The Ring/Jewelry

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

New Posts

I've tried digging through this thread for links but this laptop is crazy and I may have missed it- was the first time the ring was mentioned was on the FB page? And that was someone saying it was reported on the local news?

Has LE ever mentioned the ring at all except to say that the GF supposedly picked it up? Has LE ever been interviewed/on video talking about it? I mean, I'm assuming they were the ones who said it was worth 20,000 and that's where the reporters got that from, but being that LE has been REALLY closed mouthed about the whole ring issue, I kind of wonder. If they has said 2,000 and the reporter got it wrong, I wonder if they would have bothered to correct them?
 
TXangel said:
I've tried digging through this thread for links but this laptop is crazy and I may have missed it- was the first time the ring was mentioned was on the FB page? And that was someone saying it was reported on the local news?

Has LE ever mentioned the ring at all except to say that the GF supposedly picked it up? Has LE ever been interviewed/on video talking about it? I mean, I'm assuming they were the ones who said it was worth 20,000 and that's where the reporters got that from, but being that LE has been REALLY closed mouthed about the whole ring issue, I kind of wonder. If they has said 2,000 and the reporter got it wrong, I wonder if they would have bothered to correct them?
Click to expand...

The first time I saw the ring mentioned was grampa saying Eliz wanted him to pick it up along with the $300. I want to say it was Jan 14, but check me on that in the case calendar. It's a Saturday phone call between Eliz and grampa around that date if it's not the 14th. Not sure which FB you're referring to?

LE has never mentioned the ring directly. We have the reporter saying LE gave it back to grampa. It's not clear if LE told the reporter that directly, or if Logan told the reporter that LE said that.

We have a direct quote from Logan saying Tempe PD appraised it at $20 - $30k. It's in a video and I transcribed it and posted it in this thread. If you advanced search for keyword appraised and my name as user name it should pop up.

I found two comments on NG blog from someone asking about the ring, comments dated Feb 11 and Feb 12 - a few days before the recent spate of news articles.

http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/201...ill-is-baby-gabriel-buried-in-trash/#comments
 
Thanks, BeanE. That's what I was trying to check- if LE had ever directly mentioned the ring publicly (where we could see it, anyway) and if there was any official appraisal on record. I'm not saying Logan made it up- I'm sure he didn't- but it's still not on record anywhere officially.

The FB I mentioned was a FaceBook post. I'm sorry- I'm still getting used to all these initials. I sometimes have to stop for a second to remember who everyone is talking about, lol. That's why you'll notice a lot of the time unless we're told not to use the peron's actual name, I will.
 
TXangel said:
Thanks, BeanE. That's what I was trying to check- if LE had ever directly mentioned the ring publicly (where we could see it, anyway) and if there was any official appraisal on record. I'm not saying Logan made it up- I'm sure he didn't- but it's still not on record anywhere officially.

The FB I mentioned was a FaceBook post. I'm sorry- I'm still getting used to all these initials. I sometimes have to stop for a second to remember who everyone is talking about, lol. That's why you'll notice a lot of the time unless we're told not to use the peron's actual name, I will.
Click to expand...

Oh no. I don't think Logan made it up either. I really would like to know more about that appraisal, if it was a full appraisal from a jeweler, and also at what point was the appraisal done.

And of course my number one question, did Tempe indeed rule it out as evidence and give it back to grampa? That's my $20-30k question ;-)
 
Boo Scout said:
I agree that jewelry of that value would most likely be insured or appraised. Can anyone tell me how LE might reach out to insurance companies or jewelers with this information? It seems like it would be a huge undertaking, since they do not know an area to concentrate on. Is it possible a ring like that would have some unique identifying markers? I'm not that familiar with $20,000 jewelry pieces!
Click to expand...

I work for a very large insurance company that writes personal articles policies. If the personal that owned the ring filed a claim for the ring, as if it were lost or stolen, then that information could be more easily accessed.

However, it would make more sense, and be harder to trace, if the ring was not insured at the time, or of course, never insured. However, greed being what it is, it would not be unthinkable that the owner might have filed a claim for it.

If there is a posted picture of the ring, an insurance person, like myself, might recognize it. I once recognized a ring on a woman in an elevator and I honestly did not remember her face, but I told her the whole story of her ring and she could not believe it. (It was a very large emerald). I would say that most policies I've written, if the piece was unusual or very expensive, I would definitely remember it.

It sounds very logical to receive a ring instead of payment, but ... you cannot get $20k at a pawn shop for a $20k ring. No way.
 
febedallas said:
I work for a very large insurance company that writes personal articles policies. If the personal that owned the ring filed a claim for the ring, as if it were lost or stolen, then that information could be more easily accessed.

