Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #8

[RickshawFan]

Ugghh, :gasp:Joined Hopesis and Ricksis watching 's direct exam. This is her white shirt day.
Found something interesting.

[video=youtube;D2auai8iLTo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2auai8iLTo[/video]
Start @ 3:00:30

(not verbatim)
: I arrived around 4 ish.
Nurmi: At T's house where did you park your rental car?
: I parked in the same spot I always parked which was the center spot in the driveway
Nurmi: Do you recall there being other cars in the driveway?
: I don't remember specifically. I wasn't paying attention to that. (watch her facial expression)

Then she starts to explain in great detail how she entered T's house. She suddenly remembers everything.
----------------------------------------------
So if she is admitting she was there, why doesn't she 'remember' or know if there were other cars or no cars in the driveway? Why not just say what she saw at 4 AM?
Is it possible she really doesn't know about 'other cars situation' at 4 AM? Meaning she came much later?

There are so many gems in there....

A favorite is that she had to stop for gas "a few times". Lol That car can go >30 miles per gallon. Mesa is about 380 miles.

Earlier, KN goofs when he asks her why she didn't call RB on the evening of June 3 when she knew she'd be delayed by going to Mesa. She fumbles big time and gets around the question. JM gets a sustained objection that highlights how she didn't have a good answer.

At the beginning of that tape, the poor judge looks like she's feeling really crappy.

The AZ taxpayers should complain about the big bill racked up for cleaning her Goodwill shirts.

 

[RickshawFan]

I can't find a red shirt day.......

Oh, during the jury questions? JM left it that late?

 

[RickshawFan]

Remember we, ahem, H4M IIRC, had a thought that told TA she had an STD? In April or May 2008? I'll bet she told him she had a herpes virus. She gets sores near the lower left lip. It wouldn't take much convincing to make him think she had oral herpes, whether she did or not.

 

[Steve44]

I'll be interested to hear theories on the Olympus too as JM doesn't willingly go down empty rabbit holes, there seemed to be a point about the Olympus but it escaped me as well.

I don't get the video-making baloney either, during their hour or so (according to her) sexcapade they took pics on his camera, tried to make a video on his camera and couldn't figure it out then switched to her camera and shot a video. None of it makes any reasonable sense.

Fully agree with you about all her luggage, on her own admission she wasn't planning on spending much time at T's so why bring all that crap into the house just to cart it back down hours later? Just so she could say she slept in pjs like a good girl? So ridiculous.

Makeup?

 

[RickshawFan]

Tweedledum and Tweedledee in their matching 1960's avocado coordinated get ups.... on her baby blue itsy bitsy elementary schoolgirl uniform day...Gasp...They really want to be on TV looking like that?

 

[Hope4More]

Makeup?

Lol......

 

[Steve44]

It wasn't JM's fault she deprived herself of MM's lies about seeing bruises because she involved MM in the manufacture of her malicious lie of pedophilia. What's a prosecutor to do?

I'd say JM was taunting, not flaunting, her by bringing up MM, in no small part because virtually everything she said relating to MM was a lie, including his seeing those invisible bruises when she said he did, if he saw her at all on that return trip to Yreka in April.

left Mesa in the afternoon of the 4th, around 3pm, give or take. She couldn't have met Gus in Pasadena the afternoon, and who believes she only spent 30 minutes with him when she had to "pay" him for the Helio he "gave" her?

Yet there she was on the stand trying to assert she left Mesa, drove to Pasadena, visited Gus, then visited Matt and Darryl , in the morning, before driving to her sister's in Hollister, but she didn't spend the night with any of those men, she slept in the truck, but didn't spend the night in her truck, it must have been during the day she left Mesa, no, either the night before- which would have been in Mesa- or the night after-- when she says she reached Hollister. In time for dinner.

She couldn't fit it all in, or tell a lie that convinced in the slightest bit.

I agree, I think she pushed MM too far. Maybe she convinced him TA was abusive and he agreed to lie about bruises, then she came up with the pedo lie and assumed MM would go along with that too, because she doesn't believe that lying should have limits. Perhaps he would have, if it was easy enough, but when the pedo process blew up and came under closer scrutiny, MM realized he was in the deep end of a very dirty pool, and wanted out. I wouldn't say it was conscience as much as it was practicality, but obviously neither understands nor respects either.

 

[Steve44]

Tweedledum and Tweedledee in their matching 1960's avocado coordinated get ups.... on her baby blue itsy bitsy elementary schoolgirl uniform day...Gasp...They really want to be on TV looking like that?

It's a kind of reverse psychology. They can't be dumb enough to dress like that, therefore they must be smarter than they appear.

