That One Key Piece of Guilty Evidence

[MyBelle]

Ugh...unfortunately this just connected some dots for me. I have been contemplating that JRH was actually intending to drive all the way to the movie theater and either "discover" Cooper when parking or actually go in to the movie and do a big dramatic exit when LH called from the daycare. But I couldn't figure out why he stopped at the shopping center if this was the case. I thought maybe the smell had gotten too strong. But now I can picture it: he's driving, knows Cooper is in the back seat presumably deceased. Suddenly he hears a sound. His heart stops for a second and adrenaline rushes in. He thinks Cooper is still alive somehow and choking on something, so in his fear he actually has a normal response which is to seek help immediately, so he pulls in to the shopping center, jumping out yelling for help because his son is choking, pulls him out of the seat and realizes C is definitely deceased. Panics again because the scenario he planned has changed. Tries to reach LH on her cell and then by calling the daycare center. Gets mad because this isn't what he had planned and mad because that sound scared him so bad.

Explains some of the anger behaviors at the scene. It's so upsetting to picture this. Poor Cooper.

Actually, you SEE a person choking, you do not hear them. A person choking doesn't make much of any sound because their airway is blocked. One of the first things you are taught in learning the Heimlich is to ask the person in distress if they can speak.

I think Harris used the choking excuse to explain why he stopped and got help. I think it was Harris' own gag reflex and choking reaction to the horrific smell that made him stop. Cooper was in that enclosed, hot car right after eating and he may have vomited.

How to perform the Heimlich maneuver:

First ask, "Are you choking? Can you speak?" DO NOT perform first aid if the person is coughing forcefully and able to speak -- a strong cough can dislodge the object.




http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000049.htm

 

[EvilSoup]

No, it wasn't you. It was people with medical experience.

Well then I don't feel so doofy for thinking it was a possibility! I love it when I have the same thought as a smart person! ��

ETA: weird, my emoji smileys don't seem to be showing up although I know I have seen other folks use them in posts......

 

[CHERIE.T]

Actually, you SEE a person choking, you do not hear them. A person choking doesn't make much of any sound because their airway is blocked. One of the first things you are taught in learning the Heimlich is to ask the person in distress if they can speak.

I think Harris used the choking excuse to explain why he stopped and got help. I think it was Harris' own gag reflex and choking reaction to the horrific smell that made him stop. Cooper was in that enclosed, hot car right after eating and he may have vomited.

How to perform the Heimlich maneuver:

First ask, "Are you choking? Can you speak?" DO NOT perform first aid if the person is coughing forcefully and able to speak -- a strong cough can dislodge the object.




http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000049.htm

Maybe jh had to say Cooper was choking because his child was blue.

 

[MyBelle]

Maybe jh had to say Cooper was choking because his child was blue.

I really think he stopped because he couldn't take the smell anymore. He immediately removed the child from the car and got away from him.

JMO

 

[Nali87]

The jostling thing was me, sorry. ��

I have zero medical experience, I was just thinking aloud (well, typing). It seemed plausible to me, but I didn't mean for anyone to think I knew what I was talking about. Sorry to have caused confusion.

No need for you to apologize. Please continue to share your thoughts and thinking out loud. If it's not a plausible scenario, someone will (hopefully nicely) correct and you we all would have learned something new.

 

[tlcya]

Re: RH's statement he heard Cooper choking: is it possible rigor had set in to the point that air was escaping and noises were made? Those who work in morgues tell stories of bodies passing gas and groaning as muscles change and stiffen.

Granted, I don't believe a word RH says. This was an intentional killing of that poor child.

Those groans tend to occur well after rigor has left the body and bloat has begun. The bloat and the accumulated gases cause that effect as the gases attempt to find a way to leave the bloating body.

Cooper had been dead long enough for rigor to have set in (that starts 3-5 hours after death)

The bloat phase of decomposition occurs 3 to 5 days post death (depending on circumstances in which the remains are kept. Temperature, moisture, buried or not all seem to play a factor in how quickly bloat phase happens).

 

[MyBelle]

Those groans tend to occur well after rigor has left the body and bloat has begun. The bloat and the accumulated gases cause that effect as the gases attempt to find a way to leave the bloating body.

Cooper had been dead long enough for rigor to have set in (that starts 3-5 hours after death)

The bloat phase of decomposition occurs 3 to 5 days post death (depending on circumstances in which the remains are kept. Temperature, moisture, buried or not all seem to play a factor in how quickly bloat phase happens).

Good points. I'm not sure where some posters have gotten the idea that Cooper's body would not emit any odor of decomposition because he was seated. His mouth and nose were not covered. Gases do escape.



JMO

 

[gngr~snap]

Thank you so much for posting those local images, gngr~snap. It's so helpful to see the actual locations. Are you, or anyone else, able to make some marks over the pics to identify Home Depot Treehouse or the LAA? Are they in the tall buildings in the distance of the Publix pic? And the highway picture-- are they the buildings to the right?

I'm guessing the first one with the reddish C sign is the fast food chicken restaurant-- I've never seen one of those Chick Fil A's as a free standing restaurant, only once or twice in a mall food court, lol! (I've never eaten in one. Not sure if we have them this far north, lol!) I'm kind of surprised a fried chicken restaurant serves breakfast, but then, I guess all the fast food places are going that route to get more customers.

Anyway, thanks for any landmarks anyone can identify!

I will mame one with the Tree house and the Home Depot Store as well.

All posts are MOO

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

I will mame one with the Tree house and the Home Depot Store as well.

All posts are MOO

The Home Depot store is across from Publix

 

[tlcya]

You are right the store is across from Publix. But the circled building next to daycare is Home Depot Corporate offices. Although not the satellite office that RH worked at which is called the Treehouse.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Actually, you SEE a person choking, you do not hear them. A person choking doesn't make much of any sound because their airway is blocked. One of the first things you are taught in learning the Heimlich is to ask the person in distress if they can speak.

I think Harris used the choking excuse to explain why he stopped and got help. I think it was Harris' own gag reflex and choking reaction to the horrific smell that made him stop. Cooper was in that enclosed, hot car right after eating and he may have vomited.

How to perform the Heimlich maneuver:

First ask, "Are you choking? Can you speak?" DO NOT perform first aid if the person is coughing forcefully and able to speak -- a strong cough can dislodge the object.




http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000049.htm

A person who is coughing due to something obstructing their airway IS choking *and* making a sound. Choking means difficulty breathing due to an airway obstruction. That's what I meant, sort of a coughing or gasping sound.

 

[gngr~snap]

Ok here is another one.
It includes all 3 Home Depots , corporate the store and the Treehouse.

All posts are MOO

 

[gngr~snap]

This is RH office, the movie theater
and the crime scene.

All posts are MOO

 

[Lovejac]

Ok here is another one.

All posts are MOO

Oh wow, that really puts things into perspective. Thanks for posting this.

I especially LOVE the way you decorated the day care. That was such a happy place for Cooper :blowkiss:

 

[CHERIE.T]

I really think he stopped because he couldn't take the smell anymore. He immediately removed the child from the car and got away from him.

JMO

MY above post was a 'could be' scenario .
In all honesty your above comment is what I think happened.

The smell LE described had to be over whelming.

 

[gngr~snap]

Here is another one.
If RH was going to meet friends at the movie why was he even on Akers Mill Rd?

RH took the yellow route.
Why would he not take the pink or blue route?

I don't know where he was going, but it wasn't to the theater.

All posts are MOO

 

[gngr~snap]

IMO he was headed home or "somewhere".

All posts are MOO

 

[CHERIE.T]

The map is very helpful.

 

[gngr~snap]

Here is another one. He was headed away from help. Cooper's doctor was almost across the street! - No, it's not a hospital or emergency room, but if you found your child in the car wouldn't you haul it there for help if you didn't want to wait on 911?
I don't think for a second he didn't immediately discover Cooper.

All posts are MOO

 

[CHERIE.T]

Little Cooper's doctor's office was that close?
:thud:

Really appreciate your maps.