Sidebar Discussion #5

[LolaMoon08]

I'm going to visit my folks in Pinellas Co. in a cpl weeks. It sure will seem different to me now, since the trial.

I could never step foot in Pinellas County! I don't think I could stop myself from complaining to every single person I came into contact with about what this jury did and didn't do. My luck, I would run into one of the jurors. :furious:

 

[Lanie]

I'm going to visit my folks in Pinellas Co. in a cpl weeks. It sure will seem different to me now, since the trial.

I went to Clearwater sometime after the trial, and in all fairness, most of the people there discussing it were just as outraged as the rest of us.

SNARKY: But I know what you mean, on the way I kept thinking I was going to have to talk rrreeeaaaallllyyyyyy ssssslllllllloooooooowwwwww and use little words to be able to communicate with anyone. ;-) I also spent the first couple of days there looking at random people thinking, "Was it YOU???"

 

[lowens1975]

I guess he just plumb forgot important information. Without going into the duct tape, now just how would a 2 yr old die and be found in the woods so close to home? Did any of them stop to think about that? Then there is Zanny. We heard testimony, but we also heard the OS. Uh, one does not fit into the other story, they couldn't see this either? :furious:

BBM -

With George being an ex cop, you know he knew that the body being found so close to the Anthony home that one of the Anthony's would be implicated. So if George was the one who 'disposed' of the body, he would not have placed it where it was eventually found. CA put it there in a panicked rush to get it out of her car. She put the body close to road (instead of further in) because 45 lbs of dead weight is heavier than 45 lbs of live child and either she was planning on going back to move the body or she was afraid of going deeper into the underbrush.

And George didn't back his car into the garage and borrow a neighbors shovel.

For me, CA's actions has always spoke louder than her words.

 

[Nore]

I'm so glad you brought this trial up. I followed it too. And felt exactly like you. OCA's jury wanted to know how Caylee died, Strewart's jury didn't even have skeletal remains and they got it so right. However, Stewart's jury got to see and hear about phone records. And yet again OCA's jury got to see and hear OCA's own video's and voice but still didn't see or hear the coldness she exzuded. IDK???? I swear I'll never get over this injustice to Caylee even if karma does comes, but I can hope that it will ease some of the pain I feel.

Excuse me, could you please pass me a napkin? Thanks. All right ladies, you can stop your drooling and get back to work.
I agree, Yuri and Jeff are good eye candy. Their personalities, intelligence, wit and sense of humor are a turn on too.

-----------------
Yes!!! if only I were about 40 years younger.:blushing:

 

[watcher9]

MSN had the computer picture of FCA on its home page under "Quotes of the Month".
It was about what a good life she has been having and it was only going to get better (not verbatim). I said to myself I will have to get a new home page.

I couldn't get on to WS to see if anyone was commenting on it. It seemed like 30 minutes before I could get on. What's up with that? Are we getting overloaded or is the server having trouble?

 

[krkrjx]

BBM -

With George being an ex cop, you know he knew that the body being found so close to the Anthony home that one of the Anthony's would be implicated. So if George was the one who 'disposed' of the body, he would not have placed it where it was eventually found. CA put it there in a panicked rush to get it out of her car. She put the body close to road (instead of further in) because 45 lbs of dead weight is heavier than 45 lbs of live child and either she was planning on going back to move the body or she was afraid of going deeper into the underbrush.

And George didn't back his car into the garage and borrow a neighbors shovel.

For me, CA's actions has always spoke louder than her words.

Also, George being an ex cop would have known you do not try to make an accident look like a murder. Even Casey would know it makes no sense to do such a thing.

The duct tape pretty much totally cancels out the prospect of accidental death and why the jury could not see that still boggles. Even people who do not listen to the news or read newspapers are usually capable of adding 1 + 1 to equal 2. The forensics were obviously a challenge mentally to all the jurors; combine that with a large dose of laziness and you have a recipe for disaster.

JMO.

 

[wonders]

Thank-you! I have always said Casey is just pure evil. She doesn't fit under any catergory but evil. Evil exists! She's pranced around in front of us for nearly 4 years.

I did have a dream last night that Casey killed a dentist? Why a dentist? I have no idea? I seriously think that Casey has driven me somewhat insane. I dream about her a lot lately? She was going by a different name though... Emily something? I forget the last name?

Maybe I do need to get on this Chantax (sp?) everyone talks about? :floorlaugh:

Boy you do have a lot of dreams about her. I've only had 2 and the first I don't remember anymore, which that is the only good thing about having memory problems. I don't think your insane at all. Your just someone who cared/cares more for Caylee then her very own blood relitives.