 

[Steve44]

Here's the reason why it's possible to be certain MM had nothing to do with VW's conflict of interest:

VW's motion to withdraw states specifically that she became aware of the conflict on December 15, 2011, and that it wasn't possible for her to have known about the conflict before that date.

She obviously knew there was a problem with MM's potential testimony long before that date, as she stated just that on the record, months earlier, in August.

Wasn't about MM.

(And she may well not have known about a former client, let's say appearing on a witness list, until she saw that list of witnesses for the first time).

---ETA. It's possible that MM's statement that he was willing to lie for the was made in early 2009, to the DT's first investigator, and was included in the 400 pages or so of those DT interview summaries mysteriously turned over to the State.

Also, FWIW, MM made a cameo appearance on that wretched pro-murderess site well into the 's trial, iirc, saying even then that he had been willing to lie for her.

A strange thing to say publicly, even to that crowd. I wonder if it was by way of support, or as a way to out that she was lying.

 

[Hope4More]

A strange thing to say publicly, even to that crowd. I wonder if it was by way of support, or as a way to out that she was lying.

I really don't think it was to out her for lying. The had already done a magnificent job of outing herself as a liar extraordinare. He was defending himself, actually, for not appearing at trial to testify on her behalf. He included in his defense that the DT wasn't willing to cover his expenses, and that being a good family man, he had to put his family first.

My impression is that he would still have been willing, in theory, to lie for the , but that the DT wasn't willing to put him on the stand after the pedo evidentiary hearing, and that he knew JM would eat him alive if he did testify.

In short, JM's warning shots across the DT's bow succeeded.

 

[Hope4More]

I fell deep down a rabbit hole while relistening to the various and conflicting testimony by the about her torn out journal pages.

The dates she gave for the torn out pages remained consistent -- the third week in August 2007; September 9, 2007, and late October 2007.

She gave multiple reasons for tearing out the pages, though, and differing accounts of what she had written in the missing pages.

Then I skimmed back through the Hughes's book. Sky wrote that the routinely tried to make Travis jealous in early 2007 not just with her Abe and Jon Dixon games, but by aggressively pawing at married men during PPL events, and by texting married PPL'ers, nonstop, in TA's presence.

One of those married men she texted was the married man she disappeared with for an hour during her visit with Travis to the Sacred Grove. Before her move to Mesa she had already made a spectacle of herself in PPL circles with her pursuit of married men, including Kyle Kimbrill, and an unnamed man who she maneuvered into her car for a trip of several hours, at the end of which the married man had to be talked out of leaving his wife for his newly discovered "soulmate," the .

The indicated in her fall 2007 and spring 2008 journals that she was not only "dating" a large number of LDS men, but that she was actively scoping out high wage PPL earners. Given her track record of openly hitting on married PPLers, it would be surprising if she was the least bit subtle in her pursuit.

And then there was Gus. One of the things TA told her while she was racing back from spending nights with Gus in his Las Vegas trailer was that the had "humiliated" him. I thought what Travis meant was that she'd done so by standing him up for that pizza date and by going to Vegas instead.

But.. I don't think that's all he meant. I think what was humiliating to Travis is that the ran around calling herself his GF, at the same time she was throwing herself at his PPL colleagues, many of them married.

(Remember his exchange with Chris at the OKC convention in March 08? Travis told Chris he thought that Gus was pulling a Kyle Kimbrell with the , and Chris had a story to tell him about the acting like a *advertiser censored* (inference) at a PPL meeting in a restaurant).

Then I think back to the ripped out journal pages, and to her post-murder rewriting of entries, and to one of her main story line-lies.

The 's lies about TA were most often childlike inversions of reality. She wasn't obsessed, Travis was obsessed. She didn't take advantage of TA financially, TA borrowed her every last penny. Etc. Etc.

I understand that she had more than one reason for trying to portray Travis as promiscuous. I think one of the reasons she was so intent on doing so, as EARLY as she did (immediately after being forced out if Mesa), was that she thought Travis's threat to expose her for who she really was included her own very real promiscuity, a promiscuity that I'm beginning to believe extended to being quite literally a *advertiser censored*.

 

[Steve44]

I really don't think it was to out her for lying. The had already done a magnificent job of outing herself as a liar extraordinare. He was defending himself, actually, for not appearing at trial to testify on her behalf. He included in his defense that the DT wasn't willing to cover his expenses, and that being a good family man, he had to put his family first.

My impression is that he would still have been willing, in theory, to lie for the , but that the DT wasn't willing to put him on the stand after the pedo evidentiary hearing, and that he knew JM would eat him alive if he did testify.

In short, JM's warning shots across the DT's bow succeeded.

