GUILTY TX - Former Dallas Police Officer Amber Guyger, indicted for Murder of Botham Shem Jean #8

[turaj]

I am on board with those who see the Judges behaviour as completely inappropriate.

It's all very well to say the justice system should be more compassionate. I can get behind that. But the message this sends in the context of US police shootings and the background of this case is just all wrong.

you know I am all for "compassion" in the courtroom For me I am okay when the brother asked to hug her...but after that she could have easily asked everyone to have a seat and spoke to the defendant as well as the courtroom and said whatever she wanted to communicate to Amber...that could have helped others in the courtroom and area.

 

[Weki]

So you believe his own brother was speaking of his forgiveness, and compassion from a detached place?

I'm not sure I even understand what that means though.

Imo, anyone who has given compassion, and forgiveness doesn't do it from a detached place, but have done it in their own personal lives as well. Jmho

I dont judge Bo's beautiful mom for feeling the way she does since she isnt someone who isn't detached, nor do I judge his brother for his forgiveness who isn't detached either.

It shows each one are all totally unique individuals, and not mere clones in mass.

Jmho

No I think you’re purposely misunderstanding what I’m referring to. It’s obvious I’m not referring to the Jean family.

 

[turaj]

The judge could’ve done what she did off camera. She knew cameras were there and she had to know the optics wouldn’t look good given the type of case this was. She had to have known there would be members of the community who would see the sentence as a betrayal. She had to know that! And she had to know her embrace of AG itself would be seen as betrayal. It’s simply not her role. If she had wanted to give a statement of healing for ALL from the bench it would’ve been more appropriate.

Unless it is reported that she does this on a regular basis then she was out of line. And now I’m wondering if it was a show for her buddies at the Dallas Police Association who have endorsed her for re-election?

I just posted similar thoughts. Those "optics" are things an elected judge is well aware of and she seemed to be comfortable doing what she did. I was not and I think the community and her superiors probably were not either.

 

[turaj]

On-camera was odd. She could have done all of that behind the scenes. I think some of the family was still in the courtroom (some of whom were still in shock from sentencing). Perhaps she was overcome after watching Bo's brother speak? I've never seen a more emotional judge than this one.

there is a big difference between "compassion" and "emotional" and the later is not good in our jurists.

 

[Weki]

Judges hear victim impact statements every day as part of their job. I mean I’m not saying she should be impenetrable but, in hindsight, I’m truly baffled by this judges show of so much emotion throughout the trial. There have been cases of such a heinous nature against children where judges do not show a hint of emotion. I think that’s what we expect from our judges.

And at the risk of getting stoned I also didn’t like her reaction to finding out the DA had violated the gag order. I mean, I understand her being upset and calling him to task but the whole turning around and bending over - what was that??? Just odd. Never seen that before either.

 

[BellaVita]

I didn’t follow this case. But after the verdict came in it was discussed at work yesterday. This was my first thought. Several times I have mistakenly walked into the wrong patient’s room, which for the most part, all rooms look the same, but immediately upon entering I have always recognized i’m In the wrong room and have never treated the wrong patient as a result. I work the same long shifts. I can’t understand how once she entered the apartment she didn’t realize it wasn’t her belongings surrounding her. Particularly the couch he was on. It would literally take a split second to realize you are in the wrong place. MOO

Tunnel vision/tunnel hearing could explain.
https://www.samatters.com/understanding-stress-part-5-tunnel-vision/
I've experienced it. Someone yelled "he's got gun" and my eyes went right to the gun he was holding. He was 10-15 feet away and for the life of me, I couldn't describe anything about him except his skin color. And that's because I was focused on the gun held in his hands. That was almost 30 years ago and I still can picture that gun clear as ever.

 

[turaj]

On CNN this morning Botham's father did an interview. Clearly there is a division in the family...father and brother both showing much sympathy to Amber...the mother and sister upset about sentence but accepting it. I have to say that at the first chance of parole which could be 5 years I think both Bertram and father will speak in favor of letting her out. The father indicated he wanted to hug her too and keep in contact. If the actual victim family wants parole she will be out before you know it.

