Trial Discussion Thread #48

[Cherwell]

Take heart, Cherwell! Judge Masipa is no bleeding-heart lightweight.

Anti-violence against women is a very special interest she holds dear.

She recently sentenced a serial rapist to 252 years in prison and a life sentence to a wife-killer.

But you are still talking about him being acquitted .. why should he be? It's so clear and obvious that he killed Reeva intentionally, an acqittal just shouldn't even enter into the equation.

I have every confidence in Judge Masipa. My fears are that after she has passed sentence, he will go free on bail pending appeal, and that this situation may continue for a lengthy period. I still fear that money and influence will prevent him from ever seeing the inside of a real prison.

 

[vansleuths]

But you are still talking about him being acquitted .. why should he be? It's so clear and obvious that he killed Reeva intentionally, an acqittal just shouldn't even enter into the equation.

I'm not the judge in this case but from listening to all of the testimony, I do feel he is guilty of murder and should spend a long time in prison.

The judge may see things differently and she will need to explain her reasoning during her judgement. I'm just saying there is a chance that he is acquitted (if strings are pulled) or he is charged with CH, avoids a prison sentence and receives house custody. There is a real possibility of CH. I'd hate to see it, but it could happen.

Under these circumstances, if he avoids the justice through the court, I believe he will still face justice through civil society and life won't be the same for him.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

Well, I know if I heard a “noise” from the bathroom I’d IMMEDIATELY be “terrified”, IMMEDIATELY assume it was an “intruder”, IMMEDIATELY grab my gun and IMMEDIATELY shoot FOUR times through a closed, locked toilet door - even though my girlfriend’s in the house, was just in my bed and I just freaking spoke with her.

Ooops.

But, hey, we’d all do the same thing, right?

OP’s insane story is so g#dd#mn bizarre as to be the stuff of Hollywood grade B sci-fi/film noir.

 

[jay-jay]

Jay-jay, I don't think anyone suggested that "it wouldn't really matter too much" if Pistorius escapes jail. I will be utterly furious if that happens. The only thing to take comfort from in that eventuality is that everybody knows who he is and what he has done - and the despicable way he has behaved trying to save his own rotten skin. With feelings running high, who knows what might happen. Wherever he goes, he risks meeting somebody who might stick the knife in - so to speak.

The point about my acquaintance (yes, he did do a few years inside, not what most people tend to expect from a "life sentence" though) is that he is an anonymous joe who could start again in a new community without any of his neighbours knowing what he'd done. That's impossible for OP.

BIB .. every post of vansleuth's during this line of discussion has said exactly that .. I don't know why you are trying to defend it or make it sound like something different is being said.

 

[eimajjjj]

I'm not the judge in this case but from listening to all of the testimony, I do feel he is guilty of murder and should spend a long time in prison.

The judge may see things differently and she will need to explain her reasoning during her judgement. I'm just saying there is a chance that he is acquitted (if strings are pulled) or he is charged with CH, avoids a prison sentence and receives house custody. There is a real possibility of CH. I'd hate to see it, but it could happen.

Under these circumstances, if he avoids the justice through the court, I believe he will still face justice through civil society and life won't be the same for him.

That wouldn't be justice in the slightest.

 

[vansleuths]

I have every confidence in Judge Masipa. My fears are that after she has passed sentence, he will go free on bail pending appeal, and that this situation may continue for a lengthy period. I still fear that money and influence will prevent him from ever seeing the inside of a real prison.

We're on the same page. I do fear money and power will somehow keep him out of prison, even if it is on appeal. Meredith Kercher was killed in 2007 and 7 years later, that case is still ongoing.

 

[jay-jay]

I think I'll leave this discussion for a while as it seems to have taken a most peculiar turn .. I know what I read at the beginning of this line of discussion, I wasn't mistaken and I found it just as offensive as eimajjjjbut somehow it's ended up being twisted round ... I'll leave you guys to it.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

BIB - The problem with his claim that he was so fearful of intruders is that not only did the DT fail to provide a shred of evidence to support that claim, there is evidence to the contrary.

- He lived in a highly secure, control-accessed gated community.

- The gated community has 24 hour roving security patrol.

- His house had an alarm system, including outside motion detector beams.

- He did not have burglar bars on the windows.

- One of his downstairs windows was broken, but he was never concerned enough to have it repaired.

