TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #30

[Cannonball3804]

There's an important distinction - a glass shard can kill; safety glass (which breaks into a rounded pea-sized crumble) does not. In the last thread some posters were theorizing that maybe she was punctured or killed by "shards of broken glass"...and others of us are posting that that is unlikely if one is referencing the doors and windows of the church.

A shard does NOT have to have a sharp edge. It can just be a fragment or sliver or piece, etc.

I used the term "shard" in another thread when wondering if glass table(s) in the SW corner area were safety glass or not. But the SW referred to "broken" glass without being more specific, so who knows whether any glass had sharp edges or not.

It's interesting, the semantics debate over the word shard when nobody takes the multiple posters to task for referring to the perp as "lying in wait". There certainly is nothing from LE about that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Camerabug]

.



Exactly another reason that I do not think happened there as. That video was taken from a live shot report the night of the Murder April 18. ** which brings up another point. What would that reporter see standing there where he was looking into the main hallway at that time? Looks like the whole property was released to me or that reporter wouldn't be standing in area almost where MB Truck had parked not even 24 hours earlier. This is JMHO

maybe the reason they cleaned it up so quickly was because it could be viewed from other areas inside and outside the church. They may not have had a choice in the matter-keeping onlookers away might have proved problematic. Photographs and measurements might have been all that was needed to remove the body-especially if there was no gun involved. The rest of the church just needed a quick sweeping up. Fingerprints in a public building would be very difficult to track. Also presumably they have everything but the murder itself and the perps exit on film..jmo

eta: also the murder weapon was left behind-no need to hunt for it or identify what it might have been..

 

[roadrunnermt]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...n-church-and-video-of-a-man-dressed-as-a-cop/


This is article states "broken glass". Respectably, what's the significance between shards of glass vs. broken glass?

Shards came from a MSM news story but I can't remember which one I had just read before I posted it. I don't think it said shards on top of MB but surrounding if I remember correctly. I think it was local Dallas 4 news story.

 

[gliving]

There's an important distinction - a glass shard can kill; safety glass (which breaks into a rounded pea-sized crumble) does not. In the last thread some posters were theorizing that maybe she was punctured or killed by "shards of broken glass"...and others of us are posting that that is unlikely if one is referencing the doors and windows of the church. They would not break into shards, as they are made of tempered or safety glass.

Yes, I agree. It also differentiates between safety glass in doors and windows, to the non-safety glass from a bathroom mirror. Missy was found with glass around her body. Some posters wondered if Missy was killed in the bathroom and the glass could be from a broken mirror.

 

[SandyQLS]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but is it possible the SP is wearing camouflage pants? The video is so distorted I know they look solid black, but it's really hard to tell. Also, the thin ankles stand out, I suppose that has to do with the puffed out pants and the fitted boots. I actually wonder if they're using blousing straps rather than the pants being tucked in, like this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vTHdR1sLa2U

I recall some previous posts about the helmet being a tactical style helmet, versus say a motorcycle helmet. I agree. It just amazes me the detailed and elaborate effort the killer went to here, it seems to add up to and may mean more than mere disguise.... but that's just me. And though the get up is swat / tactical style, the SP comes across, imo, as someone not exactly the athletic or "swat" or military type, Though possibly in their past?

Here's an article that shows the camo pants, bloused out, ( I have no idea if they're using the straps ) and the tactical style helmet. Jmo
http://www.dailygazette.com/photos/2012/sep/11/39850/

Yes, I agree that the SP is wearing BDU camouflage pants bloused most likely with blousing rubbers. In minimal shadow or dim light, the camo is intended to look all black and does. I do not think the pants are tucked into the boots. I posted about it back here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...AT-gear-18-Apr-2016-5&p=12509683#post12509683

In the 4/18 presser, they called them BDU pants. In at least one SW they referred to suspect wearing all black.

And you have no 'Sorry' to post! Discuss whatever you think about or notice, discuss it again with fresh eyes and new posters. (except for saran wrap boxes....just kidding)

 

[arkansasmimi]

:thinking: I have seen it posted numerious times here at WS on threads about locals passing and seeing MPD at the church (not talking about the night that Glammie and Dental Queen iirc) saw the multiple cars.

