The case for murder

[justice be served]

I'm curious. Why would Rebecca go over with her left thigh/hip and not the right side? Was she left handed?

Good point - does anyone know? I believe there would definitely be a favoritism one way or another. With that being said, can't believe she went over the railing in any way shape or form anyway.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

As you can see from the evidence photos the entire area of smudges on the railing totaled approximately 11". The largest is 4" - 5" at most although it looks closer to 3" to me. Not enough of a swiped area to be made by her torso or hip.

I bet her hip/buttock was just about 11", since she was so small. It seems perfect, IMO.

 

[justice be served]

As you can see from the evidence photos the entire area of smudges on the railing totaled approximately 11". The largest is 4" - 5" at most although it looks closer to 3" to me. Not enough of a swiped area to be made by her torso or hip.

If the largest SINGLE area is only 5", then it is impossible that she went over the rail unless she was launched by others. She may have been small, but come on.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

If the largest SINGLE area is only 5", then it is impossible that she went over the rail unless she was launched by others. She may have been small, but come on.

Her skin would have touched the railing just briefly. There's no way to say what exactly touched. Only Rebecca would know that. LE was certain there was no one else on the balcony or in the room. Since no one else was there when she committed suicide, there are many things no one will ever know.

 

[justice be served]

Her skin would have touched the railing just briefly. There's no way to say what exactly touched. Only Rebecca would know that. LE was certain there was no one else on the balcony or in the room. Since no one else was there when she committed suicide, there are many things no one will ever know.

Would that be the same law enforcement that contaminated the scene with an officer's boot print? Now that was a really good start to the investigation and was probably the prelude to realizing they screwed it up so the decision to make it easy and call it a suicide.

I'm having a really hard time picturing how "her skin would have touched the railing briefly" unless she was on a trampoline. The investigative results are simply not rational or defensible. If they were, this massive forum would not exist debating the results.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Would that be the same law enforcement that contaminated the scene with an officer's boot print? Now that was a really good start to the investigation and was probably the prelude to realizing they screwed it up so the decision to make it easy and call it a suicide.

I'm having a really hard time picturing how "her skin would have touched the railing briefly" unless she was on a trampoline. The investigative results are simply not rational or defensible. If they were, this massive forum would not exist debating the results.

If she went over the balcony, it would have happened in a split second. I believe the investigative results or suicide are believed by most people.

A year later there aren't more than a dozen or so people here discussing it. I would not call that massive, IMO.

 

[justice be served]

Does anyone know when the next Dr. Phil show will be aired or the book being written on Rebecca's death by suicide? Networks love good ratings and this case apparently still qualifies as worthy of good ratings. Does anyone know the typical audience viewing numbers for the last show for example? It is very satisfying to know that so many people maintain that justice was NOT served by the obviously flawed investigation.

 

[elfie]

Her skin would have touched the railing just briefly. There's no way to say what exactly touched. Only Rebecca would know that. LE was certain there was no one else on the balcony or in the room. Since no one else was there when she committed suicide, there are many things no one will ever know.

Take a look at the photo of the railing again. I am comfortable with a 3 1/2" disturbance as being the largest of the cleared areas.

Of all of the possible choices for her going over by her own will:

1. Sitting on the railing and maneuvering by pulling her knees to her chest and turning to place her bound feet on the other side of the railing, with her hands tied behind her back = contact with her rear and turning --> a much larger area would have been swiped clean, probably 19" - 20"

2. Going over sideways on her left side, head first = contact with her waist sliding down her hip to her thigh in order to achieve the shift of her center of gravity enough to go over ---> 11" of completely cleared railing.

3. Going over on her torso, head first = contact with her stomach down along to her hips to shift the center of gravity ---> 19" to 20" of completely cleared railing.

There would be no way to briefly touch the railing on her own because all of the possible scenarios involve shifting her weight and sliding in order to accomplish the shift of her center of gravity in order to go over.

The (at the very most) 5" total of complete clearing does not fit with any of these scenarios.

 

[justice be served]

I agree Mrs. Holmes. I don't think most police forces have the resources to spend or don't want to on some cases because they are a big hot mess. As a second factor in this case, the DA may not want to try and prosecute someone because of $$ they would spend on their defense and/or because they would need a lot more investigating to get someone convicted.

Having said all that, I believe it is often private attorneys and investigators who end up putting the necessary pieces together. If the attorneys in Rebecca's case can do that, which I think they can, I have high hopes someone(s) WILL be eventually convicted.

Also, sometimes someone eventually talks or comes forward. I have to wonder if someone were afraid they'd be thrown under the bus if that would happen here whether that is an LE investigator, a coroner or someone related to the perp(s) in some way.

We can be pretty sure there were things in the original LE files that we have never heard of too. It always boggles my mind when I hear about some of the things that were never made public in some criminal trials....

I also feel strongly on your points made here. And, yes, someone may hopefully come forward that knows what happened to Rebecca but I hope that occurs before there is another tragedy. IMO there is a lot of evil that came down and that doesn't usually self-correct.

 

[elfie]

If the largest SINGLE area is only 5", then it is impossible that she went over the rail unless she was launched by others. She may have been small, but come on.

I know! It's not even 5". I compared the railing photo to the pdf from the presentation in Sept. 2011 and the approximately 11" total is only slightly over 10" by the tape measure, probably by 1/4".

 

[justice be served]

Take a look at the photo of the railing again. I am comfortable with a 3 1/2" disturbance as being the largest of the cleared areas.

Of all of the possible choices for her going over by her own will:

1. Sitting on the railing and maneuvering by pulling her knees to her chest and turning to place her bound feet on the other side of the railing, with her hands tied behind her back = contact with her rear and turning --> a much larger area would have been swiped clean, probably 19" - 20"

2. Going over sideways on her left side, head first = contact with her waist sliding down her hip to her thigh in order to achieve the shift of her center of gravity enough to go over ---> 11" of completely cleared railing.