However, it would make more sense, and be harder to trace, if the ring was not insured at the time, or of course, never insured. However, greed being what it is, it would not be unthinkable that the owner might have filed a claim for it.

If there is a posted picture of the ring, an insurance person, like myself, might recognize it. I once recognized a ring on a woman in an elevator and I honestly did not remember her face, but I told her the whole story of her ring and she could not believe it. (It was a very large emerald). I would say that most policies I've written, if the piece was unusual or very expensive, I would definitely remember it.

It sounds very logical to receive a ring instead of payment, but ... you cannot get $20k at a pawn shop for a $20k ring. No way.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this information. Would there be any efficient way for LE to circulate the ring information among big insurance companies, or would it be a needle in a haystack?

Also, generally, if EJ were given a ring and either witnessed or had a documented appraisal placing it's worth at $20K, would she be savvy enough to know that she couldn't sell it for that?

Even if she knew that she couldn't get $20K for the ring, to me, $7500 would represent a lot of money to a girl with no job whose on the run. It would probably be enough for her to get by while she figured her next move out.
 
“The information is coming in much slower, and the indicators that were once there are getting less and less to the point of becoming nonexistent,” Tempe police Sgt. Steve Carbajal told the Associated Press. “At this point, we're looking seriously into the possibility that (Elizabeth Johnson) killed Gabriel like she said she did.”

The comment above doesn't sound like Tempe LE has 20-30k ring in their possession that supports a form of payment for Gabriel. In fact all of Sgt.Carbajal's comments the last week of January before S.A. LE took over have the same tone...not good. Is it possible that they really didn't know about the value of ring at this time or could it be that the ring was dismissed as evidence by then? When EJ asked her grandfather to pick the "expensive" ring up could that be the first time LE considered the ring may have value to it and ordered an appraisal at that point? That doesn't make sense. Even here at WS as soon as we heard ring, we thought form of payment. A statement from LE confirming the existence, value and location of this ring would be great...
 
TXHOPE said:
“The information is coming in much slower, and the indicators that were once there are getting less and less to the point of becoming nonexistent,” Tempe police Sgt. Steve Carbajal told the Associated Press. “At this point, we're looking seriously into the possibility that (Elizabeth Johnson) killed Gabriel like she said she did.”

The comment above doesn't sound like Tempe LE has 20-30k ring in their possession that supports a form of payment for Gabriel. In fact all of Sgt.Carbajal's comments the last week of January before S.A. LE took over have the same tone...not good. Is it possible that they really didn't know about the value of ring at this time or could it be that the ring was dismissed as evidence by then? When EJ asked her grandfather to pick the "expensive" ring up could that be the first time LE considered the ring may have value to it and ordered an appraisal at that point? That doesn't make sense. Even here at WS as soon as we heard ring, we thought form of payment. A statement from LE confirming the existence, value and location of this ring would be great...
Click to expand...

Oh wow, Txhope. You gave me an idea. What if we added some of the significant LE quotes from the LE Statements thread to the case calendar to see how things line up? Could point up some interesting things. :)
 
BeanE said:
Oh wow, Txhope. You gave me an idea. What if we added some of the significant LE quotes from the LE Statements thread to the case calendar to see how things line up? Could point up some interesting things. :)
Click to expand...

Great idea!!!
Sort of O/T, I'm still very interested in the information that LE asked EJ's GM about when he last washed the car and if he waxed it. There isn't much information on that, so I hesitate to start a new thread, but I'd like to see people's takes on that. Anyone think it's thread worthy?
 
NewMommy09 said:
Great idea!!!
Sort of O/T, I'm still very interested in the information that LE asked EJ's GM about when he last washed the car and if he waxed it. There isn't much information on that, so I hesitate to start a new thread, but I'd like to see people's takes on that. Anyone think it's thread worthy?
Click to expand...

You could go ahead and make a thread for it if you'd like. We don't have much info, but we might be able to find other cases that would give us some ideas on what they could be looking for. I'm very curious about it too.
 
TXHOPE said:
“The information is coming in much slower, and the indicators that were once there are getting less and less to the point of becoming nonexistent,” Tempe police Sgt. Steve Carbajal told the Associated Press. “At this point, we're looking seriously into the possibility that (Elizabeth Johnson) killed Gabriel like she said she did.”

The comment above doesn't sound like Tempe LE has 20-30k ring in their possession that supports a form of payment for Gabriel. In fact all of Sgt.Carbajal's comments the last week of January before S.A. LE took over have the same tone...not good. Is it possible that they really didn't know about the value of ring at this time or could it be that the ring was dismissed as evidence by then? When EJ asked her grandfather to pick the "expensive" ring up could that be the first time LE considered the ring may have value to it and ordered an appraisal at that point? That doesn't make sense. Even here at WS as soon as we heard ring, we thought form of payment. A statement from LE confirming the existence, value and location of this ring would be great...
Click to expand...

