BBM - and not only is he not remorseful for killing her, but I wouldn't mind betting he is seething with anger for her, for in his mind I reckon he well and truly blames Reeva for all of this that has happened to him.
Trial Discussion Thread #58 - 14.17.10, Day 47 ~ sentencing~
- Thread starter beach
- Start date
- Status
BBM - and not only is he not remorseful for killing her, but I wouldn't mind betting he is seething with anger for her, for in his mind I reckon he well and truly blames Reeva for all of this that has happened to him.
Agreed, and I'm surprised that it wasn't pointed out more in the media how little emotion he showed during Kim's testimony - which was very emotional for almost everyone else - and how much emotion he showed for himself when Roux was going on about poor Oscar the victim. That spoke so many volumes to me.
soozieqtips
Owned by a cat...
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2011
- Messages
- 2,954
- Reaction score
- 0
Slightly OT, but here's a UK judge who police want to be investigated for his lenient sentences to domestic abusers.
"Three police and crime commissioners have taken the unprecedented step of calling for a leading judge to be investigated for misconduct on the grounds that he has “wholly disregarded sentencing guidelines on domestic abuse”. As a result of this, they claim, he has “failed to deliver justice for the public”.
http://www.theguardian.com/society/...mestic-abusers-say-three-police-commissioners
"Three police and crime commissioners have taken the unprecedented step of calling for a leading judge to be investigated for misconduct on the grounds that he has “wholly disregarded sentencing guidelines on domestic abuse”. As a result of this, they claim, he has “failed to deliver justice for the public”.
http://www.theguardian.com/society/...mestic-abusers-say-three-police-commissioners
Judge Masipa has delivered some hefty sentences in the past. I am hopeful that she does so again.
I thought Nel's argument that this is "negligence bordering on intent" was very strong and persuasive, and a clear marker of what the sentence should be.
I am worried about the health of some members of this forum if a lenient sentence is imposed... [emoji4]
I thought Nel's argument that this is "negligence bordering on intent" was very strong and persuasive, and a clear marker of what the sentence should be.
I am worried about the health of some members of this forum if a lenient sentence is imposed... [emoji4]
Pistorian *advertiser censored*.
I might be in the minority here, but during sentencing, I felt like a voyeur for the first time during the trial, and uncomfortable as a result.
I should state that I believe Pistorius shot Reeva in a rage, and must face the consequences of his actions, and these have to be a lengthy stretch, as punishment and deterrent.
However, I take no delight in his likely imprisonment. He is obviously an individual with psychological issues, from a family with an odd dynamic, and is someone who has struggled against significant challenges.
It is sad and depressing that Reeva's life and potential was wasted, yet it is also sad that OP overcame all his challenges only to throw his own life away so pointlessly.
My interest in this case was piqued by the absurd defence given by Pistorius but at the end of it all, I will want no part in the vitriolic celebration of his incarceration.
I should state that I believe Pistorius shot Reeva in a rage, and must face the consequences of his actions, and these have to be a lengthy stretch, as punishment and deterrent.
However, I take no delight in his likely imprisonment. He is obviously an individual with psychological issues, from a family with an odd dynamic, and is someone who has struggled against significant challenges.
It is sad and depressing that Reeva's life and potential was wasted, yet it is also sad that OP overcame all his challenges only to throw his own life away so pointlessly.
My interest in this case was piqued by the absurd defence given by Pistorius but at the end of it all, I will want no part in the vitriolic celebration of his incarceration.
Interesting post jimmy73. I'll admit I want him to go to prison for two reasons: one is that I agree with you on him knowingly shooting RS and though the judge's ruling and whatever sentence he receives won't reflect that, at least it will be something. The other reason is I want the message to be sent, at least on this occasion, that wealth and fame are not necessarilly enough to allow people to not face the consequences of their actions. Had he been a 'nobody' unable to afford the likes of Roux and co I have little doubt he'd have been in prison from the day of his arrest and would still be there.
