Trial Discussion Thread #47 - 14.07.8, Day 38

[Greater Than]

That's not what the world heard... not that he wasn't a great athlete given his limitations but once again, money and power spoke. Hopefully they will be silenced with the gavel of justice this time.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/olympics/london/track/story/2012-07-04/oscar-pistorius-amputee-olympic-team/56010902/1

Okay, I see now what the controversy is. He did legitimately qualify for the relay, but he missed the qualifying time for the individual race by less than 1/4 of a second. Since he was already selected to be on team SA for the relay race, he asked the committees to qualify him to run in the individual race too since SA did not have anyone else competing in that event. So although he didn't technically meet qualification criteria for the individual, he didn't take that spot from anyone else.

From the article you posted:

Reddy said his South African Sports Confederation and Olympic Committee agreed to clear Pistorius for the individual one-lap race as well.

"Since he's going to be there (in London), our decision is he can run both," Reddy told AP. "There's no reason why he can't."

[...]

He was selected alongside Willem de Beer, Ofentse Mogawane and Shaun de Jager for the 4x400 and also will be South Africa's only entry in the men's 400. He missed out by less than a quarter of a second at his final qualifying race at the African championships.

 

[minor4th]

Are you referring to OP's very low score of empathy?

I was referring to the whole thing. I didn't notice a "low score of empathy" though.

 

[Val1]

I was referring to the whole thing. I didn't notice a "low score of empathy" though.

It was actually labeled the WRM scale, it was only 35.

 

[zwiebel]

I couldn't agree more!

I can't imagine why OP wouldn't have realized he would be hit with "Thou shalt not kill."

So, did this misguided self-PR come up due to bar fight Saturday night?

O/T - @zwie - I should tease you for taking so long to rest up after your last wee-hours-of-morning Court Reporting duties, but I won't.

I'm not resting, Lol! I'm waiting.......the tension of waiting for this verdict and the verdict in Australia's Gerard Baden Clay trial is rendering me speechless. I can't even bring myself to check if the verdict's in yet for GBC.

ETA: I should have been braver earlier! Verdict was in hours ago for the Baden Clay trial. Guilty.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

Hi, everyone! I'm new to Websleuths. My first post here.

HOW is it that the “intruder” did not simply use the LADDERS directly below Oscar’s OPEN bedroom balcony doors? Must have been the stupidest “intruder” in the history of ever.

Remember, folks, the balcony light was ON that night; he testified to going onto the balcony TWICE (get the fan(s) and yell for help) - but this "terrified", super-security-conscious guy never once noticed the ladders?!

Which makes Oscar Pistorius the stupidest liar in the history of ever.

 

[Val1]

Hi, everyone! I'm new to Websleuths. My first post here.

HOW is it that the “intruder” did not simply use the LADDERS directly below Oscar’s OPEN bedroom balcony doors? Must have been the stupidest “intruder” in the history of ever.

Remember, folks, the balcony light was ON that night; he testified to going onto the balcony TWICE (get the fan(s) and yell for help) - but this "terrified", super-security-conscious guy never once noticed the ladders?!

Which makes Oscar Pistorius the stupidest liar in the history of ever.

I believe the ladders were actually around the corner from the bedroom balcony, just under the broken downstairs windows which iirc is beneath the balcony with the hot tub that was accessed from the upstairs lounge area. Otherwise, agreed.

 

[JuneBug67]

It was actually labeled the WRM scale, it was only 35.

The WRM scale is not meant to measure capacity for empathy in isolation. It is a broader measure of how warm, engaging and trusting a person is in interpersonal dealings vs being more aloof or mistrustful. Perhaps being a celebrity could have a significant impact on this. The scale which specifically measures 'poor empathy' is the ANT (antisocial) scale on which Oscar was lower than the norm at 45. So it is possible that we could perhaps equally conclude that Oscar has a greater capacity for empathy than average.

 

[believe09]

Welcome to Websleuths, Lux et Veritas!!!!!

 

[Interested Bystander]

Hi, everyone! I'm new to Websleuths. My first post here.

HOW is it that the “intruder” did not simply use the LADDERS directly below Oscar’s OPEN bedroom balcony doors? Must have been the stupidest “intruder” in the history of ever.

