Theories discussion: What could have happened to Haleigh? #3

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Elle, Ron has an attorney, maybe more than one advising him, plus his mom and grandmom, they aren't all idiots. JMO
 
The first search done by dogs that night followed HaLeighs scent from the home (from the sheets at the back door) along a wooden path to the St. Johns River and then back on to Green lane (dirt road) and through the neighborhood ( circled around) and then out of Hermits Cove on the only road out/in. If Misty or Tommy had taken HaLeigh from the home and returned.... wouldn't the dogs have back tracked to the Cummings mobile home or to the Croslin's residence on Tyler? Green lane is a dirt road wouldn't it make sense to see tire tracks on that dirt road following the scent trail? I also have wondered about that child foot print found along that path the dogs tracked HaLeigh's scent. I know Texan's run around bare foot but do Floridians run around in the woods in that area without shoes on? My point is would Misty allow HaLeigh to walk around outside ( down that path)with no shoes on?
Also, has anyone made sense out of the route through the neighborhood and the reason someone might have for going up and around the neighborhood before leaving it? I have speculated that who ever did travel by car (with HaLeighs scent) from Green lane and into the neighborhood was not familiar with the neighborhood there for making that circle before leaving.
 
If the perp was not familar with the neighborhood wouldn't that help with the narrowing down of POI. How would this abductor know HaLeigh relatively well( use of kitchen light and removed her clothes and the possibility HaLeigh walked down that wooden path) but not the neighborhood is an important clue IMO.
 
texasmommy39 said:
The first search done by dogs that night followed HaLeighs scent from the home (from the sheets at the back door) along a wooden path to the St. Johns River and then back on to Green lane (dirt road) and through the neighborhood ( circled around) and then out of Hermits Cove on the only road out/in. If Misty or Tommy had taken HaLeigh from the home and returned.... wouldn't the dogs have back tracked to the Cummings mobile home or to the Croslin's residence on Tyler? Green lane is a dirt road wouldn't it make sense to see tire tracks on that dirt road following the scent trail? I also have wondered about that child foot print found along that path the dogs tracked HaLeigh's scent. I know Texan's run around bare foot but do Floridians run around in the woods in that area without shoes on? My point is would Misty allow HaLeigh to walk around outside ( down that path)with no shoes on?
Also, has anyone made sense out of the route through the neighborhood and the reason someone might have for going up and around the neighborhood before leaving it? I have speculated that who ever did travel by car (with HaLeighs scent) from Green lane and into the neighborhood was not familiar with the neighborhood there for making that circle before leaving.
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Morning!!

I see the points you are making. I have thought over the path that the dogs made while considering much of the points you posted. I just wish I had an explanation. Of course if the explanation was that simple FBI and LE investigators would have this solved by now, maybe?

Here is my thing. I do not believe that the back door of 202 Gr Lane was the entry point of whoever went into the home. I think that whoever entered made access via the front door. I think that the back door might have been propped open for another purpose, either by Misty herself or by someone that was inside the trailer and wanted an additional exit point. Maybe a quick exit if someone came home early from work or an unexpected guest arrived at 202....who knows. Is it possible the door was propped open and Haleigh woke up and didn't see Misty and saw the back door and thought she knew where Misty was?( maybe Misty wasn't even out of the home, maybe Haleigh just didn't see her.) Would Haleigh have wandered around alone in the dark? Odds are the answer is no, but perhaps someone familiar to her saw her up...took her by the end and said they knew where Misty was? I don't know i am just throwing things out there.

