GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #5

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@thinkhard, i get what ur saying about that location. while ive never been to istanbul, a us city rich in lovely and scarry historic sites alike is new orleans. there are places that photo well in a travelogue, but some are just scarry. i honestly think she was waiting for someone who didnt show, then must have started strolling just to pass the time and ended up one step further past where it was safe to be. another thing that could have fooled her as a new york pedestrian is that in many us cities, usually (but not always) if you keep walking through a bad part, youll get to a good part eventually. i know this is not the case in some cities around the world. idk if thats the case in istanbul.
 
I appreciate your perspective as well.

I have to say just one thing though, in photos and in certain places even those walls do look fascinating....but in person, particularly the area she was found, those walls are just creepy. There is trash and broken bottles, dirty blankets, clearly visible from the road. It is not an inviting place. Even when I would drive by there in a car, I would always get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach driving by parts of them.

The best I can try to explain it that maybe you'll understand, is that going into that area would be the equivalent to going for a walk under an old bridge where its clear homeless people live.

I dunno if that makes sense, but I hope.

I found this photo taken looking through a doorway of the Bucoleon Palace. I can see what you mean...

http://www.azriona.net/gallery/international/istanbul/bucoleon_interior.jpg
 
I'm not so sure that image is from the end of the Galata bridge

I don't mean it was at the end of Galata Bridge. I meant it was nearer to Galata Bridge than to Sarayburnu.

It is on the seaside of the pedestrian overpass over Kennedy Caddessi, near where Yali Kosky Caddesi takes off. At the base of the stairs on the seaside of the pedestrian overpass

This is why I place her there:

1. The distinctive big grid pattern on the pavement that looks fairly new
2. The presence of the metal bollards around the curb
3. The pavement has a rounded curve to it and there is a small rounded area where the road curves in as a taxi stop
4. There is a small building with a brown awning that is selling takeout food. The words "CAY" "TOST" "SA (rest obscured by walkway railing)
5. I believe the chest-high counter there is what looks like a step in the still shot
6. I can pan up and see the camera on a post looking down right over the little takeout place.

Again, I apologize for my lack of technical capacity. Maybe some kind person could pinpoint it on Yandex.Haritalar

All of the images I am looking at are from Yandex.Haritalar.
 
I found this photo taken looking through a doorway of the Bucoleon Palace. I can see what you mean...

http://www.azriona.net/gallery/international/istanbul/bucoleon_interior.jpg

Ya its such a shame, they SHOULD be a really cool place to visit.

Here is a picture of Rumeli Hisari...built in 1453 by Mehmet to Conquerer .... Way safer (if your not afraid of heights), super cheap at only 5ytl (3 bucks), best Bosphorous views, and you get to run around and pretend your Princess Buttercup from the princess bride :)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/27/Bosphore_-_Forteresse_Rumeli_Hisari.jpg
 
I don't mean it was at the end of Galata Bridge. I meant it was nearer to Galata Bridge than to Sarayburnu.

It is on the seaside of the pedestrian overpass over Kennedy Caddessi, near where Yali Kosky Caddesi takes off. At the base of the stairs on the seaside of the pedestrian overpass

This is why I place her there:

1. The distinctive big grid pattern on the pavement that looks fairly new
2. The presence of the metal stations around the curb
3. The pavement has a rounded curve to it and there is a small rounded area where the road curves in as a taxi stop
4. There is a small building with a brown awning that is selling takeout food. The words "CAY" "TOST" "SA (rest obscured by walkway railing)
5. I believe the chest-high counter there is what looks like a step in the still shot
6. I can pan up and see the camera on a post looking down right over the little takeout place.

Again, I apologize for my lack of technical capacity. Maybe some kind person could pinpoint it on Yandex.Haritalar

All of the images I am looking at are from Yandex.Haritalar.

Thanks I appreciate the effort to explain it.

Though FYI those distinctive big square pattern is in a lt of places in Istanbul, particularly in the courtyard all the way around Yeni Cami, that's the mosque you see right at the end of the Galata bridge on the eminonu side.
Which is why my first thought is that it looks like the street that runs along behind Yeni Cami.

Though you could very well be right. I can't get a real good idea of what is to the periphery in that image, and I don't think I'm able to zoom out.
 
Though FYI those distinctive big square pattern is in a lt of places in Istanbul, particularly in the courtyard all the way around Yeni Cami.

.

Yes, I moved the cursor over and took a trip around Yeni Cami. I can see the square pattern of the pavement all over there.

If you look at the still surveillance photos of SS, you can see the bollards, and the curve of the curb, with taxis beside it. You don't see the stairs, but you see the countertop of the takeout place.

