Found Deceased Spain - Esther Dingley, from UK, missing in the Pyrenees, November 2020 #2

[otto]

Something that I’ve been wondering about, the transmitter on the Pic de Sauvegarde. Lots of people here are saying it’s WiFi... so is it just an actual WiFi access point or is it a small mobile phone repeater? If it’s WiFi you’re going to have to be fairly close and have nearly line of sight to get signal. So anything sent would be 100% sent at the summit.

This is all I've been able to find about the actual signal.

"An hour after the meeting [the olypian witness], just before 4 p.m., Dingley reached the peak of 8,983 feet where she sent a selfie to her partner Dan Colegate.

The photo shows her at the top, with a solar panel and a telecommunications mast on the top reflected in her sunglasses."
​

Missing hiker Esther Dingley ‘last seen by Olympic skier who says Brit continued to summit after asking for fruit’ | FR24 News English

 

[otto]

I'm very confused about this "two loop" scenario. As far as I can tell, it's all one loop. This loop is presented with all the photos of the route (including all the great photos of the Refuge basin) in the French blog upthread.
IMO In the circumstances, ED would not have been able to make it down to the Hospice and back up again between the 21st and the 22nd. There are simply not enough hours. IMO

It's a 2-3 hour hike from the Hospice de France to the Port de Venasque.

There is no obvious trail from Port de Glere to Port de Venasque. It's possible to hike from the Port de Venasque to the Refuge, then hike trails in France to the Port de Glere.

 

[Grouse]

I'm very confused about this "two loop" scenario. As far as I can tell, it's all one loop. This loop is presented with all the photos of the route (including all the great photos of the Refuge basin) in the French blog upthread.
IMO In the circumstances, ED would not have been able to make it down to the Hospice and back up again between the 21st and the 22nd. There are simply not enough hours. IMO

I think the 2 loop thing arose from the fact that she is at the Pic on day 1 (21st) and is there again at the Pic on the 22nd. So she's already made a loop of some sort by returning there. With another two days apparently still left on her final trip, and planning to stay at the Refuge de Venasque that night, it implies she would be setting off on a loop 2 on the morning of the 23rd, presumably heading to the North (unless she planned a third ascent of the Pic?)

 

[RedHaus]

Great summary that and I will look at in more detail, but I must point out one slight correction - BBM

Sorry, Grouse! Too late for me to edit that post... clearly from your Avatar, you are a "he". Next time...

 

[Grouse]

Sorry, Grouse! Too late for me to edit that post... clearly from your Avatar, you are a "he". Next time...

haha, no worries RedHaus - it prompted me to set my avatar actually, it was indeterminate before, you weren't to know

 

[RickshawFan]

It's a 2-3 hour hike from the Hospice de France to the Port de Venasque.

There is no obvious trail from Port de Glere to Port de Venasque. It's possible to hike from the Port de Venasque to the Refuge, then hike trails in France to the Port de Glere.

My understanding is that it's at least 3 1/2 hours up + the Pic. With a daypack. Down from the Port to the Hospice goes via Port de la Picade; this doesn't go in the direction of the Refuge at all. It's 4 hours down by that route. I posted the relevant photos upthread.

 

[Grouse]

Something that I’ve been wondering about, the transmitter on the Pic de Sauvegarde. Lots of people here are saying it’s WiFi... so is it just an actual WiFi access point or is it a small mobile phone repeater? If it’s WiFi you’re going to have to be fairly close and have nearly line of sight to get signal. So anything sent would be 100% sent at the summit.

I did some googling on this but didn't find much after some (admittedly brief) research. I did find something though about 13th century communications via lights from vantage points on the peaks in the Pyrenees (similar to how the Romans communicated along Hadrians Wall). Not a telecomms expert but it did make me wonder if the transmitters on the various peaks now are set up to talk to each other like that. If so might it open up the possibility of triangulation and the confirmation to LE of ED's exact whereabouts when she sent the last pictures?

 

[PeggyHenry]

Press reader.com website:So How could she just Vanish?

