Sievers Sidebar #3

[Zuri]

Do you really think anyone would say something in their "second" language like LS did that was the equivalent of the old adage, "You live by the sword, you die by the sword"?
Because TS was murdered, viciously murdered.

So it is awkward at best to say she lived big & she died big. It implies she had something to do with it.

Which. She. Didn't.




Riposa in pace, buon Medico.

As a homicide survivor, I cringed at those words. They were absolutely a poor choice, however her actions post homicide spoke volumes more to me than that actual phrase. IMO. No offense intended.

 

[Deleted member 159541]

This link has information about the condo. The deed date goes back to 2005. Interestingly, the background searches that found this address that both CWW and MS used show their "usage" date from 1999-2000 - so I am trying to find out who was the owner prior.

http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/print/RE/0210020200300320/2015/billingcollection

Also interesting that on certain mail MS used a P.O. Box in Bonita Springs and on other mail he used the office or home address. The condo's tax bill went to the P.O. Box: http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/view/RE/02-1.0-02.0-2-003-003.10/2015

 

[mikeinmo]

This link has information about the condo. The deed date goes back to 2005. Interestingly, the background searches that found this address that both CWW and MS used show their "usage" date from 1999-2000 - so I am trying to find out who was the owner prior.

http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/print/RE/0210020200300320/2015/billingcollection

calling the assessors info up last tax payment was 12.11.2015 deed filing date for both TS and MS was 10.07.2005
condo was in both names

 

[Deleted member 159541]

Yeah, makes you wonder if MS went and bought a condo two years after he and TS were married back at the building where he lived with CW in the late 90's, early 2000 and if yes, why?

 

[Batman's Mommy]

Also interesting that on certain mail MS used a P.O. Box in Bonita Springs and on other mail he used the office or home address. The condo's tax bill went to the P.O. Box: http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/view/RE/02-1.0-02.0-2-003-003.10/2015

It appears that the billing address was changed on November 9, 2015 from the home address to the P.O. Box.

 

[Zuri]

Also interesting that on certain mail MS used a P.O. Box in Bonita Springs and on other mail he used the office or home address. The condo's tax bill went to the P.O. Box: http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/view/RE/02-1.0-02.0-2-003-003.10/2015

This link has information about the condo. The deed date goes back to 2005. Interestingly, the background searches that found this address that both CWW and MS used show their "usage" date from 1999-2000 - so I am trying to find out who was the owner prior.

http://jeffersonmo.devnetwedge.com/print/RE/0210020200300320/2015/billingcollection

calling the assessors info up last tax payment was 12.11.2015 deed filing date for both TS and MS was 10.07.2005
condo was in both names

It appears that the billing address was changed on November 9, 2015 from the home address to the P.O. Box.

I wonder if MS has done that with all business related mail? Or is anticipating selling the house? Or an arrest?

 

[Batman's Mommy]

Amazon Rain,

Do you have a contact in Missouri who could go to the courthouse and do a deed search on the property? The Deed from 2005 will show who sold the property to the Sievers. It should be public record, and will just require some time and diligence. I've looked everywhere, and I can't find the info...which doesn't mean that it doesn't exist online, but that way, you could get a copy of the actual deed.

Just a suggestion. :loveyou:

 

[dmac55]

Dmac55, RN:

I hope we find out AND you mentioned another MS timeline quagmire in the previous thread, and I concur as a fellow RN: why would MS "after college become an LPN"? You are correct, it doesn't make sense & it is not the norm. Why wouldn't he just have his college credits apply towards his RN?

So it begs the question: what does "after college" really mean for MS & where was this quote from again? Did he get a few college credits & then quit? Because as dmac55 pointed out previously, if he had gotten his Associates Degree (60 credits, typically 2 yrs), he could easily lead into his RN without much ado except for his Clinicals.

Additionally, I don't really see a common or ordinary segue from his "college" first, then into becoming an LPN, and then his desire into law school. That is clearly a circuitous academic route.

i agree
the LPN "after college" quote is from the link below:

How did Mark and Teresa Sievers meet? | WINK NEWS
http://www.winknews.com/2015/12/02/how-did-mark-and-teresa-sievers-meet/

After college, Sievers became a licensed practical nurse in 1995.

