TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #12

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IMHO..The ONLY people who could possibly be hindering or delaying finding out what may have really happend to Gail are MP, his mother and his mistress... For certain they are not causing any ruckus in order to find out what happened to her.. ...JMHO..

ETA.. And due to their non actions concerning Gail's disappearance I suspect they are causing quite alot of stress and pain to Gail's children too...JMHO...

BBM. We dont know that anyone is actually hindering it, although I get your point. I dont think it is fair to imply Matt's mother is a subject of the investigation, and I dont believe that anything so far shows that she has hindered it except that she hired a lawyer as well.
 
Thanks, BeanE, for sharing your experience. Yes, I thought as I was walking away from my desk that there's good ruckus (productive) and bad ruckus (distracting). Point taken.

IMO, most ruckus is advocacy = the good kind. It keeps MPs like Gail from being forgotten.

Also: People like LE get paid to ignore distractions. The really good posters on WS, the ones who never get banned and don't need reminders, don't get distracted by the bad. They ignore the bad and keep the advocacy alive for finding Gail.

I have to believe LE is working on this case. I have to believe Gail's family is making their own ruckus, behind the scenes.

Those of us who have little to contribute other than our interest and ideas are nonetheless advocates for finding Gail. This is our way of making a ruckus.

And it should not be dismissed.

Thanks, CoolMommy. :)

I came away wondering if it's a matter of the understanding each of us posting about this have of the word ruckus. My understanding is that it means something negative.

I am very definitively for strong, positive, constructive, advocacy that focuses on the missing person, figuring out what happened to them, and getting credible information about their story out. I wonder if that's perhaps what some people have in mind. For me, I don't think of that as a ruckus, because that is not what my concept of a ruckus is.

I think you and I are actually in agreement on the concept. :)

I too am convinced that LE, as well as Gail's family, are working hard on Gail's case, in strong, positive, constructive ways, and I support them 100%.
 
I dont disagree with Bean E's post, but I want to put a slightly different spin on it from my perspective-any publicity is good publicity in a missing persons case. I firmly believe that.

However, anything that is said or done which compromises the investigation, obstructs it or misleads investigators is appalling from where I sit. FWIW.

I'm going to have to disagree, believe. I don't think publicity that takes focus off the missing person and figuring out what happened to them is helpful, and I think it is hurtful and a hindrance in many way.

But... we can agree to disagree, and I respect your opinion. :) :grouphug:
 
BBM. We dont know that anyone is actually hindering it, although I get your point. I dont think it is fair to imply Matt's mother is a subject of the investigation, and I dont believe that anything so far shows that she has hindered it except that she hired a lawyer as well.

I don't think it's fair to say that hiring an attorney shows that someone has hindered an investigation.

People hire attorneys in missing person cases for all kinds of reasons, and we are not privy to those reasons.

A couple examples. Sometimes people just want their questions answered about the process LE is following. Sometimes people have been harassed and are seeking protection from that harassment and to try to put a stop to it.

We don't know why Matt's mother retained an attorney. It may not even have had anything to do with this case. To say it shows she's hindered the investigation because she hired an attorney is unfair, IMO.

Again, we'll have to agree to disagree. :)
 
I don't think it's fair to say that hiring an attorney shows that someone has hindered an investigation.

People hire attorneys in missing person cases for all kinds of reasons, and we are not privy to those reasons.

A couple examples. Sometimes people just want their questions answered about the process LE is following. Sometimes people have been harassed and are seeking protection from that harassment and to try to put a stop to it.

We don't know why Matt's mother retained an attorney. It may not even have had anything to do with this case. To say it shows she's hindered the investigation because she hired an attorney is unfair, IMO.

Again, we'll have to agree to disagree. :)

BBM..Yes IMHO.. We will have to agree to disagree...JMHO
 
FWIW, an INNOCENT person who hires an attorney, will STILL talk to LE and tell them everything they know and they'll turn over ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that can assist in finding their loved one,................INCLUDING all electronic forms such as COMPUTERS!