 

[AllyBeeUK]

Waking up to this bit of news. Nasty comments directed at Brandt Jean on twitter? I can't say I'm surprised, which is sad.

I wish I knew where all this hate and vitriol came from. We didn't have it when I grew up, and I'm a lot older than you.

Everything is personal to everyone nowadays, which is concerning. There's no coping, no prioritizing, just heightened angst over everything these days were counselors needs to be on the ready and safe spaces must be made accessible.

A lot of hatred directed at him. It's so so sad. I can't get the link to post but his father has been on CNN expressing the same sentiment. I will say it again, what an impressive family.

They could have put her in prison for 30 years and she could suffer every day of it and she would never change, but by connecting with his family and accepting the gift they have given to her by way of love and forgiveness, that might just help to heal her. Whatever she has experienced or whatever she has been shown for her to end up how she did, I don't think that is irredeemable. Maybe they can move forward and bring some real change like his mum was talking about and Bo's death may not have been in vain.

Despite all this, I wish that he was still alive and I had never heard his name.

 

[turaj]

Judges hear victim impact statements every day as part of their job. I mean I’m not saying she should be impenetrable but, in hindsight, I’m truly baffled by this judges show of so much emotion throughout the trial. There have been cases of such a heinous nature against children where judges do not show a hint of emotion. I think that’s what we expect from our judges.

And at the risk of getting stoned I also didn’t like her reaction to finding out the DA had violated the gag order. I mean, I understand her being upset and calling him to task but the whole turning around and bending over - what was that??? Just odd. Never seen that before either.

It appears that Judge Tammy is pretty religious....maybe not to the extent of the Jean family but 4 bibles in your home indicates you might be more religious than the average. She could really relate to them. I have nothing against religion but she was way too involved in the case. Agree on DA reaction too.

 

[AllyBeeUK]

Forgiveness does not excuse their actions.

Forgiveness stops their actions from destroying your heart.

 

[BellaVita]

If the judge had embraced a young man who had just been convicted of killing a cop, I wonder how forgiving ppl would be? I wonder how forgiving ppl would be if a cop killer got 10 years? Cop killers get life typically. Just slapping a cop would get you 10 years probably. Accidentally hitting a cop during an altercation will get you charged with assaulting a PO. Are all those in favor of lighter sentences and forgiveness prepared to do so on cases that affect them and their loved LE buddies? I mean it’s so convenient to preach forgiveness and compassion from a detached place, isn’t it?

From the posts I have read here and the reaction of much of the public, I think many would be fine with the judge embracing a young man who had been convicted of killing a police officer. Especially under these circumstances. And I DO mean people from all walks of life/professions.

 

[Weki]

It appears that Judge Tammy is pretty religious....maybe not to the extent of the Jean family but 4 bibles in your home indicates you might be more religious than the average. She could really relate to them. I have nothing against religion but she was way too involved in the case. Agree on DA reaction too.

And you know what else, how are you as a judge going to get so emotional on the bench and then tell the gallery to keep it under control? I mean, YOU need to keep it under control and lead by example.

 

[turaj]

Boy I sure would like to hear from some of the jurors. Unfortunately I don't think we will have that chance. So many questions for them.

 

[Hraefn]

Im surprised at the harshness guided at Judge Kemp. Did the posters who have so much criticism of her watch the trial? She may have had to wipe her eyes a few times (for BOTH sides) but she never lost her composure, her neutrality, her control, or her fairness.
The bible was given after jurors were dismissed and after proceedings were concluded. I’m not a huge fan of that occurring, but I do not fault her for it professionally. Judge Kemp showed respect, empathy, humility, and fair mindedness in her actions after the proceedings.