Your first line about the ring was kind of what I was thinking. It made me think that either they a) reporters misunderstood the value in the first place b) LE has it and is trying to downplay the angle for reasons of their own c) they have it/had it and didn't think it was a likely form of payment or d) they don't have it at all. But in all of those scenarios, only B really has it as them ever having it and it having been at the value previously stated.

But the things I've heard about Elizabeth's call to her grandfather say that she was FRANTIC for him to pick up her things. I wonder if she was afraid they might find out the value of said ring or even where it came from? But it could just be that some jails are notorious for losing your things. Back in my younger years, I heard stories of friends going to jail for minor things, and a few of them got their things back and found they were missing a shoelace or an earring. So her worry could just be a reaction to that, too- I don't know, it's just something that occured to me.
 
I think IF she was frantic it was because if confirmed, the ring is the biggest piece of evidence to link EJ to selling Gabriel. She wanted the ring picked up before LE noticed the value. Many women that are arrested probably have at least 1 ring on at the time so I guess it's possible it was missed. But if (and that's a big IF), it was missed I think once EJ made the call to Grandpa asking him to pick up the ring the red flags went up to LE. Has it been confirmed that Grandpa did in fact pick up the ring? I know he was going to but could he of went to pick up the ring and the $300 and LE just hand him the envelope without the ring? This would explain why he doesn't know where it is or like I mentioned before, she could of had more than one ring. I looked for pictures of EJ to see if she wore rings in the past and I only found 2 pics of her hands and both times she wasn't wearing any rings.
 
TXangel said:
But the things I've heard about Elizabeth's call to her grandfather say that she was FRANTIC for him to pick up her things.
Click to expand...

TXHOPE said:
I think she was frantic because if confirmed, the ring is the biggest piece of evidence to link EJ to selling Gabriel.
Click to expand...

Hi, Txangel and Txhope. I've never seen anything indicating that Elizabeth was frantic in regards to the rings or other items she wanted her grandfather to pick up.

Could you please provide a link to your info source?

Thanks!
BeanE
 
TXHOPE said:
I think she was frantic because if confirmed, the ring is the biggest piece of evidence to link EJ to selling Gabriel. She wanted the ring picked up before LE noticed the value. Many women that are arrested probably have at least 1 ring on at the time so I guess it's possible it was missed. But if (and that's a big IF), it was missed I think once EJ made the call to Grandpa asking him to pick up the ring the red flags went up to LE. Has it been confirmed that Grandpa did in fact pick up the ring? I know he was going to but could he of went to pick up the ring and the $300 and LE just hand him the envelope without the ring? This would explain why he doesn't know where it is or like I mentioned before, she could of had more than one ring. I looked for pictures of EJ to see if she wore rings in the past and I only found 2 pics of her hands and both times she wasn't wearing any rings.
Click to expand...

IMO if EJ wanted her grandfather to pick up the cash and the ring that badly, there was something more to the ring than it just being a simple piece of jewelry. That leads me to 3 possibilities: it had a lot of sentimental value, or it was monetarily valuable, at least in EJ's eyes, or it could incriminate her somehow (the last 2 certainly can go together).

If it was of sentimental value, I would think EJ would wear it regularly, and then it would stand to reason that people in her life, e.g. Logan, would have seen it too, and I would think would know its origin. From published information on the ring, Logan has said that he had never seen it.

I tend to think the ring probably is valuable, and has the potential to be important evidence.

Unfortunately, since the initial articles regarding the ring came out, we have not received any more information on it, so it's impossible to know who has it now, if its value has been confirmed, and what the source of the appraisal was/is. So now it's a lot of speculation and not much fact :(
 
BeanE said:
Hi, Txangel and Txhope. I've never seen anything indicating that Elizabeth was frantic in regards to the rings or other items she wanted her grandfather to pick up.

Could you please provide a link to your info source?

Thanks!
BeanE
Click to expand...

Actually, looking back I've only been able to find it mentioned here.

Even if she didn't have any sense of urgency, she might hope that she could get things out of LE custody before they found out where they came from and how much they were worth. Really, the whole ring thing sounds strange to me- I guess that's why I'm so hung up on it.
 
Boo Scout said:
IMO if EJ wanted her grandfather to pick up the cash and the ring that badly, there was something more to the ring than it just being a simple piece of jewelry. That leads me to 3 possibilities: it had a lot of sentimental value, or it was monetarily valuable, at least in EJ's eyes, or it could incriminate her somehow (the last 2 certainly can go together).