They do NOT give it to their criminal defense attorney.

just sayin'
fran

PS...one must admit, IMHO, that the mistress hiring a criminal defense attorney looks a little 'hinky' as well.
 
However, anything that is said or done which compromises the investigation, obstructs it or misleads investigators is appalling from where I sit. FWIW.

Agreed. Let me preface my next statement by saying this is entirely my opinion: Unfortunately, it seems like in Gail's case there are people -- maybe some of those "complete strangers" we were talking about yesterday -- who want to insert themselves into the case for their own reasons. We're often being asked to value the opinion of said complete strangers much more highly than we are the opinions of Gail's friends and relatives who speak out with such obvious and real concern, who have real information.

The biggest example I can think of is MP's attorneys putting out hearsay and gossip about Gail in their quest to defend their client. And before I'm asked yet again for a link, I'm referring to the "flat f----d up" quote and the info given Jammer Scott. But there are also lesser examples, which I admit concern me just as much.

Like I posted yesterday with all those links, from the beginning people were claiming Gail's relatives and friends didn't want any help which must mean something. Here we are, coming up on 6 months since Gail disappeared, and we're still arguing about it.

I absolutely do not understand why.
 
Agreed. Let me preface my next statement by saying this is entirely my opinion: Unfortunately, it seems like in Gail's case there are people -- maybe some of those "complete strangers" we were talking about yesterday -- who want to insert themselves into the case for their own reasons. We're often being asked to value the opinion of said complete strangers much more highly than we are the opinions of Gail's friends and relatives who speak out with such obvious and real concern, who have real information.

The biggest example I can think of is MP's attorneys putting out hearsay and gossip about Gail in their quest to defend their client. And before I'm asked yet again for a link, I'm referring to the "flat f----d up" quote and the info given Jammer Scott. But there are also lesser examples, which I admit concern me just as much.

Like I posted yesterday with all those links, from the beginning people were claiming Gail's relatives and friends didn't want any help which must mean something. Here we are, coming up on 6 months since Gail disappeared, and we're still arguing about it.

I absolutely do not understand why.

I will ALWAYS suspect soon-to-be or just-barely SO or spouse when a person suddenly goes missing. However, my "hinky" meter gets even higher when said ex does nothing significant to help find the missing person. The meter rises even HIGHER when said ex hires an attorney before any charges are even brought against them. Sorry, but that is just the way I roll. I can't change this; and I can't change how many times my instincts are correct and said ex is eventually (sooner or later) charged.
 
I've watched many cases here on Websleuths through the years. I've also reviewed 'cold cases.'

IMHO, when you have a person in an alledged abusive relationship, who was in the process of severing her relationship with the alledged abuser, and has gone to the trouble Gail had gone to insure herself and children a safe place and sufficient funds to survive, they had been in contact with a NUMBER of people outside the home who were aware of their plight and their plan to leave the relationship, and she ends up missing without a trace and leaving children behind with the alleged abuser,........ IF the VICTIM never gives any sign of being still alive (like calling one of their trusted friends/family), ends up either dead, or the case goes unsolved until ......................

I'm not meaning to be so blunt, but this is a pattern, unfortunately. :(

JMHO
fran

PS......I was researching domestic abuse recently, and I saw one thing mentioned I'd never thought of before, but it's oh sooooo true. Not only would Gail have NOT left her children behind, she would NOT have left her dog(s). Her dog(s) that we know she'd had with her and the kids when she went to the lake that last night. NOT leave kids, NOT leave dogs.