I am wondering if the Church is maybe having an officer come out to take a report of people coming to or inside the church taking photos? I have seen that happen /read about it happening on other cases. If I worked there or attended I would be concerned, especially since the Suspect has not been arrested yet. Crazy world we live in. Photos I have shared came from public posted photos, of the Creekside Church of Christ and MSM screen shots.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

A shard does NOT have to have a sharp edge. It can just be a fragment or sliver or piece, etc.

I used the term "shard" in another thread when wondering if glass table(s) in the SW corner area were safety glass or not. But the SW referred to "broken" glass without being more specific, so who knows whether any glass had sharp edges or not.

It's interesting, the semantics debate over the word shard when nobody takes the multiple posters to task for referring to the perp as "lying in wait". There certainly is nothing from LE about that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

'Laying in wait' is synonymous with the term "ambush" (a term LE did use) - both of which were thoroughly dissected in a previous thread, of course, lol.

In this Wikipedia piece, you can see the difference delineated between safety glass (which does not produce dangerous shards when broken) and regular glass, which does. Take it or leave it, when a glass discussion is having to be specific and descriptive (concerning lethality), the choice of word matters. IMHO.

Toughened or tempered glass is a type of safety glass processed by controlled thermal or chemical treatments to increase its strength compared with normal glass. Tempering puts the outer surfaces into compression and the inner surfaces into tension. Such stresses cause the glass, when broken, to crumble into small granular chunks instead of splintering into jagged shards as plate glass (aka: annealed glass) creates. The granular chunks are less likely to cause injury.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toughened_glass

And you are correct, as I posted earlier - the SW doesn't refer to 'shards' of glass. My guess is it's because "broken glass" was a better descriptor.

 

[SteveS]

Very nice job. Quick question: Is it possible to give us an approximate location of this camera and/or scene? Thanks in advance!

I'm fairly certain, from what I've seen of the building, that you're looking at the hallway that runs on the N side of the building. I'd guess what we're seeing in that portion of video is the perp, shortly after having breached the kitchen door and having exited the kitchen, going east down the hall to explore a ways, then turning back around and going back towards the main hallway that runs down the W side of the building.

At the bottom L of the pic itself might be a keypad that has to do with access and exit through the doors behind the cam (which would be the doors at the NE corner of the church)..

 

[SandyQLS]

JMO I would not refer to the broken glass in this photo as "shards". I think of shards as sharp, capable of cutting or injuring or impaling. Agree with tlcya that there are some semantics or local dialect usages of the word.

 

[GummyWorms]

JMO I would not refer to the broken glass in this photo as "shards". I think of shards as sharp, capable of cutting or injuring or impaling. Agree with tlcya that there are some semantics or local dialect usages of the word.

As someone who used "shards," I agree with SandyQLS. I was thinking of a mirror shattering and producing pieces of glass of different sizes that could cut or injure.

 

[arkansasmimi]

I think you are probably right on a mechanism that props it open. I'm just confused or its over my head lol or I need rest or all of the above. Looks like one set is propped after crime from newscast post event. But the first one was between SP video and MB murder, right?

I searched a little on OSHA and fire codes. For most part I believe these large commercial buildings require exit doors to include pushbars and must be able to push open from the inside regardless of outside lock status during regular business hours. One site had info that side entrances were locked with deadbolts outside of business hours.

This was an interesting Link found on those doors I saved http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...T-gear-18-Apr-2016-27&p=12620328#post12620328 This was during a discussion/debate about the metal kitchen door Link to doors http://www.locksmithledger.com/article/10774876/exit-device-basics):

 

[SKresearch]

(1.) Was this person familiar with this church
- have they been on the INSIDE of it?

[If so,
HOW?]

(2.) Did this person know about the surveillance cameras
(There is a sign posted outside that states there are surveillance cameras here.)

- did this person know that the OUTSIDE cameras were turned off
(or, not functioning, due to some other reason)?

[If so,
HOW?]

(3.) tools, at the church

[Where were they at, where were they originally at?
(before,
this person supposedly used them)
Police made no statement in regard to that, as far as I am aware.]