 

[creepingskills]

Do you really think anyone would say something in their "second" language like LS did that was the equivalent of the old adage, "You live by the sword, you die by the sword"?
Because TS was murdered, viciously murdered.

So it is awkward at best to say she lived big & she died big. It implies she had something to do with it.

Which. She. Didn't.




Riposa in pace, buon Medico.

Definitely a poor choice of words, but I interpreted LS's comment as TS was like magnet, made a big impression on whoever she met and that people were captivated by her message. Maybe I'm biased after watching TS's videos. TS was tiny but had a 'big' presence, a spark so bright that I could see her being the center of attention in any room. TS's brutal murder received national attention, and kept our attention. So to me, that comment is a poorly worded way of saying TS was one of those rare people who are so brilliant, charismatic, so 'big' that you couldn't help but notice, listen and her death, sadly, is what has brought us all here.

 

[AlwaysShocked]

Dmac55, RN:

I hope we find out AND you mentioned another MS timeline quagmire in the previous thread, and I concur as a fellow RN: why would MS "after college become an LPN"? You are correct, it doesn't make sense & it is not the norm. Why wouldn't he just have his college credits apply towards his RN?

So it begs the question: what does "after college" really mean for MS & where was this quote from again? Did he get a few college credits & then quit? Because as dmac55 pointed out previously, if he had gotten his Associates Degree (60 credits, typically 2 yrs), he could easily lead into his RN without much ado except for his Clinicals.

Additionally, I don't really see a common or ordinary segue from his "college" first, then into becoming an LPN, and then his desire into law school. That is clearly a circuitous academic route.

MS was initially licensed as a Practical Nurse in Missouri, correct? Anybody know what the basic educational requirements are for a PA in that state?

I am familiar with Community College Associates Degree to RN in Pennsylvania. A lot of what you need and how much time it takes to achieve the RN depends on what course of study you followed in Community College. In the early 90's pre-reqs for a basic RN hospital-based "School of Nursing" included college level Anatomy I & II, Physiology I & II, Pathology, Pharmacology, Human Growth & Development, Psychology, English, Public Speaking, Math, Chemistry, and Nutrition. And perhaps others I've forgotten. These all had to be completed prior to entering "Nursing School".

So, depending on what one had already studied, some classes would fit in, others would not.

I'm pretty sure LPN school does not take as long and does not include as many college level classes. I always had the greatest of respect for an experienced LPN. But I did notice that they often did not seem to have an in-depth knowledge of certain areas, especially Physiology and Pharmacology.

 

[SaucyGal]

I am glad the condo is being discussed. It has been an awkward piece of the puzzle for me. I don't know why, but there is something about the fact MS has that condo that really sticks out to me. Of course, MS and CWW's connection is a complete enigma to me as well. I have not had the time to delve into the start of their friendship or how it came to be, but I recall someone (KateB?) pointing out they began their friendship in their teens. I am struggling just to keep up with the most current events. I don't know that I'll ever get caught up on all the history!

MS' sexual exploits have been discussed in terms of "swinging" and such. Has it been established whether MS and CWW may have had a relationship beyond a platonic level? I wonder (not too deeply though) about the possibility of the ménage à trois the night of CWW's wedding.....In my opinion, the rage and intimacy involved in TS' death seems to lend itself to more than just money.

There are just so many facets to this case!:gaah:

 

[SaucyGal]

Definitely a poor choice of words, but I interpreted LS's comment as TS was like magnet, made a big impression on whoever she met and that people were captivated by her message. Maybe I'm biased after watching TS's videos. TS was tiny but had a 'big' presence, a spark so bright that I could see her being the center of attention in any room. TS's brutal murder received national attention, and kept our attention. So to me, that comment is a poorly worded way of saying TS was one of those rare people who are so brilliant, charismatic, so 'big' that you couldn't help but notice, listen and her death, sadly, is what has brought us all here.

:ditto:

It also reminds me of something TS' own mother mentioned during her interview. I don't recall the exact wording...It was in essence that TS wanted to spread her healing/teaching nationally or even worldwide. Her mother noted that she would be known now, but she didn't want it to be like this...I am horrible at remembering things, but it was in that ballpark. I take it as TS was a larger than life figure. Tragically before TS' wonderful message could be shared in HER way, she became known for the wrong, yet, very noticeable reasons.