Pets are one of the things that get abused in an abusive relationship. I never thought of that before. But then it reminded me of a friend who's abuser tried to drown her dog. She saved the dog's life and not a night or two later, the dog returned the favor. Her abuser snapped and seriously, tried to kill her, but the dog attacked him! Yes! He went straight to jail, did not pass go, and stayed there for a year! :)


PPS......How do I come to the conclusion Gail was in an abusive relationship? By THREE 911 calls and LE giving her the # of an abuse hotline! fran


PPPS.....sorry, one last time.............about the attorney saying that about the friend who said she was all 'f'd up!'.................One difficulty abuse victims have is getting some people to believe them about the abuse. It can be detrimental to the victim. Someone they trusted turns on them and takes the side of the abuser!? Abusers often times are very good at what they do, keeping the problems, Gail not doing what he wants to do until he has to force her! They sound sincere on the outside, but do NOT get them behind that closed door! What goes on in their marriage, stays in their marriage! :mad: IMHO, that's what MP MAY have meant when he said something like "You're messing things up." to AD, when she wouldn't be quiet about GP's disappearance.......
 
:tyou:
I've watched many cases here on Websleuths through the years. I've also reviewed 'cold cases.'

IMHO, when you have a person in an alledged abusive relationship, who was in the process of severing her relationship with the alledged abuser, and has gone to the trouble Gail had gone to insure herself and children a safe place and sufficient funds to survive, they had been in contact with a NUMBER of people outside the home who were aware of their plight and their plan to leave the relationship, and she ends up missing without a trace and leaving children behind with the alleged abuser,........ IF the VICTIM never gives any sign of being still alive (like calling one of their trusted friends/family), ends up either dead, or the case goes unsolved until ......................

I'm not meaning to be so blunt, but this is a pattern, unfortunately. :(

JMHO
fran

PS......I was researching domestic abuse recently, and I saw one thing mentioned I'd never thought of before, but it's oh sooooo true. Not only would Gail have NOT left her children behind, she would NOT have left her dog(s). Her dog(s) that we know she'd had with her and the kids when she went to the lake that last night. NOT leave kids, NOT leave dogs.

Pets are one of the things that get abused in an abusive relationship. I never thought of that before. But then it reminded me of a friend who's abuser tried to drown her dog. She saved the dog's life and not a night or two later, the dog returned the favor. Her abuser snapped and seriously, tried to kill her, but the dog attacked him! Yes! He went straight to jail, did not pass go, and stayed there for a year! :)


PPS......How do I come to the conclusion Gail was in an abusive relationship? By THREE 911 calls and LE giving her the # of an abuse hotline! fran


PPPS.....sorry, one last time.............about the attorney saying that about the friend who said she was all 'f'd up!'.................One difficulty abuse victims have is getting some people to believe them about the abuse. It can be detrimental to the victim. Someone they trusted turns on them and takes the side of the abuser!? Abusers often times are very good at what they do, keeping the problems, Gail not doing what he wants to do until he has to force her! They sound sincere on the outside, but do NOT get them behind that closed door! What goes on in their marriage, stays in their marriage! :mad: IMHO, that's what MP MAY have meant when he said something like "You're messing things up." to AD, when she wouldn't be quiet about GP's disappearance.......

You said what I had been trying to convey - only much more eloquently! Thank you!
 
I've watched many cases here on Websleuths through the years. I've also reviewed 'cold cases.'

IMHO, when you have a person in an alledged abusive relationship, who was in the process of severing her relationship with the alledged abuser, and has gone to the trouble Gail had gone to insure herself and children a safe place and sufficient funds to survive, they had been in contact with a NUMBER of people outside the home who were aware of their plight and their plan to leave the relationship, and she ends up missing without a trace and leaving children behind with the alleged abuser,........ IF the VICTIM never gives any sign of being still alive (like calling one of their trusted friends/family), ends up either dead, or the case goes unsolved until ......................

I'm not meaning to be so blunt, but this is a pattern, unfortunately. :(

JMHO
fran

PS......I was researching domestic abuse recently, and I saw one thing mentioned I'd never thought of before, but it's oh sooooo true. Not only would Gail have NOT left her children behind, she would NOT have left her dog(s). Her dog(s) that we know she'd had with her and the kids when she went to the lake that last night. NOT leave kids, NOT leave dogs.