Did this person (already) know, that they were there?

[If so,
HOW?]

``````````````````````````
If this person knew about the exercise class being held THERE, in the early morning(s)
(If this person is tied to the church, in some way)
is THAT "how" they knew about it?

````````
(If this person is tied to the church, in some way)
Have they seen her (may have even talked to her),
before?

````````````````````````````````````````
This question previously came to me, and I then posted the question?

Did this person possibly have a "key" to the church?

[In trying to figure out 'why' that even crossed my mind,

maybe it was because:

It seems there was "staging" done in this case,
and if that was the case,

could "that" have been, staged, "too".
i.e.:
Could they get in with a "key".

But staged it to look like,
they had to, break-in, in order to do so.]

```````````
Could this case possibly consist of BOTH? (??)

Had a tie to that church

AND

knew when she was there (knew when this exercise class was held, there)

`````````
(Maybe this person hadn't been INSIDE that church before.
But it seems to me like, "maybe", they have been.)

???

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Yes, correct. Thanks for answering. However, if she were killed in the vestibule (which I find likely), SP slipping out those SW doors, that doesn't fit LEs comments that MB was seen on camera heading to the area SP was...unless maybe she did enter those doors, proceeded to restroom or kitchen for ice and headed back out towards vestibule and SP was last seen also heading towards vestibule? Any other thoughts?

Good observation, and an inconsistency that has bugged me. Addressed it a bit in post 74 of this thread. It seems LE has said two different things. At the first presser, within hours of Missy's murder, Spann answered a reporter's question about if the perp was seen leaving the church. His answer consisted of several choppy, incomplete phrases (like he was thinking on his feet), saying in the jumble that SP was seen walking in the hallway, and that "presumably" Swatperp left the way he'd entered...but also saying they had "no evidence" of his leaving via specific door or window of the church.

At a later presser, LE said in their statement that there was no video of the attack or interaction between SP and Missy, nor was the perp seen on video after the attack.

So somehow we need to reconcile those seemingly conflicting statements, and the only thing I can figure is, Spann simply didn't know the answer when asked that during Q&A hours after she was murdered. But after reviewing the video footage, LE was able to say with more certainty the next time around that SP was "not seen" after the murder.

JMO, up for anyone's interpretation.

ETA: I think I see what you're referencing...Missy walking down the hall 'toward where the perp was' - to me that means she entered by way of the main, front (west) door, and walked down toward the SW vestibule, where she was attacked.

 

[Cannonball3804]

Good observation, and an inconsistency that has bugged me. Addressed it a bit in post 74 of this thread. It seems LE has said two different things. At the first presser, within hours of Missy's murder, Spann answered a reporter's question about if the perp was seen leaving the church. His answer consisted of several choppy, incomplete phrases (like he was thinking on his feet), saying in the jumble that SP was seen walking in the hallway, and that "presumably" Swatperp left the way he'd entered...but also saying they had "no evidence" of his leaving via specific door or window of the church.

At a later presser, LE said in their statement that there was no video of the attack or interaction between SP and Missy, nor was the perp seen on video after the attack.

So somehow we need to reconcile those seemingly conflicting statements, and the only thing I can figure is, Spann simply didn't know the answer when asked that during Q&A hours after she was murdered. But after reviewing the video footage, LE was able to say with more certainty the next time around that SP was "not seen" after the murder.

JMO, up for anyone's interpretation.

My speculation is that perp wasn't picked up on camera after the crime because he was high-tailing it out of there. By the time a camera detected his motion and activated, he was already out of its field of view because he was running.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[chiefinspclouseau]

Yes, I agree that the SP is wearing BDU camouflage pants bloused most likely with blousing rubbers. In minimal shadow or dim light, the camo is intended to look all black and does. I do not think the pants are tucked into the boots. I posted about it back here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...AT-gear-18-Apr-2016-5&p=12509683#post12509683

In the 4/18 presser, they called them BDU pants. In at least one SW they referred to suspect wearing all black.

And you have no 'Sorry' to post! Discuss whatever you think about or notice, discuss it again with fresh eyes and new posters. (except for saran wrap boxes....just kidding)

