Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2

[truthspider]

You still work under the impression, that SCPD is cunning and able and therefore all they do in strange, delayed, strange & delayed, and illogical acts has to be the result of some cunning strategy. I think, you base assumption in this equation is wrong. They are in way over their head and try to cover their rears but otherwise not to cause any actions, that unleashes the media again on them.

I don't understand what you said.

 

[BKS]

I know that sounded cynical and I wasnt trying to diminish all the hard work here by people who truely care It was just how I imagine LE thinks of sleuths...jmho!

No worry justice. WS brings people together in a forum that can help solve cases and provide support for families and victims in their search for justice. That is what is important.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Omg I meant to say us...dumb phone...us...thats how they thi.k of us! ; )

No worries, I got it right the first time :floorlaugh:
Btw, are you a left hander?

 

[Peter Brendt]

I know that sounded cynical and I wasnt trying to diminish all the hard work here by people who truely care It was just how I imagine LE thinks of sleuths...jmho!

There are really good PDs and really bad PDs. The bad PDs you recognize by

- don't care about missing prostitutes and label all missing children as runaways

- play the total secrecy game in SK and other murder investigations beyond the point of reason.

- Ignore every input form the outside.

Unfortunately, we have to deal here with SCPD which is a good example for a bad PD. I can assure you, I have regular contact currently with another PD in another case (by phone) and they are pretty nice and open-minded. So what I said about SKs to GenericMale, is also true for PDs. There are such and such ones.

 

[Justiceforever]

No worries, I got it right the first time :floorlaugh:
Btw, are you a left hander?

Nope but me thinks my phone is

 

[Peter Brendt]

I don't understand what you said.

Translated: Your idea, SCPD has any cunning sinister strategies is just overestimating SCPD's skills.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Nope but me thinks my phone is

Okay, I wondered. You normally make right-handed typos and suddenly you made left-handed ones.

 

[Justiceforever]

Okay, I wondered. You normally make right-handed typos and suddenly you made left-handed ones.

Lol...who knew! Im bouncing around in a semi trying to type on a tiny touchscreen. I would love to know if that means anything tho...the right handed vs lefthanded typos...please...whats your analysis! seriously not sarcastically. Are u thinking...freudian slip?

 

[Justiceforever]

Lol...who knew! Im bouncing around in a semi trying to type on a tiny touchscreen. I would love to know if that means anything tho...the right handed vs lefthanded typos...please...whats your analysis! seriously not sarcastically. Are u thinking...freudian slip?

Might I add that was very observent I didnt realize there was a difference between right and lerthanded typos! Go figure!

 

[Peter Brendt]

Lol...who knew! Im bouncing around in a semi trying to type on a tiny touchscreen. I would love to know if that means anything tho...the right handed vs lefthanded typos...please...whats your analysis! seriously not sarcastically. Are u thinking...freudian slip?

Technically, it means nothing but the main hand is used otherwise (for example phone) or injured.. I am only prone to notice such differences. Maybe a little bit of OCD on my side.

 

[Justiceforever]

So while I may not be able to add to the extensive research that u all have done...I am learning a lot more than I knew coming on...thanks everybody...PS Peter I only type with my right index finger...soon I'll be on my laptop and might not make as many typos ; ) n the mean time I am compelled to this forum out of a strong desire to find Justice for these victims. If it was me I would hope there were as many people who cared enuf! But by the grace of God there goes me!

 

[Adler]

You go personally here. But fine. First thing, I wasn't even the first to assume paradoxical undressing. But to me it made sense so I read up, compared with own experiences and draw my conclusion. The only reason you resent me is in fact, I don't agree with your theory. And that tells more about you than about me.
And I don't hate the idea of any girl full of life and will to live ... I only doubt, your idea fully applies to someone, who has a history of self-destructive behavior in the form of drugs and untreated mental problems.
According to the TOS, I can't discuss magic, druids and psychics here. So take my apologize, but I will not follow you in that rabbit hole.

PB, I truly appreciate your posts here. I do. I resent nothing. What bothers me is the contrast at the beginning and ending of the scenario you present and all the truth it may hold: a girl running for her life next to an image of a girl burrowing to die. That contrast in that picture bothers me. Not you.

The last line of this list bothers me too:

http://medicalchemy.blogspot.com/2010/10/terminal-burrowing-hide-and-die.html

 

[truthspider]

Translated: Your idea, SCPD has any cunning sinister strategies is just overestimating SCPD's skills.

And what about the fbi? They have been working with the SCPD on this.

 

[Peter Brendt]

PB, I truly appreciate your posts here. I do. I resent nothing. What bothers me is the contrast at the beginning and ending of the scenario you present and all the truth it may hold: a girl running for her life next to an image of a girl burrowing to die. That contrast in that picture bothers me. Not you.

The last line of this list bothers me too:

http://medicalchemy.blogspot.com/2010/10/terminal-burrowing-hide-and-die.html

I take it, it's that one:
Outdoor episodes occur when the person is lost in chilly, but not freezing, weather.

That's a bit misunderstanding worded, especially when you reference it to this case.
- if the air temperature is 60F and your clothes are wet, you lode body warmth rather like about 50F. Maybe not exactly 10F less, but something in that range (sorry, my brain works rather metric/Celsius, so the conversations are not accurate on exact 1F)

- if the weather is freezing, chances are, the victim will actually freeze before falling into an undressing pattern. The pattern has sometimes not enough time to evolve because something else kills the victim faster. Thus, the 1/3 of the victims show this pattern is rather true for very cold situations, the 1/2 rather true for more moderate situations- In extreme situations, it almost never occurs (for example people from torpedoed ships in the acrtic sey convoys never tried to undress, they were frozen hard in like 5 minutes in the water anyway).

- in this specific case, and in my opinion, drugs were involved. Especially ecstasy, some prescription drugs and especially in the combination with alcohol, tend to mess with the bodies heat control. People are too hyped up to notice the signs and don't react as they would normally. Which is the reason for the high number of fatal cases after certain techno parties. Such a combination of drug/alcohol would also lead to deviations from the usual numbers one would estimate for paradoxical undressing cases. For example, since the drugs would raise body heat anyway (as would the adrenaline rush caused by drug induces paranoia), paradoxical undressing would set in earlier than usually expected. Thus, the level of actual exhaustion would at that point be lower than usually and the distance to the body longer.

- terminal burying happens only in cases in which a place is actually available. No cave, the victim won't hide in a cave. And since SG had only her finger nails at her disposal, also not too much burying at all.

- We should keep in mind, that the final COD is undetermined. Means, there is a number of possible CODs. I pointed out already earlier, there is a possibility of heat stroke caused by drugs messing with the temperature controling of the body, stroke, heart attack (from the same source) or also the possibility of losing consciousness (a condition in which a person can drown in just 1 inch of water). So there is a real possibility, something from that list killed SG before hypothermia actually did.

And I can understand, that discrepancy bothers you. But in fact, it's pretty common. A panic rush, regardless whether from real reasons or drug induced, causes adrenaline. Depending on your individual parameters (size and effectivity of adrenal glands, amount of blood, physical fitness, certain brain conditions and so on), this gives a person about 10-30 minutes of real crazy power. After that time, the adrenaline level sinks and the person feels either relief (if she thinks, she got away from the danger) or desperation (because she is exhausted and the danger is still there. Which for sure is true for a danger that exists only in her imagination, since it travels with her). At this point, desperation leads very often to surrender. Only, if a person in a state of paranoia surrenders at home or in a hospital, nothing fatal will happen, at least in most cases. But SG was out there in the marsh.

 

[Just K]

It has been stated time and time again, here at WS, that LE does monitor this site and other social media sites re: high profile cases.

There was a murder case (2005) in Virginia, where online sleuths were responsible for finding several social media sites of the main suspect. Once there, sleuths spent hundreds of hours digging through thousands of the murderer's postings/ramblings and photos. It was several "armchair slueths" that finally agreed to send one tip/photo/link to LE. The photograph and it's description depicted the exact location where the murdered 17 year old college freshman lay haphazardly buried in a shallow ditch.

Since that case, many more cases have seen LE following the major sleuth sites. We know for a certainty that the Defense team in the 2011 High Profile Case in Florida used a marketing firm to track and post at Sleuth sites...during the trial the defense "apparently" used the words, verbatim, of certain WS members. Oh, and how a Detective, under oath, had to testify to his use of the moniker, Dick Tracy, here at WS. So, although they do not talk case details they do come here.