- He slept with the balcony doors not only unlocked, but wide open.

- He did not check on or secure the workers' ladders before going to bed.

Under these conditions, do you honestly believe he was fearful of an intruder entering his home?

That doesn't even include OP's two large guard dogs ("Enzo" and "Sylah") outside that night! (Sure must have been one sneaky Ninja intruder!)

His whining claims of "fear", his entire story is bizarre in the extreme.

No rational, reasonable person would swallow such garbage.

 

[foxbluff]

So this makes me wonder if perhaps depositions were taken before the trial that would answer the many questions we have. More than once we have asked each other why Nel did not confront a clear break in OP's story, or why he did not call him on obvious (to us) lies during his testimony, or why certain witnesses were not called.

Could it be that depositions were taken during discovery period, presented to the judge, and we would never know the content of those?

Hmm... that's an interesting thought, Kitty, regarding did the lawyers happen to enter any depositions into the court records without mentioning them. If they did enter such into evidence I suppose they could both comment on the contents in their closing statements..??

OK, another question on that... if they did enter such depositions into the record... wouldn't they have announced (on camera) that such and such disposition was being entered as Exhibit SS or some such identification? For all posters here who are able to stream vids of each day's testimony, do you hear the lawyers asking the judge for permission to enter each piece of evidence into the record...such as the photos, cricket bat, etc.

If they did take depositions from NetCare, it really does seem those deps would have helped one side or the other. It could be possible, I suppose, that NetCare doesn't record such calls and the deposed individual can't remember the conversation with OP. In which case, here we go again!!

 

[Cherwell]

Wouldn't it be bitterly ironic (Mistress Karma and her wicked sense of humor) if OP lost his life at the hands of someone with anger and control issues? I think sometimes only his fame and fortune (and dumb luck) have kept him alive this long, considering his ever-growing roster of social sins...and enemies. Not to mention his adrenaline-junkie, death-wish lifestyle.

The dodgy, downright dangerous "associates" he now chooses to hang out with will not be good for his future.

Then again, he'll probably see those same dodgy, downright dangerous "associates" in prison. LOL

My thoughts exactly.

If justice is not seen to be done, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if someone decided to take the law into their own hands with regard to OP.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

I have every confidence in Judge Masipa. My fears are that after she has passed sentence, he will go free on bail pending appeal, and that this situation may continue for a lengthy period. I still fear that money and influence will prevent him from ever seeing the inside of a real prison.

Extra-generous bail on appeal will likely be harder to get, considering his in-your-face exploits with the Gina Myers comment and the drunken VIP Room brawl. This will not escape the court’s notice and no doubt, knowing OP, there will be many more such “incidents” and f#ckups. He just can’t help himself.

If he somehow survives to actually go to prison, I’ll be surprised.

His “life” is now sh#t. He’s a social pariah. What else does the man who has lost 'everything' by his own hand have to lose?

I think he’d rather die than go to prison. “Accidental” / on-purpose suicide in such cases is not unheard of. (Remember the guy who swallowed a cyanide capsule in court, immediately after being convicted?)

Further, there are likely more than a few individuals with his same specific “mindset” (OP’s aggressive, ego-driven personality) who’d like nothing better than to take out a “prize” like girlfriend-killer Pistorius.

Any way OP slices it - his life is over - just a matter of how it goes down.

 

[vansleuths]

BIB .. every post of vansleuth's during this line of discussion has said exactly that .. I don't know why you are trying to defend it or make it sound like something different is being said.

Could you find one post where I say OP deserves to be acquitted? I've never said that. I've merely raised the fact that this is a possibility because of the strings that could be pulled or through appeal.

I've said a few times that my post was misread and I've tried over and over to clarify my position on this subject.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

I think I'll leave this discussion for a while as it seems to have taken a most peculiar turn .. I know what I read at the beginning of this line of discussion, I wasn't mistaken and I found it just as offensive as eimajjjjbut somehow it's ended up being twisted round ... I'll leave you guys to it.

Aww, don't leave, Jay-jay! We've got tons of other discussions and theories going!

 

[Lux et Veritas]

My thoughts exactly.

If justice is not seen to be done, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if someone decided to take the law into their own hands with regard to OP.

I was always surprised OJ never had an unfortunate "ACCIDENT".