I think they could possibly be BDUs as well. Just a friendly FYI: blousing rubbers are not used with modern-day BDUs. Fatigues, yes -- as they were called when I was in the military many years ago. Modern-day BDUs have drawstrings at the bottom of the pant leg that are cinched and tied to keep the pant secured inside the boot.

Edit: s/he, not "they"

Edit: Sorry, I was right the first time, lol. Think I'm overthinking here. Have a good night fellow sleuths.

 

[Cannonball3804]

I think they could possibly be BDUs as well. Just a friendly FYI: blousing rubbers are not used with modern-day BDUs. Fatigues, yes -- as they were called when I was in the military many years ago. Modern-day BDUs have drawstrings at the bottom of the pant leg that are cinched and tied to keep the pant secured inside the boot.

As for pants color, I think it's possible that the pants are not black but are instead a forest green camouflage pattern. The video just wasn't high quality enough to know for sure. And IIRC, LE has only referred to them as "dark".


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

My speculation is that perp wasn't picked up on camera after the crime because he was high-tailing it out of there. By the time a camera detected his motion and activated, he was already out of its field of view because he was running.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Up to anyone's interpretation, for sure...but someone posted a videotape of kids burglarizing a gun store in the last thread. They really hightailed it (faster than I've seen SP move, for sure), yet the cameras taped their running.

JMO, but I think the comment made in an earlier thread about the split second delay in cctv taping has created an exaggerated impression about such a delay. A security cam would certainly activate and tape SP running in those church halls if that cctv system was worth its installation.

 

[Seriously?]

Thanks. How did you know I was going to ask? Just to the right of the reporter's upper left arm, inside the glass, that does indeed look like a wheelchair! Does anyone know what the other object is - a chair? The timestamp for the news report is 10:06PM on 4/18/2016, 17 hours after the murder. In the vestibule murder theory, then they had already cleaned the entire vestibule area and placed the wheelchair back in storage position? (The wheelchair being approx. where MB's body's was found in this theory.)

The other object looks like a walker.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Frankly, it sounds like to me that at this point and time (within hours of her murder), Spann had no idea how SP left. This statement was from Q & A on that first Monday afternoon presser. When he says "presumably he left the same way he came in," to me that indicates Spann was conjecturing or throwing out a possibility, because there was no evidence found that morning that SP had left by any particular way (door or window).

I say this because this is an off-the-cuff reply to a reporter's question, but this casual, self-interrupting reply is later negated by a formal statement at a later presser that they have no video recording of SP after the murder.

I agree. But we have not heard anything different to change that that. That was April 18, today is June 26. All we have is what MPD and MSM have reported JMHO The later report of no video recording of Suspect after the murder, came from iPhone/iPad SW

SW16-060 MB iPhone & iPad for Forensic Extraction
4/19 Affidavit
4/19 Warrant
4/20 Warrant return
4/28 Notarized
5/3 Filed with Clerk & made public.

Press Conf April 22 http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...eline-*NO-DISCUSSION*&p=12519658#post12519658 - nothing changing the area that I heard do you have a link saying they no longer believe Suspect went out that metal door? Thanks in advance.

 

[Cannonball3804]

Up to anyone's interpretation, for sure...but someone posted a videotape of kids burglarizing a gun store in the last thread. They really hightailed it (faster than I've seen SP move, for sure), yet the cameras taped their running.

JMO, but I think the comment made in an earlier thread about the split second delay in cctv taping has created an exaggerated impression about such a delay. A security cam would certainly activate and tape SP running in those church halls if that cctv system was worth its installation.

I don't know... As LE said, there are "technological issues" with the camera system at this church. They spoke not only of the outdoor cameras working intermittently, but the inside cameras cutting off prematurely when perp was still in field of view but at a distance.

So it's very possible that these cameras could also not turn on fast enough, particularly if the perp didn't get very close on his way out to the SW corner camera that had already shut off prematurely.

As for gun store CCTV you mentioned... the one gun store we know of in THIS case, the SWFA, we know has a MUCH better camera system than Creekside - like night and day difference.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk