TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #6

[Jade]

For me when I think of MP, shades of Josh Powell comes to mind so I'm praying MP isn't allowed to leave the State of Tennessee until Gail is found.....JMHO

While I agree that there was a picture of MP at the press conference that was a bit Josh Powell-y in expression I’m not seeing further similarities.

Not to give him any credit but MP did not spin an unbelievable, improbable, and impossible to look upon as truthful story about camping with toddlers on a frigid Sunday night.

Nor is he of the Scott Peterson ilk with dramatic appearances and farfetched tales.

Or even like Drew Peterson or to bring it closer to home Sam Parker with their “on a beach somewhere” theories.

MP had by reports only 10 minutes between when GP was last sighted and he got home unlike JP who had most of a day and all night.

I presume that GP was all the more annoying to MP by still trying to work it out [according to neighbors report] after all he has blatantly carried on, reportedly drunk to excess, blew through money, assumed to have committed DV, and yet she still waits on him to file.

I see motive-it could have been building and took place quickly. MP was after all painting himself in a corner at work also.

All IMO

 

[Jade]

But we have no way to know that is Arlene using that hat, right?

I say that particularly because some time back, someone went on a news article, and used my name to post nasty stuff solely to harrass me.

How would we know for sure that's Arlene?

Complete speculation based on post 14:

Because I gave the police the information I had on file

and post 16:

Probly not . If it was not for me or her family nothing probley would of been done.

IMO

 

[BeanE]

I dont understand your post BeanE. Are you saying you read my comment as an instruction as to what you need to think?

I'm sorry. I tried so hard to be clear.

I quoted what I was referring to. You stated it as fact, and said "we know".

I'm not asking what we can think - I know we can think whatever we like. I'm just double checking to be sure I understand what we can post.

Just trying my best to stay out of trouble.

 

[fireflylink]

No, I don't find it troubling, because I don't find it true.

Also, we don't know the truth of Matt and his alleged substance abuse... AD is the one yelling that...we have been told numerous times, just on this forum, how aggrivating the SMPD is about stopping people driving on the Mtn, for any tiny thing. Do we really believe that if Matt were driving around the Mtn. THAT intoxicated (AD's description of Matt drinking a 36 pack-I believe that is what she said) someone would not stop him?

His filings were exactly what every attorney would tell anyone in a similar situation to do.

BBM
confused, it happens. It happens all of the time. I know of a local "gentleman" who has done this for years up here (with his girls in the car), and gets away with it. I can state with certaintly and personal knowledge that if it is past 9:00am (MORNING), he has begun an all day "buffet" through work (lunchbox) and a fresh six-pack before heading up the W. He simply avoids "town", goes 1 mile under speed limt, wears heavy cologne and "talks the talk". Born here, raised here, no fear of consequences. Hopefully, they DO happen upon him one day before tragedy strikes whether on Signal Mtn or in the valley. Calling it in of no use BTW..they have to catch the driver IN the vehicle while commiting the offense. Empty vehicle, parked a home? No violation, they cannot charge based on a phone call. Just food for thought...not accusing MP of the same thing, I have no personal knowledge of his habits. But it happens everyday, everywhere, and it is God awful dangerous on "regular roads", not to mention our local mountain roads.

Either way, the solution is simple for MP - don't drink and drive. Drinking is not a great way to cope with the current situation anyway, would be doing himself and the children more harm than good. As a friend of MP's I am sure can see this, most likely better than he can. He needs a clear head to support their children right now, that is his first priority. (hypothetically and IMO, of course)

 

[Oriah]

I'm sorry. I tried so hard to be clear.

I quoted what I was referring to. You stated it as fact, and said "we know".

I'm not asking what we can think - I know we can think whatever we like. I'm just double checking to be sure I understand what we can post.

Just trying my best to stay out of trouble.

You know, between MSM and LE and independant sources and social media sources....it is getting more and more difficult every day to determine what we can post as fact!

 

[MacKat]

I think it's interesting that this didn't hit the media until today. Once again, evidence that Gail's family is working in "stealth" mode, which I think is wise.

Agreed Pearl! I think this supports the opinion that the siblings are not using this to keep the media fed with details. The listed Hamilton County Court House closes at 4pm and the time on the document is just before that. All the local news channels in Chat/SM all, as far as I know, mentioned the search of the house that evening at 6pm. If they(family) wanted a full blown media circus, a circus they could have gotten.Most of the news also featured a local, self-appointed spokesperson who made comments on the investigation.

 

[JBean]

I'm sorry. I tried so hard to be clear.

I quoted what I was referring to. You stated it as fact, and said "we know".

I'm not asking what we can think - I know we can think whatever we like. I'm just double checking to be sure I understand what we can post.

Just trying my best to stay out of trouble.

You are fine beane. Everyone should use their own comfort level as to what they choose to believe or not. I 100% respect that and I know you well enough to realize that you have a good handle on discerning fact from rumor.

Before you joined us in these threads I posted the following information for members:
[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6518116&postcount=42"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #3[/ame]

I can only say that I am privy to some information, but I rarely post any of it. There are a few details that I see frustrating to members and on a few occasions have opted to clarify so we can move on past them. But still and all I encourage each member to decide for themselves if they want to believe the little bits of inside info that I post from time to time.