Pets are one of the things that get abused in an abusive relationship. I never thought of that before. But then it reminded me of a friend who's abuser tried to drown her dog. She saved the dog's life and not a night or two later, the dog returned the favor. Her abuser snapped and seriously, tried to kill her, but the dog attacked him! Yes! He went straight to jail, did not pass go, and stayed there for a year! :)


PPS......How do I come to the conclusion Gail was in an abusive relationship? By THREE 911 calls and LE giving her the # of an abuse hotline! fran


PPPS.....sorry, one last time.............about the attorney saying that about the friend who said she was all 'f'd up!'.................One difficulty abuse victims have is getting some people to believe them about the abuse. It can be detrimental to the victim. Someone they trusted turns on them and takes the side of the abuser!? Abusers often times are very good at what they do, keeping the problems, Gail not doing what he wants to do until he has to force her! They sound sincere on the outside, but do NOT get them behind that closed door! What goes on in their marriage, stays in their marriage! :mad: IMHO, that's what MP MAY have meant when he said something like "You're messing things up." to AD, when she wouldn't be quiet about GP's disappearance.......

Just jumping from your post regarding the domestic calls to LE Fran. Why was it Gail and the children always left? Gail didn't have any family in the area, MP did; and she drove 4 hours away each time. To me, it may come back to control issues and her fears-- especially after we learned of the phone calls to NY. She may have known MP would not "let it be" for the 24 hr cooling down period. She may have known or thought he would return to the house if he was the one to leave or he would come looking for her and the children if she was to go to his mother's or to a local hotel. Then again if MP was intoxicated, LE wouldn't let him leave. I'd just like to know the reasoning behind it....as it's been a ? that keeps popping up in my thoughts since the beginning.
 
Through much discussion and thought, Admin has come to the decision to keep the Gail Nowacki Palmgren threads closed for now.

Sometimes, the merry go round in a case has to be stopped. The forum wars have proven to have way too much of an impact, and the threads have stopped being productive. In fact, they have become areas of conflict between opposing points of view, and Gail has become lost.

No one side is at fault-pretty much everyone has had a hand in this and the person who loses the most, of course, is Gail.

If there is movement in Gail's case, the decision will be re evaluated. If there are updates or information you think is important to post, please PM a mod and we will add the information to the thread.

We are NOT giving up on Gail. Shortly I will add a link where all of the threads are archived and easily accessible. We will regularly bump this one.

Thank you for all of the time and prayers you have put into the mysterious disappearance of this special woman.
 
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=466"]Gail Nowacki Palmgren Threads[/ame]
 
posting just in case.
Hopefully not Gail.


calliestarnesCallie Starnes



BREAKING: Human remains found in Renaissance Park. Kids found skull while playing. CPD says partially clothed body severely decomposed.

31 minutes ago
 
calliestarnesCallie Starnes



Investigators can't tell if body is male or female. No items found w/body to suggest person was homeless. Taken to M.E.'s office.

39 minutes ago


calliestarnesCallie Starnes
@


@becauseofdavid at foot of Market Street Bridge near parking lot. Dozens of joggers probably pass this spot every morning.
 
calliestarnes Callie Starnes



Lots of tweets out there from people hoping for leads in Gail Palmgren case. CPD says clothing leads them to believe remains are male.
 
SIGNAL MOUNTAIN, HAMILTON COUNTY, TN (WRCB) - Matthew Palmgren has filed a police report accusing his missing wife's best friend of harassing him.
Police were called to the Palmgren's Signal Mountain home Monday. It's the first time police have answered a call from 40 Ridgerock Drive since Matthew Palmgren reported his wife missing in May.
In the police report, obtained by Channel 3, Palmgren accuses Arlene Durham of taking pictures of his home and following him as he drove his daughter to school.
Durham says that is not true

much much more at link

http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/15885621/first-on-3-husband-calls-police-to-report-missing-wifes-friend
 
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