 

[Zuri]

The MSM has written quite clearly that MS is a co conspirator and involved in the planning of the murder of TS. Reference to the info within the documents is noted. Since MS has not been arrested, would the MSM that has written these stories be subject to libel lawsuits? If he is never arrested?

 

[creepingskills]

The MSM has written quite clearly that MS is a co conspirator and involved in the planning of the murder of TS. Reference to the info within the documents is noted. Since MS has not been arrested, would the MSM that has written these stories be subject to libel lawsuits? If he is never arrested?

No, MSM is safe. For liability to attach, MSM would have to; 1. act with malice (ex. knowing the information was false before publishing), or 2. act negligently (ex. failing to check sources).

 

[RANCH]

The MSM has written quite clearly that MS is a co conspirator and involved in the planning of the murder of TS. Reference to the info within the documents is noted. Since MS has not been arrested, would the MSM that has written these stories be subject to libel lawsuits? If he is never arrested?

No, MSM is safe. For liability to attach, MSM would have to; 1. act with malice (ex. knowing the information was false before publishing), or 2. act negligently (ex. failing to check sources).

In some cases it's a shame that MSM can publish things about people who are later found to be innocent.

At the same time I'm glad that the United States has the First Amendment that allows for the freedom of speech that protects us all.

 

[RANCH]

None of the interviews would be admissible as evidence at trial (although people could be confronted with inconsistencies from their prior statements of course). If an interview transcript was released, all it means is that it exists. Others probably have not yet been transcribed. And the only conclusion you can likely draw from that is that someone either in LE or in the prosecutor's office wanted to have the testimony handy in writing for some reason rather than having to go back to the video.

Come to think of it, though, I believe you can use LE interview transcripts before a grand jury.... :thinking:

I always love how you remind us of our rights. Interviews of witness's by LE are not evidence. The 6th Amendent say's that.

The Confrontation Clause of the Sixth Amendment to the United States Constitution provides that "in all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right…to be confronted with the witnesses against him." Generally, the right is to have a face-to-face confrontation with witnesses who are offering testimonial evidence against the accused in the form of cross-examination during a trial.

The State can't use the interviews against the defendants because the defense can't cross examine a video or transcript of an interview.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confrontation_Clause

 

[creepingskills]

I always love how you remind us of our rights. Interviews of witness's by LE are not evidence. The 6th Amendent say's that.



The State can't use the interviews against the defendants because the defense can't cross examine a video or transcript of an interview.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confrontation_Clause

The defense can cross examine a witness about his/her previous sworn statements given in an interview.

 

[RANCH]

The defense can cross examine a witness about his/her previous sworn statements given in an interview.

I know that. The State can do the same. AZ mentioned that in her post.

Interviews by themselves are not evidence because the accused can't cross examine. I think there are exceptions when the witness has died before trial but that has to go thru motions and such.

JMO

 

[creepingskills]

I know that. The State can do the same. AZ mentioned that in her post.

Interviews by themselves are not evidence because the accused can't cross examine. I think there are exceptions when the witness has died before trial but that has to go thru motions and such.

JMO

Ok, well you included transcripts as something that can't be used against the defendant. When the state/defense examine a witness, transcripts of the interview can be introduced.

If the witness is unavailable (death is one way) transcripts can be admitted as an exception to the hearsay rule. Other exceptions include: when the declarant is exempted from testifying about the subject matter of the declarant’s statement because the court rules that a privilege applies. IIRC AZ brilliantly pointed out that AW had waived her spousal privilege on the issues, those interview transcripts will be useful. Especially if AW falls into another category of 'unavailability' and testifies to not remembering the subject matter or claims to be suffering from mental illness.

 

[RANCH]

Ok, well you included transcripts as something that can't be used against the defendant. When the state/defense examine a witness, transcripts of the interview can be introduced.

If the witness is unavailable (death is one way) transcripts can be admitted as an exception to the hearsay rule. Other exceptions include: when the declarant is exempted from testifying about the subject matter of the declarant’s statement because the court rules that a privilege applies. IIRC AZ brilliantly pointed out that AW had waived her spousal privilege on the issues, those interview transcripts will be useful. Especially if AW falls into another category of 'unavailability' and testifies to not remembering the subject matter or claims to be suffering from mental illness.

I think we are on the same page.

I'm sorry that you felt that I was trying to say you are wrong in your postings.