The Case of JonBenet Ramsey-CBS Sept. 18

[asyousay]

It was discussed on the CBS show last night. I believe they said it was a housekeeper in the Ramsey house who once discovered the softball sized mass of feces in JBR's bed. I have heard about feces being smeared on the Christmas candies in her room before this in different articles. IMO

I wonder when he would of got a chance to smear poo over the candy as they would of stunk the room out ?

 

[fullmoon]

I'm just thinking about the pineapple digestion time. I know Burke did it but would he have hit her right then in the kitchen after she ate some or later on in the basement?

I'm wondering if BR left JBR on the floor after she was hit, and just went to bed. He said he heard the commotion after Patsy found the ransom note, but maybe the commotion was from Patsy finding JBR on the floor in the kitchen. That might be why he "stayed in his room." JR probably got it out of him. The Ramseys can't call police right away because they know the time of death is going to be the evening before she was found. So hiding the body - under the guise of a kidnapping - is what they come up with. I'm not totally sold with the conclusion of The Case of JonBenet Ramsey. Unfortunately, we'll never know for sure because of the prosecutor's failure to support the police investigation. I find it incredible that famed criminologist Werner Spitz said the Ramseys would not let him come into the house to help the police investigate. I am also floored by the fact the parents refused to cooperate and answer questions from the police for 120 days - totally contrary to human nature. What parent of a murdered child would not want an aggressive investigation by the authorities? I am also struck by the fact that the parents were allowed to view police reports regarding the incident before they finally agreed to be questioned. Had they not been so wealthy and influential, this case would have been solved quickly.

 

[Petal]

Well that would be interesting. That's not going to help Kolar's book sales!

Why ever not? Doesn't he believe Burke struck the initial blow and Patsy finished her off with the garotte?

 

[Petal]

Humour me if you will. Is it possible that JR was listening in on the call on another extension in the house with his hand over the mouthpiece, BR wants to know what's going on, and JR tells him 'we're not speaking to you', meaning we're speaking on the phone - ?

Then why didn't JR just say he was on the extension and why did they say Burke never woke up???

 

[HarmonyE.]

I am dubious that LW is going to be able to sue CBS, especially since BR has willingly come forward to do interviews and this officially makes him a public figure.

If he does sue, this is going to backfire even more than the interviews done on Dr Phil. There is a good possibility BR will have to take the stand and answer for the discrepancies of his statements and the statements made by LW and the Rs the last twenty years (like the claim of being in bed the entire night of JBR's murder, then later admitting he got out of bed to play with a toy).

If Burke sues, there is a 100% chance that he'll be required to testify under oath at a deposition and all questions about that night and his relationship with his sister will be fair game. Lin Wood can stomp his feet all he likes but I'm sure CBS (and certainly James Kolar who no doubt has a defense and indemnification contract with CBS in the event he and they are sued) would love to see this happen. I know I would.

Now we know why John is giving up interviews forever. The gig is up, and he knew it was coming.

 

[Chewy]

I thought of an interesting theory this morning. I'd like to see people's opinion on it but I'm not sure what the rules on discussion are in all these different threads so I'll just post it here.


What if the Ramseys know who did it. What if they were blackmailed by someone because they were involved in a highly illegal activity that could ruin them if it were to come out. Someone tries to blackmail them and is an insider. So they ask for money and the Ramsey's say No. Then the "evil guy" tells them that he will harm their kids if they don't pay. This is because said evil guy is also involved in the same activity. For example a pedophile ring. Evil guy can't really go to the police because he's involved so he threatens them.

They don't pay and then they wake up to find JBR missing. They search the house and find her in the basement and they know exactly who did it but they can't go to the police. So they write the ransom note to throw off the police and send them in a different direction.

IMO this would explain the fake ransom note and the fake demeanor of Patsy Ramsey's television interview where she's saying that the guy will get caught. She knows she's full of baloney because the very fact that they didn't go to the police shows the evil guy that she's not talking about him.

What do you think of this?

 

[johnjay]

Why ever not? Doesn't he believe Burke struck the initial blow and Patsy finished her off with the garotte?