 

[Peter Brendt]

And what about the fbi? They have been working with the SCPD on this.

Well, we don't talk exactly FBI here, but especially the FBI's BAU-2 (crimes against adults). As you may have noticed, those guys haven't delivered any accurate profiles since about 10/11/2001. The reason is, BAU-2 and BAU-3 (crimes against children) were raided by FBI's human resources on behalf of counter-terrorism. So lets face it, the ones left in the BAU-2 are either young and green or the ones, who weren't deemed able enough to be transferred to counter-terrorism.
The other part of that is, that the BAU profiles, but, opposite to what TV shows want to tell us, rarely active investigate. They are rarely down on the ground with somewhat cool looking black SUVs and bash in doors. In reality, they write a profile and then the local police authority can use it or not. Since some detectives share your opinion about profiling, often local PDs don't use them. In cases they do, they often got their men, in cases they didn't we got the Zodiacs and ONS. But the last thing, the BAU does is, actually build wild plans for local PDs. Especially in this case, since SCPD wouldn't be able to execute them properly in the first place.

 

[Peter Brendt]

It has been stated time and time again, here at WS, that LE does monitor this site and other social media sites re: high profile cases.

There was a murder case in Virginia, where online sleuths were responsible for finding several social media sites of the main suspect. Once there, sleuths spent hundreds of hours digging through thousands of the murderers postings/ramblings and photos. It was several "armchair slueths" that finally agreed to send one tip/photo/link to LE. The photograph and it's description depicted the exact location where the murdered 17 year old college freshman lay haphazardly buried in a shallow ditch.

Since that case, many more cases have seen LE following the major sleuth sites. We know for a certainty that the Defense team in the 2011 High Profile Case in Florida used a marketing firm to track and post at Websleuths...during the trial the defense "apparently" used the words, verbatim, of certain WS members.

And even more often, LE scans such sites, use what they find and if it works, they take the credit for their "bright ideas". Which is okay by me if they catch the unsubs that way. A good sign to figure who watches is, to see, what leaks from a PD to the press. If that is about the same, what we discussed her four weeks ago, chances are, it made it's way through a PD rather than stemming from there.

 

[truthspider]

It has been stated time and time again, here at WS, that LE does monitor this site and other social media sites re: high profile cases.

There was a murder case (2005) in Virginia, where online sleuths were responsible for finding several social media sites of the main suspect. Once there, sleuths spent hundreds of hours digging through thousands of the murderers postings/ramblings and photos. It was several "armchair slueths" that finally agreed to send one tip/photo/link to LE. The photograph and it's description depicted the exact location where the murdered 17 year old college freshman lay haphazardly buried in a shallow ditch.

Since that case, many more cases have seen LE following the major sleuth sites. We know for a certainty that the Defense team in the 2011 High Profile Case in Florida used a marketing firm to track and post at Sleuth sites...during the trial the defense "apparently" used the words, verbatim, of certain WS members.

Like zoinks! that is crazy. If the defense lawyers in this case try to quote me I will shoot them. Unless my father defends this devil (don't worry he won't) in which case I would shoot him with a water gun, steal the retainer and turn it over to the victims families.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Like zoinks! that is crazy. If the defense lawyers in this case try to quote me I will shoot them. Unless my father defends this devil (don't worry he won't) in which case I would shoot him with a water gun, steal the retainer and turn it over to the victims families.

That reminds me so of that Robin Williams speech in the beginning of his Peter Pan movie. They use now lawyers in animal testing ... of course, for reasons of humanity, but also because there are things, even rats wouldn't do for money. :floorlaugh:

 

[truthspider]

That reminds me so of that Robin Williams speech in the beginning of his Peter Pan movie. They use now lawyers in animal testing ... of course, for reasons of humanity, but also because there are things, even rats wouldn't do for money. :floorlaugh:

Good one, thats funny! Since I always have to tell the truth (side effect of this spider business) I must tell you the only reason he wouldn't defend the lisk is because CPH is bankrupt and doesn't have enough cash buried in his backyard. He also already has some lawyer with a head wound so legally CPH would have to relieve his current attorney and seek out big poppa. I would love that.....
.
:sponge:

.