Remember, folks, the balcony light was ON that night; he testified to going onto the balcony TWICE (get the fan(s) and yell for help) - but this "terrified", super-security-conscious guy never once noticed the ladders?!

Which makes Oscar Pistorius the stupidest liar in the history of ever.

What is especially strange for me is that if ladders had been used, they would have needed assembling and then be laid against the wall at the bathroom windows in complete silence. When we have painters outside the noise is very apparent and we are double glazed which OP's house is not. That, together with the adjustment of the ladders, the clunk they make when they hit the wall and the noise as the ladders flex against the brickwork when being climbed indicates to me that OP didn't think through his alibi. Whilst a burglar would attempt to be quieter than general workmen I don't believe these ladders could have been lifted into place and used in the dead of night without creating a signficant noise factor .

 

[IPITY]

The WRM scale is not meant to measure capacity for empathy in isolation. It is a broader measure of how warm, engaging and trusting a person is in interpersonal dealings vs being more aloof or mistrustful. Perhaps being a celebrity could have a significant impact on this. The scale which specifically measures 'poor empathy' is the ANT (antisocial) scale on which Oscar was lower than the norm at 45. So it is possible that we could perhaps equally conclude that Oscar has a greater capacity for empathy than average.

I don't understand this. Please could you explain further?

 

[jay-jay]

What is especially strange for me is that if ladders had been used, they would have needed assembling and then be laid against the wall at the bathroom windows in complete silence. When we have painters outside the noise is very apparent and we are double glazed which OP's house is not. That, together with the adjustment of the ladders, the clunk they make when they hit the wall and the noise as the ladders flex against the brickwork when being climbed indicates to me that OP didn't think through his alibi. Whilst a burglar would attempt to be quieter than general workmen I don't believe these ladders could have been lifted into place and used in the dead of night without creating a signficant noise factor .

Absolutely .. there is no way that anyone would suddenly think that an intruder had entered through a bathroom window in the dead of night, without first having heard the sound of the ladders being extended and put against the wall. Hence why his story is a load of old BS.

 

[JuneBug67]

Are you referring to OP's very low score of empathy?

Wow. Was this really your reply to minor4th saying the report was interesting to read? The fact is that the report could hardly have been more favourable to Oscar's case. And your summation is the twisting of a single measure among dozens. Like I said. Just wow.

 

[IPITY]

The WRM scale and its rough equivalents in other formal personality inventories are not concerned with capacity for empathy in isolation. Some people are naturally trusting, warm and open and connected to others. Others are more aloof, distant, mistrustful, impatient. The latter may open up and engage less easily or less often, but when they do they do not necessarily lack normal caring and empathy. On the other hand the antisocial personality lacks a fundamental capacity for empathy. I'm not sure if that helps or adds anything more. Sorry if I've missed the point of your question.

No, that's great and now I understand. Thank you.

 

[Greater Than]

I've seen more from him than I've seen from the usual suspects that post on these boards.

I personally have no empathy for a murderer.

Wow. Was this really your reply to minor4th saying the report was interesting to read? The fact is that the report could hardly have been more favourable to Oscar's case. And your summation is the twisting of a single measure among dozens. Like I said. Just wow.

It would have been more favorable to Oscar's case if the report indicated he was bat-**** crazy.

 

[Greater Than]

I wish My Lady would come forth and issue a new ruling that OP could no longer drink alcohol while out on bail. He is an 'accident' just waiting to happen. I m sure he still has access to some loaded weapons stashed somewhere. He should NOT be drinking out in clubs. He could easily be triggered to start shooting a place up.

In that interview OP's father gave at the beginning of the trial he said he, OP's grandfather, and OP's uncles own 55 guns between them. OP most definitely has access to loaded weapons.

 

[AJ_DS]

I'm not sure he actually "won the right to compete against able-bodied athletes". . . . I might be in err, but I thought I read much about Oscar NOT actually having the best times to compete in the Olympics. There were one or two other athletes with better times and should have held the spot Oscar took. But a lot of political, behind the scenes discussions persuaded the appropriate people, that Oscar needed to be allowed a spot. Lots of PR and support for him to race, but other hard working athletes were slighted.

As I said, I might be wrong, but that was my understanding. OP should not have actually been given the spot. Others had better times.

I know that wasn't your main point, and I agree to what you're saying...very sad situation. I do think he had quite a few people "duped" for a long time....quite a big head, the "golden boy" of S.A.