I see where you are coming from re the voyeurism. This is only the second trial I have followed - the other was Jodi Arias and ironically it was OP's that led me to her's. I have found it very interesting to watch in terms of how the law works and I think I have learned many things I knew nothing about before but I also feel that at times it has felt almost unhealthy. Some of my friends were asking 'why are you so into this' and it's hard to answer beyond a vague 'well it's fascinating' but if I were being totally honest part of it was I got into the various personalities and wanted to see Nel 'win', Uncle Arnold's smug smirk wiped off his face, the rest of the clan forced to confront who OP really is and of course, OP himself go down. The same thing happened with Jodi Arias and it was like watching a movie where you want to see the bad guy lose in the end. And to be honest I don't really like feeling like that, especially when I have no personal involvement with any of the people or even countries involved. Since I'm 'sharing' here I'll also say that in both trials I felt no particular 'kinship' with the victims beyond that of it being a shame that someone young died in a violent manner and hoping their families and friends received justice. And Reeva Steenkamp does sound like she was a very nice person. But very nice people die needlessly and violently every day and their stories should be no less important. The number of women killed everyday in SA by their partners is a horrifying example of that.
So apologies that this is a bit rambling but it's a slow time till Tuesday and your post made me think about my own motives and reactions in relation to this trial. To sum up, yes I've been very into this but am glad that it's nearly over for everyone's sake, mine included, and I don't plan to follow any more. Besides, I'm way behind on work! For all that though it has been a very interesting journey so thanks to all for their thoughtful, insightful and at times funny posts, even the people I didn't agree with. And of course, all this is just my own personal opinion - just as everyone has their own story, we all have our own reasons why we've spent so much of the past 18 months in a South African courtroom.
I think OP has been spinning out of control for some time now. His attitude that he "does what he pleases, family owns Pres. Zuma, etc, etc" has escalated from reckless driving, shooting guns out of cars/restaurants, throwing public violent tantrums when results aren't what he wants, injuring people for simply not agreeing/going along with him, crashing boats (luckily only injured himself) while drinking, and much more. The public and the law has turned a cheek and looked the other way every time he has done something that regular, everyday people like you & I would have suffered consciences for. Now he has actually killed a young, vibrant, smart woman and expected to walk away with a slap on the wrist, and then continue with his sponsors, income, travel and wealth.
I have no reservations that OP knew Reeva was awake & behind that toilet door. That he heard her scream numerous times and that the lights were on. Unfortunately, I don't believe J.Marispa is likely to send him to prison for even a year (after how she handled the verdict), but even a short "timeout" behind bars will be of benefit to this young man, a reality check that is much needed. He doesn't need all these "yes men" in his life since he began competing, he needs some boundaries and much needed consequences when he steps outside those. Just like the majority of the public faces when we do as we please and it results in the detriment of others.
I personally will be extremely disappointed and disheartened if this young man can commit this crime and not serve time behind bars for his actions and for the life he took. I will certainly not be gleeful, but I will be grateful if he is given a lengthy prison term. It will restore some justice (not peace or resolve) to the Steenkamp's and the loss they can never recoup. It will also give this man a much needed reality check, and perhaps save others from his out of control wrath in the future.
I agree, Nel did an excellent job with his "heads of argument" and the trial in general. However, I have lost all faith in J.Masipa (and the strong powers "above her") that a "hefty sentence" will be imposed. I felt after Friday that her interest in what Nel had to say, including accommodations in prison for the disabled, gave me hope of a deserving sentence. But then reality set in, and I thought about all the $$, influence and powerful people Uncle Arnold is contacting and pulling out all the stops after the conclusion of court Friday, and I was back to believing the Pistorius family (and OP of course) will walk out of court TUESDAY with the end result they had planned/arranged for. ....I am starting to think the Pistorius clan are the S.A. version of "The Godfather".
Greater Than
Retired Moderator
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2014
- Messages
- 3,948
- Reaction score
- 75
I will.
This is about justice for the victim. And about due process for the convicted criminal.
OP didn't kill Reeva in a car accident due to reckless driving. He didn't kill her by pushing her too hard causing her to fall and crack her head open. He fired not one, not two, not three, but four hollow point bullets into a tiny room she was trapped in. Four independent, conscious trigger pulls.