No struggle inside that trailer leads me to agree with LE and their theory that this was not a stranger abduction and whoever had the child was not supposed to have the child. It doesn't mean Haleigh would have struggled to go with them. Perhaps she trusted whoever was there....That trail the dogs followed has relevance, I believe it. JMO
 
texasmommy39 said:
If the perp was not familar with the neighborhood wouldn't that help with the narrowing down of POI. How would this abductor know HaLeigh relatively well( use of kitchen light and removed her clothes and the possibility HaLeigh walked down that wooden path) but not the neighborhood is an important clue IMO.
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How is it an important clue when cops say this is not a stranger abduction? I mean using normal logic, if its not a stranger, its someone who knew the home, and the neighborhood,and the family, and Haleigh, since the perp more than likely lived in the trailer Haleigh lived in, I think its safe to say they knew the neighborhood-
 
Malesherbes said:
How is it an important clue when cops say this is not a stranger abduction? I mean using normal logic, if its not a stranger, its someone who knew the home, and the neighborhood,and the family, and Haleigh, since the perp more than likely lived in the trailer Haleigh lived in, I think its safe to say they knew the neighborhood-
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Morning Malesherbes, I know you believe that Misty and Ron are guilty, but, IMO the evidence doesn't seem to support that theory yet. I am still looking and sleuthing and appreciate your point of view this morning, but, as of today I am still trying to narrow down the suspect list (HaLeigh's family) and as far as using normal logic, I have logically determined that Misty and Ron did not harm and remove HaLeigh from the home that night.
 
texasmommy39 said:
Morning Malesherbes, I know you believe that Misty and Ron are guilty, but, IMO the evidence doesn't seem to support that theory yet. I am still looking and sleuthing and appreciate your point of view this morning, but, as of today I am still trying to narrow down the suspect list (HaLeigh's family) and as far as using normal logic, I have logically determined that Misty and Ron did not harm and remove HaLeigh from the home that night.
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But if you'll check the media links, LE is on record as stating that they do not think this is a case of a stranger abduction.
 
texasmommy39 said:
Morning Malesherbes, I know you believe that Misty and Ron are guilty, but, IMO the evidence doesn't seem to support that theory yet. I am still looking and sleuthing and appreciate your point of view this morning, but, as of today I am still trying to narrow down the suspect list (HaLeigh's family) and as far as using normal logic, I have logically determined that Misty and Ron did not harm and remove HaLeigh from the home that night.
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I agree LE characterization of non stranger abduction leaves many possible perpetrators including but not limited to Ronald and Misty. Now, if we could just narrow down that list of friends and family members that had means, motive and opportunity we might get somewhere.
 
texasmommy39 said:
Morning Malesherbes, I know you believe that Misty and Ron are guilty, but, IMO the evidence doesn't seem to support that theory yet. I am still looking and sleuthing and appreciate your point of view this morning, but, as of today I am still trying to narrow down the suspect list (HaLeigh's family) and as far as using normal logic, I have logically determined that Misty and Ron did not harm and remove HaLeigh from the home that night.
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ITA Texasmommy. Knowing HaLeigh does not mean they were intimately familiar with the MH's surrounding area, particularly in the dark.
 
elle1919 said:
Morning!!

I see the points you are making. I have thought over the path that the dogs made while considering much of the points you posted. I just wish I had an explanation. Of course if the explanation was that simple FBI and LE investigators would have this solved by now, maybe?

Here is my thing. I do not believe that the back door of 202 Gr Lane was the entry point of whoever went into the home. I think that whoever entered made access via the front door. I think that the back door might have been propped open for another purpose, either by Misty herself or by someone that was inside the trailer and wanted an additional exit point. Maybe a quick exit if someone came home early from work or an unexpected guest arrived at 202....who knows. Is it possible the door was propped open and Haleigh woke up and didn't see Misty and saw the back door and thought she knew where Misty was?( maybe Misty wasn't even out of the home, maybe Haleigh just didn't see her.) Would Haleigh have wandered around alone in the dark? Odds are the answer is no, but perhaps someone familiar to her saw her up...took her by the end and said they knew where Misty was? I don't know i am just throwing things out there.