That's not the impression I got - I hope someone corrects me if I'm wrong about this. But what I got from Kolar's book and interviews with Tricia is that he implied (sometimes stronger than that):

Burke hit JBR in the head in the kitchen.

Carried her downstairs, either by holding her under her arms or somehow using the blanket.

Killed her on the carpet near the WC door - and not immediately. There was a lot of fluid evidence there, as I recall. And the train tracks were down there too.

That's how I remember his book and interviews. I'll listen to the interviews again.

I don't believe there is any reason to think Patsy or John finds JBR dead or unconscious on the kitchen floor and thinks - garrote. Or that they jabbed her with train tracks. Very gently tying her wrists seems like the kind of thing the would do - wash her and change her cloths seems like the kind of thing they would do. Wrap her in a blanket seems like the kind of thing they would do. Garrote her? I don't think so.

How could Patsy or John know her head injury was fatal? They couldn't. It wasn't discovered by police and medical personal that she was hit on the head until they cut into her. If they just found her on the kitchen floor unconscious or dead they would call 911 - and everyone would believe it was a tragic accident. Even CBS had her provoking the whole thing by saying she reached into Burkes bowl to grab a piece of his pineapple. Shame on them!

 

[Petal]

If PR and JR really believed there was this sadistic, creepy, child killer kidnapper that snuck in there home wouldn't they be afraid to stay in the home and he would possibly come back to kill them and their son? I would be very afraid to be in my house alone after my daughter was murdered by a stranger especially at night. Did they install any sophisticated alarm system new break proof windows in the basement being a murderer still at large out there who wanted $118,000? I'm not buying it they knew who the killer was that's why they continued living in their home and not talking too police.

Pretty sure they moved out immediately.

 

[madeleine]

Assuming they are 100 procent right and BR is responsable for the blow only that leaves us with one of the parents being guilty of murder cause the AR lists both head wound and strangulation as COD.the problem is..you can't tell which of the two put the cord around her neck..back to zero re charges

 

[Nick No Nora]

The pineapple wasn't found in her stomach but in her duodenum. There's a very long discussion of this in the threads. If your familiar with Monty Python, the discussion goes along the line of "the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow." The questions are of how fast pineapple passes through the stomach into the duodenum. From there you ask how much time it remains in the duodenum before it passes to the lower intestine and becomes so digested that it can't be identified.

There was also nothing actually found in the stomach. That can happen if the stomach has processed all the food and moved it to the duodenum. It can also happen if the contents of the stomach are expelled. In this case, JB could have gone into convulsions and simply threw up anything in the stomach leaving only the contents that have passed through the pyloric sphincter to remain in the duodenum.

Pineapple is full of sugars and natural fibers. It's moved into the duodenum faster than many other foods.

This is why JB taking a piece of pineapple from the table and running isn't the most well thought-out theory. There just wasn't the time in that scenario to get the pineapple into the duodenum. There had to be some time for the stomach to do its job.

Agree. I think they got they got the big questions right. But I thought this was one of the obvious holes in the details of their theory.

 

[bxbbysoxer]

I might make a longer post a while later on a couple things that bothered me about the CBS timeline, but can anyone find any info on how long it takes for food to move specifically to the small intestine? Most I've seen says it takes 6-8 hours for food to move out of the small intestine, and I acknowledge that JBR wasn't actually deceased after the blow to the head, but even then - it doesn't feel right to me that this was just a spontaneous thing, a one off accident that amounted to a child getting angry, taking into account the possibility of prior sexual abuse and the overall weirdness of the 911 call from the party a few days before.

While I'm strongly for BDI, I don't believe that this was something which happened just by chance. I really don't believe that John and Patsy would go to this extent to cover up something that was just an accident if there wasn't something deeper going on. I think there was something else they felt they needed to hide beyond three seconds of anger from a nine year old kid. This was something that built up over time and that they finally became fully aware of with JonBenet's death. JMO.

 

[Hatfield]

I wonder when he would of got a chance to smear poo over the candy as they would of stunk the room out ?

I totally believe BR smeared poo over things of JBR and especially the candies. Did you see the way BR was fooling with those candies in the interiew room with the female phych doctor?