There is a drastic difference in being impartial, fair, and unbiased than having zero emotion. The best judges are the former, not the latter IMO.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

No I think you’re purposely misunderstanding what I’m referring to. It’s obvious I’m not referring to the Jean family.

No I really wasn't.

So you are talking about the judge's behavior?

I thought all judges are to follow the law, and be merciful when doing so.. in their legal discretion when the sentences have a wide range as an option?

Even though I was surprised at the 10 year sentence, I've seen many judges impose sentences I didnt agree with ...whether merely no time was given or little time or going way overboard.

Jmho

 

[sloane7777]

Im surprised at the harshness guided at Judge Kemp. Did the posters who have so much criticism of her watch the trial? She may have had to wipe her eyes a few times (for BOTH sides) but she never lost her composure, her neutrality, her control, or her fairness.
The bible was given after jurors were dismissed and after proceedings were concluded. I’m not a huge fan of that occurring, but I do not fault her for it professionally. Judge Kemp showed respect, empathy, humility, and fair mindedness in her actions after the proceedings.

There is a drastic difference in being impartial, fair, and unbiased than having zero emotion. The best judges are the former, not the latter IMO.

OK can someone clear this up for me please ,
I thought you cant mix Church and State , that's why the schools don't pray Will some make me understand this because isn't there a seal in the courtrooms that say something about God ....I have been confused about this for a very long time need help here please .

 

[turaj]

Im surprised at the harshness guided at Judge Kemp. Did the posters who have so much criticism of her watch the trial? She may have had to wipe her eyes a few times (for BOTH sides) but she never lost her composure, her neutrality, her control, or her fairness.
The bible was given after jurors were dismissed and after proceedings were concluded. I’m not a huge fan of that occurring, but I do not fault her for it professionally. Judge Kemp showed respect, empathy, humility, and fair mindedness in her actions after the proceedings.

There is a drastic difference in being impartial, fair, and unbiased than having zero emotion. The best judges are the former, not the latter IMO.

The judge conducted a fair and speedy trial and I have been impressed with her. There were some times when she did all possible to hold back emotion (only human) and had a pretty visceral reaction to the texts authored by Amber which she previewed but jury was not in room. there was much confusion after court ended and it is possible she thought the cameras were not running??? One commentator mentioned had she taken off her robe and acted outside her judicial role it might have been better. I would agree with that. It is not just posters here that are bringing this up many people in the judicial field are questioning it. The only explanation might be Judge Tammy thought cameras were off....but these days someone will always get video. I still think her thoughts could have been expressed from the bench...I have seen many compassionate judges do just that...meaningful words for the defendant and entire room can benefit from hearing their thoughts. Now we have to guess what all that whispering was about.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

OK can someone clear this up for me please ,
I thought you cant mix Church and State , that's why the schools don't pray Will some make me understand this because isn't there a seal in the courtrooms that say something about God ....I have been confused about this for a very long time need help here please .

The judge gave her a bible after the trial. It’s been said that the judge is religious so I’m sure this was coming from a personal place. She wasn’t holding a bible study, right there, in the courtroom. No harm done, in my opinion.

On a side note, today is National Take Your Bible to School day!

 

[BellaVita]

OK can someone clear this up for me please ,
I thought you cant mix Church and State , that's why the schools don't pray Will some make me understand this because isn't there a seal in the courtrooms that say something about God ....I have been confused about this for a very long time need help here please .

"Separation of church and state" is paraphrased from Thomas Jefferson and used by others in expressing an understanding of the intent and function of the Establishment Clause and Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment to the United States Constitution which reads: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

Separation of church and state in the United States - Wikipedia

I am not at all religious however I do respect those who are religious/spiritual. I cannot understand how easily affronted non-believers are. I believe this country should afford "freedom OF religion, not FROM religion. Big difference. MOO.

 

[turaj]

If anyone hears anything about Judge Tammy thinking cameras were not filming during the whole interaction with family and Amber please do post. I do know she was strict on audio being off when not on record but not sure about this.