Hope that helps. :hug:

 

[ThoughtFox]

Siblings Of Gail Palmgren Seek Restraining Order Against Matt Palmgren
Court Hearing Set For July 11
posted June 28, 2011

Chancellor Brown signed an order directing Mr. Palmgren not to transfer or conceal any marital property or property of Ms. Palmgren, not use any marital or separate assets for anything except for "ordinary" expenses, keep all insurance policies current, not hide or destroy any evidence that might be stored on hard drives, not relocate the children without a court order, restore electrical service to the couple's lake home in Alabama, and immediately provide the children with counseling.

The petition says Ms. Palmgren just prior to her disappearance on April 30 left some jewelry with friends and the jewelry, it is believed, has been given to Mr. Palmgren.

It asks for an accounting of a collection of rare coins Ms. Palmgren had gotten from her father and grandfather.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_204140.asp

I'm glad this lawsuit has been filed.

The jewelry mentioned must be the stuff left in Birmingham with the so-called "friends" from Easter. Gail left it with them and they must have given it back to MP.

Any object that belonged to Gail, from the jewelry to the rare coins, could be viewed as joint marital property in TN. So I expect his attorneys to say just that.

Local Info: The attorneys who filed that are Chattanooga locals.

 

[BeanE]

You are fine beane. Everyone should use their own comfort level as to what they choose to believe or not. I 100% respect that and I know you well enough to realize that you have a good handle on discerning fact from rumor.

Before you joined us in these threads I posted the following information for members:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #3

I can only say that I am privy to some information, but I rarely post any of it. There are a few details that I see frustrating to members and on a few occasions have opted to clarify so we can move on past them. But still and all I encourage each member to decide for themselves if they want to believe the little bits of inside info that I post from time to time.

Hope that helps. :hug:

Thank you, my friend. :blowkiss:

 

[lalalu]

Originally Posted by Jade
Here is the link to the article with the comments by Arlene who is using the hat ATRUEFRIEND:

http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/...tody-children/

It is the 7th comment down.

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BeanE:But we have no way to know that is Arlene using that hat, right?

I say that particularly because some time back, someone went on a news article, and used my name to post nasty stuff solely to harrass me.

How would we know for sure that's Arlene?

I read the True Friend comment that the above refers to. It is difficult to know when the twitter quote part ends, due to the lack of an end quote, however, isn't there a limit to the number of characters in a tweet? I'm not sure the entire run of text after the quote symbol is the tweet.

Also I thought somewhere on an earlier thread it was confirmed that Arlene was posting as "ATrueFriend"?

 

[Emeralgem]

While I agree that there was a picture of MP at the press conference that was a bit Josh Powell-y in expression I’m not seeing further similarities.

Not to give him any credit but MP did not spin an unbelievable, improbable, and impossible to look upon as truthful story about camping with toddlers on a frigid Sunday night.

Nor is he of the Scott Peterson ilk with dramatic appearances and farfetched tales.

Or even like Drew Peterson or to bring it closer to home Sam Parker with their “on a beach somewhere” theories.

MP had by reports only 10 minutes between when GP was last sighted and he got home unlike JP who had most of a day and all night.

I presume that GP was all the more annoying to MP by still trying to work it out [according to neighbors report] after all he has blatantly carried on, reportedly drunk to excess, blew through money, assumed to have committed DV, and yet she still waits on him to file.

I see motive-it could have been building and took place quickly. MP was after all painting himself in a corner at work also.

All IMO

When I mentioned MP reminding me of Josh Powell I was referring to Josh Powell hauling rear out of state (Utah) with their two sons almost immediately after Susan Powell disappeared...JMHO

 

[hollyblue]

I'm glad this lawsuit has been filed.

The jewelry mentioned must be the stuff left in Birmingham with the so-called "friends" from Easter. Gail left it with them and they must have given it back to MP.

Any object that belonged to Gail, from the jewelry to the rare coins, could be viewed as joint marital property in TN. So I expect his attorneys to say just that.

Local Info: The attorneys who filed that are Chattanooga locals.

I was under the thought that if something was inherited, it's not joint property? I also thought MP could not sell any property they held in joint, let alone any she may hold in her name only if she is a missing person and not available to sign off? Wouldn't it eventually go to probate with a will or the state decision if none.? Thinking the selling of furniture, art, etc was my guess. ??

 

[BeanE]

I'm wondering what it would take for Diane and Kevin to actually take possession of things like the coins, which are clearly the sole property of Gail. Something like a temporary power of attorney, or move the coins into a safety deposit box that's held in trust for Gail. Something.

I'm afraid all the money in the bank accounts, if all earned after marriage, would be joint property, but I wonder if Diane and Kevin could make some kind of legal maneuver to get half of that actually moved into new accounts that are held in some kind of trust. Maybe again by a temporary power of attorney. Something based on Gail's stated intent to separate and divorce from Matt.

I'm thinking it's the money and land and houses that's the reason he withdrew his filing for separation. If separated, by his action, I think it moves him further away from access to at least half of all that. So he withdrew the separation filing to maintain the legal status of married.