He was touching a lot of the candies and I could see where he would have done something like that.

 

[Hatfield]

After watching the part 2 of CBS special last night I am much more convinced BR was the one who killed JBR in a jealous hit of her with something.

Im not convinced it was the flashlight and could have been a hammer they never found.

The way BR laughed and giggled at inappropriate times was eye opening. Similar to what he does today with DP still. I really think BR has a mental issue.

The bottom line though is I think he was much more jealous of JBR than most people realize. I think his jealousy was extreme. I dont think he realized his actions would actually kill her but I do think he wanted to hurt her as he hit her in the head.

 

[Mysteeri]

You can view it here: (can't use your to view video- must disable first)

The Case of JonBenet Ramsey-CBS

Part 1

http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-case-o...83AF1D780/the-case-of-jonbenet-ramsey-part-1/

Part 2

http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-case-o...ouD2558io/the-case-of-jonbenet-ramsey-part-2/

Thanks, but I'm not able to watch it through their website, the app is not available in my country. :/

 

[Isabelle]

It was discussed on the CBS show last night. I believe they said it was a housekeeper in the Ramsey house who once discovered the softball sized mass of feces in JBR's bed. I have heard about feces being smeared on the Christmas candies in her room before this in different articles. IMO

If one of my children did that, there would be hell to pay!!!

 

[Isabelle]

Wow attorney Lin Wood is not happy on twitter he is intending to sue cbs on behalf "of this fine young man". Has he acted out on twitter before like this? Will he really sue or is he attempting damage control for BR and JR?

If LW does sue on BR's behalf, there will be something in it for him too!!!

 

[Karinna]

Okay, Just finished watching Part2 of the CBS show. IMO it was a case of extreme sibling rivalry, hitting JBR previously with a golf club, further acting out with the feces, which could of been a psychological return to infancy,and just being generally nasty about the chocolates etc. in craving attention away from his sister. And the night of JBR's death BR got mad when he was having a snack and JBR took some pineapple from the bowl. He went after her and whacked her over the head with the torch. She would of went down with a serious head trauma and died. BR then got a train track and tried to rouse her into waking up after that. There was no sexual assault either. Then enter PR & JR and then the cover up to make it look like a monster broke into their house and did that to JBR.
I think PR & JR loved their children very much and the cover up was to protect their remaining child from the consequences of his actions, realising he didn't mean to kill his sister. All IMO.

 

[asyousay]

I totally believe BR smeared poo over things of JBR and especially the candies. Did you see the way BR was fooling with those candies in the interiew room with the female phych doctor?

He was touching a lot of the candies and I could see where he would have done something like that.

I am uk based so somebody put part 1 up last night and I am hoping part 2 will go later. I will keep a eye on the scene you mention

 

[Isabelle]

I'm just thinking about the pineapple digestion time. I know Burke did it but would he have hit her right then in the kitchen after she ate some or later on in the basement?

Im thinking JBR snatched a piece of the pineapple from BR's bowl and went about her business. BR stewed over it for a while until he blew up, then took action. Something is really not right with him.

 

[HarmonyE.]

After watching the part 2 of CBS special last night I am much more convinced BR was the one who killed JBR in a jealous hit of her with something.

Im not convinced it was the flashlight and could have been a hammer they never found.

The way BR laughed and giggled at inappropriate times was eye opening. Similar to what he does today with DP still. I really think BR has a mental issue.

The bottom line though is I think he was much more jealous of JBR than most people realize. I think his jealousy was extreme. I dont think he realized his actions would actually kill her but I do think he wanted to hurt her as he hit her in the head.

Sibling rivalry among kids is a powerful thing. Burke almost lost his mother a few years earlier, and as soon as she recovered he pretty much was pushed aside by Patsy's almost obsessive behavior over JonBenet and the pageants. All indications are that John was focused very much on work and not around the kids much. A "normal" kid would probably suffer from some pretty strong jealousy. Burke was by all accounts an introvert who kept to himself, so he also may not have had as many distractions - friends, sports, etc. - as other boys his age. And it would seem he had some mental health issues as well. Not that we'll ever know the extent of them as his medical records were sealed.