 

[Bravo]

Dreams are a release from life's anxiety and tensions etc. Altho when we have them they seem to cause anxiety if they are disturbing. MOO

 

[zippitydoda]

Also, George being an ex cop would have known you do not try to make an accident look like a murder. Even Casey would know it makes no sense to do such a thing.

The duct tape pretty much totally cancels out the prospect of accidental death and why the jury could not see that still boggles. Even people who do not listen to the news or read newspapers are usually capable of adding 1 + 1 to equal 2. The forensics were obviously a challenge mentally to all the jurors; combine that with a large dose of laziness and you have a recipe for disaster.

JMO.

hmmmm.... you would think that an ex 13 year LEO would know not to touch, tamper with, remove or clean up a suspicous scene - i.e. their white pontiac -but he did just that with CA.

 

[jon_burrows]

Maybe it would have made a difference if KC's jury had seen phone/text records, maybe not. It is difficult to know with this jury what it would have taken because when a group of people refuses to see the light they will not see it no matter how bright it shines. The weirdest thing that came out of their mouths IMO was about KC's 31 days being "normal behavior for a young gal."

Um...a young person partying and having a good time with friends is normal--except within hours of their child dying! That screams cold-blooded loud and clear. It isn't even in the same zip code as Normal. That jury was just another way that KC lucked out, IMO, because it is not common for one to have 12 of the most obtuse citizens in a given area elected to decide their fate.

BBM - The foreman didn't even know CA lied on the stand about the computer searches. I think phone/text records would have been too hard for him to comprehend. He also proudly proclaimed that he orchestrated the whole thing. I don't even want to get into the woman washing his underwear and he didn't know underwear could be folded. Arrogant idiot.

The only thing that I think may have changed the verdict was honesty from GA,CA,LA. CA painted an angelic like FCA, one that she snuggled with watching videos of her grandfather in the nursing home with Caylee . In reality, according to neighbors, there was a knock down drag out fight laced with profanity.

I believe the alternate juror said she was a good mother because all her friends thought she was. First off, bad mothers act like good mothers in front of others. Secondly, every friend that stated she was a good mother should have said they were not around her enough to know if she was a good mother. Tony only saw Caylee a couple times, same with some of the other friends.

Looking back, the SAs should have pointed out to the brain dead jury that CA threatened to take Caylee away from FCA. It was on the 911 tapes which were admitted as evidence. I'll never understand why CA's 'My Caylee is Missing' post wasn't allowed in. That post summarized FCA, no job, no money, no future, who would take care of Caylee'. Why write that when FCA is with the MOTY.

IMO

 

[krkrjx]

hmmmm.... you would think that an ex 13 year LEO would know not to touch, tamper with, remove or clean up a suspicous scene - i.e. their white pontiac -but he did just that with CA.

Right. GA should have known something was seriously wrong as soon as he smelled the car. Same goes for CA, being a nurse. But I think at the time the last thing that might have immediately crossed their minds would be that was Caylee was dead and had been in the trunk.

Makes you wonder, though, why they didn't think Casey might be dead given she was at that time missing in action, and there was the smell in the car. As for cleaning, I think CA did that after she shuffled GA off to work, telling him she would take care of things.

I honestly do not think they knew anything about what had happened to Caylee at that point, but I cannot figure out why they didn't know because given both their professional experience you would think the smell would be undeniable. I guess it may boil down to us looking at it from a different point of view than parents in the thick of the unfolding situation would. I mean, who among us would immediately jump to the conclusion that our daughter had murdered our granddaughter and piled her decomposing body in the trunk? Even those of us who might have LE or nursing backgrounds might not go there in our minds right away.

I'm not defending their actions, just trying to put myself in their positions in the first minutes after retrieving the car.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Boy you do have a lot of dreams about her. I've only had 2 and the first I don't remember anymore, which that is the only good thing about having memory problems. I don't think your insane at all. Your just someone who cared/cares more for Caylee then her very own blood relitives.

I always remember a lot of what I dream? I don't know if I am not fully asleep? Or what? Makes for some very interesting writing I've been able to do though.

And this may sound a bit strange to some, but Casey Anthony has become my muse when writing murder scenes (I write screenplays). I have found it really easy to write compelling murder scenes when you can relate to hating someone so much. Before this case, my murder scenes lacked a lot of what is needed to bring someone to actually take another person's life.

Maybe I'll thank her in my Academy Award Speech? Not!

ETA: I only kill people on paper! Promise!

 

[Lanie]

BBM - The foreman didn't even know CA lied on the stand about the computer searches. I think phone/text records would have been too hard for him to comprehend. He also proudly proclaimed that he orchestrated the whole thing. I don't even want to get into the woman washing his underwear and he didn't know underwear could be folded. Arrogant idiot.