I also agree with your last statement..."what an a-hole".

After very expensive legal proceedings involving attorneys and various experts, OP managed to get the ruling overturned and was allowed to compete against able-bodied athletes.

What was the outcome ?

OP chose to participate only in the 400-meter event against able-bodied athlete :

- In 2008 Beijing, OP failed to achieve the minimum qualifying time and did not even participate.

- In 2012 London, OP came in 23rd out of 24 athletes… the last place athlete injured himself during the race and could not even finish it… in all fairness, OP was dead last.

The reality is that OP's time in the 400-meter event were NEVER good enough to compete against able-bodied athletes… OP knew it, OP's coach knew it, OP's manager knew it, everybody knew it…

Therefore, OP's legal proceedings were utterly pointless to begin with… the sole purpose was the marketing of the OP brand : to be the first disabled athlete to compete in the Olympics.

I see a parallel with the criminal Trial… OP knows the truth : he knowingly shot and killed Reeva during a row… but OP believes that with cunning, relentless persistence, money, top attorneys and various experts, he will manage to overcome the charges against him.

Oscar Pistorius is truly a pathetic excuse of a man.

 

[AJ_DS]

BIB - lol, yes! And afterwards his media manager issued a statement from his uncle denying what the media reported happened that night.

I wonder if they're tired of making excuses for his poor judgement.

I can just imagine how OP and his 'mightier than thou' attitude will play out for him in an SA prison with hardened criminals !!

 

[Greater Than]

What is especially strange for me is that if ladders had been used, they would have needed assembling and then be laid against the wall at the bathroom windows in complete silence. When we have painters outside the noise is very apparent and we are double glazed which OP's house is not. That, together with the adjustment of the ladders, the clunk they make when they hit the wall and the noise as the ladders flex against the brickwork when being climbed indicates to me that OP didn't think through his alibi. Whilst a burglar would attempt to be quieter than general workmen I don't believe these ladders could have been lifted into place and used in the dead of night without creating a signficant noise factor .

This is such a great point. I hope Nel includes this in his closing. In OP's version, at the time the intruder would have been placing the ladder against the wall, his balcony door was open and, by his own admission, he was awake. If he could hear the sound of a window slide open, he would've also heard a clanky ladder being pulled away from the other aluminum ladder, moved into the upright position, and then a creaking sound with each step the intruder took on the way up.

OP claims that bathroom window was closed. Why on earth would an intruder choose that second floor window to gain entry, not knowing if it was locked or not. They got lucky that it was unlocked and just slid it open? And imagine how much of a ruckus would have been made when the intruder lifted their body through the window. I can't even imagine how someone could do that. Once you reach the height of the window sill, do you turn your body away from the window to sit on on it and then swing your legs around and then jump down into the bathroom? Or do you dive head first through the window falling onto the bathroom floor? The more I try to picture the scenario in my mind, the more ridiculous it becomes.

 

[kittychi]

~rsbm~

Good point, Zwiebs .. also agree with you re. him being a danger to society .. if he is let off of killing Reeva, then this type of situation is going to crop up time and time again while he is out and about, and I can see OP kicking off with someone again, and yet another person dying by his hand. He is totally out of control, and I believe that alcohol is playing a very big part in this ... his behaviour seems so familiar to me .. I would be extremely surprised if he hadn't been drinking that night he killed Reeva.

BBM: Me too. I have been thinking that from the very beginning of this. In every "incident" that OP was involved, there was some type of social gathering with drinking. Why would the murder of Reeva be different? He is an angry, mean drunk.

I also think relaxing the bail conditions to allow alcohol consumption was because he uses/needs alcohol to cope with stress.

 

[kittychi]

What is especially strange for me is that if ladders had been used, they would have needed assembling and then be laid against the wall at the bathroom windows in complete silence. When we have painters outside the noise is very apparent and we are double glazed which OP's house is not. That, together with the adjustment of the ladders, the clunk they make when they hit the wall and the noise as the ladders flex against the brickwork when being climbed indicates to me that OP didn't think through his alibi. Whilst a burglar would attempt to be quieter than general workmen I don't believe these ladders could have been lifted into place and used in the dead of night without creating a signficant noise factor .

BBM: Right, especially since he says he was already awake.

You have found another hole in his story where he would have to come up with another "yeah, but."