It was a really good idea for Diane and Kevin to take legal action on all this to protect Gail's assets.


I found these:

The General Assembly defines “separate property” as:

(A) All real and personal property owned by a spouse before marriage;

(B) Property acquired in exchange for property acquired before the marriage;

(C) Income from and appreciation of property owned by a spouse before marriage except when characterized as marital property under subdivision (b)(1);

(D) Property acquired by a spouse at any time by gift, bequest, devise or descent;

(E) Pain and suffering awards, victim of crime compensation awards, future medical expenses, and future lost wages;  and

(F) Property acquired by a spouse after an order of legal separation where the court has made a final disposition of property.

Tenn.Code Ann. § 36-4-121(b)(2) (2001).  


(A) “Marital Property” means all real and personal property, both tangible and intangible, acquired by either or both spouses during the course of the marriage up to the date of the final divorce hearing and owned by either or both spouses as of the date of filing a complaint for divorce․

(B) “Marital Property” includes income from, and any increase in value during the marriage of, property determined to be separate property in accordance with subdivision (b)(2) if each party substantially contributed to its preservation and appreciation, and the value of vested and unvested pension, vested and unvested stock option rights, retirement or other fringe benefit rights relating to employment that accrued during the period of the marriage.

(C) “Marital Property” includes recovery in personal injury, workers' compensation, social security disability actions, and other similar actions for the following:  wages lost during the marriage, reimbursement for medical bills incurred and paid with marital property, and property damage to marital property.

Tenn.Code Ann. § 36-4-121(b)(1) (2001).

 

[Columbo]

I was under the thought that if something was inherited, it's not joint property? I also thought MP could not sell any property they held in joint, let alone any she may hold in her name only if she is a missing person and not available to sign off? Wouldn't it eventually go to probate with a will or the state decision if none.? Thinking the selling of furniture, art, etc was my guess. ??

I don't know about inherited items. From reading BeanE's post (the one after yours) it sounds like anything acquired during the marriage becomes marital property. So if she inherited them while married to MP then I guess they belong to both of them. That doesn't seem fair for inherited items like family heirlooms, but it sounds like it's the law.

 

[hollyblue]

I'm wondering where they were married and if that could play into this? NY, FL?

 

[hollyblue]

I don't know about inherited items. From reading BeanE's post (the one after yours) it sounds like anything acquired during the marriage becomes marital property. So if she inherited them while married to MP then I guess they belong to both of them. That doesn't seem fair for inherited items like family heirlooms, but it sounds like it's the law.

Defined as "separate property"

(D) Property acquired by a spouse at any time by gift, bequest, devise or descent;

 

[BeanE]

@calliestarnes
Callie Starnes
Gail Palmgren's sister says she filed restraining order to look out for her sister's interests. Hear why she's worried for the kids at 6.
5 minutes ago
http://twitter.com/#!/calliestarnes/status/85778970951426048

Tweets for Gail are popping up from the reporters. I'm catching them because I'm in Twitter for the Casey Anthony trial. I'm tossing Gail's over here if anyone would like to keep a check on them:

http://keepstream.com/CaseSignal/gail-palmgren-case-tweet-archive

 

[ThoughtFox]

I was under the thought that if something was inherited, it's not joint property? I also thought MP could not sell any property they held in joint, let alone any she may hold in her name only if she is a missing person and not available to sign off? Wouldn't it eventually go to probate with a will or the state decision if none.? Thinking the selling of furniture, art, etc was my guess. ??

It's true that inherited items might be different, I'm not sure.

I was just saying that it's going to be tricky because Gail is missing, not deceased. While she's alive, they own everything together.

I know that my husband and I have both inherited lots of items (and junk) from various relatives, and as far as marriage goes those are shared assets, just like our house. I wouldn't expect a family member to get them back if anything happened to him or to me.

If Gail is found deceased and had a will, her various items might be left to the kids or other family members. That's a big unknown.

But while she's missing, I expect that his lawyers will call some of those things joint assets over which he has some ownership. I'm not saying it's legally or morally right, or judging that in any way, but only saying that according to the law, that might be what his attorneys will try to prove.

 

[ThoughtFox]

Defined as "separate property"

(D) Property acquired by a spouse at any time by gift, bequest, devise or descent;

Oh, okay ~ thanks!

That still won't stop his defense attorney from fighting this restraining order because MP might say that while Gail was alive, she gave some of that stuff to him. He can say anything he likes - he has more claim to her belongings as a husband than the rest of her family.

That might sound harsh, but I think it's legally true. Next of kin is the husband, not a brother or sister.

But to be clear, I think this restraining order is a great thing. I wish they had done it sooner, but maybe they were waiting to see if the searches turned up any of the inherited items, or if they weren't found. I think that explains the timing of this filing. :twocents:

 

[Columbo]

I'm just guessing, but I think most people with children and a lot of financial assets do set up a will and trust. The Palmgrens are well-educated and seem to have a lot of contact with legal representatives, so it seems like they would have been advised to have something set up for the children's sake, "just in case".