The only thing that I think may have changed the verdict was honesty from GA,CA,LA. CA painted an angelic like FCA, one that she snuggled with watching videos of her grandfather in the nursing home with Caylee . In reality, according to neighbors, there was a knock down drag out fight laced with profanity.

I believe the alternate juror said she was a good mother because all her friends thought she was. First off, bad mothers act like good mothers in front of others. Secondly, every friend that stated she was a good mother should have said they were not around her enough to know if she was a good mother. Tony only saw Caylee a couple times, same with some of the other friends.

Looking back, the SAs should have pointed out to the brain dead jury that CA threatened to take Caylee away from FCA. It was on the 911 tapes which were admitted as evidence. I'll never understand why CA's 'My Caylee is Missing' post wasn't allowed in. That post summarized FCA, no job, no money, no future, who would take care of Caylee'. Why write that when FCA is with the MOTY.

IMO

I don't remember anymore what was brought out in court and what I just know.
That 'good mother' thing really chaps me, though. How does a person who leaves their newborn with a babysitter, not to go to work and support the newborn, but to get away from the newborn, qualify as a good mother? This went on all of Caylee's short life, and not just a few hours here and there, but the equivalent of a full-time job, and then some. People have wondered from Day 31 what CFCA was doing with all this free time. IMO, she wasn't doing much of anything, because it wasn't about Caylee being in the way of her doing this or that, it was all about her not being around Caylee.

 

[bayouland]

Also, George being an ex cop would have known you do not try to make an accident look like a murder. Even Casey would know it makes no sense to do such a thing.

The duct tape pretty much totally cancels out the prospect of accidental death and why the jury could not see that still boggles. Even people who do not listen to the news or read newspapers are usually capable of adding 1 + 1 to equal 2. The forensics were obviously a challenge mentally to all the jurors; combine that with a large dose of laziness and you have a recipe for disaster.

JMO.

BBM. JMO. I can see only two reasons for the duct tape.

1. It was the murder weapon; or

2. FCA watched too many movies and thought that to stage a kidnapping the victim (if found) needed to be duct taped.

I vote #1.

 

[bayouland]

here is a link to the "stop smoking in honor of caylee" thread in the jury room. All members are welcome to come aboard and help our friends who are wishing to quit smoking.

websleuths crime sleuthing community

bump!

 

[bayouland]

Also, George being an ex cop would have known you do not try to make an accident look like a murder. Even Casey would know it makes no sense to do such a thing.

The duct tape pretty much totally cancels out the prospect of accidental death and why the jury could not see that still boggles. Even people who do not listen to the news or read newspapers are usually capable of adding 1 + 1 to equal 2. The forensics were obviously a challenge mentally to all the jurors; combine that with a large dose of laziness and you have a recipe for disaster.

JMO.

BBM, I missed this part.......you are so right!!!

 

[Aedrys]

Right. GA should have known something was seriously wrong as soon as he smelled the car. Same goes for CA, being a nurse. But I think at the time the last thing that might have immediately crossed their minds would be that was Caylee was dead and had been in the trunk.

Makes you wonder, though, why they didn't think Casey might be dead given she was at that time missing in action, and there was the smell in the car. As for cleaning, I think CA did that after she shuffled GA off to work, telling him she would take care of things.

I honestly do not think they knew anything about what had happened to Caylee at that point, but I cannot figure out why they didn't know because given both their professional experience you would think the smell would be undeniable. I guess it may boil down to us looking at it from a different point of view than parents in the thick of the unfolding situation would. I mean, who among us would immediately jump to the conclusion that our daughter had murdered our granddaughter and piled her decomposing body in the trunk? Even those of us who might have LE or nursing backgrounds might not go there in our minds right away.

I'm not defending their actions, just trying to put myself in their positions in the first minutes after retrieving the car.

I think that Casey played so many games with them, they didn't truly know what to think. I think deep inside they knew it was either Casey or Caylee, but couldn't bring themselves to accept it, especially because Casey had kept Caylee from them before (remember Lee asking if this was like last time?). I think they thought Casey had taken it to a whole new level this time, trying to send them a message that maybe that Caylee could be dead if they didn't do what she wanted. Like I said, she's played so many games with them (and we all know they dysfunctional games that seem to be part of that family, the secret codes, weird ways of talking, etc). I really think they, at least Cindy, just wasn't sure Caylee was actually dead until that day in Baez's office. I'm not sure about George, though. I think he may have figure it out sooner, but just couldn't bring himself to think of Casey as a murderer or Caylee dead. Or maybe Cindy wouldn't allow the thought of Caylee being dead to be said in that house.