In this way, she is on the sea side of Kennedy all along her route.
 
the bottom line seems to be that if sarai was killed in that location because she was there, it simply could be that she was on foot trying to find her way around solo and simply got lost. many a tourist around the world have run into trouble that way. if she went there on purpose because some told her "meet me there" is odd at best, but deserves inquiry. the possibility she was killed somewhere else and dumped there(which i dont believe) is even more odd.
 
Kennedy Cadessi images....

Just after the Galata bridge, but before the tram turns sharply toward Sultanahmet at Serkeci stop:

http://www.panoramio.com/m/photo/8454158

The first one is the spot. Go about 15ft from police car in the foreground to the right and that's where she was.

I believe the video was taken from the camera that is almost on top of Sarayburnu, where it turns to go into the park
 
the bottom line seems to be that if sarai was killed in that location because she was there, it simply could be that she was on foot trying to find her way around solo and simply got lost. many a tourist around the world have run into trouble that way. if she went there on purpose because some told her "meet me there" is odd at best, but deserves inquiry. the possibility she was killed somewhere else and dumped there(which i dont believe) is even more odd.

I totally get tourist wondering around scenario. As a matter of fact one of my absolute favorite things to do when visiting a new city is to simply walk around and get lost. I sort of hate just sticking to the strictly touristy areas, because in those areas, all you ever run into are tourist, and people trying to sell stuff to tourists. I call it, getting a feel for the city. You always find the best little hiden gems of cafes and shops that way.

The thing I find weird however about where Sarai would have just wondered too, is that she wondered to a place where there isn't much of anything. No shops, no places to get food, no people really. I mean she basically wandered down a highway.

Yes I understand there is the Bosphorous there, but it really isn't the best view of the Bosphorous. It's where the Bosphorous meets the golden horn, and the Sea of Marmara. It doesn't typically have the beautiful teal torquises color you see along other parts of the Bosphorous. Looking out across in a y direction you just see buildings and big cargo ships, there really isn't even a good skyline view of much at that point. And yes there are the walls, but in that area they are the equivalent to under bridges (homeless burrows) . The road on the seaside would be loud, with cars wizzing by.

Even a wandering tourist, I just can't see the appeal of that walk. I can't imagine it would feel relaxing. And there wouldn't be anything to "window shop" at. I'm not saying she couldn't have just wandered there....it's just difficult for me to believe that there wasnt something more specific bringing her to that spot. .... Kind of like we all kind of feel that there was something more specific which brought her to Istanbul in the first place.

It's like, how its not out of the question for a female to travel solo....but when you start adding other factors in; she left her kids, and her husband, she was going for 3 weeks, she had never been out if the country, she chose a less common destination, they didn't have a lot of money....you take anyone of those no biggie...but when you start putting them all together....you just start to question motive....I guess that's how I feel about her "choice" to go to the wall that day....I just feel there had to be something else to it.
 
:dance:
Kennedy Cadessi images....

Just after the Galata bridge, but before the tram turns sharply toward Sultanahmet at Serkeci stop:

http://www.panoramio.com/m/photo/8454158

The first photo is the place. :dance:

Go about 15ft from police car in the foreground to the right and that's where she was.

I believe the video was taken from the camera that is almost on top of Sarayburnu, where it turns to go into the park
 
The first one is the spot. Go about 15ft from police car in the foreground to the right and that's where she was.

I believe the video was taken from the camera that is almost on top of Sarayburnu, where it turns to go into the park

Thanks!

Only thing is, I didnt notice those distinct square tiling on the walkway there....perhaps a recent update (at least recent in regards to whenever this pic was taken)?


.... One more observation .... I noticed in the photo of her...the black short pole things, whatever there called, along the edge of the pedestrian walk seem to be connected (creating more of a barricade) with some kind of cabling. And the ones in the panorama photo are not connected at all.

My question is do you just think the panorama photo is old enough that the in the sarai photo that same area has had some updates? Or do you think we might have the wrong spot?

Please don't think I'm doubting you, I'm just "sleuthing" and working together and I just want to make sure we don't miss something.

Please don't feel insulted like I'm doubting you. Cause I don't mean that at all, and id feel really bad if I hurt your feelings.
 
Thanks!

Only thing is, I didnt notice those distinct square tiling on the walkway there....perhaps a recent update (at least recent in regards to whenever this pic was taken)?


.... One more observation .... I noticed in the photo of her...the black short pole things, whatever there called, along the edge of the pedestrian walk seem to be connected (creating more of a barricade) with some kind of cabling. And the ones in the panorama photo are not connected at all.

My question is do you just think the panorama photo is old enough that the in the sarai photo that same area has had some updates? Or do you think we might have the wrong spot?