3. Going over on her torso, head first = contact with her stomach down along to her hips to shift the center of gravity ---> 19" to 20" of completely cleared railing.

There would be no way to briefly touch the railing on her own because all of the possible scenarios involve shifting her weight and sliding in order to accomplish the shift of her center of gravity in order to go over.

The (at the very most) 5" total of complete clearing does not fit with any of these scenarios.

Elfie, great analysis of all potential scenarios for dust disturbances of the railing. Well done! Your key point is that a shifting, sliding motion is the only possible method which negates all small dust disturbance dimensions.

 

[justice be served]

You guys, my hip sideways would clear a little less than 4 and 1/2"

So is mine but i would have to be elevated on a chair, lean at the same level as the rail sideways on my hip and then pivot over. And there was only a toe print. And no chair.

 

[Jessica2012]

So is mine but i would have to be elevated on a chair, lean at the same level as the rail sideways on my hip and then pivot over. And there was only a toe print. And no chair.

Justice, how tall was the railing?

 

[justice be served]

Today's guardrail code height is 42" and a handrail 36". I do not recall how high this one was.

 

[freespeech]

I also feel strongly on your points made here. And, yes, someone may hopefully come forward that knows what happened to Rebecca but I hope that occurs before there is another tragedy. IMO there is a lot of evil that came down and that doesn't usually self-correct.

Here is the latest on Gore's public statements at the Coronado Roundtable meeting. The comments are interesting as usual. He comments on the Zahau case. I am not sure if this has been posted here yet.

It's amazing how many people believe she was murdered, cross country and world wide. I think this case will go down in history as another Gore mess-up. He doesn't seem able to feel shame and embarrassment for his role in this.

http://coronado.patch.com/articles/...rthers-news-media-and-spreckels-case#comments

 

[justice be served]

Here is the latest on Gore's public statements at the Coronado Roundtable meeting. The comments are interesting as usual. He comments on the Zahau case. I am not sure if this has been posted here yet.

It's amazing how many people believe she was murdered, cross country and world wide. I think this case will go down in history as another Gore mess-up. He doesn't seem able to feel shame and embarrassment for his role in this.

http://coronado.patch.com/articles/...rthers-news-media-and-spreckels-case#comments

What a piece of work Gore is. And CHANNEL 8 is stating he lied quoting their spokesperson. Narcissism seems to be the prevalant mental state of many of the defenders of the suicide fantasy.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Does anyone know when the next Dr. Phil show will be aired or the book being written on Rebecca's death by suicide? Networks love good ratings and this case apparently still qualifies as worthy of good ratings. Does anyone know the typical audience viewing numbers for the last show for example? It is very satisfying to know that so many people maintain that justice was NOT served by the obviously flawed investigation.

The subject of the last Dr. Phil show was Max and what really may have happened to him, not the suicide of Rebecca Zahau.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Take a look at the photo of the railing again. I am comfortable with a 3 1/2" disturbance as being the largest of the cleared areas.

Of all of the possible choices for her going over by her own will:

1. Sitting on the railing and maneuvering by pulling her knees to her chest and turning to place her bound feet on the other side of the railing, with her hands tied behind her back = contact with her rear and turning --> a much larger area would have been swiped clean, probably 19" - 20"

2. Going over sideways on her left side, head first = contact with her waist sliding down her hip to her thigh in order to achieve the shift of her center of gravity enough to go over ---> 11" of completely cleared railing.

3. Going over on her torso, head first = contact with her stomach down along to her hips to shift the center of gravity ---> 19" to 20" of completely cleared railing.

There would be no way to briefly touch the railing on her own because all of the possible scenarios involve shifting her weight and sliding in order to accomplish the shift of her center of gravity in order to go over.

The (at the very most) 5" total of complete clearing does not fit with any of these scenarios.

There are so many more ways she could have gone over. If her hip/buttock touched and she fell backward, that is all that would have touched the railing, and IMO, would have been about 11". The SDSO also thought that area was from her hip/thigh.

Your scenerios have Rebecca touching the railing with almost every spot on her body. IMO, that would not have happened. Once her hip was up on that railing, she went over backwards immediately, IMO.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

I believe the railing was only 36" high. Very easy for someone of Rebecca's athleticism to just give a little hop, to do a "sit" on the rail, and over she'd go. IMO, that's how she did it.

 

[elfie]

There are so many more ways she could have gone over. If her hip/buttock touched and she fell backward, that is all that would have touched the railing, and IMO, would have been about 11". The SDSO also thought that area was from her hip/thigh.

Your scenerios have Rebecca touching the railing with almost every spot on her body. IMO, that would not have happened. Once her hip was up on that railing, she went over backwards immediately, IMO.

If you consider her rear, stomach, hips and thighs "every spot on her body" then there are other difficulties we need to address.

The scenarios I outlined are the possibilities for a person of her height, tied in the manner that she was bound. There are no toe or foot prints facing back towards the room, so that eliminates scenario #1.

She could not have gone over the railing backwards on her own. Her right foot toe prints were facing towards the rail on a slight diagonal to the right. There is a 1" disturbance on the rail closest to her toe print.

She could not have hopped to sit on the rail with her right foot toe prints facing the rail.

Also, she could not have gone over backwards with her right foot toe prints facing the rail, and her arms bound behind her back.

All other scenarios require leverage to overcome her center of gravity which would have been below the top of the railing.

There is no clearing on the railing larger than 3 1/2", eliminating the sideways and torso scenarios.

Rebecca could not have gone over the railing of her own free will.