It's hard to fathom how lying became a virtue to that group. I guess you can't lie to anyone until you've lied to yourself, and It's possible to cheat at life, provided you're willing to be your first victim.

 

[Wing Ding]

I fell deep down a rabbit hole while relistening to the various and conflicting testimony by the about her torn out journal pages.

The dates she gave for the torn out pages remained consistent -- the third week in August 2007; September 9, 2007, and late October 2007.

She gave multiple reasons for tearing out the pages, though, and differing accounts of what she had written in the missing pages.

Then I skimmed back through the Hughes's book. Sky wrote that the routinely tried to make Travis jealous in early 2007 not just with her Abe and Jon Dixon games, but by aggressively pawing at married men during PPL events, and by texting married PPL'ers, nonstop, in TA's presence.

One of those married men she texted was the married man she disappeared with for an hour during her visit with Travis to the Sacred Grove. Before her move to Mesa she had already made a spectacle of herself in PPL circles with her pursuit of married men, including Kyle Kimbrill, and an unnamed man who she maneuvered into her car for a trip of several hours, at the end of which the married man had to be talked out of leaving his wife for his newly discovered "soulmate," the .

The indicated in her fall 2007 and spring 2008 journals that she was not only "dating" a large number of LDS men, but that she was actively scoping out high wage PPL earners. Given her track record of openly hitting on married PPLers, it would be surprising if she was the least bit subtle in her pursuit.

And then there was Gus. One of the things TA told her while she was racing back from spending nights with Gus in his Las Vegas trailer was that the had "humiliated" him. I thought what Travis meant was that she'd done so by standing him up for that pizza date and by going to Vegas instead.

But.. I don't think that's all he meant. I think what was humiliating to Travis is that the ran around calling herself his GF, at the same time she was throwing herself at his PPL colleagues, many of them married.

(Remember his exchange with Chris at the OKC convention in March 08? Travis told Chris he thought that Gus was pulling a Kyle Kimbrell with the , and Chris had a story to tell him about the acting like a *advertiser censored* (inference) at a PPL meeting in a restaurant).

Then I think back to the ripped out journal pages, and to her post-murder rewriting of entries, and to one of her main story line-lies.

The 's lies about TA were most often childlike inversions of reality. She wasn't obsessed, Travis was obsessed. She didn't take advantage of TA financially, TA borrowed her every last penny. Etc. Etc.

I understand that she had more than one reason for trying to portray Travis as promiscuous. I think one of the reasons she was so intent on doing so, as EARLY as she did (immediately after being forced out if Mesa), was that she thought Travis's threat to expose her for who she really was included her own very real promiscuity, a promiscuity that I'm beginning to believe extended to being quite literally a *advertiser censored*.

I wonder if Travis may have been embarrassed by #Her primarily because he had brought her into the Mormon Church and he felt personally responsible for her and her actions. He does his best to show her the ways of the church in the first few months they know each other, but because he rejects her as a potential life partner she then goes on the offensive with other married men in an effort to make herself appear desirable to him. I know I'd be embarrassed by her if I brought her into the church (believing her intentions were sincere) and she turned out to be a shrew. Not to mention the things I'd be hearing about her from my close circle of Mormon friends. I can't imagine the futility he surely experienced in dealing with her. What's the name of that song? "How Do You Solve A Problem Like Jodi?"

 

[Hope4More]

BTW...

First time I caught this in her journals:

September 18, 2007.

TO DO LIST:

1. Shell receipts
2. Call Marketing

3. PASSPORT AGENCY (SF or LA)

4. Deposit
5. SW Airlines

6. HELIO

7. Call back Lisa P.
8. Call back brother
9. Appt with Infiniti
10. LOA

Passport for what? Cancun, perhaps?

 

[TexMex]

BTW...

First time I caught this in her journals:

September 18, 2007.

TO DO LIST:

1. Shell receipts
2. Call Marketing

3. PASSPORT AGENCY (SF or LA)

4. Deposit
5. SW Airlines

6. HELIO

7. Call back Lisa P.
8. Call back brother
9. Appt with Infiniti
10. LOA

Passport for what? Cancun, perhaps?

Maybe her passport was expiring? She likely got hers in 1997 when she went to Costa Rica

 

[geevee]

Maybe her passport was expiring? She likely got hers in 1997 when she went to Costa Rica

I would think that too if that notation hadn't been followed by 'Deposit' (bank?) and then 'SW Airlines', as if she's planning a trip requiring a passport.

Did Travis know he'd won the Cancun trip by Sept. of '07?

 

[TexMex]

I would think that too if that notation hadn't been followed by 'Deposit' (bank?) and then 'SW Airlines', as if she's planning a trip requiring a passport.