No struggle inside that trailer leads me to agree with LE and their theory that this was not a stranger abduction and whoever had the child was not supposed to have the child. It doesn't mean Haleigh would have struggled to go with them. Perhaps she trusted whoever was there....That trail the dogs followed has relevance, I believe it. JMO
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At this point in time it has been simplified for us by LE and revealed that there was no forced entry. Either the doors where unlocked or someone had a key and we know about neither to determine what relavance it bares on the crime at this time. I am more interested in the behavior demonstrated in the other clues left behind such as the cinderblock's use and original location,kitchen light being used by the abductor, Haleigh's T-shirt being removed and no clothing found to be missing, the child foot print found on the path and if she had been allowed to walk that path with no shoes prior and the significance that these known clues reveal about this crime and criminal. I do believe these little clues are significant and do reveal things about the abductor. The fact that the dogs did not back track to the house clears Misty and Tommy Croslin IMO (but could be wrong). HaLeigh would not leave with Misty's cousin and submit without a struggle (Remember the picture of HaLeigh on the first day of school and getting on the school bus?) under those circumstances ( doesn't know Joe and would not allow him to remove her clothes and would not walk down that path with). So if Misty, Ron, Tommy and Joe didn't do it who did?
 
I dont hold any stock in the lone footprint, last time I checked Haleigh had two feet, I dont think there would just be one print, and its a FACT, it was never established as Haleighs-
 
Malesherbes said:
I don't hold any stock in the lone footprint, last time I checked Haleigh had two feet, I don't think there would just be one print, and its a FACT, it was never established as Haleigh's-
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I know I have mentioned I hunt in the past and I am going on record as saying prints do not always have a set (2 or in my case 4) in a straight path and all visible. Now I will also go on record as saying that prints degrade over time and if prints where detected and noted I would have to logically conclude they are relevant based on these and a few other factors. I have questioned the fact that HaLeigh or any other child was walking along that wooded path in February bare footed in the first place. You can discredit the evidence if you want to. Maybe that is why you are still hung on Misty and Ron.:waitasec:
 
Flossie JMO said:
ITA Texasmommy. Knowing HaLeigh does not mean they were intimately familiar with the MH's surrounding area, particularly in the dark.
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Thank you Flossie, this was my point! Who would know HaLeigh intimately enough but not know the neighborhood? It obviously was not someone that had been in the neighborhood prior. I wonder why they would make their way to the river first with HaLeigh if they where going to leave the area in a vehicle?
 
Malesherbes said:
Right, but the print was never proven to be Haleighs, so you wont find me thinking of theories because of a footprint that may or may not be hers, its not as if she was the only child within a mile radius of the home-
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Malesherbes, I believe you where responding to my post on the subject and your participation is welcomed, but, can you please be a little more considerate of others rights to express there theories and opinions? I have not wanted to debate anything this morning, but, discuss the probabilities and possibilities in this case. Lets just get along, please?
 
texasmommy39 said:
At this point in time it has been simplified for us by LE and revealed that there was no forced entry. Either the doors where unlocked or someone had a key and we know about neither to determine what relavance it bares on the crime at this time. I am more interested in the behavior demonstrated in the other clues left behind such as the cinderblock's use and original location,kitchen light being used by the abductor, Haleigh's T-shirt being removed and no clothing found to be missing, the child foot print found on the path and if she had been allowed to walk that path with no shoes prior and the significance that these known clues reveal about this crime and criminal. I do believe these little clues are significant and do reveal things about the abductor. The fact that the dogs did not back track to the house clears Misty and Tommy Croslin IMO (but could be wrong). HaLeigh would not leave with Misty's cousin and submit without a struggle (Remember the picture of HaLeigh on the first day of school and getting on the school bus?) under those circumstances ( doesn't know Joe and would not allow him to remove her clothes and would not walk down that path with). So if Misty, Ron, Tommy and Joe didn't do it who did?
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I am not sure what house you mean the dogs didn't track back to? Could you elaborate on that point a little for me? TIA : )

As far as the pink shirt being removed, I think the discovery of this shirt was a plus in Misty's favor( if you believe that could happen). Misty was under no obligation to admit that the shirt in the laundry pile was the shirt Haleigh went to bed in. It makes her look less suspicious in my opinion that she pointed that shirt out. The exact spot that it was found means something. Did Haleigh wet? Why would an abductor remove the shirt? Would a relative care what shirt Haleigh was wearing? No, not in my opinion. That shirt was removed from Haleigh for a reason. Along those same lines a SO wouldn't care less about what shirt Haleigh was wearing. So who took off the shirt and why? I think Haleigh might have woke up and taken off her own shirt. Just a suspicion.