I think it was only after that day Baez's office that Cindy knew Caylee was dead for sure, and then it became get the body first before LE did. I think Baez, early on, was drilling into their heads that if the body was found, Casey would die. Then the body was found, and what came back on the table but the death penalty. Baez was proven right. It became save Casey at any cost after that.

I'm not excusing their actions, but that family is so very dysfunctional, I really don't believe they knew for sure that Caylee was dead until that day in Baez's office. I think they clung to the hope that this was just another of Casey's games, and they would get Caylee back. I think before this time, she had held Caylee away from them, but gave her back, so they expected this was the same type of game Casey played but worse than the last time. Talk about torturing them when she knew all along that Caylee was dead. I don't like the A's, but Casey sure had them completely messed up after so many years of her games and carp.

If she hadn't played so many games with them for so long, I think we would have seen a totally different situation play out.

 

[krkrjx]

I think that Casey played so many games with them, they didn't truly know what to think. I think deep inside they knew it was either Casey or Caylee, but couldn't bring themselves to accept it, especially because Casey had kept Caylee from them before (remember Lee asking if this was like last time?). I think they thought Casey had taken it to a whole new level this time, trying to send them a message that maybe that Caylee could be dead if they didn't do what she wanted. Like I said, she's played so many games with them (and we all know they dysfunctional games that seem to be part of that family, the secret codes, weird ways of talking, etc). I really think they, at least Cindy, just wasn't sure Caylee was actually dead until that day in Baez's office. I'm not sure about George, though. I think he may have figure it out sooner, but just couldn't bring himself to think of Casey as a murderer or Caylee dead. Or maybe Cindy wouldn't allow the thought of Caylee being dead to be said in that house.

I think it was only after that day Baez's office that Cindy knew Caylee was dead for sure, and then it became get the body first before LE did. I think Baez, early on, was drilling into their heads that if the body was found, Casey would die. Then the body was found, and what came back on the table but the death penalty. Baez was proven right. It became save Casey at any cost after that.

I'm not excusing their actions, but that family is so very dysfunctional, I really don't believe they knew for sure that Caylee was dead until that day in Baez's office. I think they clung to the hope that this was just another of Casey's games, and they would get Caylee back. I think before this time, she had held Caylee away from them, but gave her back, so they expected this was the same type of game Casey played but worse than the last time. Talk about torturing them when she knew all along that Caylee was dead. I don't like the A's, but Casey sure had them completely messed up after so many years of her games and carp.

If she hadn't played so many games with them for so long, I think we would have seen a totally different situation play out.

I agree.

It is easy to critique a play after the final curtain. It is less so to accurately critique the play in just the first few minutes. I have ALWAYS felt that Casey had withheld Caylee (taken her away for several days or longer) at least once before. Lee's questioning Casey, "Is this like the last time?" is telling, IMO.

If Casey had ever removed Caylee from her home and not allowed her parents to see her for any extended time period but eventually brought her home safe and sound, it would certainly explain why CA and GA were not thinking Caylee was harmed in any way--or even Casey for that matter.

The smell in the car being ignored by them is the stickler. But, I do think we are all have access to defense mechanisms that take over when something presents itself that we really are not capable of dealing with on an emotional level. Clearly, CA was not totally denying the smell was there and what it was. "...and it smells like there's been a dead body in the damn car!" is very telling. But even with that, I have a hard time believing that in the first minutes or even hours of the car being home and GA having left for work, CA set about deliberately destroying evidence of a death, especially murder. For all she knew it could have been Casey who was the victim of foul play. Wouldn't CA have wanted to preserve evidence to convict whoever was responsible for her daughter's death?

All things considered, I do not think it was a conscious effort at that time for CA to clean up evidence that Casey had murdered Caylee. And it is for that same reason that GA left for work before any questions he might have had were answered. I think they just didn't suspect that either their daughter or their grandaughter had died at that time. Later on, however, is a different story.

Lee had something specific in mind when he asked Casey if this was like the last time. Of that, I am convinced.

 

[Sleuths4Me]

I just wan to know those 2 jurors who voted murder first and how they changed their mind to NG. Seriously that is a big leap. I also want to know why they didn't stay on their vote and hang the jury? I would have rather go through the whole trial again w/ a different set than to see her walk free

 

[krkrjx]

I just wan to know those 2 jurors who voted murder first and how they changed their mind to NG. Seriously that is a big leap. I also want to know why they didn't stay on their vote and hang the jury? I would have rather go through the whole trial again w/ a different set than to see her walk free

I believe that those two jurors are the type who tend to go with the flow. Some people go along with the group and do not make waves no matter what the situation. They are not able to stand up for what they believe in. They are easily intimidated. For some people, any type of confrontation is just not something they can deal with.