Did Travis know he'd won the Cancun trip by Sept. of '07?

No. He found out in Spring of '08 geevee

 

[Steve44]

I fell deep down a rabbit hole while relistening to the various and conflicting testimony by the about her torn out journal pages.

The dates she gave for the torn out pages remained consistent -- the third week in August 2007; September 9, 2007, and late October 2007.

She gave multiple reasons for tearing out the pages, though, and differing accounts of what she had written in the missing pages.

Then I skimmed back through the Hughes's book. Sky wrote that the routinely tried to make Travis jealous in early 2007 not just with her Abe and Jon Dixon games, but by aggressively pawing at married men during PPL events, and by texting married PPL'ers, nonstop, in TA's presence.

One of those married men she texted was the married man she disappeared with for an hour during her visit with Travis to the Sacred Grove. Before her move to Mesa she had already made a spectacle of herself in PPL circles with her pursuit of married men, including Kyle Kimbrill, and an unnamed man who she maneuvered into her car for a trip of several hours, at the end of which the married man had to be talked out of leaving his wife for his newly discovered "soulmate," the .

The indicated in her fall 2007 and spring 2008 journals that she was not only "dating" a large number of LDS men, but that she was actively scoping out high wage PPL earners. Given her track record of openly hitting on married PPLers, it would be surprising if she was the least bit subtle in her pursuit.

And then there was Gus. One of the things TA told her while she was racing back from spending nights with Gus in his Las Vegas trailer was that the had "humiliated" him. I thought what Travis meant was that she'd done so by standing him up for that pizza date and by going to Vegas instead.

But.. I don't think that's all he meant. I think what was humiliating to Travis is that the ran around calling herself his GF, at the same time she was throwing herself at his PPL colleagues, many of them married.

(Remember his exchange with Chris at the OKC convention in March 08? Travis told Chris he thought that Gus was pulling a Kyle Kimbrell with the , and Chris had a story to tell him about the acting like a *advertiser censored* (inference) at a PPL meeting in a restaurant).

Then I think back to the ripped out journal pages, and to her post-murder rewriting of entries, and to one of her main story line-lies.

The 's lies about TA were most often childlike inversions of reality. She wasn't obsessed, Travis was obsessed. She didn't take advantage of TA financially, TA borrowed her every last penny. Etc. Etc.

I understand that she had more than one reason for trying to portray Travis as promiscuous. I think one of the reasons she was so intent on doing so, as EARLY as she did (immediately after being forced out if Mesa), was that she thought Travis's threat to expose her for who she really was included her own very real promiscuity, a promiscuity that I'm beginning to believe extended to being quite literally a *advertiser censored*.

Did she tear them out post-murder or around that time? If so, probably an effort to polish her reputation in order to contrast better with Travis' soon to be tarnished one. The deleted info probably wouldn't stand under scrutiny in support of the image she wanted to project of her relationship to Travis (ie passive, devoted, long-suffering, and tolerant of Travis' womanizing). The reality being that she gave as well as she got, and then some, with regard to flirting and sexual boundaries, but that couldn't come out in court.

BTW, with regard to ' behavior toward the opposite sex, rabbit fits, and hole fits, so I'd say your assessment is accurate.

 

[Hope4More]

Maybe her passport was expiring? She likely got hers in 1997 when she went to Costa Rica

I would think that too if that notation hadn't been followed by 'Deposit' (bank?) and then 'SW Airlines', as if she's planning a trip requiring a passport.

Did Travis know he'd won the Cancun trip by Sept. of '07?

The was broke. Difficult for me to imagine she'd prioritize renewing her passport if she didn't think she was going to have occasion to use one in the near future.

The Hughes say in their book that Travis did initially put her name down for Cancun. Both TA and knew about the trip a year beforehand, so she'd have been thinking about the passport a few months after learning of the trip.

Travis needed to meet an ED quota every month for a year to actually win the trip, so he didn't know for sure he was going until early April, 2008, iirc, but the likely assumed he would.

 

[Steve44]

The was broke. Difficult for me to imagine she'd prioritize renewing her passport if she didn't think she was going to have occasion to use one in the near future.

The Hughes say in their book that Travis did initially put her name down for Cancun. Both TA and knew about the trip a year beforehand, so she'd have been thinking about the passport a few months after learning of the trip.

Travis needed to meet an ED quota every month for a year to actually win the trip, so he didn't know for sure he was going until early April, 2008, iirc, but the likely assumed he would.

My thinking as well. Seeing he would likely win it, she assumed she would be going, and like you said, that was Travis' original plan as well, but by the time the trip was won, she had worn out her welcome.