If it was of sentimental value, I would think EJ would wear it regularly, and then it would stand to reason that people in her life, e.g. Logan, would have seen it too, and I would think would know its origin. From published information on the ring, Logan has said that he had never seen it.

I tend to think the ring probably is valuable, and has the potential to be important evidence.

Unfortunately, since the initial articles regarding the ring came out, we have not received any more information on it, so it's impossible to know who has it now, if its value has been confirmed, and what the source of the appraisal was/is. So now it's a lot of speculation and not much fact :(
Click to expand...

Actually, it might even be all 3 of your possibilities. It may have sentimental value in a different sense than most would think. Maybe sentimental in the sense of her reminder of what she gave up or how bad she hurt Logan???

I think it's really important that Logan never saw the ring. They lived together for two years and knew each other since Jr. High. That ring is new, I'm convinced of it. JMO.
 
Recap of Links Regarding the Ring

TayJay mentions EJ selling jewelry on NG January 13, 2010

SMITH: I asked her that. She told me that when she left she had $2,000. She sold jewelry, her laptop computer, her dogs. She got $400 for rent and she got a check. I asked her if these people even -- I said, well, did the people even give you money to compensate for the trip that you had to make? And she said no.


This visit denial for Gramps and bro is Thurs Jan 14:
http://www.kpho.com/news/22242288/detail.html


Elizabeth Johnson Calls Grandfather
POSTED: 7:53 pm MST January 16, 2010
UPDATED: 10:14 am MST January 17, 2010

The two only spoke for a couple of minutes, talking about items she wanted him to pick up from jail. Johnson asked her grandfather to pick up the $300 she had when she was arrested in Florida, as well as an expensive ring she said she was wearing.

http://www.kpho.com/news/22256806/detail.html


Video with brief clip of Eliz on phone to grampa Sat Jan 16:
http://www.kpho.com/video/22258496/index.html


Monday Jan 18 visit with grandfather
http://www.kpho.com/news/22266828/detail.html

Another video same day, interview with EJ's twin brother:
http://www.kpho.com/video/22241483/index.html



Landfill Search For Baby Gabriel Begins Second Phase But More Evidence Points To Gabriel Alive
POSTED: 11:05 pm MST February 17, 2010
UPDATED: 11:26 pm MST February 17, 2010

McQueary pointed to new evidence that Elizabeth was arrested with a ruby and diamond ring in her pocket worth approximately $20,000. He lived with her for two years, but he had never seen it before.

"Sometimes when they give the baby away for adoption, they hand over a piece of jewelry to the mother or someone who is handing over the baby as a payment instead of money," said McQueary.

http://www.kpho.com/news/22597349/detail.html


More Evidence Points To Gabriel Alive
POSTED: 11:05 pm MST February 17, 2010
UPDATED: 6:59 pm MST February 18, 2010

Article: http://www.kpho.com/news/22597349/detail.html

Video: http://www.kpho.com/video/22606409/index.html


Expensive ring may prove Baby Gabriel is alive and adopted, father says
Posted on February 18, 2010 at 8:44 AM
Updated Thursday, Feb 18 at 12:36 PM

(Includes video where reporter says Tempe PD gave ring back to EJ's grandfather)

Transcribed by me from the KENs5 ring video:

Reporter: Well we've heard that Tempe Arizona investigators have handed the ring in question over to Elizabeth's grandfather, Bob Johnson.

According to Logan McQueary, Bob Johnson says he doesn't know where that ring is.

http://www.kens5.com/news/Baby-Gabr...-prove-son-is-alive-and-adopted-84694897.html


video at 1:35, transcribed by me:
Logan: The Tempe police appraised the ring and it appraised at about 20 to 30 thousand dollars.
http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpp/news/local/tempe/tammi_smith_not_guilty_021810
 
Investigators said it was Tammi Smith’s “desperate attempts” to adopt the child that hindered the investigation. Police allege that the Smiths had a plan in place to adopt Gabriel or were developing a plan to somehow pick up the child in Nashville, Tenn., and her contradictory statements to police and to the media led to her arrest.

Theory-If this was the plan then it's possible that the ring was a form of payment by the Smiths and they gave her the ring to go along with the plan and go to SA and then promised more once Gabriel was in Tenn.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is DeKalb County John Doe (2022)?

Members online

... and 198 more.
Total: 3,962 (members: 199, guests: 3,763)

Online statistics

Members online
199
Guests online
3,763
Total visitors
3,962
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
604,469
Messages
18,172,648
Members
232,609
Latest member
Madsulli
Back
Top