He murdered her, but got away with a mere CH conviction. Reeva deserves a prison sentence handed down. I will absolutely celebrate if she gets the justice she deserves.
soozieqtips
Owned by a cat...
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2011
- Messages
- 2,954
- Reaction score
- 0
I will be glad to see him go to prison and be out of harm's way for once. Celebration doesn't have to be vitriolic. If justice is done for Reeva (the only victim in this case) then that's a good reason to celebrate, in my opinion. Her family have made it clear that house arrest as a punishment does not fit the crime, and I couldn't agree more.
Greater Than
Retired Moderator
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2014
- Messages
- 3,948
- Reaction score
- 75
He does. He said so on the stand. He said if she had only called out to him..let him know she was in there....
This is all her fault.
Marfa Lights
Member
- Joined
- May 4, 2014
- Messages
- 682
- Reaction score
- 0
Guess Carl skipped class the day they actually read Nietzsche or he would know Nietzsche was an atheist.
KarenUK
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2011
- Messages
- 828
- Reaction score
- 2,552
Respectfully snipped for space
I'm interested that the one other for you was the Jodi Arias case, that was also probably one of the first court cases I paid close attention to as a Websleuther, but I stopped watching and reading about it after the first two days of JA on the stand..... She was so determined to give all these details of their sex life etc was so unpleasant that watching it or hearing about it made me feel like I needed to go bath in bleach!
OP reminds me of Arias in a strange way (so false and self-obsessed), and all of OP's testimony about staggering around in the dark reminded me of Jodi's fog - a way of dodging cross examination and not giving away anything that might incriminate themselves.
Yes I also see some similarities between them - the arrogance primarilly and as you say the convenient fogs and darkness and of course their memory lapses. I think the 'tricky' part of getting involved in these trials is that I formed opinions on the personalities of those involved and with both Pistorius and Arias I came to heartily dislike them. That's the part that makes me uncomfortable I guess - likability has nothing to do with guilt or innocence but in both cases the lengths they've been willing to go to in trying to convince the courts of their 'innocence' has in turn led to me disliking them. It's all so confusing so it's lucky I guess that I happen to think they are both guilty as hell!
jilly
Registered User
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2004
- Messages
- 7,989
- Reaction score
- 53
Thanks for this.
I found it to be a difficult read, but either way, I think the Verdict needs to be appealed for some clarity.
vansleuths
New Member
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2014
- Messages
- 396
- Reaction score
- 0
Just finished watching all of Friday's court session and reading 27 pages of WS. Lots was covered, but I'm really surprised no one at all mentioned this, Nel gave Roux a taste of his own medicine by giving him the PT Heads of Arguments just minutes before Roux started to argue his own case.
We've always called Roux out on this and many, myself included will simply feel Nel was responding in kind by delaying the transfer of his HOA to the defence, but I'm surprised there was no mention of it.
We've always called Roux out on this and many, myself included will simply feel Nel was responding in kind by delaying the transfer of his HOA to the defence, but I'm surprised there was no mention of it.
vansleuths
New Member
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2014
- Messages
- 396
- Reaction score
- 0
Would you have a link to an article confirming this, I'd like to learn a bit more about the Appeal process?
:rolling:
.. just looking at Carl's twitter and this tweet here https://twitter.com/carlpistorius/status/522760893260918784 .. someone called 'uoboaubaouba' is having a right old go at him with loads of tweets .. does Carl ever actually read any of these? He can't do .. surely if they read it some of it would get home and they'd realise just how unacceptable their behaviour is .. they must have the skin of a rhino (probably one shot by them).
jilly
Registered User
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2004
- Messages
- 7,989
- Reaction score
- 53
I totally agree with you. He belongs in prison to reflect and get treatment/counselling. There's no hope for him otherwise. It would certainly do him well to get a break from his family.
Having said that, I think we'll be lucky if Masipa gives him a suspended sentence with treatment/counselling conditions. If so, I'm sure we'll be hearing about him getting into trouble again. It's inbred and inevitable.
- Status