Pierre Gaillard, deputy commander of the french high mountain gendarmerie platoon
says the last time Esthers phone was active
Was when she called Dan just before 4 pm on November 22nd. There is no data use or GPS trace since then

 

[PeggyHenry]

The sun.co.uk 5th Dec


Well-placed sources confirmed she had been on the peak on November 21 and posted a selfie on Instagram before returning the following day.

The source said: “Esther was on Pico Salvaguardia on November 21.

“She left the peak to sleep in another area further down and returned to the summit the following day with the intention of heading down a little before crossing into French territory.

“She took a photo on November 21 that was published on Instagram and
and another the following day when she made contact with her boyfriend that wasn’t published there.”

Civil Guard spokesmen in the provincial capital Huesca and the national force HQ in Madrid, asked about what other work is being done to unravel the mystery of what has happened to Esther, will only say: “All options are being considered. None have been ruled out.”
A well-placed source said: “The Civil Guard rarely if ever go into detail about what they are doing as part of ongoing investigations.

“We know that Esther was last on Pico Salvaguardia on the afternoon of November 22 and was planning to walk a circular route taking in the border area of Spain and France before returning to Benasque where she’d left her camper van in a car park.


“That version coincides with the testimony of witnesses who have contacted us to say they saw her on her way up to the summit she was on the afternoon of November 22.

 

[Lucy6226]

Press reader.com website:So How could she just Vanish?

Pierre Gaillard, deputy commander of the french high mountain gendarmerie platoon
says the last time Esthers phone was active
Was when she called Dan just before 4 pm on November 22nd. There is no data use or GPS trace since then

I think the general thought from other hikers here is that she turned her phone onto airplane mode to save battery, so she possibly did this after speaking to Dan, hence no data or GPS after it

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I think the general thought from other hikers here is that she turned her phone onto airplane mode to save battery, so she possibly did this after speaking to Dan, hence no data or GPS after it

It was the French police who said she switched it to airplane mode.

 

[BobbleBob]

I did some googling on this but didn't find much after some (admittedly brief) research. I did find something though about 13th century communications via lights from vantage points on the peaks in the Pyrenees (similar to how the Romans communicated along Hadrians Wall). Not a telecomms expert but it did make me wonder if the transmitters on the various peaks now are set up to talk to each other like that. If so might it open up the possibility of triangulation and the confirmation to LE of ED's exact whereabouts when she sent the last pictures?

Thanks for the info Grouse!

The individual transmitters may talk to each other to piggyback to a bigger station further down the mountain and back into the main teleco network. That wouldn’t help triangulate were ED physically was on the last ping though, unless the other mast could pick up her phone’s signal. But that’s all discussed further up this thread, or the first one.

 

[RickshawFan]

Press reader.com website:So How could she just Vanish?

Snipped for focus...
Ummmm..... Missing hiker = the hiker vanished. It's a common occurrence in the backcountry.

 

[otto]

Snipped for focus...
Ummmm..... Missing hiker = the hiker vanished. It's a common occurrence in the backcountry.

When Michel Trudeau was swept into a very deep Rocky Mountain lake, there were witnesses. If he had been alone, he and all trace of him would have vanished in seconds and no one would know where he is. That's how quick and easy it is to vanish in the mountains.

 

[RickshawFan]

My understanding is that it's at least 3 1/2 hours up + the Pic. With a daypack. Down from the Port to the Hospice goes via Port de la Picade; this doesn't go in the direction of the Refuge at all. It's 4 hours down by that route. I posted the relevant photos upthread.

I meant to say if you descend on a different trail from the Port de Venasque than one that goes through the bowl where the Refuge is. That seems to be the only way to create a loop that includes the Hospice, the Refuge, and the Port de Venasque. The trail is clear and well-trodden as you are walking. It's not visible in the aerial photos or trail maps we are using simple because all the focus has been on the Refuge.... as you descend from the Pic and are in the Port, the trail to the refuge goes right with switchbacks downhill and the trail to the Port de Picade goes left and traverses the flank on the other side until you reach a couple of Ports further along. AFAIK

 

[otto]

I meant to say if you descend on a different trail from the Port de Venasque than one that goes through the bowl where the Refuge is. That seems to be the only way to create a loop that includes the Hospice, the Refuge, and the Port de Venasque. The trail is clear and well-trodden as you are walking. It's not visible in the aerial photos or trail maps we are using simple because all the focus has been on the Refuge.... as you zdescend from the Pic and are in the Port, the trail to the refuge goes right with switchbacks downhill and the trail to the Port de Picade goes left and traverses the flank on the other side until you reach a couple of Ports further along. AFAIK

The trails - where did she go after speaking with the olympian?

She was one hour from the Pic de Sauvegarde (summit) and 30 minutes from the Port de Venasque trail head.

 

[otto]

Map link.

OpenTopoMap - Topographische Karten aus OpenStreetMap

 

[otto]

There has been speculation in the discussion that she bypassed the summit, yet posted a 4 PM Nov 22 photo, bypassed the Refuge de Venasque and vanished.

I think that's unlikely.

I think she was at the summit Safeguard at 4PM on Nov 22. That's the last contact. According to her partner, she was hiking to the Refuge de Venasque from the Pic de Sauvegarde.

 

[Hatty]

Press reader.com website:So How could she just Vanish?

Pierre Gaillard, deputy commander of the french high mountain gendarmerie platoon
says the last time Esthers phone was active
Was when she called Dan just before 4 pm on November 22nd. There is no data use or GPS trace since then

So if she actually called and spoke to DC, it seems likely IMO that she would have confirmed her plans to him, which is why it seems DC is satisfied that the areas searched by SAR were done correctly and extensively. DC seems to favour the view she is not on the mountain - and yes, this could be because he is clinging to the hope she is still alive. Maybe she told him something like “So, I’m off to the Refuge now ....but if it gets really cold, I might just head back to the van!” We know she chose this option with the guy who gave her a lift on the 21st - she favoured, yoga, warmth etc.

If she did descend and start heading back to the van on the road, might she have stopped for a call of nature and tripped and fallen somewhere not far off the road and injured herself badly? I don’t know what the terrain is like around there. Alternatively we come back to the possibility of hitching a ride with the wrong person....

One would suppose that for safety reasons they would have agreed that she should tell DC what her plans were so that in the event of her disappearance, he would be able to direct SAR. She seems to have been in contact most days and I know DC did not expect contact early on 22nd due to the lack of signal but after that how long would she have been out of range...? I guess DC assumed her phone battery had died which is why he did not call SAR before 25th.

 

[PeggyHenry]

So if she actually called and spoke to DC, it seems likely IMO that she would have confirmed her plans to him, which is why it seems DC is satisfied that the areas searched by SAR were done correctly and extensively. DC seems to favour the view she is not on the mountain - and yes, this could be because he is clinging to the hope she is still alive. Maybe she told him something like “So, I’m off to the Refuge now ....but if it gets really cold, I might just head back to the van!” We know she chose this option with the guy who gave her a lift on the 21st - she favoured, yoga, warmth etc.

If she did descend and start heading back to the van on the road, might she have stopped for a call of nature and tripped and fallen somewhere not far off the road and injured herself badly? I don’t know what the terrain is like around there. Alternatively we come back to the possibility of hitching a ride with the wrong person....

One would suppose that for safety reasons they would have agreed that she should tell DC what her plans were so that in the event of her disappearance, he would be able to direct SAR. She seems to have been in contact most days and I know DC did not expect contact early on 22nd due to the lack of signal but after that how long would she have been out of range...? I guess DC assumed her phone battery had died which is why he did not call SAR before 25th.

She favoured yoga, warmth etc...

I think that’s quite important to note.. even though we hear a lot about how Esther likes to push herself ... she also likes her home comforts.. which might easily influence decision making. Do we know on what night she was last in her van as opposed to sleeping out?