 

[soozieqtips]

Hmm... that's an interesting thought, Kitty, regarding did the lawyers happen to enter any depositions into the court records without mentioning them. If they did enter such into evidence I suppose they could both comment on the contents in their closing statements..??

OK, another question on that... if they did enter such depositions into the record... wouldn't they have announced (on camera) that such and such disposition was being entered as Exhibit SS or some such identification? For all posters here who are able to stream vids of each day's testimony, do you hear the lawyers asking the judge for permission to enter each piece of evidence into the record...such as the photos, cricket bat, etc.

If they did take depositions from NetCare, it really does seem those deps would have helped one side or the other. It could be possible, I suppose, that NetCare doesn't record such calls and the deposed individual can't remember the conversation with OP. In which case, here we go again!!

BBM - I'm sure someone posted a Netcare link in an earlier thread that stated quite clearly they do record emergency calls. Several of us have wondered why on earth Netcare weren't called. In the UK, all emergency calls are recorded, and some of those calls are played in court during murder trials (where the caller is the actual murderer). I would have thought Netcare had a duty to keep recordings of emergency calls, even if only to prove what advice they've given. In OP's case, surely it would have been gross negligence to suggest he moved a body with a gunshot to the head.

 

[Greater Than]

Extra-generous bail on appeal will likely be harder to get, considering his in-your-face exploits with the Gina Myers comment and the drunken VIP Room brawl. This will not escape the court’s notice and no doubt, knowing OP, there will be many more such “incidents” and f#ckups. He just can’t help himself.

If he somehow survives to actually go to prison, I’ll be surprised.

His “life” is now sh#t. He’s a social pariah. What else does the man who has lost 'everything' by his own hand have to lose?

I think he’d rather die than go to prison. “Accidental” / on-purpose suicide in such cases is not unheard of. (Remember the guy who swallowed a cyanide capsule in court, immediately after being convicted?)

Further, there are likely more than a few individuals with his same specific “mindset” (OP’s aggressive, ego-driven personality) who’d like nothing better than to take out a “prize” like girlfriend-killer Pistorius.

Any way OP slices it - his life is over - just a matter of how it goes down.

"I'll survive. I always win." - Oscar Pistorius

 

[Lux et Veritas]

"I'll survive. I always win." - Oscar Pistorius

The ego and bravado never end, do they? lol

We'll see. He's never been convicted of murder and sent to prison before either. LOL Perhaps he's not as tough as he thinks he is. (Whining, wailing and puking into The Green Bucket is not exactly macho material.)

(I'm trying to remember - did he say that to a cop at the crime scene?)

 

[Greater Than]

The ego and bravado never end, do they? lol

We'll see. He's never been convicted of murder and sent to prison before either. LOL Perhaps he's not as tough as he thinks he is. (Whining, wailing and puking into The Green Bucket is not exactly macho material.)

(I'm trying to remember - did he say that to a cop at the crime scene?)

Indeed he did. Charming, isn't he?

 

[jilly]

I'm not the judge in this case but from listening to all of the testimony, I do feel he is guilty of murder and should spend a long time in prison.

The judge may see things differently and she will need to explain her reasoning during her judgement. I'm just saying there is a chance that he is acquitted (if strings are pulled) or he is charged with CH, avoids a prison sentence and receives house custody. There is a real possibility of CH. I'd hate to see it, but it could happen.

Under these circumstances, if he avoids the justice through the court, I believe he will still face justice through civil society and life won't be the same for him.

I don't think he'll be acquitted. Nope. 4 shots through a closed door. Can't say I haven't had my doubts about the Judge though with some of her questions. She jumped on the psychological assessment. It had nagged at me that she might be looking for an 'out', however, she may be simply have been preserving the record. No Judge wants an appeal. I'm still not sure, she will give him prison time or that the prosecution nailed this for her.
I'll be elated though, if Oscar does get time.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

Indeed he did. Charming, isn't he?

He certainly is! In a wonderfully understated, psychotic sort of way.

What a strange, ominous thing to say, right after you've "accidentally" killed the "love" of your life.

What a frightening look into his psyche.

Whatever went on immediately before the shooting between OP and Reeva (I'm sure we'll never know) - he did indeed "survive" and "win".

If I didn't know any better, I'd even say it might be a veiled, subconscious confession to murder.

Or perhaps I think too much. LOL