the shower only to appease the , who couldn't have been acting normally at that point, and to make her go away.

(ETA: maybe the reason for his delay in taking a shower was because she'd asked to redo the shaving photos, he said no, and he knew she'd be relentless about taking them if he went into the bathroom to shave and shower).

 

[Hope4More]

Plus he got his camera a month after she left Mesa

I think Pocket has convincingly demonstrated it was possible for photos taken on the 's camera to have been transferred to TA's. In theory, at least.

 

[Val1]

That all makes the most sense to me, too.

And her coaxing him into posing for glamour shots in the shower has always been more believable to me than the popular, alternative theory of her sneaking into his bathroom undetected and taking candid pics of him showering. Why? Because he's not holding a bar of soap or a bottle of shampoo, there are no soap suds anywhere, and the shower door is open. Who showers like that for? If you're mission is to scrub Jodi Arias' skin cells off your body, you'd need more than to merely rinse off in a shower with weak water pressure. For that, you'd need to stand in front of an open fire hydrant out on the street corner and have the municipal water pressure send her skin cell cooties flying safely out into the street where they inevitably die from exposure to the elements.

That's great and all except that wouldn't JA have used soap of some kind herself when showering herself off over him if only to try and remove any DNA evidence from her on him, or him on her? Just because he's not covered in suds during the minutes she had taken those pics doesn't mean he either hadn't already done so or was about to... there was stuff there. Heck I usually take about 20 minutes for my showers... not all of it covered in suds, most of the time is spent rinsing them off. I just keep going back to the pic at 5:27:18 as to whether he had even known she was there before that and my gut says no.

 

[TexMex]

BBM

Thanks so much for this Val, it solves a bit of the nude-tame stamp-mystery - I really would like to see Melendez's report, and wonder if BK has tried to attain it. It might answer quite a few questions..why hasn't it been released?

The nudes (all but 2) were verified by EXIF data. The metadata captures the moment the shutter was pressed. Martinez verified the other 2 bed pics by noting the position of the KY bottle

Per owners manual for Sony Cyber Shot DSC H9

Notes
You cannot transfer image data on a memory card to the internal memory.
By making a USB connection between the camera and a computer with the dedicated USB cable, you can transfer data stored in the internal memory to a computer. However you cannot transfer data on a computer to the internal memory.

 

[Hope4More]

That's great and all except that wouldn't JA have used soap of some kind herself when showering herself off over him if only to try and remove any DNA evidence from her on him, or him on her? Just because he's not covered in suds during the minutes she had taken those pics doesn't mean he either hadn't already done so or was about to... there was stuff there. Heck I usually take about 20 minutes for my showers... not all of it covered in suds, most of the time is spent rinsing them off. I just keep going back to the pic at 5:27:18 as to whether he had even known she was there before that and my gut says no.

View attachment 100098View attachment 100099

I know JM doesn't think the held a gun to Travis in the shower, but IMO that's when she did pull out a gun, while saying something to him that clearly startled him.

The reason I think he knew she was there beforehand is the shower door was open throughout, something I don't believe he would ordinarily do, especially since he had been punished and traumatized as a child for getting the bathroom floor wet.

 

[Val1]

The nudes (all but 2) were verified by EXIF data. The metadata captures the moment the shutter was pressed. Martinez verified the other 2 bed pics by noting the position of the KY bottle

Per owners manual for Sony Cyber Shot DSC H9

Notes
You cannot transfer image data on a memory card to the internal memory.
By making a USB connection between the camera and a computer with the dedicated USB cable, you can transfer data stored in the internal memory to a computer. However you cannot transfer data on a computer to the internal memory.

Yet the evidence is that exif data is easily manipulated by any number of programs and even by simple transferring as pocketaccent proved, even back then. Also that there was no data found on the internal memory of the camera, not even the shower pics. All of the data was allegedly found on the memory stick which DM admitted he had been unable to use a write-blocker before pulling the info off it. Therefore he plugged it directly into the reader to pull the info using Encase.. he later went on to say that the date/time info on the unallocated pics was created by the Encase software report. JM has him verify that the date/time info for the shower pics came from the camera having imprinted them directly, but did not say that specifically about the nudes too.

On top of that, when importing pics( which is quite possibly what set off TA's spybot program on his Mac laptop at 1:44), Macs are notorious for causing the exif data on pics to default to the modification date(ie. the import date) as the creation date.

 

[RickshawFan]

True that, that about viruses already being there (though Taylor didn't help him clean the computer in May or June, he told TA to just buy another one). I still think it's possible, though, she messed with the computer when she accessed it around 4:30am.

And true that she could have simply hid somewhere in his house, including in the storage area of his garage. When I say she left, what I mean is that Travis thought she'd left, not that she necessarily went to her car and drove anywhere, though given his neighborhood, that's possible too, IMO, because she wouldn't have had to drive very far at all to keep watch on his house.

As for the rest. IMO the truth is somewhere in between the scenario that he responded to her arrival with casual nonchalance, hung out for hours, and agreed to the shower photos, and the scenario that she knew he was so done with her that she had no choice but to surprise him in the shower, and there was no interaction at all that day before the shower.

I think he WAS done with her, which is why she called him on June 2 to try to soften him up enough that she could follow through on her plan of sex then murder in the shower.

I don't think she managed to get TA to forgive her, or for things to go back to normal, and I think one proof of that is that he didn't respond to her additional multiple attempts to reach him by phone as she travelled closer, and because it's clear to me that not only wasn't he expecting her, but that she waited until he was asleep to enter the house.

How she talked him into sex is less mysterious to me than the 4 hour gap afterwards, which is why I think Travis believed she'd left at some point, most likely because she needed to dodge Zach seeing her/knowing she was there.

And the shower photos. I think her original plan was to ask him to redo the shaving photos (she laid the groundwork for that beforehand, telling him by text in May she wanted that redo), then to transition to also taking photos in the shower. I think she'd planned it that way precisely because she knew he wouldn't agree beforehand to naked photos of himself in the shower.

IMO it's significant that there aren't any shaving photos, because I think it means she asked him and he refused (remember her stumbling through the shaving versus shower photo testimony?), which is all the more suggestive to me that TA did NOT agree to the shower photos beforehand, and IMO, "agreed" to them when she ambushed him in the shower only to appease the , who couldn't have been acting normally at that point, and to make her go away.

(ETA: maybe the reason for his delay in taking a shower was because she'd asked to redo the shaving photos, he said no, and he knew she'd be relentless about taking them if he went into the bathroom to shave and shower).

Yes...especially on how the shower photos happened in coordination with the shaving. Your scenario makes sense of the trial testimony. And we do know he shaved before he showered, IIRC.

 

[RickshawFan]

That's great and all except that wouldn't JA have used soap of some kind herself when showering herself off over him if only to try and remove any DNA evidence from her on him, or him on her? Just because he's not covered in suds during the minutes she had taken those pics doesn't mean he either hadn't already done so or was about to... there was stuff there. Heck I usually take about 20 minutes for my showers... not all of it covered in suds, most of the time is spent rinsing them off. I just keep going back to the pic at 5:27:18 as to whether he had even known she was there before that and my gut says no.

View attachment 100098View attachment 100099

Yes, and the shower might have been as much to calm himself down as to clean up. No telling, too, whether this wasn't a second shower that day.