Please don't think I'm doubting you, I'm just "sleuthing" and working together and I just want to make sure we don't miss something.

Please don't feel insulted like I'm doubting you. Cause I don't mean that at all, and id feel really bad if I hurt your feelings.

No feelings hurt, I assure you. If I could pin the place on Yandex.Haritalar it would be easier.

I can't tell much about the pavement from that height. The bollards (the short black curbside poles) look like they are new. It's really the countertop that clues it in for me. It had pot on the side which is probably for condiments or plastic utentils or maybe for garbage. I feel comfortable that's the spot, but others may certain not agree.
 
Even a wandering tourist, I just can't see the appeal of that walk. .

I totally agree.

It's a beautiful day. She's wearing some clean clothes. Getting packed, thinking about the kids. Supposed to meet TaylanK but that doesn't work out. From the timeline, she must have stopped somewhere as she would have been out for at least 4 hours prior to passing this way. Surely she would have exhausted the photographic opportunities. Yet we see her walking in a determined, almost brisk way along Kennedy Caddesi.

On a beautiful bright day, she goes out and ends up walking along the broken rubble and trash of an ugly old broken down part of the city.

Hmmmm. I think she didn't find what she came to Istanbul for.
 
I totally agree.

It's a beautiful day. She's wearing some clean clothes. Getting packed, thinking about the kids. Supposed to meet TaylanK but that doesn't work out. From the timeline, she must have stopped somewhere as she would have been out for at least 4 hours prior to passing this way. Surely she would have exhausted the photographic opportunities. Yet we see her walking in a determined, almost brisk way along Kennedy Caddesi.

On a beautiful bright day, she goes out and ends up walking along the broken rubble and trash of an ugly old broken down part of the city.

Hmmmm. I think she didn't find what she came to Istanbul for.

IF that's is her walking on video (I still have my doubts).....

Then the question is did the person she was going there to meet find her? .... Or did someone else first?

But here's the thing.....if she was going to meet someone else....and this someone else had no ill intentions for her....and they went to meet her at the walls....and they can't find her....so they leave feeling like they got stood up....and then she gets reported missing and it makes international news.....wouldn't the person who was suppose to meet her go to the police and say "we had plans to meet at the walls, but I came and I never saw her."


In less they did go to police and say this...and we just haven't heard about it...and that is why police started focusing on that area....or started focusing their camera searches on the cameras in that area.
 
A snippet from a discussion held on a Turkish based site from members living in Turkey. I never considered the police angle...interesting

".I wonder how she was dressed...as far as I know Istanbul is open minded in that case, but if a nyc girl, with her sexy party outfit would walk somewhere else in Turkey, alone at night, I wouldnt wonder if some *******s try to rape her...who knows, maybe it was the police who killed that poor girl I dont trust turkish police at all...a lot of them have connections to the Mafia. And also..imagine..if they raped her or did something else to her or something illegal, they maybe killed her, so that she can not tell anybody. ...or maybe it was just some psychopath"
 
A snippet from a discussion held on a Turkish based site from members living in Turkey. I never considered the police angle...interesting

".I wonder how she was dressed...as far as I know Istanbul is open minded in that case, but if a nyc girl, with her sexy party outfit would walk somewhere else in Turkey, alone at night, I wouldnt wonder if some *******s try to rape her...who knows, maybe it was the police who killed that poor girl I dont trust turkish police at all...a lot of them have connections to the Mafia. And also..imagine..if they raped her or did something else to her or something illegal, they maybe killed her, so that she can not tell anybody. ...or maybe it was just some psychopath"

Most of the street cops are about 18 and baby faced in Istanbul for starters.

Additionally I hardly think Turkey is alone in the whole mafia mixing with LE thing....ever been to Providence? What about Boston?

It's an interesting angle.

But I don't give it too much credit for being what happened to her. Something about a cop following her up into the walls to rape and bludgeon her, and get blood all over his uniform in broad day light....I'm not buying it.

Not that a would say it would be impossible for a Turkish cop to do something illegal...I mean I wouldn't believe cops pretty much anywhere are incapable of doing something illegal.

I just don't really see that sequence going down like that in this set of circumstances. At least not from what we know so far.

*also the quote, you quoted...doesn't sound like the most intelligent train of thought. It also doesn't sound like the voice of an expat living in Istanbul. (It sounds more like an 18 yr old airfirce recruit in incirlik, in otherwords, young, naive, and in a remote part of turkey, of course thats just my opinion). Additionally I am aware of all the expat sites, and you don't actually have to be an expat to join them. Just FYI.
 
I have to admit there were some outlandish theories being spread around over there. How about this for outlandish! A serial rapist Turkish police officer who attacks women while off-duty.
 
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