Why wouldn't Haleigh go willingly with a family friend such as Joe or Misty's brother Tommy? If either of them told her that they were taking her to her father or Misty, she would go in my opinion. Even if the person in the house that night had only been seen by Haleigh on 1 previous occasion, once is enough. Children are trusting by nature in my opinion. I don't think that Haleigh had reached an age that she becomes suspect of people and senses when something doesn't feel right. That is why children so young are victimized time and time again. Children as young as Haleigh, or as old as Haleigh, can still be manipulated with very minimal effort. These are just my opinions of course and I think the more we bounce these thoughts off of each other the more likely we can get our answers!
 
texasmommy39 said:
Malesherbes, I believe you where responding to my post on the subject and your participation is welcomed, but, can you please be a little more considerate of others rights to express there theories and opinions? I have not wanted to debate anything this morning, but, discuss the probabilities and possibilities in this case. Lets just get along, please?
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Your thoughts are good, and make sense coming from the angle you are looking at based on the key points you are using with what LE has released to the public. Keep bringing up these good points for discussion, what's your thoughts on why just one foot print based on your hunting experience? I'm considerate of your post.
 
elle1919 said:
I am not sure what house you mean the dogs didn't track back to? Could you elaborate on that point a little for me? TIA : )

As far as the pink shirt being removed, I think the discovery of this shirt was a plus in Misty's favor( if you believe that could happen). Misty was under no obligation to admit that the shirt in the laundry pile was the shirt Haleigh went to bed in. It makes her look less suspicious in my opinion that she pointed that shirt out. The exact spot that it was found means something. Did Haleigh wet? Why would an abductor remove the shirt? Would a relative care what shirt Haleigh was wearing? No, not in my opinion. That shirt was removed from Haleigh for a reason. Along those same lines a SO wouldn't care less about what shirt Haleigh was wearing. So who took off the shirt and why? I think Haleigh might have woke up and taken off her own shirt. Just a suspicion.

Why wouldn't Haleigh go willingly with a family friend such as Joe or Misty's brother Tommy? If either of them told her that they were taking her to her father or Misty, she would go in my opinion. Even if the person in the house that night had only been seen by Haleigh on 1 previous occasion, once is enough. Children are trusting by nature in my opinion. I don't think that Haleigh had reached an age that she becomes suspect of people and senses when something doesn't feel right. That is why children so young are victimized time and time again. Children as young as Haleigh, or as old as Haleigh, can still be manipulated with very minimal effort. These are just my opinions of course and I think the more we bounce these thoughts off of each other the more likely we can get our answers!
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The dogs did not back track at any point to the Cummings mobile home nor to Tommy's residence.
As far as Joe would HaLeigh have met him? He was only in town for how long and in your opinion Misty was hanging out with cousin and the kids? HaLeigh goes to school aslo... so when did HaLeigh meet Joe? I do not believe just anyone walked in there removed HaLeigh from the bed turned on the kitchen light and removed HaLeighs clothes and HaLeigh walked along side this person on that wooded path that led to the river. To clarify my point about tracks I will suggets leaf matter scatter and soil (hard packed dirt to loose soil to sand)conditions would also be relevant to the quality of the foot prints and if there was any other prints on that trail.
 
It is not simply a matter 'discrediting evidence' if a poster eg may take into consideration factors such as the reliability (or unreliability) of scent articles used for tracking, question time of day, or relevance of additional variables. There are other theories that appear to 'discredit' even the possibilty of staging. Different posters working w the same set of facts bring their own unique perspective and just weight the evidence differently. Depending upon how much significance I assign to various evidence, there are still at least two if not three entirely different scenarios *I* myself can see having unfolded that night. Still no one solid, concrete theory here yet.

:parrot:
 
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